Psychological Question

reply to post by femmefreud


:-)

welcome to ATS femmefreud - the land of stinky-making

you'll get used to it

welcome to ATS femmefreud - the land of stinky-making

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


Monkey your a gas.... lol

My experience helping hoarders is thus:

They know they aren't like most people. Not "normal".
They like their stuff. It might have a purpose one day.
They hate having so much stuff, and they might want help.
You help them, they like it for a short period of time. Then they gradually put the same amount of matter back in the space. Even if you threw some away.
Then they are embarrassed, but just while you are there.
You can't help them. They have to want to change. They usually don't want to change as bad or more as they want to.

reply to post by seagrass


hey Seagrass

yup

that about sums it up I think

also - welcome back

:-)

My experience helping hoarders is thus

reply to post by seagrass


If you dont mind me asking .. How is it you have experience with hoarders. ?? Thank you

I clean houses. Clean ones, and messy ones. I see both sides and all shades of gray in that spectrum.

Personally, I prefer the hoarders to the anti-hoarders.
They seem much more generous and kind than the opposite. Less angry.
Less judgmental.

When I am around the anti-hoarders it is as if even my "matter" being in the space is too much for them. And, heaven forbid you spill something or leave something behind by accident.

It is my belief that people have a certain amount of matter that they want around them. A level if you will. Take too much away.. and they need to add something back. Put too much in.. and well it's "chaos". I also believe that each and every one of us has OCD somewhere in our lives and or personality.

reply to post by seagrass


Thats true, I know i have my own OCD things no doubt about that, i have plenty of junk and my filing system for my mail and such stinks, I never trow ads away, And laundry ugg , I have plenty of that, But gosh darn it dont let my doilies or my throw pillows go (a rye) and dont leave stuff on my coffee table, my kids would mess them up just to see me get uppity .i mean the whole house could be upside down but dont let them doilies be be frumpled. Yes we all have our things,

I

have friends from all walks of life , I dont care if there house is messy thats unimportant , i have some that there house was so clean it was scary, but whatever. And i love them all the same we just tease each other about stuff like that . And i love my friend too no matter what , Im just afraid and sorry for her.she is not happy, this much i know. And living this way is not healthy in more ways than you can imagine, I dont want to ridicule her ever and sometimes it seems like i am, I just am trying to understand the cause of this. And help if i can ,if not well then so be it , I will just keep a watchful eye and hope for the best.

clean houses. Clean ones, and messy ones. I see both sides and all shades of gray in that spectrum.

reply to post by seagrass


I guess that would give you a inside look at people, Thank you . I agree i am much more comfortable in a messy house so to speak, My grandmother kept plastic on her furniture and plastic runners on carpeet and you always had to take shoes off before going in. It was never homey, I hadnt thought about that in a long time . I defenitely see your point there.

Understanding of her ability to live like that? Or understanding of why someone would choose to? Perhaps you need to understand why she lives like that?
But needing to fix it, may be something you need to look at in yourself. Why do you care? You are concerned for her health, but she is the one who has to care about her health. If she really needed to lay flat on her bed, she could in all actuality shove the crap off couldn't she? If she needed to stretch her legs out, she could stack some things higher... she doesn't need to, obviously, nor want to.

Why do people smoke knowing it is "bad" for them? And controversially others?
Why do people race cars? Jump out of airplanes? Play with snakes?
Why do people do many of the things that are bad or unhealthy for them?
Why do we care?

Why do people smoke knowing it is "bad" for them? And controversially others?

reply to post by seagrass


So your saying < If you had a friend that was visibly unhappy, And say was maybe headed for suicide, You would just not care , or try to help in any way ? Not that this is to that point YET. But before it can get there i surely would like to try and help. I hope that i had a friend to do the same for me. And if she was the only person affectred by this it would be different , I know people who smoke but dont around their kids. see what i mean ? I HAVE KNOWN HER FOR 18 YEARS THIS IS NOT WHO SHE WAS . OR IS....

[edit on 18-11-2009 by femmefreud]

[edit on 18-11-2009 by femmefreud]

SORRY DOUBLE POST....

[edit on 18-11-2009 by femmefreud]

Thoughts of suicide usually are the lowest point before change occurs. It is a hopelessness from not being able to find a solution. I suppose it would depend on why she was having the suicidal thoughts. Those thoughts might not stem from having "stuff" all around. The problem may not be the "stuff" at all. It may be the outward cry for help for something much deeper that actually needs to be fixed. Perhaps you should look farther in for what is causing the problem. There may lie the thing that you can actually help with. With acceptance and love and understanding..

reply to post by seagrass


tHAT IS WHAY I STARTED THIS THREAD, TO SEE IF ANYONE HAD SOME INSIGHT TO WHAT HAS MADE HER LIKE THIS , HOARDING IS NOT THE REAL PROBLEM , I KNOW ITS UNDERLYING SOMEWHERE, I HAVE LEARNED ALOT FROM YOU ALL , AND AM DIGGING DEEP TO SEE WHAT COULD APPLY, tHANK YOU FOR THIS, AND YES I HAVE EVEN LOOKED IN THE MIRROR ON THIS, I DONT WANT TO DO OR SAY THE WRONG THING , SO IHAVENT DONE ANYTHING AS OF YET.JUST GETTING MY DUCKS IN A ROW SO TO SPEAK FIRST.IN HOPES OF NOT HAVING TO USE THEM.

Is hoarding a symptom of a "particular" problem?
I don't know why certain people hoard and certain people don't, but my guess is it is out of loneliness and loss of people. A needing to put back what was lost. Sometimes people find comfort in "things" around them when love is not.

My hoarders talk a lot about health issues and talk about dying a lot.

I am apprehensive about the idea that you can control another persons destiny and life path, but if you think you can help her, she may accept your help. It takes two people to make that agreement.
we could look for correlations, but everyone is different. Has a different experience.
My hoarders lost parents fairly early. My hoarders live alone with pets. They hide in their house. A reason not to have people come over? Perhaps a personal excuse why no one wants to come over, or be with them, live with them, accept them... I have wondered much...
[edit on 18-11-2009 by seagrass]

[edit on 18-11-2009 by seagrass]

[edit on 18-11-2009 by seagrass]

My hoarders are also not filthy. Although some people might disagree. I have no health concerns based on their 'stuff' level. They seem depressed, and yet at other times quite content with their lifestyle. They are somewhat antisocial, and yet can carry on quite a conversation at times in public. They get excited about each new purchase and project while feeling guilty that they haven't finished 200 other ones of the same type. I think they like the "idea" more than the "doing".

reply to post by seagrass


SEAGRASS. I sent a link to you via u2u , you may find it interesting. Your people sound sweet, And lucky to have you !!

Originally posted by elaine
Hoarding is a mental disorder. I think it's caused by insecurity or fear.

What absolute poppycock.

Hoarding is natural. If by our very nature we as a human race had never hoarded anything, then we'd still be running around naked (like mad apes).


Edit: on topic. Suggest she take up a creative hobby. Possibly writing or painting or music.

From the sounds of things she's just addicted to gathering.

[edit on 18-11-2009 by mr-lizard]

what happened to your friend? Did she get divorced, was there a death? There is likely an event that lead to it. My hoarders are crafters. Like my good friend Spira said, it isn't a horrible thing to have loads of paintbrushes, more than you will ever need.
Why they need so many may be based on belief that one is lacking in what one will need in the future, because needs weren't met in the past. It could be a lack of caring about ones 'appearance', because no one loves us anyway. It could be a lack of motivation, or an excuse to have one. If it is hopeless, one doesn't have to "try" anymore. Or hurry about it.