Satan Does not Exist, page 2

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reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:21 PM by pepsi78

But positive and negative are just words made up by man. You could call them dumb and dumber, or right and more right. Just because you call them negative, doesn't mean that they are bad, just opposites.

We have to define them some how, we could call them X and Y, it does not matter they are still there without us.

Definition does not equal invention. We did not invent subtraction and adding, it was all there before us just like science we just named it. Math was there before us we just defined it. It's two things that are different that opose.

If you want to view an example of no definition as in that is how things are then take a look at two magnets.
I'm sure we did not invent magnets that repel eachother, it's what they do, they atract and repel without a definition, it's --> VS <---
If you want to call it rejection the call it that, if no one were around and this universe had no life the magnets would still do that in absence of life.

Definition of things came much later than things. Magnets don't have hearts or fear, but they do have force. Look at the action and not the definition. It's just the way things are.

Think of it like this.
If everything is energy then energy has a mind of it's own, it does not need a definition for it's self? You are a form of energy so you decide good or bad. It's more of an abstract viewing than on a personal note, call it a matrix.

Why do people think that everything evolves aroud them? I think not, there are bigger things than humanity already there in place.

I'm sorry but you are not "right" You might be right about Satan, he might not exist, that I don't know, what I'm sure of tho is that there is a positive and a negative and it was long before I made an opinion about it.

It's like there is an object in front of you and you refuse to see it, calling a glitch of the mind.

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:24 PM by 12.21.12

reply to post by pepsi78

Thank you sir, you are 100% absolutely correct.

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:29 PM by MrDudle

reply to post by 12.21.12

You have no evidence for Jesus. You have no evidence Satan doesn't exist. Unless you can bring me evidence that is able to be studied/documented/measured, your arguments are completely invalid.

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:30 PM by tribewilder

reply to post by pepsi78

I agree 100 percent with you.

I am saying that there is no right and wrong except in the mind of the observer.
I am saying that there is no good and evil except in the mind of the observer.

To me, that's different than positive and negative which as you say are there whether we are here or not.

Unless of course positive and negative don't exist unless there is an observer, but I am way too ignorant in quantum physics to get into that, as I have no clue at all.

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:31 PM by 12.21.12

reply to post by MrDudle

I'm soory but if you want to know about Jesus or any other subject you have to ask me a question.

Whats fair is fair.

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:33 PM by Ridhya

Thats like the stupid Luciferian Front, they tell you Satan does not exist (as a demon), he is actually an alien, so it is okay to worship him. Oy

All I can say is that you are the exact same as those saying Satan DOES exist, it is your certainty in your opinion that is folly. You have no proof he doesnt exist either!

Concepts of good and evil are subjective to your personal view, like capitalist think it is okay to exploit people and do harm if it makes them profit, but who really knows maybe that is right in God's eyes..?

Whether or not Satan exists as an actual being or just as a PERSONIFICATION of evil, it exists, and either way you think, I dont care. Someone who think they are actually praying to Lucifer and doing his bidding in exchange for power are just as bad as someone who steals or kills to further their own fortune, because they are both 'doing the work of Satan', just one believes it is an actual being!

Whichever is true I oppose Satanism in all form, and I hope there are other people too, because we could always use more selfless people, there are already more than share of greedy.

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:35 PM by elaine

Evil does exist in the world because man has created it with his negative thoughts.

Whether you call that "Satan" or not doesn't matter.

Negative thoughts (or actions)----->Evil----->Satan (or whichever evil entity name you prefer)

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:42 PM by 12.21.12

reply to post by elaine

Thanks.... But lets not call it that.

Let's call it pushing beliefs on others.

The only thing that is real...is truth.

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:52 PM by elaine

reply to post by 12.21.12

I'm sorry I am not "pushing" my beliefs on anyone. Those are just my own thoughts on the matter.

I should have made that more clear.

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 10:58 PM by pepsi78

reply to post by tribewilder

Tell me how is it to help someone without feeling anything at all?
There is an action for sure but no thought on it. But it's an action and it has an outcome.

For example you take a walk on the stars, you see a plantet full of craters but you have no idea of destruction of creativity, you only see the craters, you are an entity, what is going on your mind in that moment?

Does fire consume or is it just a definition?
Is there an action besides the definition in a separate way, I would say yes.

Simply put if there is a wall in front of me and I try to walk further in front, the wall will stop me. I don't have to define the wall to stop me do I?
I don't have to think of it, and I have to say, I will stop in the wall not because I think the wall will stop me or not because that's just the way it is. I have to say I'm a rock traveling so I have no feelings, but I will stop.

I took a look at the ice and I wondered why it's so cold then it soon changed as it melted in my "head" not hand, and I told my self, it's just a trick of the mind.

Did it melt in your hand or in your head?

I would say blolth, it would melt in your hand even if you were a lifeless corpse, you being alive involves your preception of that event besides the action that will hapen regardless if you are around or not.

Action and definition are two separate things.
I would like to get in to this, there are two things, two worlds, a material one and the one of the mind. Where logic makes sence and the material where brute actions happen where negativity and positivity turns in to real actions. Power of the thought can't influence objects, just action will as it is a material world, I think you are trying to glue those two in to one.

But one can exist without the other, there is no connection unless you get involved. If you let things flow they will function without you getting invlolved. Natural events occur without involvment. Does a tree grow leafs because I think the tree should grow leafs or because I have a definition on it?

For a fact random events are there to show us that definition has no effect
on actions. We refuse to see some things so we call them dark, black non existant, define non existance...well it's black, dark and so on.

And nothing is what as in definition?
It's black, dark ?
Does nothing exist?

