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Common cultural heritage between the Hopi, Sumerians, Mayans, Tibetans, and others..

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posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 12:57 PM
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Cultural similarities between the Hopi and the Sumerians

The following cultural and linguistic similarities between the two groups seems to beg the question: Is there a common cultural hertiage?

    ~The Hopi believe the Creator of Man is a woman. The Sumerians believed the Creator of Man was a woman.

    ~The Hopi believe the Father Creator is KA. The Sumerians believed the Father Essence was KA.

    ~The Hopi believe Taiowa, the Sun God, is the Creator of the Earth. The Sumerians believe TA.EA was the Creator.

    ~The Hopi believe two brothers had guardianship of the Earth. The Sumerians believed two brothers had dominion over the Earth.

    ~The Hopi believe Alo to be spiritual guides. The Sumerians believed AL.U to be beings of Heaven.

    ~The Hopi believe Kachinas (Kat'sinas) are the spirits of nature and the messengers and teachers sent by the Great Spirit. The Sumerians believed KAT.SI.NA were righteous ones sent of God.

    ~The Hopi believe Eototo is the Father of Katsinas. The Sumerians believed EA.TA was the Father of all beings.

    ~The Hopi believe Chakwaina is the Chief of Warriors. The Sumerians believed TAK.AN.U was the Heavenly Destroyer.

    ~The Hopi believe Nan-ga-Sohu is the Chasing Star Katsina. The Sumerians believed NIN.GIR.SU to be the Master of Starships.

    ~The Hopi believe Akush to be the Dawn Katsina. The Sumerians believed AK.U to be Beings oflight.

    ~The Hopi believe Danik to be Guardians in the Clouds. The Sumerians believed DAK.AN to be Sky Warriors.

    ~The Hopi believe Sotunangu is a Sky Katsina. The Sumerians believed TAK.AN.IKU were Sky Warriors.

    ~The Hopi name for the Pleaides is ChooChookam. The Sumerians believed SHU. SHU.KHEM were the supreme Stars.

    ~The Hopi believe Tapuat is the name of Earth. The Sumerians believed Tiamat was the name of Earth.

    ~The Hopi call a snake Chu'a. The Sumerians called a snake SHU.

    ~The Hopi word for "dead" is Mokee. The Sumerians used KI. MAH to mean "dead."

    ~The Hopi use Omiq to mean above, up. The Sumerians used AM.IK to mean looking to Heaven.

    ~The Hopi believe Tuawta is One Who Sees Magic. The Sumerians believed TUAT.U was One from the Other World.

    ~The Hopi believe Pahana was the Lost Brother who would one day return to assist the Hopi and humankind. The Sumerians would recognize PA.HA.NA as an Ancestor from heaven who would return.


The Hopi share linguistic similarities and coincidental synchronicities w/other, seemingly dispariit cultures as well.

Hopi and Tibet

If you could draw a line through the Earth from the Hopi Reservation to the other side of the world, you would come out in Tibet. The Tibetan word for "sun" is the Hopi word for "moon", and the Hopi word for "sun" is the Tibetan word for "moon".

Prophecy:

"When the iron eagle flies and horses run on wheels, the Tibetan people will be scattered over the earth and the dharma will go to the land of the red man." -- Tibetan Prophecy

"When the iron bird flies, the red-robed people of the East who have lost their land will appear, and the two brothers from across the great ocean will be reunited." -- Hopi Prophecy


Hopi and Maya

Two branches of the same tree...


Harry James notes in his book 'Pages from Hopi History' that as late as the time of the Pueblo Rebellion in the 17th century, there were Hopi who still held out hope that the white Spanish were the ancestors of the feathered-serpent Quetzalcoatl, and again in the 19th century, some mistook the first Americans as the feathered-serpent's heirs. The blind brutality of both the Spanish and the Americans convinced them otherwise.


I'll continue later..

[edit on 21-11-2009 by Anamnesis]




posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 01:24 PM
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Most excellent idea for a thread.

