First I want to say that I am on the fence when it comes to religion. I was raised a Christian (Baptist) and until a few years ago, believed heavily in God and His religion. I am not so sure anymore but I don't allow any ill-will that I feel towards Christianity or organized religion in general to be advertised as I don't believe in ANY kind of hate.

While I am new to ATS (6+ months), I have seen a trend that is beginning to develop which is an ugly trend. ATS is a powerful and successful site and I have benefitted from it greatly while meeting many intelligent individuals from various backgrounds, upbringings and are different races, sexes, some may not have even been human. That being said, and before my account is banned, I am sorely disappointed in the ATS moderators for their decision regarding an issue I raised.

To get to the point, the only hate that is allowed on ATS is Anti-Christian. I sent several mods (no I won't name them as I still have some respect for them) that an individual on here had a prejudice signature line. It reads > I don't hate Christians, I hate what they do <. To me, that is hateful (see the word hate) and after SO posted an anti-hate thread, it should be a no-brainer that a sig line like that isn't allowed on ATS. Except it matches the trend which is hate towards Christians is ok. It is the only kind of hate allowed on ATS. You can't say anything racist or sexist but hate towards Christians is ok.

Here is the quote from the mod who replied to the u2u:

The reasoning behind such being that it is/was not a racial nor ethnic issue but more one of Someone's personal opinion.

To equate that of one person's opinion regarding a given religious group to that of an entire race wouldn't even seem on the same scale... per se.

Maybe I am just over sensitive and should take my meds . Is it just me? Does no one else think that there is some hatred which is allowed on ATS even though SO has strictly forbid it? I appreciate everyone's response as long as they aren't personal attacks. Remember, ATS has no place for most hatred

MODS, please allow an open forum for discussion. No names have been mentioned. Thank you.



edit tp fix my grmmr

[edit on 12-11-2009 by Roadblockx]

[edit on 12-11-2009 by Roadblockx]

In regards to the signature line that the OP quoted, IMO, it is no different then Christians who state "I don't hate the sinner, I hate the sin". Don't they pull THAT from the Bible? Personally, I think you're letting something offend you more than it should.

As far as hatred against Christians being allowed, and the Mods response, in particular...The Mod who wrote that up seems to neglect the fact that any hate is one's "personal opinion". If it said "I don't hate Muslims, I hate what they do", I'm sure that wouldn't be allowed. So, to a certain extent, yes, I think ATS turns a blind eye to "hatred" of Christianity, while coddling other religions.

Originally posted by Layla
In regards to the signature line that the OP quoted, IMO, it is no different then Christians who state "I don't hate the sinner, I hate the sin". Don't they pull THAT from the Bible? Personally, I think you're letting something offend you more than it should.

As far as hatred against Christians being allowed, and the Mods response, in particular...The Mod who wrote that up seems to neglect the fact that any hate is one's "personal opinion". If it said "I don't hate Muslims, I hate what they do", I'm sure that wouldn't be allowed. So, to a certain extent, yes, I think ATS turns a blind eye to "hatred" of Christianity, while coddling other religions.

Very well stated. I would rather the example you listed then seeing someone advertise hatred to a group of people regardless of the group. How about, "I don't hate rapists, I hate what they do"? Is that any better? I don't think that would be allowed for a second.

Sucks that I am letting it get to me. I guess I had high hopes that ATS would be THAT site where you wouldn't be allowed to wear a badge of hate and get away with it but sadly it's not THAT site. It's like the other million out there. Yes I am still here as the personal gain outweighs the ignorant statements of some.

Thanks for your reply.

i'd say you have a valid argument.

but i don't think it's the mods fault really.

It seems to me that when one way of thinking is perceived as common here, the mods then tend to let it slide unless it gets to be inflammatory.

an example of this would be on the 9/11 board. since it is clear that there is going to be NO compromise for a while, these boards are being watched carefully. but i would bet cash money that if there was outstanding evidence one way or the other that was accepted, they would not be watched as carefully.

i have seen that signature, and i too find it a bit out of line and tasteless. and you could very easily say " i don't hate black people, but i hate what they do" how is that different?

let me explain:

i say " i dont hate christians, i hate what they do"
the first part of that statement is "i dont hate christians". Fair enough. No one should hate a whole group.

"I hate what they do"
with reasonable deduction, it can be assumed that "they" are all christians.

what is the difference in saying "I hate christians" and "i hate what they do"?

a more reasonable, and less bigoted, statement would be "i hate what SOME do" my family is christian. they do not subscribe to the extreme part. they go to church, live a good life, dont push it on other people. nothing wrong with that.

this persons signature was the first i remember seeing on ATS. i read it, got a twisted face and said "that's in poor taste". this was day one of being on ATS

but in short, i agree. it seems like some things are allowed to slide while some aren't. it should simply be more fair.

Oh, it's very simple. Its politically correct in the modern climate to bash caucasian people and associated religions. After all, they subjugated the world for centuries and slaughtered millions in their relentless pursuit of power and wealth. Its a case of ignoring the rapist down the street, because the man next door was found to have 20 corpses stacked under his stairs.

