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The Cholesterol 'Paradox'

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posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 04:40 AM

posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 10:47 AM
Is Cholesterol Relevant to Heart Disease?

For years I have been saying that cholesterol is irrelevant to cardiovascular disease. At first my "hopeless bias" was based primarily on my awareness that in some 50% of new heart attacks, cholesterol values were well within the accepted norm for the times.

Naturally I have been looking for evidence to support my radical thoughts. This new Framingham data (Association of Circulating Cholesteryl Ester Transfer Protein Activity With Incidence of Cardiovascular Disease in the Community, Ramachandran S and others. Circulation. 30 November, 2009) is unusually convincing.

The Framingham study was started just after my internship in 1955 and has proven to be of tremendous help to public health and preventive medicine. Initiating a longitudinal study of all the factors associated with cardiovascular disease was the original intent of this program but while I was getting my MPH ( Master in Public Heath ) at Johns Hopkins in 1958, cholesterol's role suddenly changed from associated to causative with not even one piece of
supportive data.

The only reasonable explanation for these extraordinary findings is that cholesterol is irrelevant to the atherosclerotic process.

Duane Graveline MD MPH
Former USAF Flight Surgeon
Former NASA Astronaut
Retired Family Doctor

posted on Dec, 22 2009 @ 02:11 AM
im sure that 50 year old study is still relevatn with 2009.

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 04:59 AM
reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd

The secret behind the Cholesterol Paradox are: Chlorine in the water Reacts with saturated fat like Whale Blubbers and since non-westernized Inuits are not exposed to chlorine the saturated fat that they eat are won't cause heart attack

[edit on 5-2-2010 by masonicon]

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 05:26 AM
This is a great thread!!! Thanks!!!.......

I started statins about 30 days ago and stopped a week ago as the side effects are just too much.....Did some research into natural cholesterol reducing and found Profibe - a product that I read claims a 92% "success" rate. I'm waiting delivery of this stuff and wonder if anyone has any experience with it or other "natural" solutions toward maintaining "good" cholesterol levels..........


posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 07:01 AM
reply to post by prjct

You may be familiar with a daily serving of 30~50 grams of oats or barley.

The beta glucan fiber which is only present in these 2 grains albeit with a little trace amount also in rye, traps cholesterol from getting re-absorbed back in the bloodstream, so it goes away when the body *ahem*, does its purging in the toilet....

Also, more natural/herbal practitioners will immediately recommend Red Yeast Rice.

It is one of the natural therapies with clinical studies/trials behind to support its effectiveness.

Also, garlic was shown in animal studies to block just like statins do, HMG CoA pathway.

Garlic blocks a little earlier in the pathway, thus greatly lessening the side effects.

[edit on 5-2-2010 by jjjtir]

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 07:16 AM
Paradox covered by the video in this thread.

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 11:24 AM
Great post Dev!

Some points i wanted to bring up,

The cause of heart disease and clogged arteries actually seems to be the so called heart healthy oils they push now a days(corn, soy, rapeseed, olive etc.). Due to the nature of unsaturated fat it is easily oxidized in the presence of heat or light exposure and because of this basically every vegetable oil you get the store(except for a few) will be oxidized/rancid. There is a definite correlation between the rise in heart disease and the use of vegetable oils. The fat in clogged arteries is actually only 20% saturated the other portion being primarily poly unsaturated.

Another issue is the fact that essentially every mammal on earth derives the majority of their energy from saturated fats (short chain fatty acids via gut fermentation). Why do these animals experience no problems??

My last point, short chain and medium chain fatty acids, the first one is always saturated and you produce it in your gut, are probably the best surce of energy available to animals. They instantly are absorbed when eaten and require to bile like glucose(they are actually more similar to glucose then long chain fatty acids) but they produce 441 ATP per molecule vs 38 ATP per glucose molecule. That is pretty damn significant.

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 12:27 PM
reply to post by Sourdough4life

Excellent post. I couldn't agree more.

Fat = Efficiency

And, as you've pointed out, it is prefered by the body. Thanks for sharing.


Edit to add: Welcome to ATS! Not a bad first post, eh?

[edit on 5-2-2010 by DevolutionEvolvd]

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 12:29 PM
reply to post by Sourdough4life

Good luck convincing people to ditch olive oil, the chief central oil of the Mediterranean diet, a large number of the world's population follow it.

In spite of oxidizing easily, olive oil contains some polyphenols and flavonoids, antioxidant compounds.

Those who really adopt the diet know to take proper care of the oil, protecting it from light and in an air tight container, not the usual supermarket metal containers where most people punch a 1~3 milimeter hole and forget about it, leaving the container open to oxygen 24 hours per day.