Among our community we have many who are intensely interested in these subjects, I am not the least of them.

I have always been a great admirer of these comparisons. I hope there's more....



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 01:39 PM
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Hmm, I'm still stuck at : Enki and Enlil, two brothers at war, one is known to the western world as God (Enki) and the other is known as Allah (Enlil) for muslims.
Hence why the west is always invading the middle east..

I just heard Dr. Deagle on a youtube, he said Iran is the last battle between the Factions.. Hmm..I'm just ranting here..

Freemasons look at Allah as MoonGod.. so I might be somewhat right here.
i also know that the anunnaki consist of a good and a bad faction... Blah, what a mess...



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 02:03 PM
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~The Hopi believe Tuawta is One Who Sees Magic. The Sumerians believed TUAT.U was One from the Other World.



I wonder if Tuawta and TUAT.U were related to the Celtic TUATHA De Danann? They were also descended from a goddess.




The Tuatha Dé Danann ("People of the Goddess Danu") were one of the mythical races who settled in Ireland before the arrival of the Milesians, the ancestors of modern Gaels. The Dananns were descendants of the goddess Danu. Her son Dagda was their most powerful leader of the Dananns.

The Tuatha Dé Dananns were a race of deities as well as race of heroes. They were skilled in art and science, poetry and magic.

(It should be noted that the fairies in Celtic myths (especially Irish, Welsh and Arthurian myths) had nothing to do with tiny pixie with wings that are found in folklore and children fairy tales, like Tinklebell in Peter Pan or the Fairy Godmother in Cinderella. The fairies found here were human with supernatural power. Modern interpretations of fairies tend to prettify them, particularly during the Victorian period (19th century) in Britain.

In early Irish and Welsh literature, they could be tall or short, beautiful or ugly. They can be benevolent beings, but at other times they can be frighteningly cruel or malign. Morrigan and Morgan le Fay would not be considered fairies in the modern sense.)

www.timelessmyths.com...






[edit on 21-11-2009 by gazerstar]



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:08 PM
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Maxmars
I'm glad to know there are others here with interest in this subject. I've seen other threads related but nothing that makes direct comparisons.

Gazerstar
Great addition I hadn't made that connection to the Celts.

I hope others will post what they have found here as well.

More similarities....

Hopi and India


Vedic tradition and most of the other ancient civilization believe in the feminine aspect of the creator. Vedic tradition calls her as Prakriti (Mother Nature) or Shakti (creative force responsible for weaving the web of life). Interestingly, the Hopi regard her as Spiderwoman, i.e. the one who has woven the web of life. This was the predominant thinking of most of the civilizations during the Age of Cancer, the mother sign, which lasted from around 8000B.C to 6000B.C.



The Hopi believe the Father Creator is KA. The Vedic tradition also believes that the root of the father essence is ‘KA’ which is the first alphabet of Sanskrit, the primary language of the Vedic tradition.



...Cultures including the Egyptians, Mayans, Assyrians, Phoenicians,and the Jews have this concept of twin gods or brothers presiding over the affairs of the earth.


Full Text

Indra's net


Indra's net symbolizes a universe where infinitely repeated mutual relations exist between all members of the universe.[5] This idea is communicated in the image of the interconnectedness of the universe as seen in the net of the Vedic god Indra,


More later...


[edit on 21-11-2009 by Anamnesis]

[edit on 21-11-2009 by Anamnesis]

[edit on 21-11-2009 by Anamnesis]



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 03:10 AM
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both are pretty primitve languages, some words are bound to sound alike.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 06:59 AM
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reply to post by STFUPPERCUTTER
 


both the languages might have same origin thats why they sound alike....or might be a dialect of the original language.
great comparision s&f .........



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 09:03 AM
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STFUPPERCUTTER & andrewsymonds, Thank you both for the input. Your comments prompted me to search for information about common language origins. It's interesting to note that some linguistic scholars have made signifigant arguments in support of a common linguistic origin for all extant human languages.


