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Socialized Health Care reform will never happen in the USA

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posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 10:49 AM
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This issue is about CONTROL, and nothing else.

If they are going to subsidize your health care, they will tell you what ,where, when, how much and how.....Just take a looksy around at the industries that the .gov sponsors for a clue..




posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 11:52 AM
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reply to post by RolandBrichter
 


I find the bill to be more like a letter of suicide by the American Republic more than anything else.

Our economy is on life support, so we are just going to pull the plug?



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 11:54 AM
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reply to post by havok
 


There is an African Union as well...although, I actually support that one



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 11:59 AM
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reply to post by Seiko
 


The reason OP calls it slavery instead of socialism or a 'guarantee' is that it isn't truly free or socialized.

It's not a guarantee to force everyone under threat of penalty of fine or imprisonment to buy a certain product. It would not be a 'guarantee' of a hot meal if every american was forced to purchase the meal or face jail time.

This entire reform effort is cursed if you ask me. We have a fairly good private sector already. The only problems are:

1. discrimination against certain clients (ie; preexisting conditions)

2. portability (largely just a function of the employer model)

3. price (a function of anti-trust exemptions, lack of competition across boundaries, etc)

This so called reform is not about scrapping or even fixing these market failures. It's about expanding the market with all its failures. Even socialized medicine would be better than this reform. Although, I support government mandates to actually fix these market problems and let the lower prices/portability fix the uninsured problem.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 12:02 PM
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reply to post by 12.21.12
 


I also have to disagree with the Title of this post.

Instead of focusing on market fixes for market problems we are allowing those problems to persist, infact making them worse, while introducing a 'government option' to the mix.

Its only a matter of time until the private system with its current failures + the burden of this legislation collapses leaving only the 'public option.' Not much of an option then, now is it.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 12:20 PM
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Originally posted by 12.21.12
reply to post by RolandBrichter
 


I find the bill to be more like a letter of suicide by the American Republic more than anything else.

Our economy is on life support, so we are just going to pull the plug?


My thoughts are that the original idea of the American Republic has been "publicly" suicided many years ago...At least, that's what the PTB would have you believe....There exists, fortunately, a very substantial movement to preserve the original ideals, and I'll leave it your imagination what they're prepared to do to preserve them...

It's not OUR economy that's on life support, it's THEIRS...and pulling the plug would be the most humane course of action at this point.....Consider the horrific measures they will take to save it...further enslavement, population reduction, war....savy?



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 12:43 PM
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How can people, on one hand talk about the greatness of the USA and speak of us being #1

while at the same time be the only industrialized nation to not guarantee health care for it's citizens.

Spend way more on health care than any other nation, while at the same time.......

Rank 37th. in health care, just above Slovenia and just below Costa Rica.
Rank way down at 29th. in infant mortality.

Lower life expectancy
Higher infant mortality

Pro life, while also being pro war..? hypocrisy.

Sure, USA, we're number one......


Also embarrassing, is the number of people who actually think Glenn Beck, Sarah Palin, Hannity and all the rest of their ilk, are actually concerned about this Nation more than their own bank accounts.

U S A...... We're Number One!!!!!



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 02:15 PM
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In order to have an NAU, you must have everyone on the same sheet of music, I have said this time and time again. once we do the Healthcare thing next would be Mexico's turn, and we know how many poor in Mexico. Next, they will start in canada and erase boundaries, then erase US boundaries, then Mexico, these boundaries i speak of are not territorial boundaries but of Financial and Political boundaries, territorial boundaries will come much, much later, after they establish a World bank and World government.

The Healthcare system is not broken that we have in place, it is the insurance and big Pharmaceutical(and that includes medical supplies) that is sucking the money out of the system, cap those and we would have an excellent system.

When people talk about not having healthcare, it is because they have not applied for it at the local social welfare office where you would receive a medical card, i agree there are adjustments as to income that needed to be tweaked in such hard times, like a floating minimum wage in reference to economical situations.

Since the Elites can not bring the World "up" to the US standards, they will bring the US "down" to the world standards.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 02:17 PM
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reply to post by tiso_us
 


This is not entirely true, many states simply don't offer health care to poor individuals. I realize they say they do, but it simply is not true.

It's a matter of whether you can afford the care. If you can't, sure our system sucks. If you're rich, you probably get the best care imagined.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 02:40 PM
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Originally posted by Seiko
reply to post by tiso_us
 


This is not entirely true, many states simply don't offer health care to poor individuals. I realize they say they do, but it simply is not true.

It's a matter of whether you can afford the care. If you can't, sure our system sucks. If you're rich, you probably get the best care imagined.


The Healthcare system as we know it is "at less" a Healthcare system, has it's flaws i do agree. "some people" would simply refuse to apply for a medical card based on their beliefs or simply out of pure pride, there is nothing wrong with that and i admire them for it.

