Fuming Mad Christian

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posted on Nov, 27 2009 @ 11:41 PM
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Well firstly I would just like to say that I'm most often a lurker and I hardly ever post. I've only been on the site for a few months but keep seeing threads about religion come up and have never bothered to post in any of them...until now.

First off, the title of the thread is what drew me in because I wondered "why is this person so angry"? I must admit, I was quite surprised and also felt a bit sad for the OP when I read the first post.

My beliefs are an important part of who I am and I do consider myself "christian" in the sense that I believe in Christ. I was brought up Anglican but made the choice as a young teenager that I no longer wanted to attend church (my own reason - which isn't all that important). My parents were very accepting as they knew it was my choice to make. Even though I consider myself a christian, I don't consider myself religious and to this day I do not attend church as I feel that the rituals of religion are not what's important - but rather the way a person lives their life.

Being a christian, by no means do I consider myself to be better or above those who aren't christian/any other belief-system. I try my best every day to do the things I know I should (treat people with kindness, compassion, understanding, etc) and I struggle and make mistakes. I know I'm a constant work in progress and I could hardly judge Joe Blow for their life/actions/beliefs or whatever as I KNOW with all certainty that I am far from perfect.

I do understand how the OP can become angry as its hard to be lumped in with people who are all thought of as one big bad group of people (to some, anyway). However (and here's why I felt sad for the OP), I try not to concern myself with what others think of me as I know the truth of who I am better than anyone else. I feel sad for the OP that he/she let him/herself be made angry (and keep in mind that no one can make you feel anything without you giving them permission) because in the scheme of things, why does it matter to you if people think badly about you as a christian if they don't even know you? Forgive them and move on.

The only thing I have to say about the topic in general is that (and this is only my opinion, of course) religion is not the problem. It never has been. People are what cause the problems. People misinterpret meanings or take their own meaning from religions and apply it in life as they see fit. That is where the error is - as all people make mistakes. The teachings of Jesus are that of acceptance, tolerance, kindness, compassion and love. People take their own meaning from books like the bible/koran/torah and blame is lain on the book rather than on the person who committed the acts in question (by this I mean atrocities like the Inquisition, Salem Witch Trials, terrorist attacks by various religious groups, etc). I believe that the people who do the actions are to blame, not the belief-system. To me its the same as saying the video games make kids violent - kids choose to become violent. People just don't seem to want to take responsibility for their actions and would rather blame anything else than themselves.

Well anyway, that's only my opinion so take it as you will. I think I'm done rambling now


Blessings and love to all!




posted on Nov, 27 2009 @ 11:47 PM
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Originally posted by oliveoil
I am addressing everyone and anyone who has problem against Christians.
First off when you say Christians, Who the H. E. double hockey sticks are you referring to?
There are over twenty two denominations and or sects and they are not all the same.

Second, What is your big problem anyway? Is it that we have faith and believe in Christ?
Is it that we Cloth the poor? Feed the Hungry? Comfort the sick?Help the homeless?
(Whens the last time you did that?)

Or maybe its because of our close ties to Judaism and Israel.

FACT: America is a Christian country and was founded on Christian Values.

Our national motto is IN GOD WE TRUST for crying out loud,Which in my opinion is undeniable PROOF that the United States government acknowledges that the God of the Christian Bible exists.

If you have a problem with Christians you have a problem with America. And God knows America does not need anymore problems. So please, just CHILL OUT !!

Mods:please feel free to post where you think appropriate.



A couple of pieces of advice from one well-meaning Christian to another...

1) There are some who will hate you simply for being a Christian or having faith. You cannot reason with most of these people, so don't let them get you on the defensive, or otherwise get under your skin. These people get pleasure out of negativity and will base their choices around that. Arguing or fighting with people like this is just giving them what they want. They don't even care if it's destructive to themselves, so long as it's destructive to you as well. If they insist on behaving as those under the influence of evil, it's only fair and prudent to treat them as such. Fortunately, most people seem to really fall under my next point instead...

