Did Satan inspire the Old testament

reply to post by Wobbly Anomaly


I'd really like to hear some of your music, as well as the priciples used behind it's composition. It's always been a subject of fascination for me although i'm not the best of musicians.

You could try to talk this over with someone at the meeting... Isn't beer a great way to get the wheels turning when dealing with complex subjects

I'm really enjoying this thread, I look forward to your next post

reply to post by Lichter daraus


Quite possibly, but personally i have to make sure the words i use, for both my thinking about the subject and expressing it on here, reflect the way i feel and are not sidelined by misinterpretation. eg. The word God, to me, describes the being that claims to be the creator in the OT although to some god may be more than that and jehovah and satan aspects of that entity.

You see, i havnt got it sorted yet, maybe after that beer i mentioned !

reply to post by Wobbly Anomaly


I got ya. I try to use the word God loosely as i prefer to call it the true creator, the one and only almighty force.

Did Satan inspire the old testament? Of course.

Just read the book of Job. If the Satan did not do the things that it did, then Job and his pals would have discussed something different(e.g. the weather, which bait works best) and that would not have made for an interesting book and would never have been written down.

Another question would be, "Did the Satan inspire the new testament?" Most certainly.

The Satan is a constant figure in the new testament. Whereas the Satan is only mentioned briefly in the old testament.

It is only in the new testament that the Satan is created in to a "bad guy" In the old testament it is simply an entity doing its job.

However in response to the ideas suggested in the original post, this is similar to the theology of the Cathars.

It was the Cathar heresy that was the driving force behind the inquisition. Well, in the beginning anyway. After the Cathars were eliminated, it was just hate and prejudice.

Nah, no evil or divine influences just the ever active minds of the men in ancient time

After all when they were not procreating with their wives, concubines and slaves, they had pleanty of time in their hands, It seems the Israelis had a very over active minds.

Jesus does not seem to be any relation to the vengeful bloody god of the OT.

Actually, there is much research available discussing scholarly implications that there is more than one god in the OT, but all the attributes have actually been rolled into one and given to YHWH or Jehovah.

Did Satan inspire OT?

A very interesting proposition is the theory of The Serpent Seed. The premise is that Cain was the son of Satan. Read up on it and see what you think.

Originally posted by siahchi
reply to post by Wobbly Anomaly

 

I'd really like to hear some of your music, as well as the priciples used behind it's composition. It's always been a subject of fascination for me although i'm not the best of musicians.

You could try to talk this over with someone at the meeting... Isn't beer a great way to get the wheels turning when dealing with complex subjects

I'm really enjoying this thread, I look forward to your next post

Still thinking about it ! What you've said seems to fit with other thoughts ive been having eg this thread ive been commenting on www.abovetopsecret.com...

I will reply properly once the words jiggle themselves into place.

I honestly don't see why people spend so much time with the idea that satan has anything to do with anything.

Moses was a major contributor to the old testament. That was a guy that who went around starting plagues.

reply to post by siahchi

Here's the interesting thing, if you study gnosticism (neo-platonism and gnostic christianity) then that's exactly what is said! YHVH is equivalent to lucifer, because YHVH is not the creator of all, he is an emination of the creator of all. The creator is everything already, however it has to create to KNOW itself as the creator.
...

You are basically correct here. There are actually several versions of the Gnostic Creation myth, 'classic', Basilides, Marcian, Valentian, Ptolemy, etc.


Here is a discussion of the 'classic' version: (from this source)

This original God went through a series of emanations, during which its essence is seen as expanding into many successive "generations" of paired male and female beings, called "aeons." A frequent complaint concerning gnostic texts is the complexity of their narratives and the numerous characters within them. Some gnostic texts posit as many as twenty of these aeons (Valentinius listed thirty-three such pairs). These can be seen as representative of the various attributes of God, themselves indiscernible when not abstracted from their origin. In this sense, the aeons and their emanation are more akin to a poetic device. They allow an otherwise utterly unknowable God to be discussed in a meaningful way amongst initiates. Collectively, God and the aeons comprise the sum total of the spiritual universe, known as the Pleroma.

