aLEX jONES LIES ABOUT Operation Northwoods.

reply to post by ecoparity


I voted for that fool too....... The second time we were screwed either way.

reply to post by ecoparity


I agree with you. AJ did and do great job by awaking people. Everybody with bit critical thinking will soon realize his contradictions and misinterpretations and start own research/fact checking. Still - compared with MSM he is valuable source of information. But quality of info vary highly.
APF was thoroughly discussed in this ATS thread:
www.abovetopsecret.com
Qoute from page linked above (originally AP article, source linked in thread):

"They're really invisible," said Alan Chvotkin, executive vice president and counsel for the Professional Services Council. The group's members include major security contractors Triple Canopy, DynCorp and Xe Services, formerly known as Blackwater Worldwide.

In short APF is part of mercenary army at Blackwater/Xe scale (HUGE). Just speculation but I think that at least some of these groups have common personal/financial background. Maybe we can speak about one army with many PR front ends - who know?

Wow, what a useless post and terrible excerpt of the entire interview.

I remember listening to that broadcast; guess what? You're missing
some import information.

#1. Alex Jones is talking about somebody ACCUSING him of making up
the story about Northwoods.

#2. He is (was) making a parallel between Sept. 11th and Northwoods.
If you had the entire interview available instead of a deceptive 15 seconds
worth, you would know this. Even with that little bit you can understand
that the emphasis is on Northwoods and NOT Sept. 11th.

Notice he says Northwoods is documented and lists the sources. Here is
a nice link for anyone to read which contains the sources Alex talked about:

www.historycommons.org...

Beard, please be more careful when accusing others ... and please be
more thorough with your amount of information presented.

reply to post by beard


that's the best you can do to come up with an accusation is.. a youtube video.. LMAO ..

bring some docs and prove it..

reply to post by beard



Obviously not........


Did you listen to what he was saying ???

If you'd had recorded another 30 seconds it wouldn't sound like that at all.......


[edit on 24-11-2009 by SirPatrickHenry]

registered today just to bash alex right after climate change research center was hacked and the info proving man made global warming has been exagerated and alex is spreading the info like wildfire...

hmmm... seems Alex has the PTB scared

Originally posted by beard
Did operation northwoods state anything about flying jets into buildings and bombing DC?

If so, I beg you to please show me where it states it in the document. we all know Alex has all the documents. but...fails to have a website dedicated to all these secret documents.

So...I'm asking anyone to show me where it says in Op N'woods about flying jets into buildings and bombing DC. For the life of me I can't seem to find it.

Yes, Alex Jones is lying, but what's more, *everyone* is lying, as far as Northwoods is concerned. The whole plot was to stage a false flag event to justify war against Cuba...

-Blowing up and sinking a US warship in Guantanamo harbor, which, behind the scenes, would have been empty.

-Civilian aircraft beign harassed (but not shot down) by fighters mocked up in Cuban military colors, so the pasengers can report what the "Cubans" were doing.

-staging false attacks on Guantanamo with Cuban exiles in Cuban army uniforms to capture and "parade" to the reporters

-blowing up an passenger plane and reporting passengers being killed, which, behind the scenes, the plane would have been empty and the passengers never existing to begin with.

...but it was designed to NOT get any innocent people killed. The plan specifically wanted people to survive becuase they were going to be unwitting witnesses to report on Cuba's "aggression. Then, there's the obvious flaw that there was no guarantee that it'd even work! All the reporters needed to do is track down the next of kin of the listed dead passengers...and it's a given that they would...to find out they never existed and that somethign was fishy. The plan was scrapped and the guy who came up with it was fired, so we'll never know.


The reason I say everyone is lying is that they use this as an example that the gov't *would* commit a false flag operation, and that the gov't *would* kill innocent people, whent the reality shows that the exact opposite is true. Moreover, the gov't *admitted* they had such a plan, so it's unrealistic to claim there are all these secret plots goign on when they're not particularly trying to keep their plots secret.