2) There are others who are extremely turned off by your approach here, and you'll get a lot of flack for that, from people who otherwise might agree with you on many things. If you want them to respect your faith, you will need to respect that they have other views. Saying that "this is a Christian nation" is not only factually false, but also quite insulting, even to a number of Christians. Please don't try to force Christianity down anyone's throats. We all need to remember that most faiths, and even a number of agnostics and atheists, actually agree on basic morals and how to live an honorable life. There is a ridiculous amount of petty bickering and hostilities between denominations and religions over the minor details, which apparently blinds us to the fact that we actually agree about many bigger things. It's really sad that some people are actually offended to hear me say that and suggest that they reach out and respect each other.



posted on Nov, 27 2009 @ 11:54 PM
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reply to post by someguy420
 


Yes, I would say that Jeshua is "The Man in The Clouds" as some understand it.
You see, before I became a Christian, I thought there may be a god or goddess(or aliens) that orchestrated our lives, (or used us as guinea pigs in an experiment)
but, I had NO CLUE what was going on FOR SURE!!!
I failed to mention i was also paranoid, and bi-polar with psychotic tendencies, but whatever, i was seriously confused and cynical.
When I asked Jeshua to forgive me, I IMMEDIATELY CHANGED and felt Him put His glorious arms around me!!!
The next morning, i didnt need any speed or cigarettes to "get me going" and that was the
biggest clue that I had really been transformed.
In fact i literally couldnt remember the bad stuff in my previous life!

I didnt even realize Jesus was real and then He has been the most real thing in my adult life. Peace to you friend.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:03 AM
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Wow!!! Christians....you people are bigger zealots than any terrorist out there.

You believe in a man made philosophy that is so deranged it should be linked right in there with Hitler.

How audacious you folks are.

You are so concerned with saving the "souls" of us heathens, that you can't even see that you are contradicting the entire premise of the religion you adhere to. I don't recall any of you followers doing one single act or miracle that your supposed jesus did. I know people that can walk on fire but I haven't seen any of you walk on water. Didn't your leader say you could do all those things he did? You follow in blindness not knowing that stepping outside the box and questioning your beliefs is the very thing you need to do.

Jesus and satan went into the desert for 40 days and nights and jesus was tempted by 3 temptations....What a story. Who wrote the details down? Jesus or Satan? It would do you all good to go thru your bible (whichever version you chose...King James, Scofield, etc.) and take a pad of paper and write down your answers to each verse in the bible with these questions in mind....

1. Who was there?
2. Who saw it?
3. Who wrote it down?

It has more holes than the 911 story. This is the same basis that any court of law would ask you for before being tried.

Do you folks really need someone to tell you where you came from and why you are here?

It's the same with all religions. Someone wants to feel powerful, so they say they have a direct link to G.O.D. (guns, oil, drugs) They tell me what a bad person I am (sinner) and if I believe their way and adhere to all the "rules" (10 commandments, holy trinity, died for "your" sins...blah, blah, blah) I will get to spend "eternity" in a really cool place called heaven and sit and play a harp and sing psalms all day....Hmmmeeemmm..sounds like the way I want to spend eternity. Or, don't believe your way and go to total damnation in hell for eternity...No better way to scare the masses into submission than by making them afraid...I seem to recall that most governments use that tactic too.

Here is a really simple test for all you christians. See if you can do this for one day and see what it does. You don't need all the rules and regulations you live under to "save" your fellow man. Try this...........

1. Always tell the truth. (that could bring down governments and empires)
2. Do not violate the rights of your fellow man...If you have to ask what those rights are or who your fellow man is, you don't deserve to know.

3.If you have a belief in a God, keep it to yourself.

Now then, wasn't that simple. It would cause world peace overnight and would help us as a species to move forward. Just remember, a belief is nothing but a thought that you continue to think..over and over.

Change your thinking, change your world.

You cannot be poor enough to help the poor. You cannot be hungry enough to help the starving. You cannot bring about peace by protesting war. You are still focused upon war. Focus on what you want to come about and not what you "don't want".

What if the world is the way it is (global warming, rape, death, disease, economic disaster, wars) because "THAT" is the plan? Do you really want to step in there and try and change your creators plan?

