Zeitgeist Movement = most hardcore NWO propaganda ever.

reply to post by IgnoranceIsntBlisss


Some websites to check out:

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Some websites to check out:

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and

www.reprap.org...

Originally posted by dalan.
Why would we build an experimental city within the confines of existing cities? Build the new city somewhere far outside of any current city. There is such a thing as robots building robots.

Wow you did a great job dodging my questions with straw men. Where are you going to get the robots? Who is going to pay for them? Where will you mine rare earth magnets from? You say build a NEW city (the premise of 'building a city'), and then say you're going to mine current cities. It sounds like even in your experimental city stage you're already engaging in rapid entitlement behavoir.

Even if you start with one robot, where will you get all the different ores to make quality alloys? Then you need petroleum and processing plant(s) to extract the distillates to make resins and plastics. It sound slike this city will reside on the most fictional bountiful tract of land, with neatly loctated ore desopits and petroleum fields. Also sounds like tyou'll all being living next door to chemical processing plants and factories. The livestock and agricultural fields on the outskirts will have oil derricks.

"No, dalan, you can only have 2 wheelbarrows of compost today." "dalan, we need you to hurry up and finish weaving those baskets for the community."

1st: Why would I be using compost for anything? If I were growing any manner of a garden, hydroponics are far superior.

2nd: Why would I be weaving baskets? Unless I enjoyed weaving baskets, in which case, big deal.

Answer the question of where you're going to get all the robots and materials from for your proposed city. I guess you're going to make the robot slaves grow all your food too, since apparently you dont intend to do gardening so majority of the food you eat is in your yard to save on the resource costs of everything involved in growing and getting food into your fridge.

Instead of complaining about, "Well what about this problem or this problem?" Get off the computer and maybe go get a degree in some technical field so that perhaps you can actually SOLVE a problem.

I have a degree in electronics engineering, and still grow a large percentage of my own food.

It is easy to ask open-ended questions.

I'm asking crucial questions into the feasibility of your utopia and it doesnt seem anyone can hardly answer any of them directly.

If the Zeitgeist Movement/Venus Project were NWO propaganda they would already be shoving it down our throats and telling us that its "good" for us. I have yet to see the MSM pick up any story related to it. If Fox News ever runs a story on it singing it praises then maybe we should be afraid.

Didnt you watch the news a year ago during the banking fallout?

It just so happens that I have a huge thread from today filled with global government and global resource management and global currency:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
Nobody seems to want to actually explain the implementation / transition. ...

As I mentioned before, I see 2 ways, "consent" or "conquest". let's look at consent first developing further what dalan says:

Originally posted by dalan.
reply to post by IgnoranceIsntBlisss

 

I already said that for the transition the plan was to build an "experimental city." With enough people who have the technical skills necessary to solve problems the city would slowly evolve...or grow and adapt.

You do not have to force anyone to do anything. If you do not want to go to the city then don't.

Only it will have to be more or less global. you cannot control resources to be used by all if you don't do it globally. (oh, dalan, did I mention that such experimental cities were tried and failed? ) Also you need to buy the land and materials for that experimental city, you need to get agreements from the current government (with soldiers) and people.

So this is how it can work out. All the super wealthy that have been stashing wealth, buying up the land, etc will have to rob a bit more, so that the planet belongs to them. then they create these cities and let people enter on their terms. this is NWO by consent. it works similar to this forum. Someone started it, created rules and lets you in. the moment you break the rules you're out.

only in the global system there is no OUT. The people that start VP will develop the rules (heavily influenced by unseen forces) about the distribution of wealth in a way that seems fair to them and only to them. This is no different from our current system where taxpayer's money is redistributed in a fair way according to those who control redistribution. I do not believe that it is easy for the founders of VP to give up all their beliefs for the development of new world if majority would want to go other way. say people will feel strongly against genetic manipulations, will the "new elite" do it?

We could use internet as an example. Many societies form and coexist with their values and rules. its all free (in a way), some people contribute, others consume, everyone is happy as long as there is an abundance in bandwidth. but can anyone tell me why this system is different from VP? it is different in several subtle ways...

