Metallic saucer filmed on my mobile phone {{Identified}}

He figured out the phone # of his parents neighbors (or his neighbors as he calls it) real quick living approx 350 miles away.

How convenient! Probably just remembered the phone number because they we so close friends!

So close friends that they never noticed any balloons before but then the neighbor new why he was calling.

115 flags.

ATS must be proud!

Originally posted by Wookiep

Originally posted by mckyle

Originally posted by Wookiep

Yes, I agree. It does kind-of point more fingers at the OP for his *criminality* lol.

My analogy was casting the OP in a more favourable light ;-)

[edit on 27-11-2009 by mckyle]

Well, in fact I was also putting the OP in a favorable light hence the stars around *criminality*.

lol this was to point out his "guilt" that so many others have seemed to accuse him of...in this case it was free_spirit being the accuser/cop. :p

LOL - I get you now. My apologies for misconstruing your reply. Though I knew you weren't suggesting anything untoward to the OP.

Originally posted by free_spirit
No so fast people. The point of showing the Colorado saucer balloon to echeleon117 is
precisely to demonstrate there are saucer shaped balloons, weather or not anywhere,
echeleon117 declared his neighbor told him i guess by phone he had a weather balloon

I see your rationale, but I don't agree with it.

I think if you wanted to keep things neutral, and void of suggestion, you could have presented a less emotive/suggestive photo of a common, everyday, weather balloon.

The one you showed is a highly-publicised one-off that is not a weather balloon, and has been associated with a major hoax! It's iconic of something that is contrary to the information provided by the OP's neighbor.

It would have been just as easy to post a generic pic and say to the op: "describe this to your neighbor over the phone to see if it is what he has?"


[edit on 27-11-2009 by mckyle]

Originally posted by william.gauncents

I remember only getting that excited one time in my life.

It was while I was watching Sesame Street while I was a child.

While looking at snuffaluffagus I originally thought it was a hairy elephant only then did I realize that after a google search some 30 years later for it's full name, I found out his full name was Aloysius Snuffleupagus.

I wish I had myself on cam because I can't remember if I was swearing out loud and breathing heavy.

[edit on 27-11-2009 by william.gauncents]

I am sorry to hear about your traumatic revelation regarding Mr. snuffaluffagus.

It explains a lot.

Originally posted by william.gauncents
115 flags.

ATS must be proud!

And you must be jealous.

Get a life.

Originally posted by free_spirit
But later on he retracted himself for some reason not clear, uploaded again the three
videos and started a second thread with the same case simultaneous that the original
wich doesn't make sense, he could have made an update.

You're being selective in what you bring forth about the new post by the OP: you know why he posted a new thread about this! He goes in detail to explain that he couldn't update the original video links!

Forgive me if I am wrong, but this seems a little dishonest to not mention this, when you were the last poster at that new thread. You must have seen his explanation, but now you throw it up as a point of suspicion regarding the OP's motives

HERE is an explaination by the OP for making the new thread.

AND HERE is where he reiterates his reason for making a new thread.

How could you have missed that?


[edit on 27-11-2009 by mckyle]

[edit on 27-11-2009 by mckyle]

To my very good friend Internos: you are the reason I try to ensure sound investigation into this phenomena.

Thank you mate for being a great inspiraton to myself and many, many others

I miss you my friend. I hope you appear on the boards again soon!

Originally posted by Horza

Originally posted by djusdjus
You are blaming the people of the world for being critical of the videos and not jumping in and slapping the op on the back and telling him how marvelous he is for posting blurry vids that are suspect for several reasons?

Actually, he is blaming people for not being critical of the video.

Critical analysis is when you offer some information, evidence or proof that backs up an hypothesis you are making about a particular subject.

This is the kind of post he is referring to:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

All this guy offers is a personal attack and an opinion ...

Not very helpful at all ...

Unfortunately, this kind of post happens all to often here on ATS.

All they do is show ignorance ... they certainly don't deny it.

Horza: I would kiss you - if I were more secure in my manhood!

Most people visiting this site have no idea of what constitutes critical thinking/analysis. Unfortunately, too many, like djusdjus, for example, think to be critical is to reject! Nothing could be further from the truth!

