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Researcher: Faint writing seen on Shroud of Turin

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posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 03:53 PM
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Researcher: Faint writing seen on Shroud of Turin


news.yahoo.com

Barbara Frale, a researcher at the Vatican archives, says in a new book that she used computer-enhanced images of the shroud to decipher faintly written words in Greek, Latin and Aramaic scattered across the cloth.

She asserts that the words include the name "(J)esu(s) Nazarene" — or Jesus of Nazareth — in Greek. That, she said, proves the text could not be of medieval origin because no Christian at the time, even a forger, would have mentioned Jesus without referring to his divinity. Failing to do so would risk being branded a heretic.

"Even someone intent on forging a relic woul
(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 03:53 PM
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"She said she counted at least 11 words in her study of enhanced images produced by French scientists in a 1994 study. The words are fragmented and scattered on and around the image's head, crisscrossing the cloth vertically and horizontally.

One short sequence of Aramaic letters has not been fully translated. Another fragment in Greek — "iber" — may refer to Emperor Tiberius, who reigned at the time of Jesus' crucifixion, Frale said.

She said the text also partially confirms the Gospels' account of Jesus' final moments. A fragment in Greek that can be read as "removed at the ninth hour" may refer to Christ's time of death reported in the holy texts, she said.

In her book "The Shroud of Jesus Nazarene," published in Italian, Frale reconstructs from the lettering on the shroud what she believes Jesus' death certificate said: "Jesus Nazarene. Found (guilty of inciting the people to revolt). Put to death in the year 16 of Tiberius. Taken down at the ninth hour."

She said the text then stipulates the body will returned to relatives after a year.

Frale said her research was done without the support of the Vatican.

"I tried to be objective and leave religious issues aside," Frale told the AP. "What I studied was an ancient document that certifies the execution of a man, in a specific time and place." "


I also found this interesting.

"Frale's work usually focuses on medieval documents. She is noted for research on the order of the Knights Templar and her discovery of unpublished documents on the group in the Vatican's archives.

Earlier this year, she published a study saying the Templars once had the shroud in their possession. That raised eyebrows because the order was abolished in the early 14th century and the shroud is first recorded in history around 1360 in the hands of a French knight. "

news.yahoo.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 02:06 AM
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That is crazy, So maybe this sets in stone that it was in fact him.
Without the consent of the Vatican. Wonder why they didnt give consent?



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 02:13 AM
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I think I see a flaw in her reasoning... Wouldn't forging the shroud of turin in the first place put one in the realm of being branded a heretic? I mean she says it couldn't be from the carbon dating proposed time frame because they would be afraid of this happening but I don't think anyone ballsy enough to make something and say it was a religious relic would think twice about being branded a heretic. just my two cents.



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 04:30 AM
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IT PROVES 100% THAT ITS JESUS!!!!!
no one in Medieval times new greek, latin, or aramaic!!!!!!


[edit on 21-11-2009 by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest]



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:43 AM
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That's weird... I thought the writing said,

"If Found, Please Return to Omar's Prop Supplies".
"Reward of 2 Camels".

IRM



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 06:00 AM
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It also said "lies next to his trusty tyrannosaurus rex"

it's simple, find the dinosaur bones and you find jesus. hallelujah!

okok seriously what has happened here? A desperate church is pulling out all the stops to keep from crashing. The vatican orchestrates a double hoax on this cloth to TRY to make people believe Jesus existed blah blah...



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 06:01 AM
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Originally posted by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest
IT PROVES 100% THAT ITS JESUS!!!!!
no one in Medieval times new greek, latin, or aramaic!!!!!!


[edit on 21-11-2009 by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest]


This is actually a double post, first one herewww.abovetopsecret.com...

but thats fine by me.. I get to post twice! Ha!

Ya know the above statement by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest is funny because The Greeks, Italians and Jews all lived through the Medieval area and They knew those languages!



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 06:05 AM
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Originally posted by InfaRedMan
That's weird... I thought the writing said,

"If Found, Please Return to Omar's Prop Supplies".
"Reward of 2 Camels".

IRM

Bro. I cant thank you enough!!!!!I've been suffering hayfever real bad & been clogged up severe until i read your post.Who would've thought shooting coffee out your nose could remedy nasal congestion?!?!



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 06:09 AM
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reply to post by Phlynx
 


thanks for the interesting news.

the only point i have is about this explaination:

(from the source: news.yahoo.com)


....She believes the text was written on a document by a clerk and glued to the shroud over the face so the body could be identified by relatives and buried properly. Metals in the ink used at the time may have allowed the writing to transfer to the linen, Frale said.


Why would some corpse accounting clerk for the occupation army of Romans 'paste or glue' an identification document to the shroud?

It would have been easier to use a needle as a stick pin to attach the document that served as an ID. IF the Romans even had that much reverence for a cruicified rebel's shroud.

Next, If the Roman soldiers had a roll of the dice to see whom would own the clothes/robes of Jesus....why wasn't the burial shroud also a coveted souvenoir/relic?

None of it makes sense to me, i'd say she was (pun intended)
"Fabricating" a good story



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 07:32 AM
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This is interesting but I'm still not sure how to feel about it. Firstly, I had always thought Jesus's real name to be along the lines of Yeshua. Secondly, if the writing is in Greek and Latin then couldn't the medieval monks, who knew Latin well, translate the Greek and Aramaic?

Also, they're sort of ignoring the whole burned in image issue, which I had always thought was the true mystery of the Shroud. Who is that an image of and how did it get burned into the shroud? Even a Roman clerk would have taken notice if one of the funeral shrouds happened to have an image burned into it.