If VP advocated for creation of an infrastructure similar to the internet and nothing more (leaving people alone to do whatever and being able to shield themselves from whatever) then I'd be on board.

Originally posted by dalan.
High Speed Robot Hand

that video is cool sci-fi cities are cool too, only if everything was as easy as that technology alone cannot solve human problems. but I am all for advances in technology.

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
Nobody seems to want to actually explain the implementation / transition. ...

Originally posted by dalan.
High Speed Robot Hand

that video is cool sci-fi cities are cool too, only if everything was as easy as that technology alone cannot solve human problems. but I am all for advances in technology.

Yeah, I posted it to show the advancements being made in robotics. That arm alone has many capabilities.

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
Originally posted by dalan.

Wow you did a great job dodging my questions with straw men. Where are you going to get the robots? Who is going to pay for them? Where will you mine rare earth magnets from? You say build a NEW city (the premise of 'building a city'), and then say you're going to mine current cities. It sounds like even in your experimental city stage you're already engaging in rapid entitlement behavoir.

How do you suggest that we go about using technology? Or obtaining technology? Do you have any ideas? This should be a group effort...

Even if you start with one robot, where will you get all the different ores to make quality alloys? Then you need petroleum and processing plant(s) to extract the distillates to make resins and plastics. It sound like this city will reside on the most fictional bountiful tract of land, with neatly located ore deposits and petroleum fields. Also sounds like you'll all being living next door to chemical processing plants and factories. The livestock and agricultural fields on the outskirts will have oil derricks.

Have any better ideas? What could we do that would be more proficient?

"No, dalan, you can only have 2 wheelbarrows of compost today." "dalan, we need you to hurry up and finish weaving those baskets for the community."

1st: Why would I be using compost for anything? If I were growing any manner of a garden, hydroponics are far superior.

2nd: Why would I be weaving baskets? Unless I enjoyed weaving baskets, in which case, big deal.

Answer the question of where you're going to get all the robots and materials from for your proposed city. I guess you're going to make the robot slaves grow all your food too, since apparently you don't intend to do gardening so majority of the food you eat is in your yard to save on the resource costs of everything involved in growing and getting food into your fridge.

I didn't say that I would not do any gardening, I said I would use hydroponics, and I would do it myself.

Instead of complaining about, "Well what about this problem or this problem?" Get off the computer and maybe go get a degree in some technical field so that perhaps you can actually SOLVE a problem.

I have a degree in electronics engineering, and still grow a large percentage of my own food.

Then why don't you get with a group of people that you could actually solve some of these problems with? The transition idea was an experimental city...

I do not have all of the logistical answers for how the city would get resources, I would need to work with the people with the technical ability to solve such problems.

That is why it would be a group effort.

It is easy to ask open-ended questions.

I'm asking crucial questions into the feasibility of your utopia and it doesn't seem anyone can hardly answer any of them directly.

Its not a Utopia, a utopia is simply an idea of a perfect place. This is problem solving which we are completely capable of.

If the Zeitgeist Movement/Venus Project were NWO propaganda they would already be shoving it down our throats and telling us that its "good" for us. I have yet to see the MSM pick up any story related to it. If Fox News ever runs a story on it singing it praises then maybe we should be afraid.

Didn't you watch the news a year ago during the banking fallout?

It just so happens that I have a huge thread from today filled with global government and global resource management and global currency:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

If our leaders decided to manage our resources for us (which they already do) they would do it with legislation and a police force. They would do it with economic control over populations, using debt to entrapped human beings.

Which has nothing to do with Zeitgeist/Venus Project...

You have just associated the two because of the use of the word "global."

Originally posted by dalan.
How do you suggest that we go about using technology? Or obtaining technology? Do you have any ideas? This should be a group effort...

Have any better ideas? What could we do that would be more proficient?

Then why don't you get with a group of people that you could actually solve some of these problems with? The transition idea was an experimental city...

I do not have all of the logistical answers for how the city would get resources, I would need to work with the people with the technical ability to solve such problems.

That is why it would be a group effort.

Are you asking me to help you figure out hwo to make your utopia work? (and YES, the entire notion is utopian) I thought PJ and JF were the geniuses who have it all figured out. You should be linking in their quotes that answer all of our tough questions.