At this point in the myth the universe was still entirely non-material. The increasing fragmentation of the nature of God into more and more aeons led, eventually, to instability within the primordial universe. This growing problem reached its climax with the appearance of the lowest aeon, called Sophia (Gr. "wisdom"). In several versions, Sophia attempts to surmount the rigid hierarchy of the divine nature, trying to approach close to God himself. (Recall that though the aeons comprise God in his totality, they are nevertheless at the same time individual characters abstracted from him, otherwise we would have the paradoxical situation of God divided into many essences.) In other cases, Sophia imitates God in performing an emanation of her own. In both cases, this intransigence causes a crisis within the Pleroma, leading to the creation of Yaldabaoth, a "serpent with a lion's head" (Apocryphon of John). This figure is commonly known as the Demiurge, after the figure in Plato's Timaeus (Gr. demiurgos - "one who shapes" (typical translation); "Tame Worker / One Who Domesticates" (literal translation)). This being is at first hidden by Sophia, but later escapes, stealing a portion of divine power from her in the process.

Using this stolen power, Yaldabaoth creates a material world in imitation of the divine Pleroma. To complete this task, he spawns a group of entities known collectively as Archons, "petty rulers" and craftsmen of the physical world. Like him they are commonly depicted as theriomorphic, having the heads of animals. At this point the events of the Gnostic narrative join with the events of Genesis, with the Demiurge and his Archontic cohorts fulfilling the role of the creator. The Demiurge declares himself to be the only god, and that none exist superior to him.

From here the events follow in the familiar fashion. God creates Adam, during the process unwittingly transferring into Adam's body the portion of power stolen from Sophia. He then creates Eve from Adam's rib; the two are tempted by the serpent, and fall. However, the addition of the prologue radically alters the nature of this event; rather than attributing the fall to human weakness, gnostics locate the ultimate cause of the fall in the instability of the divine nature itself. The 'fall' of Adam and Eve thus becomes something of a redemption, and the serpent in the Garden of Eden becomes a heroic, salvific figure rather than an adversary of humanity. Eating the fruit of Knowledge is the first act of human salvation from cruel, oppressive powers.

The old testament is a garbled account of a greedy society run by power-hungry priests for profit.

The priests stirred up hatred against all societies around, telling their gullible followers that God demanded they rape, murder and steal, taking everything from whatever group they cast their blood-lusting eyes on. They were even ordered to murder their own children if those children showed disrespect.

The greatest libel of all has been too blame this mish-mash of garbled history, idiotic laws and legends borrowed from great cultures long past, onto God.

Do you want to know what God is really like?
We all recognise good when we see it. Look at what is best in parents, teachers, friends, lovers and children, and you will be seeing a little bit of God.

Look at religion used as a weapon, beliefs used to frighten people into obedience, prescriptions to punish and to hate, and you will see not-God.

I think the bible, both old and new testaments were inspired by both....depending on which ear the writer has the infection in at the time he was writing that particular section...

no, seriously, much of it comes from just how you read it, what you want God to say to you!! you can justify, or condemn pretty much anything through the words written in the book probably.
it's like a highway, it can lead you to heaven, or it can lead you to hell, just depends on which messages contained within it's cover you chose to listen to...

I have searched for a link to this but all i can find is sites with people stating its false.

I watched a video a while back which said when Constantine the Great was in power his kingdom was a diverse religious place of which the majority lived in peace. Constantine was unhappy his kingdom was divided and set about creating the NT leaving out what he deemed un-neccessary or un-worthy (Book of Enoch & many more) to unite his kingdom.
Now i kind of followed this until i read the other sites stating he wasn't even alive the time NT was made or put out.

Just thought i'd share that.

reply to post by Lucifer84


Constantine didn't write anything. All he did was preside over the Council of Nicea in 325 A.D, which canonized the Bible. It was indeed a political move on his part.