[edit on 14-11-2009 by pepsi78]

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 11:00 PM by Starseed32

reply to post by 12.21.12

I absolutley agree with you, that there is no satan! I grew up having the bajeebies scared out of me about satan. I have done my homework on this very thing and much more and I feel comfortable believing that satan was created by man to control and scare others in doing what they want them to do. I could go on and on about why I have changed my way of thinking on this but do not feel the need to as this is my personal choice.

I have to admit though that my life has really changed for the better when I changed my way of thinking. All I look towards now is an all loving God! Although I really feel that if there really was a satan, my father-in-law would be a pretty close fit!

He tried to scare my daughter up about satan when she was 4! I stopped that real quick and we no longer speak.

The whole story of an angel trying to take over and was kicked out of heaven and now he is so powerful that he can cause people to do bad things just doesn't make any rational sense.

That's my two cents, each to their own!

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 11:06 PM by 12.21.12

reply to post by elaine

I am not stating that you were.

I was just stating simply that the difference between good and evil is the difference between putting your best intentions fourth or enforcing your intentions upon others.

There is a difference. Everybody has good intentions, but those intentions are only good as long as they are accepted upon free will.

reply posted on 14-11-2009 @ 11:25 PM by pepsi78

My take on all of this, there is a Satan and maybe his name is not Satan, maybe he does not have horns and maybe it's not even a he or a she.

But I'm sure something like that exists, maybe a force, I would say something bad is. It is in all things, maybe it can take the form of an entity who knows. If out of sand we can make glass and glass will melt away because it's just water then all posible combinations are posible.
The air can turn in tornados, maybe we can even fly without wings but we just don't know yet how to. If energy can harm but it can also do good then a nuclear warhead can be Satan?

Humans evolved from bacteria and bacteria came from star stuff and bacteria and star stuff is just energy. So maybe this form of energy can transform faster, evolve in a second, in an instance from pure energy in to some other form. Anything is posible.

I have a question, does energy consume stuff, feeds when it wipes all that is in it's path?

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 12:31 AM by On the Edge

This seems to be about pointing out that Satan is always connected with "bad" things. That could be "relative" in this sense,that some people believe there is worldly power to be gained by worshipping him.The name Alistair Crowley springs to mind. Think of the skull and Bones Society. Think about Hitler's embracing of the occult. They do believe,but they also believe that "evil" power is good.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 12:58 AM by kyred

Originally posted by 12.21.12
reply to post by kyred

Well then GW. I never thought you posted here. I never thought I would get to know your screen name anyways.

Heh. Good one,.........GW. I like that.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 01:04 AM by P. O. W.

Say we have recorded history for 10,000 years or so. No one really knows why we are here or how, and there is so much in life the enviroment oceans , mountains, stars, space and we dont really know if other intelligent life is out there. Its possible anything is possible. Say our life is like a gift and we are given free will and a playbook to teach us right from wrong. The conchuss the angel and demon on the shoulders with are every decision, sometimes there are big repercussions. The seven deadly sins all lead to corruption or self destruction if too much. And what about the enviroment and people in it. We are all in this alone, together. More and more people are just having flip outs with guns destroying things and peoples lives. I dont know maybe we will be judged at the end of all things. When I was younger I used to think what could be so bad that you could be punished for all of eternity. Maybe we are dealing with absolutes ( I think ). Just young people can be savage or chaos or chaotic at times not listening or doing whatever , being immature or rebellious. Maybe nowadays people dont always take the teachings to heart.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 01:09 AM by Phantomfire707

Good and Evil are words that cast a wide net. If you narrow things down and dig a little deeper you arrive at words such as: suffering, pain, loss, pleasure, joy, gain.

Evil is made up of: suffering, pain, or various kinds of loss.

Suffering, pain, and reductions are real.

Good is made up of: pleasure, joy, or various kinds of gains, or avoidance of pain.

Pleasure, joy, and increases...are real.

The labels and concepts of "Good/Evil" may only exist in the mind and are relative, but that does not mean that the foundation of which Good/Evil labels are placed upon are not real.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 01:11 AM by Phantomfire707

Originally posted by 12.21.12
The only thing that is real...is truth.

If truth is the one thing that is real, then all that is left is not real, thus truth must be made up of only things that are not real. Is that true? :-)

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 01:18 AM by Majiq

Originally posted by MrDudle
reply to post by 12.21.12

You have no evidence for Jesus. You have no evidence Satan doesn't exist. Unless you can bring me evidence that is able to be studied/documented/measured, your arguments are completely invalid.

Right, there is no evidence for Jesus' existence, but that is another topic. This one is about Satan, and your statement that he give physical proof of a negative is ridicules. In a debate about whether something is real or not (ie: tooth fairy, bigfoot, Santa, God, Satan, etc...) the burden of proof is on the person asserting that the something, in this case Satan, is real.

My proof that Satan isn't real is the fact that there is nothing to study or document. You can't measure what isn't real. There are no photos, videos, nothing showing me Satan is real. If you can provide proof that he is real I would love to see it.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 01:29 AM by csuldm

reply to post by 12.21.12

I personally feel like Satan and God/Jesus all exist on a higher plane, but manifest themselves differently here in our world.

Temptation is obviously all around us on a day to day basis. Whether it is the temptation to do good, or the temptation to do evil.

The way I have always viewed it, is that we are "test creatures". We are put here on Earth, innocent from the start. But our surroundings and potential choices are provided for us by God/Jesus and Satan, as a sort of test to see which side we will "choose", and then obviously once the "test period" of our lives is over (we die), we are granted the fruits of our labors, whether they be good (go to Heaven) or bad (go to Hell).

Remember this is only my own personal opinion, so don't try and prove me wrong and say how dumb I am and proceed to try and force your own opinions on me... you are only wasting your time.

Thanks, and I look forward to reading all of your other opinions and thoughts.

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