Most metal containers don't have the pull-up closing system yet, so conscious people prefer the glass version, where it can be closed to avoid oxidation.

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 01:33 PM
It's the polyunsaturated vegetable oils (except omega 3) that are causing most of the damage. Of course, olive oil, made of oleic acid, has a low smoke point so cooking with it is not a great idea.

The point I made in the OP is that olive oil is not a miracle oil and that it was simply used as a way to solve a paradox.

I mean, if there is one oil I could have in my would be coconut oil. Hands Down.


posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 01:42 PM
I would think that the high level of flouride in our water would be the cause of many of the increased health problems in America.

I will stick to my liquor thank you very much.


posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 02:21 PM
reply to post by FoxStriker

That's fine.....but what you "think" doesn't explain why other countries that don't fluoridate their water supplies still have a high prevalence of the same chronic diseases.


posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 02:33 PM
reply to post by jjjtir


Meditteranean cultures do use small amounts of olive oil but the main oils used for the most part are actually animal fats(especially for cooking). The government and government funded researchers love to perpetuate the use of carbs(whole grains) and "heart healthy" oils in these long lived cultures but neglect there rampant use of animal products to try to conform to the goverment recommended diet. I actually think its just one big conspiracy to keep americans dumb, sick and lazy.

The real meditteranean diet is loaded with saturated fat, cheese, butter, lard, duck fat, meat etc. Even sourdough bread the traditional meditteranean bread is loaded with saturated fat(SCFA) when long fermented.

[edit on 5-2-2010 by Sourdough4life]

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 02:34 PM

Originally posted by DevolutionEvolvd
it would be coconut oil.


No doubt, the stuff is awesome!

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 03:00 PM
I was on statins several years ago and I quit them due to the side effects. After my own study of the subject I have concluded they are just a way for the drug companies to make money.

If a person is worried about cholesterol, which I am not, you can simply eat a pink grapefruit daily and for extra measure swallow a little of the fluffy white stuff inside the peel.

I had a good friend who was a pathologist/toxicologist, was the good laboratory practices czar for Bristol Meyers Squibb, later ran his own drug testing laboratory and did long term studies for every major drug company.
He told me in his later years that he ascribed the bulk of the health problems he ever had to "allopathic medicine". When he was diagnosed with cancer and given 6 months to live almost 20 years ago he told his oncologist who wanted him to start some chemo-therapy drug "I tested that stuff and saw what it did to animals, if you think you are going to use it on me you are crazy". He cured the cancer with megadose IV sodium ascorbate (vitamin C) 50 grams a day for two weeks. He told me a lump the size of a golf ball on his neck went away and skin cancers turned white, dried up and fell off. He was a "Big-Pharma" insider and became a proponent of natural and alternative therapies. He told me that any treatment for any disease that does not have the possibility of big money for the pharmaceutical industry will be suppressed and labeled quackery no matter how safe and effective it is.

posted on Feb, 5 2010 @ 03:09 PM
Thought i would put this here because i feel this goes along with the post subject

In 1985, scientists made an important discovery. Ascorbic acid (Vitamin C) is the human body's natural HMG-CoA reductase inhibitor.
  • When vitamin C levels are low, the body compensates and manufactures more cholesterol; when levels are high, the vitamin inhibits HMG-CoA reductase, lowering cholesterol.

    Seems like vitamin C may act as a natural statin.

  • posted on Feb, 6 2010 @ 03:00 AM
    reply to post by Sourdough4life

    I know olive isn't the sole oil used, should have expressed myself better.

    What I meant to say by "chief central oil" is that it is in almost the majority of recipes even if the amount is small, among the ingredient list.

    posted on Feb, 6 2010 @ 03:14 AM
    reply to post by Sourdough4life

    Thanks for your link about Vitamin C. A couple of journal citations there.

    The particular one you refer to was cited more than 20 times by other researchers, at least it got some attention...

    One thing I noticed, is that many physicians out there with dynamic schedules simply do not have time anymore to keep up with research and articles published.

    The biological and medical journals today number in the hundreds. Some monthly, some weekly.

    But in the information age, important articles published can and sometimes do fall off the radar. Not every article is given attention in the news.

    [edit on 6-2-2010 by jjjtir]

    posted on Feb, 25 2010 @ 06:12 PM

    Two laboratory machines have played a role in perhaps the greatest medical misadventure of our time: the indictment of a villain — LDL cholesterol — with the ultimate crime of the heart, coronary artery disease.

    One machine delivered the early, misleading evidence of cholesterol's guilt, and another may have just nabbed the actual killer. And because the killer's likeliest and earliest targets are men, we'd all better pay attention to the new case being made against it.

    Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

    Good read.

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