Which has nothing to do with Zeitgeist/Venus Project...

You have just associated the two because of the use of the word "global."

Actualy, it does, because as I've been arguing the entire thread, ZM is mere NWO propaganda to divert 'truth movement' or 'freedom movement' types away from bringing down the NWO.

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
Originally posted by dalan.

How do you suggest that we go about using technology? Or obtaining technology? Do you have any ideas? This should be a group effort...

Have any better ideas? What could we do that would be more proficient?

Then why don't you get with a group of people that you could actually solve some of these problems with? The transition idea was an experimental city...

I do not have all of the logistical answers for how the city would get resources, I would need to work with the people with the technical ability to solve such problems.

That is why it would be a group effort.

Are you asking me to help you figure out hwo to make your utopia work? (and YES, the entire notion is utopian) I thought PJ and JF were the geniuses who have it all figured out. You should be linking in their quotes that answer all of our tough questions.

No, I am asking that since you have some technical capabilites...could you help solve problems without worrying about making a profit? Which is the point....

We could be doing a lot more if we were not worried about how much money we could make.

The zeitgeist movement/Venus Project is not a utopia, the entire concept of a utopia is a perfect civilization with no problems whatsoever...a paradise on earth. Human beings would still face challenges, this approach is simply a better way at approaching those challenges. Aside from how we do it now, which is ignore it altogether.

Like poverty, starvation. disease, homelessness, pollution, crime, war...

Which has nothing to do with Zeitgeist/Venus Project...

You have just associated the two because of the use of the word "global."

Actualy, it does, because as I've been arguing the entire thread, ZM is mere NWO propaganda to divert 'truth movement' or 'freedom movement' types away from bringing down the NWO.

How would the appraoch to problem solving desribed by the Venus Project not bring down the NWO?

How do you suppose we take down the NWO?

Build a new bank? Some more prisons? Start a violent revolution?

Or argue on the internet?

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss

Originally posted by RobertPaulsim
Nowhere. I know people EXTREMELY educated that are emotion-freaks like teens way beyond 30´s.

Bingo. They think you can just re-educate people and all the worlds problems will go away. Nice try. Look at the liberals out there worshipping Obama after 8 years of chastizing Bush worshippers for doing the same. And the ZM is a progressive movement. (In comparison: Eugenics, Soviet / Communism and even the Nazi's were all progressive movements)

If everyone was "re-educated" with true knowledge the worlds problems would go away. Imagine if just a few of the alternative science or medicine breakthroughs would be put into action. There are millions of possibilities the Zeitgeist movies cover a sliver of what we're capable of. Screw any movement because in the end You are your own movement. Take in everything and decide what actually sits with you. That's what it's all about.

reply to post by dalan.


dalan-

I admire your commitment to your beliefs and ideals. that's the stuff that ultimately keeps you going when things get hard. You take a lot of heat, and yet you continue to stay positive - which is going to bring you success, and benefit the world around you, more profoundly than any set of ideas about particular solutions.

the world does need structural changes, and none of us have big enough eyes to see the complete picture. more important, is that we stay optimistic by continuously generating new ideas and putting a few into action - and that we remind ourselves from time to time that we are all up against the same forces.

None of us have a complete solution. No doubt, technology will play a crucial role as our energy needs continue to expand. And who knows - maybe true abundance would have a profound effect on human relationships. I have doubts about the literal physical possibility of achieving such a system on a finite planet, but who would have predicted modern agriculture or medicine before the age of oil?

Humans are built on adaptability. That's the one things that gives me hope. Our true gift is our ability to survive in diverse environments - by being able to act back upon those environments with incredible ingenuity.


Anyhow. It's a pleasure to meet you here. I enjoy your posts - I'm glad I shut up long enough to really read them.

peace.





[edit on 9-12-2009 by TrueTruth]

reply to post by dalan.


dalan, on another thought, don't you think that VP's approach to solve world's problems is somewhat one sided. taking the hand trick you posted earlier, we can now buy artificial limbs that function like hands without doing any surgery (see this post) but as I mentioned before, you can have sci-fi reanimator sarcophaguses and limb growing technology, but many will still die unnecessarily. You will be forced to accept some kinds of regulation or control as a solution to many human problems, the old bait and switch tactics. Say, some scientists go over the top with particular technology, people die. A Great Venus Council decides we need to stop any research in this area (just like cloning) and so it starts.