In his book, On the Origin of Languages; Studies in Linguistic Taxonomy, Merritt Ruhlen makes a strong case for common language origin.


The author argues that all of these firmly entrenched—and vigorously defended—beliefs are false, that they are myths propagated by a small group of scholars who have failed to understand the true basis of genetic affinity. Twentieth-century Indo-Europeanists (though not their nineteenth-century forebears) have confused the issue of genetic affinity, which derives from classification, with such traditional concerns of historical linguistics as reconstruction and sound correspondences.



a comparison of all the world’s languages in this new perspective leaves little doubt that all extant human languages share a common origin.


There have been other linguists proposing the same conjecture regarding common origins.

In several works published during the first quarter of the twentieth century, the Italian linguist Alfredo Trombetti sought to establish the monogenesis of human language by comparing lexical and grammatical roots from languages and language families around the world.

in 1987, American linguist Joseph Greenberg presented substantial evidence for an Amerind phylum that would include all NewWorld languages except those belonging to the Na-Dene and Eskimo-Aleut families.


Many linguists believe that the rate of linguistic change is such that all trace of genetic affiliation is effaced after only several thousand years.
One of the most cogent pieces of evidence that Greenberg (1987) offered in support of the Amerind phylum was the presence of first-person "n" and second-person "m" in all eleven branches. As noted in Chapter 12, the first- and second-person pronouns are known to be among the most stable meanings over time.



posted on Dec, 3 2009 @ 12:12 AM
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reply to post by Anamnesis
 


I think your Hopi and Maya claims are very likely, since the Hopi and Maya are both Native Americans in the southwestern part of North America, and the Hopi speak an Uto-Aztecan language related to the Aztec, anf the Maya and Aztec lived close together.

Your Tibetan claims are possible too (but I think "sun" and "moon" being swapped is just a coincidence), because the Native Americans came from Asia, the Yeniseian languages (in Russia) are related to Na-Dene (in North America). They could be distant relatives. The "iron bird" and "iron eagle" probably refers to an airplane (or a UFO?).

However, the Sumerian-Hopi has some problems. I was researching these claims and found a lot of mistakes. I'm really interested in Sumerian gods and Nibiru and these sorts of things, so I noticed a lot of problems right away, but this interested me so I wanted to find more information.

Are any of these your source?
www.care2.com...
fusionanomaly.net...
www.dreamscape.com...
This was copied and pasted to many forums, and dates back to at least 2005.

The Sumerian Lexicon and ePSD are very good Sumerian dictionaries, with some God and Place names also.




ka: mouth [KA archaic frequency: 108; concatenates 2 sign variants].

ka: in late usage the difference between a rough measuring and a final measuring of a quantity of grain.

ká: gate [? KA2 archaic frequency: 11; concatenates 4 sign variants].

ka5-(a): fox.

ka9: (cf., kas7 and nígtilde-kas7/ka9).

kas7, ka9: deduction; settlement of accounts; possession (back-formation from nígtilde-kas7/ka9).


The Sumerians don't have a word KA meaning "Father Essence." The Sumerian Father of the Gods was An. The Egyptians have a word Ka (k3) meaning soul or spirit.

Hopi Creation
The two brothers, Enlil and Enki, were bitter rivals, the gods of Air and Earth/Water. One tried killing mankind, the other tried saving them. They were like Cain and Abel, Set and Osiris, Romulus and Remus, etc. Poqanghoya and Palongawhoya, the Hopi brothers, lived on the Earth's poles (one on each), and were not enemies, having to work together to balance the Earth.



ta, dá: n., nature, character [TA archaic frequency: 34; concatenates 6 sign variants].

prep., from; to; for; by means of (ablative-instrumental noun suffix and verbal prefix; as a noun suffix can be a locative with remote deixis, as in an-ta and ki-ta).

ta6: (cf., taka4).


The God called "TA.EA" is probably E.A (House of Water), the Earth and Water God, also called Enki. The Sumerian Sun God was Utu.

