what made the universe!

Originally posted by 13579
reply to post by sirnex

 

Take your last words.. I did not NEED to mesure it.

i just made a logic connection.. I mean what is your problem?

What I am saying is this Incase you missed it AGAIN

The universe WORKS the same way our MIND does?

I mean what is so hard with that?

can you tell me any reason why that is not the case? please tell me

There is no usage of logic in this statement at all lmao.

Do you have explicit knowledge of the entire universe, both in how it works and explicit knowledge of it's size and all objects within in which to claim knowledge of it's shape or lack of?


*edit* Guess I'll have to wait till you get out of school for a reply back on this explicit knowledge you've attained of the universe and the human mind. Narcissist.


[edit on 30-11-2009 by sirnex]

[edit on 30-11-2009 by sirnex]

Originally posted by 13579
reply to post by spy66

 

how is it being smart? you are the one who used that as your reason for being not me?

or did you not like that i pointed it out as your comment made no valid sens other than My mum? ..

Is that your basis for being alive? Oh because my mum made me?

that is some what childish if you dont mind me saying or can you not think past one generation of the genomes? LOL classic

[edit on 30-11-2009 by 13579]

Well fella. I dont think this topic will last. But good luck with Your reality.

reply to post by sirnex

Do you have explicit knowledge of the entire universe, both in how it works and explicit knowledge of it's size and all objects within in which to claim knowledge of it's shape or lack of?

I understand how it works yes.. Can i tell you why? Nope..

The only thing and i continue to say is that the universe IS a reflection of your mind.

Now if you wish to add something other than taking snide comments and being a troll you are free to leave this thread.

If you have NO idea what im taking about that is OK with me also.

But once upon a time jesus walked on water and the world was flat and we had no idea what gravity was.

I suggest you read history books..

Some people Have a goal in life some people change life and some people are happy just being here

what one are you?



and do not take that statement as offensive.. im just pointing out that maybe just mabye

I DO KNOW WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT

And if that scares you.. well the world in your eyes is indeed FLAT

have a nice day

reply to post by spy66

Nothing can never happen. Something always happens.

your signiture not mine

reply to post by 13579

I understand how it works yes.. Can i tell you why? Nope..

If you can't explain why, then you don't truly understand and your nothing more than a deluded nitwit calling other people trolls while you troll around for ignorant prey to stroke your ego.

The only thing and i continue to say is that the universe IS a reflection of your mind.

And I demand evidence for this explicit claim of knowledge of all things there is to know about the universe and the mind. You made the claim, the burden of proof is on you unless I am right and your just a purposeful lying little troll yourself.

Now if you wish to add something other than taking snide comments and being a troll you are free to leave this thread.

I look for truthful people, I haven't found many yet. ATS seems to be filled with arrogantly ignorant narcissistic little punks who call everyone who demands evidence for their absolute truths, facts and explicit knowledge, trolls. Be honest with me here and we won't have a problem. I'll tell you one thing, I won't quite.

If you have NO idea what im taking about that is OK with me also.

Your not talking about anything slightly intelligent.

But once upon a time jesus walked on water and the world was flat and we had no idea what gravity was.

I suggest you read history books..

OMFG That's rich... Here we have it folks, this guy compares himself to Jesus.

Some people Have a goal in life some people change life and some people are happy just being here

what one are you?

I'm here to change *your* life. I'm here to open your eyes to honesty, humility, reservation of judgment, courage to explore. None of this can happen until your ready to stop being a nitwit retard and quite exclaiming you've discovered the wonders of the universe but just can't prove it right now.

and do not take that statement as offensive.. im just pointing out that maybe just mabye

I DO KNOW WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT

And if that scares you.. well the world in your eyes is indeed FLAT

have a nice day

Interesting... You quote history and allude to a few discoveries thereby implying you might possibly be a great mind like some in the history books and yet.... One flaw, they had evidence, they did work. You.... omfg you are just something else. You make these bold outrageous claims and turn around and state, I don't know why I know this but I know I am right because Jesus walked on water? WTF DUDE! LMFAO!!!

reply to post by sirnex

I understand how it works yes.. Can i tell you why? Nope..

If you can not understand why it is i cant then feel free to ask god or whatever.. becuase finding out why would result in the END of the universe me and you.

The universe IS a phyiscal repesentation of a question

And you my little padawan are the answer to it

Did that help?

reply to post by sirnex

Interesting... You quote history and allude to a few discoveries thereby implying you might possibly be a great mind like some in the history books and yet.... One flaw, they had evidence, they did work. You.... omfg you are just something else. You make these bold outrageous claims and turn around and state, I don't know why I know this but I know I am right because Jesus walked on water? WTF DUDE! LMFAO!!!