Although, if this woman is a Templar scholar then I would be inclined to believe her assertion that the Templars had the Shroud. The Templars, along with most medieval travelers, were voracious relic hunters. In the middle ages having a good relic in your town was the key to success in tourism.



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 10:25 AM
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Originally posted by fotsyfots

Originally posted by InfaRedMan
That's weird... I thought the writing said,

"If Found, Please Return to Omar's Prop Supplies".
"Reward of 2 Camels".

IRM

Bro. I cant thank you enough!!!!!I've been suffering hayfever real bad & been clogged up severe until i read your post.Who would've thought shooting coffee out your nose could remedy nasal congestion?!?!


Hehehe!

I hope you weren't using a $100 note


IRM



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 10:34 AM
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Originally posted by JohnPhoenix


Ya know the above statement by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest is funny because The Greeks, Italians and Jews all lived through the Medieval area and They knew those languages!


Not to mention many crusaders learned those languages including arabic. The Templars especially learned the languages of whomever they were dealing with in the Holy Land, whether it be Greeks, Hebrews, or Arabs. And, it just so happens the Shroud was in the possession of a Templar family in the years previous to it being made public.

However, I find it very convenient that they are finding this writing proclaiming the Shroud image to be Jesus. I don't know if I believe it to be true. If it is, it still could have been written by a Templar.



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 03:13 PM
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The translation I found at timesonline.com was thus:



"In the year 16 of the reign of the Emperor Tiberius Jesus the Nazarene, taken down in the early evening after having been condemned to death by a Roman judge because he was found guilty by a Hebrew authority, is hereby sent for burial with the obligation of being consigned to his family only after one full year"


It is, of course, not a smoking gun or a slam dunk, especially for the devout antiChristian. But it is one more item in a long line of curiosities.

The main thing here, I guess, would be that the faithful Christian will not be put off by any manner of evidence against authenticity... just as the nonbeliever would not be inclined to accept it even if Christ Himself were to rise from the shadowy figure thereon.

This being the case, and I believe it is, it is left as it probably should be, to faith alone.



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 03:33 PM
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I'm at a loss as to what the shroud's actual purpose would be?

If the biblical stories are to be held as true, when was this shroud used? Jesus arose from his tomb after 3 days, right? Was he wrapped in the shroud for those 3 days? In those 3 days his 'image' was 'burned' into the shroud?



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 04:48 PM
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Something this researcher failed to consider, and is frequently overlooked in regards to the Shroud of Turin, is the manner in which it was kept and regarded.

There are two situations that could explain writing on the Shroud. One is Translation (elevatio corporis) and the other is Transference.

Oftentimes, when a sacred Relic is Translated, that is elevated to a position of holy reverence, it undergoes a Translation ceremony where it is moved from one locality to a Reliquary or Sepulcrum in another locality where it is then housed. Some relics, such as the Shroud of Turin, were Translated from place to place, buffeted by the tides of wars and conflicts many times over. Each of these times it is Translated, it comes within physical contact with other Relics.

The situation of Transference is where the sanctity or holiness of a Relic is used to anoint or make another object sacred by coming in physical contact with one another. Ever wonder why there are so many wooden slivers of the Cross of Jesus in Reliquaries around the world to make a forest of Crosses? Some are forgeries, but most are Relics due to Transference. If an object comes in physical contact with an actual Relic, it becomes a sacred and holy Relic in it's own right by act of Transference.

The Shroud of Turin was both Translated and underwent Transference on so many occasions that there were literally hundreds of opportunities for the Shroud to gain particles trapped in it's fibers obtained from contact with other Relics, or to have been smudged by ink, paint, or the image of written words upon Relics that were pressed up against it.

It is widely regarded, by most of the scientific community that the writing seen on the Shroud of Turin is wishful (the more unkind say "fanciful") thinking, but in all reality that isn't entirely without doubts of its own either. This writing is most likely not originally part of the Shroud, but more likely gained by act of Translation or Transference, and therefore cannot conclusively be used to either date or authenticate the Relic. All it can do is show that the Shroud of Turin, at some point, came in physical contact with another Relic that was authentic and dated to that period.

[edit on 21-11-2009 by fraterormus]



posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 07:43 PM
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Originally posted by St Udio
reply to post by Phlynx
 


thanks for the interesting news.

the only point i have is about this explaination:

(from the source: news.yahoo.com)


....She believes the text was written on a document by a clerk and glued to the shroud over the face so the body could be identified by relatives and buried properly. Metals in the ink used at the time may have allowed the writing to transfer to the linen, Frale said.


Why would some corpse accounting clerk for the occupation army of Romans 'paste or glue' an identification document to the shroud?

It would have been easier to use a needle as a stick pin to attach the document that served as an ID. IF the Romans even had that much reverence for a cruicified rebel's shroud.

Next, If the Roman soldiers had a roll of the dice to see whom would own the clothes/robes of Jesus....why wasn't the burial shroud also a coveted souvenoir/relic?

None of it makes sense to me, i'd say she was (pun intended)
"Fabricating" a good story




I've been trying to research more about the Shroud of Turin as its not a subject I really know much about. But it appears in those times when sentenced to death, a body was buried for a year before it was turned over to the family, and they did somehow fasten a document to the deceased person's face, for identity purposes later.

But, that since Jesus was not buried but placed in a tomb the document was glued or otherwise fastened to the shroud.

Also in regards to my earlier post, I'm guessing the shroud could only be the "linens" that Peter saw when he entered the tomb (John 20:5).

But, that passage mentions a 'cloth' that was 'wrapped about his head'. Was this cloth just over his head and not his face? It would have to be for his face to be able to transmit through to the shroud.

I wonder what that practice consists of, the wrapping of the head. I'll try to look into that.




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