Evolution is in fact real. 100 gazillion years ago, man found out he could hit 2 stones together and make a thing we now call fire. They probaly called it something else but who cares. Now, we throw away a Bic lighter because it is disposable.....I'd say that is pretty evolved.

Think about it before you bash me.

peas



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:11 AM
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reply to post by oliveoil
 


We're referring to all of your denominations and sects. For most of us, the problem is people who profess to be Christians but cannot live their own faith. Don't think that we are ignorant of the tenets of your faith just because we are not members of your church.

I do not believe that you are rejoicing, nor being exceeding glad (see Matthew 5:10-12). You want to attack us with your faith, but you are unable to live it yourself. This is the crux (pun intended) of the matter for most non-believers. In your zest to defend your religion, you have exemplified the very characteristics that non-believers have come to find disgusting in people who profess to have faith. Your failure to adhere to the standards set in your religion while simultaneously judging the rest of us is what we loathe about you.

Our big problem, again, is when you clearly don't live your faith but claim that you do, then attack us for our lack of faith. It's when you don't clothe the poor as you are instructed. It's when you don't feed the hungry as you are instructed. It's when you don't comfort the sick or help the homeless, and still affix the label of Christian to yourself. That is what we hate. We hate your duplicity. We hate your lie. The last time we did any of those things is irrelevant. We aren't commanded to do so. And no one in their right minds, regardless of whether they believe in the divinity of Christ would hate you for actually living a good life.

As for your little tangent about your ties to Judaism, I actually laughed out loud at that. Your close ties to the people who killed your lord and savior are *hilarious* (and befuddling) to the rest of us... Especially when we have seen how so few of you are actually capable of forgiving others.


Originally posted by oliveoil
FACT: America is a Christian country and was founded on Christian Values.


That's an opinion and you know it. Again, when people claiming to be Christians *LIE* despite being commanded to be truthful, we lose even more respect for you. What is a fact is that our country was founded on principles of religious freedom, and the only people who don't remember that tend to profess a belief in one of the three major Abrahamic religions. The rest of us take note of that sort of thing.

Also, out of curiosity, how do you think Jesus would feel about his father's name on America's favorite idol (money)? Do you think he appreciates the pathetic lip service that we pay to the supreme creator by tossing him a shout out on a quarter?

While I do have a problem with *some* Christians (namely those who cannot seem to live their own faith, though I dearly love the ones who can), it does not follow that I have some implied problem with America as a result of that. Your statement on this is so unbelievably unfair. It's like saying that if I have a problem with Eskimos, I have a problem with ice cream. Your line of reasoning is insulting. And saying infuriating things like that is yet another reason why non-believers don't respect you.

And so what if I do have a problem with America? I'm not allowed to disagree with America because I live here? I may not have agreed with everything my parents said or did throughout my life, but I love them tremendously, and I would never wish for different ones.

Your OP is actually the perfect example of the problem that we have with you. If you can't see why, then I feel sad for you. I can only hope that one day you come to find actual faith and comfort in your own religion. If you had it, you'd never have written the original post.

-FT.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:16 AM
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spirituality is agreat thing.
too bad religeon ruins it.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:22 AM
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reply to post by oliveoil
 


Actually, America was founded on Masonic values, not Christian.

I feel where you're coming from, but the answer is understanding instead of anger.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:23 AM
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Please bear with me because Im a little 'rusty' with quoting on here lol.

Originally posted by theonlyrusty


You are so concerned with saving the "souls" of us heathens, that you can't even see that you are contradicting the entire premise of the religion you adhere to. I don't recall any of you followers doing one single act or miracle that your supposed jesus did. I know people that can walk on fire but I haven't seen any of you walk on water. Didn't your leader say you could do all those things he did?

Jeshua said, if we had faith the size of a mustard seed we could and even that can be hard on us mere mortals with ego, lusts etc.. But, not tooting my own horn, I've seen MANY miracles. I even prayed out a woman's burn on her hands before.


You follow in blindness not knowing that stepping outside the box and questioning your beliefs is the very thing you need to do.

Questioning with a sincere (not sinful) heart is GREAT.