Some people understand history and take note of it..

Some poeple are happy to ignore it

Some people embrace it

Some people change it

And the ironic part is

You entire life is based on NO proof

ever heard of religon? thats why the call it FAITH because there is NO proof jesus walked on water but yet all of the laws of the land are based upon them

funny heh? i thought so too...

you've discovered the wonders of the universe

Nope just one if i had more im sure i would talk about it though, but for now im happy with what i have to offer.



Do you know what a fractal is?

I really don't know what to make of this because in part we have some areas of the discussion rich in idealism which I do admit I am more fond of idealism then materialism when discussing the true nature of the Universe.

We don't know what created the Universe is a bit of a statement. If it is created, then that implies something with intelligence and self-awareness had an ability to create and organize the laws which govern natural law and applied an entire system of reality around these laws.

Religious people have claimed for millennium that this being is God. If god is one who creates and the universe is created, then it was God who created it. As to what context or representation of God you chose, the statement implies that a created reality requires a god like intelligence to create said universe.

Now in my dream based idealism where I observe a precognitive dream actualizing into this materialistic world, I can say a few things about that process.

I am the dreamer, and the dream is my creation. How it came to be actualized as my reality... I'm still working on the details but I assume that all of us somehow are involved in a co-creative process by which the externalized world is formed.

Each of us a node in the isms of a creative force we call God. That's just some of my musings. I am after all, a dreamer.

reply to post by YouAreDreaming


Well you are correct in you meaning as i stated you are on the right track on your dreaming point.

But to have a god would mean who made god? that becomes endless correct? and why is it endless?

why do we have words like infinity? or in math the equation of PI?

because its self replicating in nature.

the body is no different to ones mind it does in deed replicate and what is the force and reason for this ?

We life in something that is alive .. and we also keep it going

Death and life are part of the same deal

without one you do not get the other.. like energy and mass

Both have a connection and are interchangerble

Be for you was alive you was ?? then you are alive?? then you die???

all componets of the same thing, but what links them when you are alive is the very understanding that you can see your self

Mirror effect. Reality is YOU seeing how your mind works physicaly as you are not able to when you are dead because you go back to being the one who is asking again

its ALL about the method of asking and the result is me and you and this thing we call reality

if it was any other way.. we would not be here

everything on this planet was once formed from a star that went super nova

people have a need to think themselves special or above anything but we aren't

you should treat everything with the same amount of respect you yourself expect

everything in this universe came from the samething

billions of years ago before any of us were born we were all the same singularity

from the pile of dog # outside ya house to the pope

we ALL come from the same stuff

it just managed to change over the billions of years is all

O.k... o.k... Enough already.. I confess, I did it. I created the universe.

But I'm Not gonna tell ya how I did it!

Originally posted by JohnPhoenix
O.k... o.k... Enough already.. I confess, I did it. I created the universe.

But I'm Not gonna tell ya how I did it!

omg you bastard!

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


haha

well you did

if you was dead you wouldnt be asking now would you ; ) hehe

reply to post by YouAreDreaming

We don't know what created the Universe is a bit of a statement. If it is created, then that implies something with intelligence and self-awareness had an ability to create and organize the laws which govern natural law and applied an entire system of reality around these laws.

That is a bit of a statement in itself. Your right that we don't know *where the universe came from* as equally as we don't know whether it arose through some unintelligent natural process or was purposefully created by some intelligence. In either case, whatever process that had occurred would not be spiritual nor supernatural as it is a part of reality that makes up our observable universe. Either way we slice and dice it, it is a natural phenomena that is either intelligent or not.

But to state that religions of the world say the universe was intelligently created and then to use your own biased opinion in favor of idealism and claim that this appears more correct due to a semantics based argument through using the word created is just as wrong.

Religious people have claimed for millennium that this being is God. If god is one who creates and the universe is created, then it was God who created it. As to what context or representation of God you chose, the statement implies that a created reality requires a god like intelligence to create said universe.

Technically, throughout human history, especially recorded history, the consensus has been that there are *many Gods*, not just one all mighty creator. Polytheism has the longest running track history of belief over monotheism. If we're going to take the argument of religions along with the semantic argument of created and then apply it to beliefs through history, then many Gods wins out over just one singular god. This belief even falls more into reality than the singular monotheistic God as these Gods were considered real tangible physical beings and not as some invisible supernatural spiritual being that is heard in our heads more than it is seen through our eyes. As these beings are considered physical coming from physical places within the confines of reality and its laws of physics, they would appear to be the more real and proper answer than this ridiculous singular monotheistic deity.

