My Failed Attempt to Become a Freemason, page 3

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reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 07:45 AM by Witness2008

reply to post by Rockpuck

What does it mean when high ranking Masons actively pursue an individual through diners, golf trips, tickets and air fare to baseball games?

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 08:04 AM by Davidius

I can see why some people think my story is false, but I have no intention of deceiving anyone.

I don't know why the Secretary showed me the masonic handshake during my meeting with him. I did find it strange for him to do that.

It is also important to note that the lodge doesn't do things "by the book". I remember I had asked the secretary if there was a dress code and he said, "We do things very informal down here. You don't have to wear fancy clothes like the people from up north, jeans and a shirt will be fine."

I should also mention that when my friend told me he was a mason, he had just barely gotten initiated and been only to one meeting. He also made it very clear to me that it was up to the individual to decide for himself if he wanted to join the fraternity. He never once told me that I should join or told me it would be beneficial for me to do so.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 08:45 AM by Choronzon

Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by Rockpuck

What does it mean when high ranking Masons actively pursue an individual through diners, golf trips, tickets and air fare to baseball games?

While the constitution of Masonry states that none should actively recruit, each lodge runs under its autonomy. If something of this nature were to occur, someone would then have to bring them up on charges. But if everyone in that district is turning a blind eye, things can happen which are not permitted, even under the basic precepts of what Freemasonry stands for...it is sad.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 08:52 AM by Witness2008

reply to post by Choronzon

Thanks for the reply. It was my son who was being wined and dined by a few Masons. He knew that they were trying to recruit him and I was very nervous about the ordeal.

I raised my kids to be down to earth and resist material gain...but when they bought him Mets tickets, air fare for him and his girlfriend and put him up in the Hyatt in Times square I put my foot down.

Could it be because my son was working on a Masters and going after the corruption in the public Universities that they may have seen him as a threat.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 10:26 AM by Maya00a

Originally posted by nixie_nox
Why aren't women allowed to join the masons?

Women can become Freemasons.

The Grand Lodge of Freemasonry for Men and Women was Inaugurated on the 18th February 2001, as a result of a need of an Order for Freemasonry freed from the dictates of other Obediences.

GrandLodge.org.uk

Edit to add another link to Freemasonry For Women

There are at present Co-Masonic lodges in at least 50 nations, including the U.S., Canada, Britain, Australia, Greece, Holland, Brazil, Chile, Peru, Mexico, Belgium, and Venezuela. Androgynous jurisdictions worldwide include Le Droit Humain, based in France, and the American Federation of Human Rights, based in the U.S.A. All-female jurisdictions include the Grand Loge Feminine de France and the Lady Masons of Great Britain.

[edit on 15-11-2009 by Maya00a]

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 10:56 AM by iwasasked2b1

It is quite different in the UK. A potential candidate would not be invited to attend the beginning of a meeting. It may be possible that they would attend the meal afterwards but I have never seen this. Annual Ladies Night events are held where wives, partners, friends are encouraged to attend.

With regards the Worshipful Master not speaking with you, that WM will have a lot of ritual to perform in the evening which required concentration and focus. He will have a great many things to attend to before the meeting begins and if he is "caught up in it all" may not attend to everything. The WM is just a regular guy who has worked his way up the offices. Nobody's perfect.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 01:23 PM by Illuminator13

Wow, a no go? Maybe they knew something about you?

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 01:24 PM by Rockpuck

reply to post by iwasasked2b1

You misunderstood.. he did not attend a meeting, most lodges eat before lodge, not after, unless its for dessert or drinks. The "meeting" in this case was dinner.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 01:31 PM by JoshNorton

Originally posted by Davidius
Perhaps there is something more to these masons than meets the eye.

The secret is out. We're Transformers™.

I don't know why the Secretary showed me the masonic handshake during my meeting with him. I did find it strange for him to do that.

He may have shown you a Masonic handshake. There could be at least 5 or 6 depending on your jurisdiction...

It is also important to note that the lodge doesn't do things "by the book". I remember I had asked the secretary if there was a dress code and he said, "We do things very informal down here. You don't have to wear fancy clothes like the people from up north, jeans and a shirt will be fine."

That's up for each lodge to decide. I'm from a fairly bohemian lodge compared to some others in my city.

