Black holes: Wholesome activity put forward that gets reults.

Hi there fellow ATSers, I hope that all is well with all of you! It is with me (well, sort of), but I wanted to have a go at describing this thing that a conversation between me and my pillow produced:

Black holes are basically mouths that have an insatiable desire: intaking all kinds of matter. Right? But where does the matter go? Well, it either enters an inescapable oblivion, is stored within the black hole for safe keeping, or dumped in another universe. Now I posted a thread on here before about my beliefs concerning other universes, and it didn't seem to go down that well. So here it sort of is again.

But first: I do not believe that matter, physical matter to be specific, can be reduced to absolute nothing, that is illogical, but then again, so are Black holes. Then, if we say that the holes store the matter, eventually it should feel the need to rid itself of it. How? And if so, why?

Well, I can't remember who, though the name is on the tip of my tongue, someone said that the universe will expand and expand, until it becomes infinite, which is when it will retract back to when it doesn't exist, which is when it begins to expand again? So, if black holes follow in that nature, they will keep absorbing material until they become infinite (on the 'inside'), which will be the time for them to replace what they took.

But they would have to change from being terrifying, indestructible (as far as we know) monsters that defy science, to being calm, productive, matter spewing holes. I propose this: Once they become infinite they stop emitting Hawking radiation and begin to absorb it, whilst spewing forth the digested matter. This would make them 'white' holes. Then, when the hole neither emits or absorbs the Hawking radiation (and the same with physical matter), it could be called a 'grey' hole because grey is inbetween white and black.

Then, because we know (if you either remember my Circle theory, or just know it from somewhere else) that this universe has only one parallel, and the universe parallel to that is this universe as it is parallel to us, the matter from a black hole here would be chucked out through a parallel white hole, and viceversa. All the other universes (the 'Time variants') would not be effected in as much as they will share the same experiences as those which we have experienced (or they have already experienced them, as both the end of the universe and the beginning happen at the same time).


So, after all that, I think I've lost the point, but that's basically the conversation in a nut shell. If you are then that means you will have read the post so thankyou very much! I hope that you do read it, but I wouldn't blame you if you didn't, as it looks boring and probably doesn't read very well. I look forward to rreading any responses (if it gets any )

Thanks

Ramadwarf on black hole-associated pillow madness.

[edit on 13-11-2009 by Ramadwarf Philes]

reply to post by Ramadwarf Philes


Hi Ramadwarf Philes,

I S&F your thread because of your, "thinking outside the box.'

But, after reading that I couldn't help but to be ....
You say, 'until it becomes infinite.' .....Infinite is never ending, how can something become infinite (never ending) and then retract back....

I might be missing something

reply to post by rainfall


Well, I don't really know, I think that, if something gets to a point where it has no boundaries, it cancels itself out, because if there's no end, there's no start, and therefore it can't have a real existence. It's like a circle. You draw a circle, but it has no boundaries, and infinitely goes round and round. So, if a black hole becomes infinite, it cannot exist, for the simple reason that it is infinite. Anyway, that's someone elses idea (I think). To be honest, when I was thinking about it earlier, it made sense. Now, after writing it down, my head hurts.

Let me get this straight: is it just the whole 'infinite' thing that you found hard? If so: The black holes fill themselves to the brim and unload in another universe. Forget the infinite thing. Just think of it like that and hopefully you won't be as confused as I am.

Ok, you're not missing anything, you're dead on, I want you to get a pencil (preferably one with a rubber on the end). Then, draw a circle. Now, once it's done, it is, in some respects, infinite, yes? so you then get the rubber and begin rubbing it out until you have nothing left. Look at this diagram:

Beginning----Middle----End
End-----Middle-----Beginning

The beginning is infinity, and the middle is nothing, whilst the end is also infinity, which means the start and end are both the same. The middle is not, as it is the 'balance', so what that means is that the universe doesn't exist, as it is infinite (and was from the start), but the contradiction is that the middle (life-us) does exist, and therefore it isn't infinite at all, but rather a circle that, once drawn, exists infinitely no matter what you do to it.

Yeah, I don't think we're thinking outside the box this time, but I can make sense of this, I can.

Ramadwarf on circles and infinity

We don't know what black holes are because aside from streams of energy black holes dont emit anything resembling matter.

My theory is that our area of the universe, or perhaps our universe itself, is to young to have yet observed what happens when a black hole reaches its form of critical mass and becomes a white hole. It may take billions of more years for this to occur.

The idea that its being dumped in another universe is a bit odd, since why isn't there any places where white holes are opening up in our cosmos from other universes and dumping matter into our own?

I also don't believe in the big bang as an absolute, nor do I believe the universe will contract to a point and re-expand over and over again.

reply to post by Seventhdoor


Uh, well, um, right: well just because we haven't witnessed anything resembling a black hole emitting matter into our 'cosmos', it doesn't mean it isn't happening somewhere. In fact, it could have happpened under the watchful eye of some astrologer/science type, but, if it's happening in a way not easily noticeable, how would we know it has happened?

I too don't have my mind made up about the big bang, but it goes into this theory quite well.

And white holes don't just open up, they are the other end of a black hole that, once all the matter has been disposed of, will become a black hole again (after becoming a grey or neutral hole). So how old is the universe?

Does that lift your doubts? Or lower them? Thanks

Ramadwarf on astrologers and matter