Going to Alex Jones (or Morgan Reynolds, or "Loose Change", etc) for information on conspiracies is akin to going to Josef Goebbels for information on how bad the Jews are. The only reason you's be going to such characters with blatantly obvious agendas is if they were saying things you wanted to hear to begin with. People are being all paranoid over secret gov't 9/11 plots NOT becuase there really are any secret gov't 9/11 plots, but becuase all these damned fool conspiracy web sites are putting out rubbish exactly like this specifically to get people all paranoid over shadows.

stop feeding the troll.

reply to post by GoodOlDave



Speaking of Josef Goebbels he'd be proud to see what you posted right now.

This thread is much ado about nothing. Operation Northwoods was a false-flag terrorist plan remarkably similar to 9/11. The specific plan is immaterial. Phony terrorism is phony terrorism, whether it's Operation Northwoods, Gulf of Tonkin, the USS Liberty, Oklahoma City or 9/11. If the government planned it 45 years ago, they're certainly capable of doing it today -- and they have.

Among the actions recommended was "a series of well coordinated incidents to take place in and around" the U.S. Navy base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. This included dressing "friendly" Cubans in Cuban military uniforms and then have them "start riots near the main gate of the base. Others would pretend to be saboteurs inside the base. Ammunition would be blown up, fires started, aircraft sabotaged, mortars fired at the base with damage to installations."

The suggested operations grew progressively more outrageous. Another called for an action similar to the infamous incident in February 1898 when an explosion aboard the battleship Maine in Havana harbor killed 266 U.S. sailors. Although the exact cause of the explosion remained undetermined, it sparked the Spanish-American War with Cuba. Incited by the deadly blast, more than one million men volunteered for duty. Lemnitzer and his generals came up with a similar plan. "We could blow up a U.S. ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba," they proposed; "casualty lists in U.S. newspapers would cause a helpful wave of national indignation."

There seemed no limit to their fanaticism: "We could develop a Communist Cuban terror campaign in the Miami area, in other Florida cities and even in Washington," they wrote. "The terror campaign could be pointed at Cuban refugees seeking haven in the United States.

We could sink a boatload of Cubans en route to Florida (real or simulated). . . . We could foster attempts on lives of Cuban refugees in the United States even to the extent of wounding in instances to be widely publicized."

Bombings were proposed, false arrests, hijackings:

*"Exploding a few plastic bombs in carefully chosen spots, the arrest of Cuban agents and the release of prepared documents substantiating Cuban involvement also would be helpful in projecting the idea of an irresponsible government."

*"Advantage can be taken of the sensitivity of the Dominican [Republic] Air Force to intrusions within their national air space. 'Cuban' B-26 or C-46 type aircraft could make cane burning raids at night. Soviet Bloc incendiaries could be found. This could be coupled with 'Cuban' messages to the Communist underground in the Dominican Republic and 'Cuban' shipments of arms which would be found, or intercepted, on the beach. Use of MiG type aircraft by U.S. pilots could provide additional provocation."

*"Hijacking attempts against civil air and surface craft could appear to continue as harassing measures condoned by the Government of Cuba."

Among the most elaborate schemes was to "create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner en route from the United States to Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama or Venezuela. The destination would be chosen only to cause the flight plan route to cross Cuba. The passengers could be a group of college students off on a holiday or any grouping of persons with a common interest to support chartering a non-scheduled flight."

Lemnitzer and the Joint Chiefs worked out a complex deception:

An aircraft at Elgin AFB would be painted and numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered aircraft belonging to a CJA proprietary organization in the Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be substituted for the actual civil aircraft and would be loaded with the selected passengers, all boarded under carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered aircraft would be converted to a drone [a remotely controlled unmanned aircraft]. Take off times of the drone aircraft and the actual aircraft will be scheduled to allow a rendezvous south of Florida.

From the rendezvous point the passenger-carrying aircraft will descend to minimum altitude and go directly into an auxiliary field at Elgin AFB where arrangements will have been made to evacuate the passengers and return the aircraft to its original status. The drone aircraft meanwhile will continue to fly the filed flight plan. When over Cuba the drone will be transmitting on the international distress frequency a "May Day" message stating he is under attack by Cuban MiG aircraft. The transmission will be interrupted by destruction of the aircraft, which will be triggered by radio signal. This will allow ICAO [International Civil Aviation Organization radio stations in the Western Hemisphere to tell the U.S. what has happened to the aircraft instead of the U.S. trying to "sell" the incident.