Wikipedia on Alu


Alû is one of the Utukku, vengeful spirits in the lore of the ancient Assyrians. According to Pamela Allardice, they were feared more greatly than death itself. She describes Alû as "a horrid phantom of a leprous man with an arm and a leg missing." The clutch, or even the merest touch of Alû would give one the disease.

Stephen Hubert Langdon cites a translation of a cuneiform script by H.J. Rawlinson. From from v Pl. 50, A, line 42: "Whom in his bed the wicked Alû covered,/Whom the wicked ghost by night overwhelmed". Langdon (364) states that Alû is androgynous and "attacks a man's breast".

That certainly doesn't sound like a "being of heaven." It does come from the afterlife, but it's a horrible demon, not a spiritual guide like the Hopi have.

(Continued in next post)



posted on Dec, 3 2009 @ 01:08 AM
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The Kachina/Katsina is a spirit that inhabits everything. Other parallels:

Wikipedia on Shinto


Kami are defined in English as "spirit", "essence" or "deities", that are associated with many understood formats; in some cases being human like, some animistic, others associated with more abstract "natural" forces in the world (mountains, rivers, lightning, wind, waves, trees, rocks).


Wikipedia on Slavic Mythology


The lowest level of development of Slavic mythology includes various groups of home or nature spirits and magical creatures, which vary greatly amongst different Slavic nations.


Wikipedia on Sumer


In pre-Semitic Sumer there are no anthropomorphic gods. We hear, instead, of the zi or 'spirit', a word properly signifying 'life' which manifested itself in the power of motion. All things that moved were possessed of life, and there was accordingly a 'life' or 'spirit' of the water as well as of man or beast.


However, the Sumerians have no word for "righteous ones sent by God" (or "sent by the Gods").



lú-zi(-d): righteous, good man ('man' + 'faithful, true').

This is the closest thing in this dictionary, and there is no sign KAT, nor is there a ka-at-si-na, kat-sin-na, or any other variation. This is probably just writing the Hopi word with period separators to make it look Sumerian.

EA.TA, another variation on E.A (actually meaning "from E.A" with the preposition quoted in my previous post)



taka, taga, tak, tag, tà: to touch, handle, hold; to weave; to decorate, adorn; to
strike, hit, push; to start a fire; to fish, hunt, catch (can be reduplicated) (te, 'to approach' + aka, 'to do,
place, make') [TAG archaic frequency: 48 ?; concatenates 7 ? sign variants] .
taka4, tak4, tag4, ta6: to abandon; to disregard, neglect; to divorce; to leave with a person,
entrust; to open, leave open (reduplication class - ta6-ta6 in marû) (ta, 'to, from', + ge4, 'turn from,
restore') [TAK4 archaic frequency: 128; concatenates 2 sign variants] .
...
tar: v., to cut; to decide; to determine; to inquire; to smoke; to break, destroy (ta, 'from', + ur4, 'to shear,
reap'; cf., dar and nam...tar) [TAR archaic frequency: 56; concatenates 2 sign variants] .
adj., deliberate, judicious.
...
IM×TAK4; IM.TAK4; TAK4; TAK4.IM: to cut; to be cut out.


There is no TAK.AN.U, but TAK can mean "to cut" or "to destroy" and AN means heaven, so whoever wrote this does know some Sumerian, since it literally means "Heavenly Destroyer."

Ninurta (Ningirsu) on Wikipedia
He is a farmer god with healing powers, a son of Enlil, and the lord of Girsu, Lagash.
There is nothing about space, except for this:

In older transliteration the name is rendered Ninib and in early commentary he was sometimes portrayed as a solar deity.