Now in my dream based idealism where I observe a precognitive dream actualizing into this materialistic world, I can say a few things about that process.

I am the dreamer, and the dream is my creation. How it came to be actualized as my reality... I'm still working on the details but I assume that all of us somehow are involved in a co-creative process by which the externalized world is formed.

Each of us a node in the isms of a creative force we call God. That's just some of my musings. I am after all, a dreamer.

This sounds to me to be a stretch of the imagination so to speak. In most cases, most people are not aware they are dreaming and have no real control over dreams at all, yet the brain still will sometimes commit a few of those dreams to memory and only under certain circumstances it appears.

The few that are able to become conscious during a dream and able to control said dream are only to exact a limited amount of control. Despite that limited control, some aspects of control defy what is currently physically possible within the waking experience, showing that the dream world is not based on physical reality at all and is only accessible through physical sleep or purposeful meditative practices that allow for lucid control over the dream world. Even with lucid control, it is not entirely possible to maintain ultimate control over the dream world for very long periods of time. This shows that despite the appearance of control, that actual control is very tenuous and short lived.

To the OP.

I simply go with this:

There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened.

-Doulas Adams

So please stop asking the question

Something CANNOT be made of nothing. The true definition of nothing anyways.

For anything to cause "the big bang", there had to be something there. Not nothing.

The theory of an omnipotent being that created what exists now, almost makes more sense than tracing the universe back to a big bang that formed out of nothing.

However, To say that it has always existed and continually expands and contracts also makes sense. Until you ask the question, if it didn't always exist, where did it come from?

It didn't come from nothing. But as far as I know, I'm only here for a ridiculously small fraction of what HAS and what WILL exist.

Originally posted by Demoncreeper
Something CANNOT be made of nothing. The true definition of nothing anyways.

For anything to cause "the big bang", there had to be something there. Not nothing.

The theory of an omnipotent being that created what exists now, almost makes more sense than tracing the universe back to a big bang that formed out of nothing.

However, To say that it has always existed and continually expands and contracts also makes sense. Until you ask the question, if it didn't always exist, where did it come from?

It didn't come from nothing. But as far as I know, I'm only here for a ridiculously small fraction of what HAS and what WILL exist.

Well, to say that coming from nothing makes no sense or that a continuous cycle makes no sense because it would have to come from something initially but then state that it makes more sense to have an eternal creator that arose from nothing itself is a bit of a contradiction and devoid of all logical thought and intelligence.

It would make equally less sense if not more than less sense to have this complex being to have arose from nothing, existed for an infinite amount of time and pick one arbitrary moment out of an infinite moments to create a vast universe for one intelligent species that would never be able to utilize the entire space of that universe.

Our universe would by nature be less complex than any form of creator, be it the biblical God or a computer scientist running a simulation. If it makes no sense for a less complex 'thing' to arise naturally but more sense for a complex intelligent thing to always exist to create a less complex thing from seemingly nothing itself, then you've lost all sense of mind yourself.

reply to post by sirnex

Well, to say that coming from nothing makes no sense or that a continuous cycle makes no sense because it would have to come from something initially but then state that it makes more sense to have an eternal creator that arose from nothing itself is a bit of a contradiction and devoid of all logical thought and intelligence.

Yeah, my computer doesn't come with a sarcasm detector either.

I just use common sense.




[edit on 6-12-2009 by Demoncreeper]

Originally posted by Demoncreeper
reply to post by sirnex

 

Well, to say that coming from nothing makes no sense or that a continuous cycle makes no sense because it would have to come from something initially but then state that it makes more sense to have an eternal creator that arose from nothing itself is a bit of a contradiction and devoid of all logical thought and intelligence.

Yeah, my computer doesn't come with a sarcasm detector either.

I just use common sense.

[edit on 6-12-2009 by Demoncreeper]

If your attempting to say that what you posted was a form of common sense sarcasm, then you don't understand what either are or don't understand how to fully articulate such a stance in written form.

From the form of writing you did put forth, it looked more serious than sarcastic. Not trying to start something, but pointing out a slight flaw in thought form to written form. To be honest, it *is* quiet difficult to discern what your state of mind is compared to your post. There are many ways to articulate your thought a lot more coherently, but common sense, as you indicate, was not one of them. Please learn the differences between all these before posting drivel BS. Thank you.