Finally, there was a plan to "make it appear that Communist Cuban MiGs have destroyed a USAF aircraft over international waters in an unprovoked attack." It was a particularly believable operation given the decade of shoot downs that had just taken place.

In the final sentence of his letter to Secretary McNamara recommending the operations, Lemnitzer made a grab for even more power asking that the Joint Chiefs be placed in charge of carrying out Operation Northwoods and the invasion. "It is recommended," he wrote, "that this responsibility for both oven and covert military operations be assigned to the Joint Chiefs of Staff."

At 2:30 on the afternoon of Tuesday, March 13, 1962, Lemnitzer went over last-minute details of Operation Northwoods with his covert action chief, Brigadier General William H. Craig, and signed the document. He then went to a "special meeting" in McNamara's office. An hour later he met with Kennedy's military representative, General Maxwell Taylor. What happened during those meetings is unknown. But three days later, President Kennedy told Lemnitzer that there was virtually no possibility that the U.S. would ever use overt military force in Cuba.

Alex Jones was the only one who correctly predicted the 9/11 false flag terrorist attack just a couple months before it happened.

Originally posted by Doc Tesla
stop feeding the troll.

And that he is. He is also this person here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by SirPatrickHenry

Speaking of Josef Goebbels he'd be proud to see what you posted right now.

Don't be a putz. Is there one single thing in anything I said that was incorrect? Was my synopsis of the Northwoods operation wrong? Is my pointing out Jones' misrepresentation incorrect? We both know what I said is accurate, otherwise you'd be gleefully exposing me as a liar.

I'm sorry if the truth hurts, but believe me when I say I'm not here to criticize you or insult you. I'm here to point out exactly how you're being raped by these damned fool conspiracy sites. Tell me, since you think Alex Jones is such a champion of the truther movement, just what has he accomplished in all the years of broadcasting other than just feed you nonstop rubbish to keep you in a perpetual state of paranoia and helplessness? Can you name even one constructive accomplishment he's done?

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
The reason I say everyone is lying is that they use this as an example that the gov't *would* commit a false flag operation, and that the gov't *would* kill innocent people, whent the reality shows that the exact opposite is true.

The exact opposite is true? Why would they even produce this memo if the Joint Chiefs weren't considering actually doing it?

Our military kills innocent people every day, they're just foreigners. I guess killing foreign innocent people is less risque than killing our own civilians, also for military agendas. Except I'm not buying that at all. They don't really care about you. What a crock.

Alex Jones is full of it, but so are you, "Good 'Ol Dave."

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
...but it was designed to NOT get any innocent people killed.

Hmmm... I take it that you don't think that Cubans are 'innocent people'?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/38cdf2cd1aff.jpg[/atsimg]

Real or simulated?

Tell me, GoodOlDave... is Cuba a toilet of a country as well? Is that why we don't have to think of them as 'innocent people'? Because they weren't American?

Rewey

I have many an issue with how Alex Jones presents information, but in this case, I think he is being misunderstood.

I believe his larger point, is that the military was scheming to stage false terror attacks to generate support for a war, and the fact that it involves an airplane may just be coincidence. It just so happened that hijackings were becoming 'common' in terms of what we could expect from terrorists from the middle east, and so the incorporation of one (or more) into an event only made sense.

I also seem to recall something about a discussion of assassinating civilians in major US cities, but I no longer remember if Jones added that in, or whether I read it in the document - and I haven't the energy to check today (too much turkey....)


Anyhow. I don't think Jones lied on this one, so much as has made too much out of a minor detail that may just be coincidence.


I don't think our government DID this, so much as allowed it to happen. And I base this belief on the reports of multiple warnings of the impending attack from foreign intelligence agencies that we somehow completely ignored - and also on the fact that the administration had already begun scheming to attack Iraq before 9/11 rolled around.... if they knew this was coming, and felt strongly about the 'need' to get into Iraq, it's logical to me they'd simply turn a blind eye, and capitalize on it.

It also reminds me of how James Baker told Saddam that the US had no interest in whether he invaded Kuwait, and then immediately turned on that statement and pretended to be shocked and outraged.... here again, we did not PLAN his invasion, but we surely made good use of it (and trickery) to serve our own ends.


peace.