Jesus and satan went into the desert for 40 days and nights and jesus was tempted by 3 temptations....What a story. Who wrote the details down? Jesus or Satan? It would do you all good to go thru your bible (whichever version you chose...King James, Scofield, etc.) and take a pad of paper and write down your answers to each verse in the bible with these questions in mind....

1. Who was there?
2. Who saw it?
3. Who wrote it down?


You fail to realize the Holy Spirit was ALWAYS there!!!




Do you folks really need someone to tell you where you came from and why you are here?

Doesnt it make YOU wonder???





Just remember, a belief is nothing but a thought that you continue to think..over and over.


Like "this world sucks, man is selfish usually, etc, etc..........?




You cannot be poor enough to help the poor. You cannot be hungry enough to help the starving. You cannot bring about peace by protesting war. You are still focused upon war. Focus on what you want to come about and not what you "don't want"


thinking isnt enough, you have to physically DO SOMETHING also..


What if the world is the way it is (global warming, rape, death, disease, economic disaster, wars) because "THAT" is the plan? Do you really want to step in there and try and change your creators plan?

ummmm, thats not G-d's plan!!! Maybe the NWO or the vatican, but.

Peace



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:40 AM
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Nothing brings more joy to my life than laughing at xtians. Every time I see a massive load of xtian hypocrisy it's a rush.. like shooting up. Makes me feel alive, and the doc says laughter is good for health. Please don't go anywhere xtians I don't know what I would do without such entertainment.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:41 AM
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Clearskies..............

You are so brainwashed it is scary.

You answer questions with diatribe that can't be reasoned or discussed.

So, your all knowing creator decided he needed to create some outlandish species that needs to worship him or his "sun" (son)...

Does your God really need people to do "his" will and worship him because they (his creations) are all unworthy sinners? How insane is that?

You do nothing but spew the beliefs of those that spewed their beliefs upon you and you keep the momentum going. Good for you. I suppose that is what you need to experience in this world.

You cannot understand your own religion until you have mastered every other religion so you know what your "enemies" are coming at you with.

I imagine your next post will have something in tune with..........."Jesus is the son of God and I believe it cause I read it in the bible and the bible is the word of god"............

And you base your entire existence on that?.........All I can say is "wow"....

Go outside and get some fresh air.

peas



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:51 AM
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reply to post by oliveoil
 


Have you ever listened to a billy Graham speech? or even the other evaginicals on tv?
If you want a more personal interaction well then I was in private catholic school for three years and they the kids thought they were better than anybody in public school and I came from public school so that was fun.
That is probably thanks to an elitist type mind that we're rich you're poor type mentality. But my friend was a Methodist who came to the catholic school, I don't know why he was there, but he was treated like crap and teased.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:52 AM
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Holy crap I can't belive I still even come to this website.
Yeah!!! Rah, rah rah.
Sorry guys I just read the first post and I couldn't help but feel the need to cheerlead!

"In god we trust" = Christians are right and you ALL ARE WRONG... Furthrmore, you're all GOING TO HELL.

Jeeze, lighten up!



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:53 AM
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Originally posted by Clearskies
ummmm, thats not G-d's plan!!! Maybe the NWO or the vatican, but.


How do you know it's not Gad's (I guessed the middle letter
) plan?

Doesn't she move in mysterious ways?

I'm interested. how do you know Gad's plan anyway? What is it, please?

Nice of you to pray out a burn. Maybe you could pray a leg back for that guy who lost his?




posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:57 AM
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In my experience, I tend to find a lot of people who try and live by the word tend to have deficits in their life that they do not understand or want to deal with. So they seek a higher guidance. I have also known people (and still do) who simply believe in good vibes and get the same effect concerning their spirituality. I'm turned off by those who try and shove their beliefs down the throats of others under the conception of there is a higher power. I do not believe this to be true and feel sorry for those who walk around with the belief that when they die they will be in the kingdom so to speak as terrorists also think that they will be in the company of virgins when they die. In my opinion, its all about what one has to do and believe in to get by in life. Sadly many of the most undesirable people I have ever met have been self described christians or, believers in god. If there really is a higher being, then I would tend to think he would know who is doing good things in life to and for others and in general, being a good human without having to go to church, midnight preachings, revivals and the other non sense that goes on. I also think that a "higher being" would instruct those who believe in him not to down others who do not follow their belief system if he really did create mankind in his likeness.