"In early commentary" means when they were first starting to translate Sumerian in the modern era. Ningirsu is on the very famous seal that shows the planets, so this is probably why the author did this. If the Anunnaki did come from space, then they would all be related to space ships.



ud, u4: n., sun; light; day; time; weather; storm (demon) [UD archaic frequency: 419].
prep., when; since.
...
kúm: n., heat; summer; fever (kù, 'bright' + to be).
v., to heat.
adj., hot.
...
kára, kár, guru6: to encircle, besiege; to impute, accuse; to shine, illuminate; to be bright (of
light, day) (reduplication class) (sometimes written for kúr) (place + ur, 'to surround' + a, nominative
ending, and ara4, 'to shine') [? KAR2 archaic frequency: 68; concatenates 2 sign variants] .

www.20000-names.com...

It's possible that this AK.U is related to kù or u4, and there is also a Babylonian moon god named Aku.

To be continued



posted on Dec, 3 2009 @ 02:10 AM
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~The Hopi believe Danik to be Guardians in the Clouds. The Sumerians believed DAK.AN to be Sky Warriors.

~The Hopi believe Sotunangu is a Sky Katsina. The Sumerians believed TAK.AN.IKU were Sky Warriors.


These are obviously variations of TAK.AN.U:


~The Hopi believe Chakwaina is the Chief of Warriors. The Sumerians believed TAK.AN.U was the Heavenly Destroyer.


And now for the IKU part:


iku: a surface measure of 3600 meters2 = 100 sar = 1 square 'rope' = 1/18 bùr (plural Akk. form of ég,
ék, 'levee').
...
ukur3,4, uku2,5: n., poor man; poverty.
v., to be or become poor.
...
ùña, ùñ, ùku, un(-ñá): people; population; crowd.


The word ùku meaning people is probably the one. This would make the etymology of TAK.AN.IKU be destroy+heaven+people, which, even though it doesn't appear in my dictionary, and could be made up, it is based on actual Sumerian words and sounds like a good way of saying "Sky Warriors."



šu: n., hand; share, portion, bundle; strength; control [ŠU archaic frequency: 360].
v., to pour.
šu4(-g): to stand; to be deployed, set up (plural, reduplication class).
...
šuš(2), šu2,4: to overthrow; to throw down; to go down; to set, become dark, be overcast (said of the
sun); to cover (with -da-) (reduplication class) (reduplicated šu, 'hand'; cf., šub) [ŠUŠ2 archaic frequency:
243].
šuš4: to fell trees; to chop away (reduplicated šu, 'hand').
šuš5,6, šu5,6: bedding, litter, feed, fodder (scattered for animals) (reduplicated uš, 'to stand upon').
...
šùde, šùdu, šùd, šu12: n., prayer, blessing [ŠU12 archaic frequency: 1].
v., to pray, bless (šu, 'hand', + dé, 'to hail').

None of these are related to stars.

Some Sumerian words for star:


ul: n., joy, pleasure, satisfaction; star; flower; bud; ornament; a capacity measure of 36 liters in Presargonic
Girsu.
v., to glitter, shine.
adj., remote, distant (in time); ancient, enduring.
...
mul: n., star; constellation; planet; meteor (ñi6/mi, 'night', + ul, 'star, ornament') [MUL archaic frequency: 6].
v., to (let) sparkle, shine, glow.
...
šún[MUL]: n., star.
v., to shine brightly.
...
kìlib, kìli: totality; star(s).
...
AN.MUL: starry sky (verify than AN is not the rare sign ŠÚ; cf., kunga[ŠÚ.MUL]).

There is a šún meaning "star," but MUL was the usual word for star, so the author was probably picking the closest word that resembles the Hopi word.

en.wikipedia.org...


In Babylonian mythology[1], Tiamat is a goddess who personifies the sea. Tiamat is considered the monstrous embodiment of primordial chaos.[2] Although there are no early precedents for it, some sources identify her with images of a sea serpent or dragon.[3] In the Enûma Elish, the Babylonian epic of creation, she gives birth to the first generation of deities; she later makes war upon them and is killed by the storm-god Marduk. The heavens and the earth are formed from her divided body.


The Earth, as in the planet, was called KI or uraš. Saþar and šubur mean earth, as in dirt or soil. Earth was never called Tiamat, but the sea sometimes was.