My thought on the whole matter is that since you were going off to college, you would not have been able to complete the degrees with the lodge you started with. It's a pain in the ass paper-work-wise, and probably not good for your own learning to be taught in different lodges. So the first lodge turning you away makes sense.

As to the lodge in your "college town"... Is it the only lodge in that area? If so, find out what nights they meet and go before a meeting to see the secretary in person. If not, do the same thing with another lodge. You'll never know if you're a good fit until you've met and hung out with some of the guys in the lodge. Conducting your investigation by email doesn't do you any good. You've got to actually go to the effort of meeting the people involved—it will help you know you're joining the right lodge, and it will help them know that you want to join for the right reasons. Everybody wins.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 02:14 PM by ForkandSpoon

Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by Choronzon

Thanks for the reply. It was my son who was being wined and dined by a few Masons. He knew that they were trying to recruit him and I was very nervous about the ordeal.

I raised my kids to be down to earth and resist material gain...but when they bought him Mets tickets, air fare for him and his girlfriend and put him up in the Hyatt in Times square I put my foot down.

Could it be because my son was working on a Masters and going after the corruption in the public Universities that they may have seen him as a threat.

Forgive me, but this simply does not sound like any Masonic behavior I have ever seen. Friends giving tickets that happen to be masons......maybe....but we do not recruit it is forbidden to do so. Furthermore masonry by it's very nature does not desire material gain, our lessons, and our rituals press the importance of humility, and sacrifice, not material gain. Sure there are wealthy masons, but there's alot more just breaking even.....if some people got him tickets and airfaire, and put him up in a Hyatt, I'd ask your son who they REALLY are....because you're not getting the real story.

Sounds more like a company recruiting.....

[edit on 15/11/2009 by ForkandSpoon]

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 02:20 PM by ForkandSpoon

Originally posted by Maya00a

Originally posted by nixie_nox
Why aren't women allowed to join the masons?

Women can become Freemasons.

Clandestine Freemasons, may use the name but that doesn't make them Freemasons.

The Grand Orient and other such lodges are not recognized by original masonry. Women may not be freemasons. Women can be member's of Eastern Star, Social Order of the Beauceant, and many other women's appendent bodies.

It's not about any sort of bigotry against women, rather masonry is about making better "MEN", and men really never act themselves with women present. It is a FRATERNITY. Just as the Boyscouts is for boys, and the girlscouts is for girls.

If you hear of such lodges who admit women, or do not require a belief in God etc....it's a clandestine lodge it is not recognized by original Masonry, and they are not allowed to join Scottish Rite, York Rite, Shriners etc.....nor will we hold any masonic communication with them.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 03:27 PM by iwasasked2b1

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by iwasasked2b1

You misunderstood.. he did not attend a meeting, most lodges eat before lodge, not after, unless its for dessert or drinks. The "meeting" in this case was dinner.

Aah, OK. Another difference between the jurisdictions. We always eat after the ceremony.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 03:34 PM by Rockpuck

reply to post by ForkandSpoon

Indeed.. I have NEVER heard of this lol .. utterly bizarre, perhaps there was a miscommunication between father and son, or group and recruit lol.. especially seeing as his sons supposed master thesis has absolutely nothing what so ever to do with Masonry. I wouldn't even say it's a university trying to stop his research, they could just fail him and turn him into a laughing stock ruining his career before it even started.

Besides.. what a dumb thesis, we all already know universities are corrupt?!

It's amazing how many BS stories come out about Masons..

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 04:38 PM by Witness2008

reply to post by Rockpuck

Actually Rockpuck that was not a BS story and at the time my son was not working on a thesis but working with local media concerning school corruption.

Given the incredible but most inaccurate assumptions made by you and another on this thread I am going to have to assume for myself that you know not the full story of those you defend.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 05:29 PM by Rockpuck

reply to post by Witness2008

No, I am pretty much certain either you or your son are full of crap.

Or, you could tell us which lodge went to such an extent to get your seemingly important (or self important) son?

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 06:40 PM by Izarith

reply to post by Davidius

Hello Davidius,

I don't think your story is false at all, it sounds very much like my experience with Freemasonry over the years while I was exploring about Freemasonry.