To be critical of evidence, statements, etc. merely means to study them closely with an open, unbiased, mind!

This really should be hammered out to all members who struggle to put together a good argument! I don't mean that patronisingly! We all need to learn to be critical! It doesn't come naturally.

In doing so, you'll open many new doors within your mind, and start seeing the world in a very different way!

It would be time-consuming, but it would be great if newer members could submit their paper/thesis/report to a group of members who could offer a critique and suggestions. Perhaps that's not practical. But if it could be done, it would really lift the standard of ATS articles and be a great help for members in general.

Originally posted by free_spirit
... Anyway the real issue here
is so simple, so easy and so necessary: Why don't you go with your neighbor take your
videocamera and ask him to show you that saucer shaped weather balloon, that would
determine the course of this case.

Agreed.

This would help clear up things immensely. A pic of the neighbour's weather balloon would be especially helpful.

I can't access the videos on YOUTUBE; I get that they have been removed by the user. I would have liked to see them. Is there anywhere else that I can see them on the interne?

Originally posted by rachel07
I can't access the videos on YOUTUBE; I get that they have been removed by the user. I would have liked to see them. Is there anywhere else that I can see them on the interne?

Hi rachel07 - He re-posted them on YT a while back. Refer to this point in the thread where the links are now:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Oh come on people.... I can tell these are fake in the first 5 seconds!



Every time the camera shakes the UFO bounces all over the place. This is a classic sign of very HORRIBLE "motion tracking".

Use an object that is actually in the video as a measuring device. Use the top of the house and the side of the house for reference by looking at it, then watch the UFO move around every time the camera moves.

what a CRAPPY attempt at CGI. I can't believe anyone would ever try to pass this off as real.

I think this topic should be thrown in the HOAX forum and the OP banned.

[edit on 27-11-2009 by ALLis0NE]

-edit-

I'm going to stablize the video using the house as a reference, then show you how it bounces around... I'll post back.

[edit on 27-11-2009 by ALLis0NE]

Originally posted by Wookiep
reply to post by mckyle

 

...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/1491bc517d09.jpg[/atsimg]

...

[edit on 27-11-2009 by Wookiep]

I have a small.... theory!

What if the neighbour does indeed have a weather balloon?
(A balloon which looks like the one in the picture above, from wookieb's previous post. THANKS WOOKIE!!)

What if that balloon was actually the 2nd object in the videos, which rises above the trees on the left, and moves back and forth as it rises... just like a... tethered balloon in the wind would do?

What if the large saucer shaped object was not in fact a balloon?

What if several people saw the saucer shaped object and called the neighbour to ask if he knew what the h*ll it was?

He'd think that they were talking about his weather balloon! and he'd probably get a laugh out of so many people thinking that it was a UFO!

Echelon then phones a few days later, and asks "this probably sounds crazy, but do you own..." at which point, the neighbour KNOWS whats coming, and starts laughing! Because he knows that Echelon is asking about the "UFO" balloon.

Echelon thinks "oh, well... that's that..." BUT the neighbour may be talking about the smaller object to the left, not the main saucer shaped object.

Echelon has been completely honest.
Neighbour has been honest too.
But the mystery remains!

yes? no? maybe? keep taking the tablets?

When I said...

Originally posted by ALLis0NE
I can tell these are fake in the first 5 seconds!

...I wasn't joking.

Here is a stabilized version of the first 3 seconds of the video:



You can clearly see the object move up, left, right, all around, exactly when he moves his camera. Balloons don't move like this.... and if it is a real UFO, then it must be watching the camera man, and moving every time his hand shakes which I believe is B.S.

This is another CGI HOAX, and I can see it clear as day. I am hardly ever wrong too... Again, I think this topic should be moved to the HOAX forum, and the OP should be removed from the forum.

P.S. I'm trying to stabilize it more. Ill re-post if I can.


[edit on 27-11-2009 by ALLis0NE]

Here is a second pass of the deshaker filter. It's not that much better, but I looped it this time for better analysis.



Clearly, if you study the object, you can see it move left with the camera, move up when the camera moves up, and move left when the camera moves left. This is a sign of very bad motion tracking.