I guess my question is, how VPs science approach going to prevent a group of people from organising together, then creating a problem, provoking people's reaction and then presenting their solution as necessary evil to tackle this problem?

VP is so raw and versatile that it cane be used as part of any regime, which gives its own definition to fair distribution of resources. supporting VP as it is now can mean supporting any regime, NWO for example.

Originally posted by TrueTruth
reply to post by dalan.

 

dalan-

I admire your commitment to your beliefs and ideals. that's the stuff that ultimately keeps you going when things get hard. You take a lot of heat, and yet you continue to stay positive - which is going to bring you success, and benefit the world around you, more profoundly than any set of ideas about particular solutions.

the world does need structural changes, and none of us have big enough eyes to see the complete picture. more important, is that we stay optimistic by continuously generating new ideas and putting a few into action - and that we remind ourselves from time to time that we are all up against the same forces.

None of us have a complete solution. No doubt, technology will play a crucial role as our energy needs continue to expand. And who knows - maybe true abundance would have a profound effect on human relationships. I have doubts about the literal physical possibility of achieving such a system on a finite planet, but who would have predicted modern agriculture or medicine before the age of oil?

Humans are built on adaptability. That's the one things that gives me hope. Our true gift is our ability to survive in diverse environments - by being able to act back upon those environments with incredible ingenuity.


Anyhow. It's a pleasure to meet you here. I enjoy your posts - I'm glad I shut up long enough to really read them.

peace.[edit on 9-12-2009 by TrueTruth]

Wow dude, I love this post, and I needed to hear it...thank you for the uplifting words.

Originally posted by mushibrain
reply to post by dalan.

 

dalan, on another thought, don't you think that VP's approach to solve world's problems is somewhat one sided. taking the hand trick you posted earlier, we can now buy artificial limbs that function like hands without doing any surgery (see this post) but as I mentioned before, you can have sci-fi reanimator sarcophaguses and limb growing technology, but many will still die unnecessarily. You will be forced to accept some kinds of regulation or control as a solution to many human problems, the old bait and switch tactics. Say, some scientists go over the top with particular technology, people die. A Great Venus Council decides we need to stop any research in this area (just like cloning) and so it starts.

I guess my question is, how VPs science approach going to prevent a group of people from organising together, then creating a problem, provoking people's reaction and then presenting their solution as necessary evil to tackle this problem?

VP is so raw and versatile that it cane be used as part of any regime, which gives its own definition to fair distribution of resources. supporting VP as it is now can mean supporting any regime, NWO for example.

Indeed, and I have given thought to all of this, when it comes down to it though I do agree that what we do with our technology is up to us. We can either build atom bombs or can can put as much commitment and passion into elevating one another.

The one thing that has fueled the NWO is lack of education...more than anything we need better institutions for learning. Not to indoctrinate our children but to give them the problem solving skills necessary for cooperation.

Originally posted by dalan.
....
The one thing that has fueled the NWO is lack of education...more than anything we need better institutions for learning. Not to indoctrinate our children but to give them the problem solving skills necessary for cooperation.

Actually two things. I see two things that are different in VP. One you mentioned - education. And the other is freeing people from work, removing the need to work. With the latter, I don't see how NWO can be maintained. When people have time on their hands and are not dependent on the state they are harder to control. You’d need a huge distraction to fill the free time, which is usually taken by the job. So who knows, sci-fi sounds fascinating.

I still believe there is a big danger to slip into something nasty here. I know you want some solid arguments, but something doesn't sit right with this VP, sorry. I'd stick a label on it "proceed with caution"

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
Peter Joseph's “Zeitgeist Movement” and cosponsor “Venus Project” are a hardcore front in the New World Order / Neo-Communist / Neo-Eugenicist-Transhumanist agenda.
thezeitgeistmovement.com...
www.thevenusproject.com...
ZM Manifesto

I see training people to be noncompetitive as a far more sinister means of controlling their every whim opposed to how disgusting it already is how TPTB use competitiveness to divert us with things like sports and other tribalistic nonsense. We need to be trained to cooperate with our looming machine overlords, because tribalism in human/machine affairs would be counter-productive to the Transhumanist agenda.