Sumerian words for snake:


mer(2), mir(2); gùr: n., storm wind; violent storm; north(wind); anger; belt, waistband; an
encircling snake (var. of gùr) (me3,6,7,9,'battle', + to flow / circle + ur, 'to surround') [MER archaic
frequency: 48; concatenates 2 sign variants] .
v., to blow fiercely; to get angry.
adj., fierce, angry, furious.
...
muš: n., snake; reptile (eme, 'tongue'/ma4, 'to leave, depart, go out', + úš, 'to kill'/uš11, 'venom, poison') [MUŠ
archaic frequency: 3; BU: archaic frequency: 393; concatenation of 2 sign variants] .
adj., bitter.

The Sumerian word for snake was mer or muš, not šu. I listed all of the words pronounced "šu" in the Sumerian Lexicon but none mean snake.

To be continued...



posted on Dec, 3 2009 @ 03:18 AM
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ki-maþ: high place; place of honor; grave ('place' + 'exalted').




ug4,5,7,8: n., death; dead person.
v., to kill; to die (singular and plural marû stem; plural hamtu, which is sometimes reduplicated; cf., úš).
...
úš: n., blood; blood vessel; death [? ZATU-644 archaic frequency: 65; concatenation of 2 sign variants] .
v., to die; to kill; to block (singular hamtu stem).
adj., dead.
...
gam: n., decline, incline; death; depth (cf., gúr).
v., to bend, curve; to bow down, kneel (for someone: dative; direction: terminative); to shrivel; to succumb
(like a circle + to be).
...
gúr: n., sphere; circle, ring; loop; hoop (circle + ur, 'to surround').
v., to bow down, submit; to curb, subdue; to die (cf., gam).
...
nam-úš: death (abstract prefix + 'to die').
...
saþar(-da)...gi4: to turn into dust; euphemism for 'to die' ('dust' + 'to turn, return').


The main Sumerian words for dead are ug and úš. KI.MAH is more like "hallowed ground" and also sounds nothing like "Mokee," except for having the same consonants.



an: n., sky, heaven; the god An; grain ear/date cluster ('water' + 'high') [AN archaic frequency: 806].
v., to be high.
adj., high.
prep., in front.
...
igi: n., eye(s); glance; face; aspect, looks; front (reduplicated ig, 'door') [IGI archaic frequency: 21].
v., to see.
prep., before, in front of.
...
sañ (an-šè)...íl: to lift the head (towards heaven); to raise up ('head' ( + 'unto heaven') + 'to lift
up').


Words for above:


nim, num: n., prince; flying insect; highland; east; morning (high + to be) [NIM archaic frequency: 109;
concatenation of 4 sign variants] .
v., to be high; to multiply in arithmetic.
adj., high; early.
adv., above.
...
an-ta: above ('heaven' + locative with remote deixis).


These words are related, and AN (not AM) means heaven, and IGI means to see, but there is no word AN.IGI or AM.IK or any other variation. The word an-šè means towards heaven, and "num" and an-ta mean above, none of which resemble the Hopi word "Omiq."



~The Hopi believe Tuawta is One Who Sees Magic. The Sumerians believed TUAT.U was One from the Other World.


This site is the only thing (other than copies of the OP's quote) that I can find about either Tuawta or TUAT.U, and even it is just a comment on the aforementioned quote. I'm guessing that the Hopi word is spelled wrong, since I could find information on most of the other Hopi words. Since I could find nothing on Sumerian "TUAT.U" it's probably just taking a Hopi word and making it look Sumerian like with "KAT.SI.NA."

Pahana is a Hopi legend of someone who will return, like the Aztecs with Quetzalcoatl or the Christians with the Second Coming of Jesus. There is no word PA.HA.NA in Sumerian, so it's another fake "Sumerianization" like "TUAT.U" and "KAT.SI.NA."