At this juncture, with so many people unemployed, they should be the one's applying for a card, they paid into it, they deserve it.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 02:40 PM
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reply to post by tiso_us
 


That will be the interesting thing to watch for. How they are going to do this, in getting the nau.

Time will tell, but these people are very good at this like we have seen in europe.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 02:47 PM
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reply to post by tiso_us
 



What I'm saying is that they don't qualify just by being poor. There are so many ways to disqualify, and people are not getting the help. Own two cars? sell one. Sell everything you own till your net worth is less the 3000 dollars, and then come back and apply.

Medicaid is only required to cover poor old people, and disabled people, the rest is left to each state to decide who they want to cover. Most families that get welfare will have children that qualify.

I know many poor people who can't afford health insurance, and can't qualify for medicaid. Medicaid is not helping them as much as you think. the system has failed them.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 02:48 PM
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reply to post by andy1033
 


Agreed, interesting indeed.

If you google out NAU, you will find the NAU is already setting guidelines for the European states, which they have been doing for sometime now.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 03:03 PM
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reply to post by Seiko
 


In this sense I do agree. some doctors would simply push drugs. you wait in an doctor's office for hours only to be seen 2 minutes. no exam, no xrays, nothing. just take these pills and if you have any problems, let us know.

As with any government program, we have "red" tape. It is not the best system in the world but it needs to be "tweaked" (i.e. floating income adjustment) and must have exemption in relations to economic hardships.

Instead of creating another monster to support, fix the one we have in place first.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 03:11 PM
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Originally posted by snusfanatic

buy a certain product


Key words -

You look at it this way it will stay a product -

You don't call the PD or FD a product do you? Yet we all pay, regardless if need arises;

At the beginning of this, HC could have been taken off the list of products to be bought and sold. as is $2,000,000,000,000.00 a year spent on this "Product"

I would say Orange Juice is a product, I see a distinction, wish you guys could do the same.

[edit on 22-11-2009 by Janky Red]

[edit on 22-11-2009 by Janky Red]

[edit on 22-11-2009 by Janky Red]



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 03:26 PM
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reply to post by Janky Red
 


You're confusing my point. Let me try to explain this better.

Health care is a service, health insurance is a product. The new bill forces us to buy the product, that being health insurance. Health insurance does not mean you are going to get health care. These are two very separate things.

It would be like you buying a rain check for orange juice with no guarantee the store would ever carry orange juice again. You've paid for the right to a bottle of orange juice, but there's no guarantee they'll ever have it.

So no I don't want the product, nor do I want to be forced to pay for a product. If I'm going to pay, I expect health care, and I expect the orange juice.



posted on Nov, 22 2009 @ 05:03 PM
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If you guys have been having any trouble finding sources on the internet like me, try using the keyword NAFTA instead of North American Union or NAU as they no longer refer to the program as NAU in the media.



posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 02:12 PM
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Originally posted by RolandBrichter


This issue is about CONTROL, and nothing else.

If they are going to subsidize your health care, they will tell you what ,where, when, how much and how.....Just take a looksy around at the industries that the .gov sponsors for a clue..


You are totally right--it's all about control. As yourself what is left that you have a say in? If the government takes over health care with this monstrauscity of a bill, your free choice for anything concerning your health will be gone. Don't kid yourself, it's all about control.

If this plan is so great, why are congressmen trading in their own health care for it.?? they want free choice, and know this bill takes it away.

we do need health care reform,but not at the cost of bankrupting an already bankrupt country, and taking away free choice.



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 09:15 AM
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reply to post by 12.21.12
 

We the taxpaying citizens are all "criminals" now.

Out of control corruption on Capitol Hill. Wash Post announced this morning that Senator Dodd has been paid off with a $100 milllion project for his vote. Senator Nelson similarly paid off last week. Senator Landrieu two weeks ago. Corruption of a lower level used to occur behind closed doors...no more. Right out in the open now - right in our faces. For the first time in my life, I am seeing politicians unconcerned about losing reelection. There is no stopping them now....they are like crack addicts.



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 09:21 AM
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Originally posted by Seiko
reply to post by tiso_us
 


This is not entirely true, many states simply don't offer health care to poor individuals. I realize they say they do, but it simply is not true.


What you believe is not correct. Go today to an emergency room and you will see a sign that says that NO ONE may be denied health care. Therer is a pohone number to report to the federal gov't if you believe you are being denied care. NO ONE may be denied. Not the poor, not illegal aliens, no one. It is unlawful for hospitals to not offer care, incl surgery, rehab, and whatever else is required. Not everyone in America has insurance, but EVERYONE has health care. You are beig lied to if you have heard otherwise.







 
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