I do think however that you are not relating things in the way they actually happened.

For example the Masonic handshake that was shown to you. I find it hard to believe that a Mason would "Show" you how to do a Masonic hand shake. I think you shook hands briefly and then you were told that that was a Masonic handshake, leaving you perplexed and wishing you had payed attention to how he shook hands with you. But I imagine after the handshake you had no better knowledge of how to do a Masonic handshake than before you were told you had been given a masonic handshake.

About your accounts of getting the cold shoulder. Most lodges are close to forced by their grand lodge to not give the curious the feeling of being excluded. This is only due to the fact, I believe, that the numbers of loss of membership due to death out number the ones of new membership. Membership is dropping.

In Operative Masonry you were one lucky mother @#$$2#@ if you became an apprentice, it took close to a decade of hard work to become a fellow craftsman and you were, much later, even luckier if you became a Master Mason.

Back then, in Operative Masonry, You were scared out of your wits to make sure you really wanted to become a an apprentice because it was not easy and you had obligations you had to take an oath for. Your whole way of life changed and you had new responsibilities and obligations that were inexcusable to brake. It was no joke and the candidate was pushed away to prove he really wanted it.

These traits along with many others passed onto Speculative Masonry. It is still no joke to become a Freemason and many old timers remember the days when membership was high and there was no need to appease. You only became a Mason if you worked for it after meeting the requirements.

All I have said about Freemasonry is just speculation on my part.

[edit on 15-11-2009 by Izarith]

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 06:58 PM by network dude

reply to post by Witness2008

I think what my brethren are trying to say, is that there would be no reason for any masonic group to be interested enough in recruiting anybody to that extent. the goal of a mason is to make his community a better place. So he would be much better served to donate that money to a youth group, or some other community function. That is not to say that the guys who were recruiting your son weren't masons, just that they weren't doing all that just to get him into the lodge. I would bet large sums of money that they had a different thing in mind. Most likely employment as was said before. headhunters will wine and dine someone to that extent if they are of good quality, and the fact that your son was in graduate school, it would stand to reason he had a little bit of sense about him. Of course there are bad masons I guess, I just never met one. You might want to talk to your son about this a bit more in detail just to ease your own mind. I would hate to have anyone believing false things about the fraternity when it didn't have to be that way. have a nice day.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 07:00 PM by network dude

reply to post by Davidius

could you u2u me the lodge you visited? I would like to speak to the secretary to attempt to clear this up. if you are a good candidate for masonry, there is quite a few things the local lodge can do to help you out with you masonic journey. I think there may have been a misunderstanding.

reply posted on 15-11-2009 @ 09:09 PM by ForkandSpoon

Maybe it was a clandestined group like teh Grand Orient for all I know.....but in legally constituted lodge recruiting of any sort is not permitted that is true from coast to coast, from north to south and over seas. The closest to recruiting I have seen were the Mass Grand Lodge commercials and that was not aimed at any one person, also I have seen masons invite friends and family to different lodge functions open to public in the hopes they might ask the question......but to do all the things he said, the story is either false, they are a clandestine lodge, or he is mistaken as to who they actually represent.

Remember Masons also work for many differnet groups, a Mason who is a Pharm Rep might wine and dine Doctors, but that doesn't mean he's recruiting for masonry. Likewise different sorts of sales groups, or maybe a HR manager, or professional headhunter might also happen to be a mason, and recruit as a living or as apart of some other group....but recruiting to masonry isn't done, if you do not feel the need to ask the question, your not desired for membership.

Let me go one better if this really is a group of Masons, and they really are doing what you say, report them to the Grand Lodge of their state and state your displeasure and I GUARANTEE it would be put to a stop immediately.

reply posted on 16-11-2009 @ 08:57 AM by Witness2008

reply to post by network dude

Thanks for the reply minus the insults. Masonry is not a subject I have paid much attention to, and I must say that your brethren (if that is what they really are) certainly have not advanced the cause and protocol of Masonry in my mind.

My son and I simply thought it odd that these full grown successful men took such interest in him. The one thing that was made clear during these rendezvouses was that they were Masons, and one of them was an Alumni of the school that had simply known of my sons activities.

Thanks...you have answered the questions in my mind as best you could.

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