Case Closed in my book, this is a HOAX.

Originally posted by Gordi The Drummer

I have a small.... theory!

What if the neighbour does indeed have a weather balloon?
(A balloon which looks like the one in the picture above, from wookieb's previous post.
THANKS WOOKIE!!)

What if that balloon was actually the 2nd object in the videos, which rises above
the trees on the left, and moves back and forth as it rises... just like a... tethered
balloon in the wind would do?

What if the large saucer shaped object was not in fact a balloon?

That's an interesting theory, if confirmed would explain the balloon - UFO controversy.
The posible confusion among the videographer and the neighbor makes sense to me
and I think that makes more necessarily to talk again with that neighbor.

On the other hand ALLis0NE is proposing the CGI theory wich at this moment I think
has not been discarded, not to my knowledge that is I don't know if the raw footage
has been analyzed yet to find out if there is any digital manipulation, if I'm wrong
correct me. So what's the actual status of this case? In my opinion still inconclusive.
The footage is certainly interesting and I would love this sighting to be authentic but
discretion is advised when confronting such kind of evidence and we have to be very
sure that all the the posible explanations have been explored.

Originally posted by mckyle

Originally posted by william.gauncents
115 flags.

ATS must be proud!

And you must be jealous.

Get a life.

Of course I am.

What's not to be jealous of here?

Why is it that all can do is critique others methods of sifting through BS?

Do we need to get a "investigator" badge from you?

When calling a spade a spade means that I don't have a life, then I should probably go kill myself.

Have you wondered why nobody has properly or professionally analyzed this
this garbage? Probably not. You are too busy trying to think of another way to insult me with $10 words and phrases.

I don't think my words should be taken lightly.

I am a professional graphic artist, I have a background in special effects, 3D modeling, game design, and I am a profound video and image analyst.

You can take my opinion as a professional analysis.

Although I don't have access to the original data, in this case it is not needed. The object in the video is CLEARLY moving in sync with the camera shake.

That means:

A) A real UFO is watching the camera man's hands shake, and is flying exactly with it. (b.s.)

B) The UFO is directly attached to the camera in some way. (i don't think so)

C) It is a CGI composite on a real video with a crappy motion tracking implementation. (I believe it is).

I believe C is the correct answer. You can clearly see the software that was used to do the motion tracking of the UFO so that it moves with the camera shake was not working properly, or not configured correctly.

It's CGI.

Watch this video and learn:

Think of the text as the ufo.


First you can see the Text move with the camera shake, but it still slightly bounces around EXACTLY like the UFO in the OP.

Next, you can see when the narrator sets the "tracker", which is a square box that selects pixels to track. The creator of the OP's video probably used the rafters on the house for a tracking point, that is why he left the rafters in the video for most of the shot. Maybe even used the house for a tracking point, or another bad spot.

Sometimes, because of perspective, when the camera pans or rotates, one section of the video will move faster than another section of video. When you set your "tracker" to the section that moves more or less yet your object is in the opposite side, you get tracking errors.

I believe the OP's video is showing these tracking errors caused by slight changes of perspective.

-edit to add-

When you move a camera around, things that are closer to you move more than things that are further away. If you set a tracker on something that is close to you, yet the object that is going to to be using the tracking is supposed to be far away, the object is going to move like it is closer. You must set the tracker on something that is in the distance so that the object using the tracker will move as if it is off in the distance.

Look at this image:


If i set the tracker closer to the camera next to the dark blue cylinder, yet I wanted the object to look further away next to the light blue tube, it wont look right. The object will move as if it was closer.


I think the error is similar to that in the OP's video. They set the tracker in the incorrect place, causing tracking errors.


[edit on 27-11-2009 by ALLis0NE]

reply to post by ALLis0NE


Allisone- I can't lie, you make a good presentation. I'm no CGI expert so I can only assume you know your stuff. Is there any way you could stabilize all 3 videos at full length for us to see? If you'd like the raw videos tell me where/how to send them to you. (tho, I won't be able to do that till tonight since I'm on a short break) Also, are there any other CGI experts on ATS that can double-confirm this so to speak?