Wikipedia on Hopi Mythology


The legend of the Pahana seems intimately connected with the Aztec story of Quetzalcoatl, and other legends of Central America.[4] This similarity is furthered by the liberal representation of Awanyu, the horned or plumed serpent, in Hopi and other Puebloan art. This figure bears a striking resemblance to figures of Quetzacoatl, the feathered serpent, in Mexico. In the early 16th century, both the Hopis and the Aztecs seem to have believed that coming of the Spanish conquistadors was in fact the return of this lost white prophet.


So here's a connection between Hopis and Aztecs. In my first post in this thread I wrote that the Hopi and Aztec both speak related languages. It seems that everyone wants to try to be related to Sumerians, since they were the first to have writing and civilization.

I spent a little over 4 hours nonstop researching every Sumerian-Hopi claim posted here (as you can see from my post times), so I hope at least somebody finds this information useful.



posted on Dec, 3 2009 @ 02:43 PM
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reply to post by YukaiHenjin
 


Outstanding! Thank you for correcting the discrepancies. I've always been interested in cultural heritage but I'm cetainly no expert on the subject and I probably don't even qualify as a novice.

Please add more if you come accross new info.

Thanks again....

~peace



posted on Dec, 3 2009 @ 07:55 PM
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reply to post by Anamnesis
 


Thank you very much! I'm so glad that you read this. I would like to find more similarities between the Aztecs, Mayans, and Hopis, and perhaps find out who this original "white man" Pahana who was meant to return was. That might refer to seafarers from Europe or the Mediterranean area (Phoenicians, Romans, Egyptians, Vikings maybe). What we need to find out is when this first Pahana was supposed to have arrived, then we can try to pinpoint what civilization may have visited the Hopi and Aztecs as Pahana/Quetzalcoatl. Wikipedia's article says that the Hopi thought that the Spanish were Pahana at first, but the Spanish didn't understand the Hopi customs and started a battle.

I like researching this sort of thing, and I think it would be good to look into the Tibetan similarities and this "iron eagle" more. Horses on wheels probably refers to cars (it could also refer to chariots or carriages too since it never said "iron horses" or anything like that, but "on wheels" makes it seem like the "horse" itself is on wheels, not that it is pulling something else on wheels).

The main problems with comparing anything to Sumerian is that it has a huge number of homophones, and the readings of words change (Gilgamesh was once called "Bilgames"). There's a šu12, so at least 12 different words were pronounced SHU. Only Chinese and Japanese are like this today. I guess it's the use of meaning-based characters instead of an alphabet that makes this possible. I would like to know what Sumerian dictionary the original author of that comparison used, because it's entirely possible that some of these words that I couldn't find would be in a outdated dictionary (like one that uses "Bilgames").



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 09:15 AM
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wow...this thread really wonderful with all the
inputs and inputs by anamnesis.
so many similarities between them ...is there any similarity between hopi and sanskrit?or tibetan & sanskrit?

[edit on 4-12-2009 by andrewsymonds]



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 02:59 PM
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Originally posted by YukaiHenjin
I think it would be good to look into the Tibetan similarities and this "iron eagle" more. Horses on wheels probably refers to cars (it could also refer to chariots or carriages too since it never said "iron horses" or anything like that, but "on wheels" makes it seem like the "horse" itself is on wheels, not that it is pulling something else on wheels).


There's really no reason to.

The source of that Tibetan prophecy is the sage Padmasambhava. He lived in the eight century A.D.

Surely no one is suggesting that the Hopi were not here until after then?

Harte
Edited to add:

I meant to say nice work YukaiHenjin. I am very skeptical of these so called "connections" based on sound-alike words. Without an etymologist, people can fool themselves into believing anything if they go too far down that road.

H.

[edit on 12/4/2009 by Harte]



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 06:07 PM
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Originally posted by andrewsymonds
wow...this thread really wonderful with all the
inputs and inputs by anamnesis.
so many similarities between them ...is there any similarity between hopi and sanskrit?or tibetan & sanskrit?