Originally posted by Rewey

Hmmm... I take it that you don't think that Cubans are 'innocent people'?

You rerally are expert at hearing only what you want to hear, Reway. Nowhere have I said I supported the plan. I am pointing out that the plan specifically avoided targetting American civilians, and in fact every time the plan required American civilians to get killed they would be simulated. How does this supposedly prove the gov't is heartless enough to deliberately murder thousands of citizens?

Then there's the OTHER incredibly phony thing about using Northwoods to prop up these conspiracy stories- the claim that the planes that hit the WTC were remote controlled and/or all the passengers killed were false identities who never really existed. I've seen your fellow conspiracy theorists making that claim more times than I can count. You know as well as I do that goofball idea came from someone reading Northwoods.

Then, there's the other, OTHER incredibly phony thing- Northwoods was clearly a goal driven event, as everything was meant to advance one purpose-to make Cuba look like they're the aggressors. These 9/11 conspiracy stories on the other hand are the most NON goal driven event operation I've ever heard, and sound more like a bunch of random events you're trying to connect together to form the picture you're trying to make, then it does anythign esle. Tell me, just what the heck is the goal of faking a crash site in Shanksville in order to fool us, only to turn around and cover up the fake crash site they made to fool us? Please, explain that one to me.

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
Northwoods was clearly a goal driven event, as everything was meant to advance one purpose-to make Cuba look like they're the aggressors. These 9/11 conspiracy stories on the other hand are the most NON goal driven event operation I've ever heard

That's until you look at the PNAC documents and take those into account:

From the "Statement of Principles":

1) Increase an already enormous military budget at the expense of domestic social programs
2) Toppling of regimes resistant to our corporate interests
3) Forcing democracy at the barrel of a gun in regions that have no history of the democratic process
4) Replacing the UN’s role of preserving and extending international order

And all of which wouldn't be possible without:

"the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event -- like a new Pearl Harbor"

And 9/11 was that new Pearl Harbor.

Originally posted by GoodOlDave

Originally posted by SirPatrickHenry

Speaking of Josef Goebbels he'd be proud to see what you posted right now.

Don't be a putz. Is there one single thing in anything I said that was incorrect? Was my synopsis of the Northwoods operation wrong? Is my pointing out Jones' misrepresentation incorrect? We both know what I said is accurate, otherwise you'd be gleefully exposing me as a liar.

I'm sorry if the truth hurts, but believe me when I say I'm not here to criticize you or insult you. I'm here to point out exactly how you're being raped by these damned fool conspiracy sites. Tell me, since you think Alex Jones is such a champion of the truther movement, just what has he accomplished in all the years of broadcasting other than just feed you nonstop rubbish to keep you in a perpetual state of paranoia and helplessness? Can you name even one constructive accomplishment he's done?

Honestly Dave ? Don't be a Putz.... If you think a past idea isn't brought up with almost every new president(The Good Ole boy System is very real, ahhaha and even when the guy who gave the plan for Operation NorthWood to Kennedy, and Kennedy got rid of him, was then brought back in by the next president, oh Yea, ), Combine all that with a President who is the son of Director of the CIA, and is a former President, Whom everyone in the Cabinet mostly consist of is great old pals,(They are ALL very well connected)
And have always been known for there "Smearing" in Washington ??(seriously One could go all day with the odd things that happen with this certain group of fellows)

Honestly Dave ??????????

PS: Who gives two hoots about Alex Jones, I believe the man just said, that Alex was being taken out of Context, and if you hear the clip, he was. It doesn't take a Genius to hear that.



[edit on 26-11-2009 by Truzzyx]

[edit on 26-11-2009 by Truzzyx]

Originally posted by beard
Did operation northwoods state anything about flying jets into buildings and bombing DC?

no, but it does talk about murdering americans and blaming it on someone else. the definition of false flag attack.

do you deny this?

Originally posted by beard
So nobody can stick up for Alex's lie? Is DC mentioned anywhere in Northwoods?

yes dc is mentioned in northwoods.

as part of the sniper attacks......

unless of course you believe the washington they plan on 'developing cuban terror attacks' in after miami and other parts of florida is the state and not washington, d.c.

[edit on 27-11-2009 by wholetruth]