Just wait until the Middle East does something so colossally abhorrent that we can't ignore it, then it we will all be free to bash on them while clucking our tongues if you point out someone else's shortcomings.

It's all a wonderful vicious cycle. I dream of the day when I will be able to point at an ignorant fool and call him such without being dragged before a court or postbanned for "Promoting hatred"

The largest target is easiest to strike.

Christians (generally speaking) will 'turn the other cheek' rather than struggle against the spewing hatred. So it's less likely that blatant anti-Christianism will be confronted.

It's "cool" and "en time" among the 'inteligencia' to hate people for having an "irrational" faith.

Sadly, too many Christian leaders have embarrassed the faithful repeatedly..., but then, that could be said of many other religions too.

However, I can assure you, as Moderators, we do not sit still for flagrant hatred, and we fight bias and ignorance every day - whether it be directed at Christians or any other generalized group.

But we can not be every where at all times. Use the ALERT button and we will answer.

Part of the irritation you face comes from thinking that no one cares that it is happening. We do, and we do not tolerate it.

On the possibility that you are, yourself, a Christian, I will caution you, throw no stones, lest ye be judged. Too many times we see those who, in defense of their preferred faith, commit the same breaches as those they vilify.

Deny Ignorance.

Originally posted by Maxmars
The largest target is easiest to strike.

Christians (generally speaking) will 'turn the other cheek' rather than struggle against the spewing hatred. So it's less likely that blatant anti-Christianism will be confronted.

It's "cool" and "en time" among the 'inteligencia' to hate people for having an "irrational" faith.

Sadly, too many Christian leaders have embarrassed the faithful repeatedly..., but then, that could be said of many other religions too.

However, I can assure you, as Moderators, we do not sit still for flagrant hatred, and we fight bias and ignorance every day - whether it be directed at Christians or any other generalized group.

But we can not be every where at all times. Use the ALERT button and we will answer.

Part of the irritation you face comes from thinking that no one cares that it is happening. We do, and we do not tolerate it.

On the possibility that you are, yourself, a Christian, I will caution you, throw no stones, lest ye be judged. Too many times we see those who, in defense of their preferred faith, commit the same breaches as those they vilify.

Deny Ignorance.

maxmars!! How cool that you stopped by.

Yes, it is because of you and a couple of other mods that I stopped short of say "ALL" mods (dare I cast a stone at a group). I have always enjoyed reading your insightful and well-thoughtout replies while maintaining fairness. Please don't feel that you are included in this thread. What I am concerned about is not the mods but the atmosphere that is being created. Hate of anything should not be tolerated.

I've found there are MANY more anti-Islam posts.

I think the problem people at ATS have with Christians, is that they start debates here that they can't win, and use the Bible as fact.

The reason there is so much anti-Christian stuff here, is because there are so many Christians bashing other peoples beliefs.

It still puzzles me when someone can believe in a fairy tale, Christian, Muslim or Jew.

Originally posted by Roadblockx
To get to the point, the only hate that is allowed on ATS is Anti-Christian.

got to say that your example is farcical. dude..read the forums.

there are whole swathes of posts on here from people who label the entire islamic religion as backward and call for its annihilation.

there are people who question the holocaust of ww2 solely because of the fact it happened to jewish people.

and you are upset about a signature line? really?

Originally posted by Roadblockx

I have to say I am a little shocked but do understand your point, to some degree. I don't think it is ever appropriate to lump an entire group of people together and say you hate that group's actions.

Nor do I ... but would you rather have those sentiments forbidden from public view, exposure or discussion ... left only to fester and perhaps take further root in the dark confines of minds who would choose to entertain such. ?

Originally posted by breakingdradles
I've found there are MANY more anti-Islam posts.

I think the problem people at ATS have with Christians, is that they start debates here that they can't win, and use the Bible as fact.

The reason there is so much anti-Christian stuff here, is because there are so many Christians bashing other peoples beliefs.

It still puzzles me when someone can believe in a fairy tale, Christian, Muslim or Jew.

Fair enough. I can't say one way or another as I have stayed away from debates about religion because I am facing my own battle and it would be difficult to offer a heart felt opinion.

With that said, still don't believe that there should be anti-Islam either. Where did the environment go that allowed free exchange of thoughts and ideas? When did hate become acceptable that as long as you didn't hate more then the other guy, it was cool?

I completely agree with your viewpoint.

It seems throughout history Christian bashing is fair game. Same here.

I am not Christian per se, grew up Roman Catholic, but no longer follow any organized religion.

Some seem to forget that the Majority of Christians follow their faith properly. And the asshats that spew their religion like zealots are idiots that will not reach enlightenment with their skewed faith.

I always wondered how many Christians were killed in the 20th Century by the likes of Hitler, Stalin, and Mao.

It seems history, kind of glosses over atrocities committed against Christians and only pushes the atrocities committed by Christian Zealots.

I personally do not see a problem with the line you quoted. It is the same as saying that if you're going to claim to be Christian, then you should be Christ like, in a nutshell. Why take offense to that?