[edit on 4-12-2009 by andrewsymonds]

Sanskrit is an Sino-Tibetan language, and Sanskrit is an Indo-European language. Tibetan has some Sanskrit words from Buddhism, but Sanskrit is closer to Persian and Russian and Tibetan is closer to Chinese. English is Indo-European too. But, unlike most Asian languages, the Tibetan alphabet was based on Sanskrit. So they aren't directly related, but the Tibetans have some Sanskrit influence and culture.

This should be interesting:
en.wikipedia.org...
The Dards mentioned in that quote are Indo-Iranians (related to Sanskrit and Persians).
en.wikipedia.org...
The Tibetan script came from India.


Originally posted by Harte
There's really no reason to.

The source of that Tibetan prophecy is the sage Padmasambhava. He lived in the eight century A.D.


Harte, do you think that the "iron eagle" refers to airplanes or some type of aircraft? It is a prophecy, and prophecies are about the future, so that is my guess on what it means. The original author probably had no other way to describe an airplane, and I can't think of anything else that would be called an "iron eagle."



Surely no one is suggesting that the Hopi were not here until after then?


I think the Hopi arrived across the Bering Strait with the Aztecs and other Native Americans. I was talking about the Pahana, who was described as a white man, and whether the Pahana came more recently from Europe/Middle East. All I know is that they came before the Spanish, but I'd like to know when the Hopi first prophecized about Pahana.



Harte
Edited to add:

I meant to say nice work YukaiHenjin. I am very skeptical of these so called "connections" based on sound-alike words. Without an etymologist, people can fool themselves into believing anything if they go too far down that road.

H.

[edit on 12/4/2009 by Harte]


Thanks



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 06:22 PM
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to my thinking.... this connection/linking your attempting to establish

is better understood as the ancients use of a innate human condition called ARCHTYPEs...... which is born into the human mind

a condition in humans which Jung re-awakened our knowledge of
and developed a therapy around....
the seemingly 'strange' connection between disparate peoples & cultures is only our unity through the sharing of universal 'Archtypes' ->

and similar thought packs, words, sounds, responses,
thinking will seem like 'Telepathy' between diverse individual peoples & cultures.



wrong board... this should be in philosophy/metaphysics



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 07:02 PM
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Take a look at the teachings of Theosophy...this is exactly what it examines, and shows clearly to the one who is willing to open their mind.

Everything is connected by a common link or thread. Nothing exists without purpose or intent.



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 09:10 PM
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Scientific & medical studies are nowhere near as fun or engaging as the kind of insight shared here (thanks everyone); but shared DNA certainly increases the probability of shared cultures & languages.

"The Phylogeny of the Four Pan-American MtDNA Haplogroups: Implications for Evolutionary and Disease Studies" is a good starting point, for anyone interested in the scientific side of these questions. And the References are a great jumping off point to check out other published studies.

In broad brushstrokes, this particular research (Mar 2008) says that mtDNA can be traced to just four major haplogroups of Asian origin shared by North, Central and South American Indian populations, & that there are a total (thus far) of nine haplogroups of Native Americans. It was reported in the MSM as something along the lines of "95% of Native Americans can trace their ancestry back to 6 women." That's not quite what they concluded _javascript:icon('
'), but they do indicate that we're (Natives) all related & more closely than previously thought. The debate is when we all branched out & at what point what diverged.

This "makes sense" to me intuitively, because my grandmother is "full blooded" Japanese, her husband is full Native (Navajo/Zuni), whilst my other grandmother is Cherokee. It continually amazes me how similar some cultural aspects & understandings are between all 3 of these grandparents, who literally grew up immersed in "different" cultures thousands of miles apart.

I'll defer to you on the Hopi & Sumerians cultures specifically, but to the questions of "Is there a common cultural hertiage?", & is/was there common language? My vote is yes absolutely. And science aside (so to speak) its fascinating to examine similarities & differences, & ponder the whys.

Cheers, & thanks again everyone for a super thread!

PS if that link is wonky, the referenced study is published on PlosONE.org (a peer review journal for scientific and medical research). Lots of great stuff there.



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