"How could God let this happen?....Perhaps there is your answer."

[edit on 28-11-2009 by mikelee]



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 01:02 AM
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I usually do not have a problem with
anyone who can present themselves or
thier position in a thoughtful, intelligent
manner. You could not do either.

What I have a "problem" with YOU is
your arrogance, ignorance, and general
lack of the history of this country. I was
actually expecting you to tell me that if
I was not a Christian, then I should leave.
You know, the whole love it your leave it
routine.

I would hope that the people here who
are real Christians are just as upset as
us heathens when some pinhead complains
" In God We Trust"

In closing I will agree with you on one
thing you wrote. Yes, you do have a problem
with me.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 01:04 AM
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reply to post by Clearskies
 


I'm not saying that what Christians call "god" doesn't exist, in fact I know personally that it does, just not in the sense that most Christians believe. I know that what you call god exists, but I don't give it any names or human like attributes.

You all have to remember that it was us humans who "named" god, and created HIM from OUR likeness , when in fact "god" is nameless.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 01:10 AM
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Originally posted by oliveoil
Or maybe its because of our close ties to Judaism and Israel.


Did you know Judaism is a religion dedicated to misleading people into worshipping Egyptian gods?

There is no evidence that certain people such as Abraham ever existed but there is evidence that a Pharaoh with the same name did exist in the same time that Abraham was supposed to.

[edit on 11/28/2009 by nightmarehalo]



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 01:17 AM
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ATS has gone from being an open source forum about all topics of interest to people whinging about religion or crying about what a bad rap religion or religious sects are getting.

EVERYDAY there is a new thread about some religious debate or another and it FLAMES on and on with two sides taking aim at one another. starring and flagging. I know if i dont like it dont get involved and i agree there is nothing forcing me to participate. But im seeing an ugly trend here. I seriously think some people create inflammatory threads that are by their very nature sensitive subjects to be and that will garner a response based on emotion and not rational debate.

Before you know the thread is doing warp speed off topic as people throw barbs at one another and question each others sense of intelligence and ability to be logical. THIS IS NOT CONSTRUCTIVE, This is a CONSPIRACY site not a " i want to talk about my feelings site"

AT best this is a RANT. At worst this is a cheap attempt to garner points. Regardless there seems to be alot of tension in this forum and all i see is people trying to out prove everybody else. What the hell happened to agree to disagree.

What the hell is happening to this site???



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 01:24 AM
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I dont hate them...i do very much dislike them....they make me throw up a little in mouth when they start talking about god and then crying....

Billy Gramhn, Pat Robertson, The 500 Club dude....unless thats pat Robertson I don't know......Jim Baker...Larry Craig...im sure im missing millions more...but you get the point. Most 'christians' are nothing more than people who can't live for themselves and need to be defined by a made up image.

Like I said....when most of them open their mouths....I throw up a little. And somewhere a puppy is probably kicked.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 01:29 AM
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reply to post by reasonable
 


It is very amusing that everyone uses the word "believe" - which is "to hope something is true and real". God does not exist. Those who claim to believe in god have a very mild mental condition - that's all. If they were born in other countries, or had other parents, they would be following another religion.

There are other people who just don't have the condition. No matter how much you show them, tell them, lead them and preach - they just look at you blankly and say "I don't get it". They will NEVER be religious - they don't have the condition.

Those with the condition will NEVER see through their religion - no matter how much logic and clear thinking you present to them, they won't change. People like that Ray Comfort and Kirk Cameron character are good examples. You can get these people to agree to your line of reasoning right up to the point where is shows religion is not correct - and they immediately jump away from your train of logic into some "off the planet" god solution. Their brains do not allow them to go there.

Maybe one day we will discover what this condition is and if there is a treatment for it. Life would be much more honest and less judgemental without this condition blurring so many brains.





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