Originally posted by zazzafrazz
The poverty cycle indigenous people are caught in is our fault.

I have to say that it certainly isn't my fault.

An example is the recent uproar over the disgusting conditions a few Aboriginal communities were living in, the government copped it hard from the media, saying the should spend more money on them etc etc.

If they were talking about a zoo, where the animals can't look after themselves, I would agree but last time I checked, these communities were full of adult humans, not animals. So why is it the governments or taxpayers fault?

Did the government make them burn all the furniture so they have nowhere to sleep? Did the government make them kick holes in the walls where a child stuck their hand in and got electrocuted? Did the government make them spend all their money on alcohol instead of food? Did the government make the men rape their children?

No.

Broad generalizations I know but so is the assumption that somehow us whiteys are responsible for their actions.

Sorry for the rant, I could go on big time...but I won't.

PS. Zazzy I wasn't having a go at you, the subject is a touchy one for me since I spent a year in Fitzroy Crossing, where as you know a lot of the above things and more went down...

Originally posted by Chadwickus

Originally posted by zazzafrazz
The poverty cycle indigenous people are caught in is our fault.

I have to say that it certainly isn't my fault.

An example is the recent uproar over the disgusting conditions a few Aboriginal communities were living in, the government copped it hard from the media, saying the should spend more money on them etc etc.

If they were talking about a zoo, where the animals can't look after themselves, I would agree but last time I checked, these communities were full of adult humans, not animals. So why is it the governments or taxpayers fault?

Did the government make them burn all the furniture so they have nowhere to sleep? Did the government make them kick holes in the walls where a child stuck their hand in and got electrocuted? Did the government make them spend all their money on alcohol instead of food? Did the government make the men rape their children?

No.

Broad generalizations I know but so is the assumption that somehow us whiteys are responsible for their actions.

Sorry for the rant, I could go on big time...but I won't.

PS. Zazzy I wasn't having a go at you, the subject is a touchy one for me since I spent a year in Fitzroy Crossing, where as you know a lot of the above things and more went down...

It's not the fault of White People collectively, it is the fault of English colonialists from about 1780 to 1970, and the people who sympathized with their atrocities.

They're all but destroyed what was an amazing ancient and spiritually advanced culture.

...eeek...

...I'm really - really - hoping this thread doesn't descend into a racial slanging match as many others have done before.

I'm not an Aborigine from Australia - I am however a Maori from New Zealand...so in some ways have more than a passing knowledge and direct life experience in regards to racism within society and its various sectors.

That said - very few things are simply (excuse the pun) black or white...instead they are more often shades of grey.

My own country certainly has racial elements within it, certainly has racially loaded slanting within the media, within many different facets of our society. There are certainly elements of stigma and discrimination associated with being brown.


That said - I'll also be real honest here: I don't think that some members/elements of my own race/culture do us any favours.
Ultimately regardless of the slanting that may exist - if it wasn't for the wealth of available *ammo* to load the guns of racial slanting that is provided by some elements of my own culture then we wouldn't be getting shot down as much.

As alluded to within a previous reply, WE also need to collectively shoulder some responsibility for how our respective cultures are portrayed.
If its a Maori our there robbing someone, or beating down someone, or in the media for some crime, or taking up space in the Social Welfare line...then absolutely that tends to shine a bad light upon us all as a collective culture.

Thats how it is. We all know that.

We can point the finger of blame at the media or at the Police or everyone and anyone else - but the simple fact is if there were a darn sight LESS of us out there providing those 'bad examples' (and absolutely there are GOOD examples which aren't so publicised) then those more 'racially slanted/focussed' sectors of our society would have a lot LESS chances to put the boot in.

Add to the mix some elements of our society that - IMO - cause a greater disservice to us all by being far too PC about things.
Sometimes a spade is a spade is a spade...NOT a manually activated earth relocation impliment.

There are certainly - IMO - examples where over leniency is shown. A recent example of that is one of our Maori MPs...a Mr Hone Harawira...running off at the mouth a little bit too colourfully. I totally AGREE with my Non-Maori friends who say "Ya know, if one of us said what he said, we'd be hung drawn and quartered"



...when *people* are out to paint you badly, best thing to do is not to provide them with paint...



Peace.

[edit on 16-11-2009 by alien]

The laws are stupid period and the same junk goes on here, like one story i remember from cali a guy who went to jail for his 3rd strike on a stolen piece of pizza... Jail for LIFE, for a piece of PIZZA.

Mandatory sentences and minimums is insane, at least prior to these moronic laws a judge could simply throw this kind of nonsense out... Now eve a Judge with a heart basically has little choice but to throw away the keys to your cell...

Call me crazy, but I think for petty crimes corporal punishment worked the best, we went crazy in the States when they Caned that kid for Graffiti in Singapore, but I bet that worked 10x better... in regards to him not doing it again...

I just can't see prison working for many behaviors... it's expensive to the rest of us tax wise, it's basically crime school, it doesn't just hurt the person but their family as well and if your not an actual danger I'm just not sure it actually works or serves any good...

Your prone to mild criminal behavior and petty theft or acting out in manners that haven't caused any serious physical harm like hospitalization etc, etc...

And the help given is to dunk you in with psychopaths and career criminals...

Totally moronic...

The white race has always been able to justify the dehumanization of people that are of a different race and culture than their own..... It is pretty obvious if you think about all of the weapons of war that have developed to be used on people that are still being killed in their native lands for resources that benefit wealthy white people..... Hell yes it is racism that allows injustice for non white people to be commonplace worldwide.

Careful folks this is turning into a thread derogatory to whites; Ahhh thats right, I forgot, thats O.K. LOL. xxxxx

Originally posted by KRISKALI777
Careful folks this is turning into a thread derogatory to whites; Ahhh thats right, I forgot, thats O.
K. LOL. xxxxx

Oi Kris

Meeeahh no its not, listing facts of violations, isn't done with the intent to be racist against white people (well by me I can assure you of that). These are not debatable facts, they happened

I agree that the methods used were disproportionate to the nature of the suspected crime and the age of the subject. However, this is a clear-cut example of a person appealing to the "white guilt" mentality.

You are right: if it was a white child, there would have been a lot more noise. But let's consider why this is the case. Instead of preaching that the country has a racism problem - or not enough respect for indigenous people, why don't we use logic to work out why. Could it be that non-aboriginal parents are generally more responsible and less likely to neglect their children than Aboriginal parents? We all know that lack of parental guidance is likely to result in involvement in crime and violence.

I am not saying that Aboriginal parents have these negative qualities because they are Aboriginal. The colour of one's skin, the religion they follow, their sexual orientation, their ethnicity does not determine their character or worth as human beings. But it is the actions and indeed inactions of certain peoples that do explain to some extent why these people are suffering.

[edit on 16/11/2009 by Dark Ghost]