[edit on 28-11-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

WTH? Are you supporting this? From this paragraph it seems like you want the readers to go with the Transhumanist agenda. Did I miss something?

The NWO is working incredibly hard to eliminate tribalism from all of the cultures of the world and reduce everybody to individuals by injecting the crafted "Western Culture" all over the world, even separating them from the family unit. The idea is to tear out the roots so that whatever it is you plant on the top soil can be removed easier.

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
And that’s what I’ve gathered just glancing over it.
[edit on 28-11-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Yewwwwww missed something rather important my friend.

The electro magnetic trains. WE NEED TO USE THOSE TRAINS NOW!!
The alternative energies - wind, tidal, ocean surface waves, thermal, etc
WE NEED TO USE THOSE NOW!!!

everything else, fine, fair call.

But you missed the good in the presentations,
the move towards efficient & non polluting (already existing) technologies.

-B.M

reply to post by Lucidliving


Well actually the transhumanist agenda is the latest form of tribalism. But I do get what you mean, all this 'global citizenship' noise these days. Its a train wreck of a mess in the EU.

But tribalism is wielded far and wide. Despite the move towards smashing down national sovereignty awide, we're still controlled via tribalism in other more pervasive and ubiquitous ways, such as sports team, music genres (even rapper vs. rapper), and all other sorts of pseudo-ethnicities. And its still religion vs. religion, and so on. Sure the NWO wants to smash ALL religions, but for now this form of tribalism is needed in a deep way in order to play the game towards their goals.

But I do feel ya on the individualism arguments you made. I wrote a long time ago about "Pseudo Individualism", whereas everyone is obsessed with being 'individuals' (as defined by their car 'mods', clothes, etc), yet all in fact still do the same thing ultimately (consumerism, leader worship, mindlessly ignorant, deliberately ignorant, selfish, apathetic, etc). You might enjoy my read, as reposted from my old myspace blog over to Wordpress:
*Pseudo-Individualism used to Divide & Conquer

reply to post by B.Morrison


This is, the pretty sounding energy etc echnologies are irrelevant to the talking points.

But for the sake of argument, do you really believe that wind / etc is enough to supply all of humanity's needs? At prices per watt cheaper than by using all available energy? At what point, what scale, does it reach the point where the land covered with giant wind and solar arrays, and coastlines lined with wave generator obstructions, at what point does it all become pollution?

You might want to go thru the thread. There were quite a few good posts discussing energy technology.

[edit on 28-12-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

[edit on 28-12-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

I appreciate you putting your time into making this thread but you are putting too much effort into trying make Zeitgeist sound so horrible when in fact it is filled with a ton of good information! Yes there is a bit of crap within the documentary but its not enough to make it a horrible propaganda film! I highly doubt that the guy who made it is involved in the NWO or has any part in the NWO agenda.

Until you have facts, this is nothing but speculation, and it's just your opinion.

-sonicboom

reply to post by sonicboom


I guess we cant judge it by it merits?

Lets see, both the ZM and the NWO call for the following:

Global dictatorship.
End of all religion.
Irrational environmental policies that will ultimately harm humans.
Robots replacing humans as workers.
Quazi-Communism ("Neo-Communism").
Artificial Intelligence overlord computers running the world.
Population reduction.
Transhumanist cyborg merging of humans with machines.

And I'm sure theres several more if I sat here on this a little while longer. I dont care whether or not he's been inducted into the 'Illumunati', as the merits of his works shows what he is. I give him the credit of being smart enough to know what hes doing. But I'm also sure some others here could make the argument in the other direction, such as the certain little lady mentor he has that helped him with all his anti-religion philosophies. But I'm not the right guy for that debate.

Zeitgeist took information from Thomas Paine, Aaron Russo and Alex Jones and tries to use it to propose the solution that the socialist nwo advocates want (as opposed to the world federalist nwo)