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The REAL Swine Flu Conspiracy

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posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 01:35 PM
reply to post by ecoparity

use this one:
the text in polish says that small side effects of the vaccine are visible on the skin and should disappear soon, but right now safety of people is more important

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 01:48 PM
reply to post by jedi_hamster

Holy #, it's a mole man.

Run for your lives!

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 01:58 PM
reply to post by ecoparity

sell it to Jane as a result of new baxter bioweapon experiment

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 09:17 PM

I posted about Gibb's paper back when it first came out. That's from back in May. Like I said, there were two strains he did not know were already in circulation in pigs (found in test samples form N Carolina, I believe). It was this missing data which led him to his conclusion. Send him an email and see where he stands now, he pulled his paper from publication in the journals once the information came out about the missing strains.

At the time, I supported his claims also because my private sources were also coming to that conclusion. If you want more detail on the missing strain issue let me know and I'll ask about it.

I'm done being an A hole Eco. I would like to know what information you have in this regard. I believe in the scientific method. But I'm also aware that it is not used when it comes to this issue. I also would have expected the WHO to parade this information instead of a flat dismissal?

If a fair falsification can be made then so be it. However I cannot see how the discovery of two strains can explain why all the gene sequences have been sped up? I mean even the Eurasian strains were sped up? I don't get it.
And there are others besides Gibbs.

Did these strains suddenly appear in the data base? sounds suspicious.

I've been trying to find how I can contact Mr Gibbs, no luck so far.

Any help would be much appreciated, I'm only after the truth and not easily thrown of track unless the evidence meets a high standard.

Our main argument is on the vaccination issue. I still contend that they are ineffective. Each to there own. I will leave that issue alone in respect of your opinion and your thread.

I do sincerely request any help with this.

This is just for interest sake, there are some more scientist listed here I intend to check out. Sorry Jane does feature.

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 10:05 PM
What I've been told is that Gibbs assumed the virus was accelerated because there was a "missing link" in the development stage of them between virus samples in the wild and where the swine flu he analyzed currently existed.

The two strains in N Carolina were that "missing link", they proved that there was no "missing step" in the development cycle.

Even Jane Burgermeister's own "team" is warning people not to listen to her, that she's willing to push any story forward without checking it and that she's lying about the entire case. She never filed any charges as she claims and her lawyer is not really a lawyer.

People have forgotten all her claims about drills going live and so on that never came to pass. Worst of all - all the incorrect facts circulating on the Baxter issue come from her - the 72 kilo thing is her quote, the claim that Baxter admitted all this is from her - I'd like to see the Austrian investigation documents, personally.

I was able to email Gibbs back in May let me see if I can find it.

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 12:13 AM
blah... about the activity in the other thread, eco - you can't win with stupidity. let them die if they want to, that's their choice. i won't be wasting my time on that thread anymore.

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 12:16 AM
reply to post by ecoparity

DO IT. really... debunking that damn baxter story and compromising Jane Burgermeister is one of the best things that can be done in this situation. because then people will open their eyes and they'll start to listen. otherwise, they're lost. in my opinion... it's a false flag operation. baxter working together with Jane to push forward NWO agenda. and people are just too blind to believe it's possible.

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 01:47 AM
reply to post by ecoparity

Thanks, that would be great. With the contact that is.

Hopefully If I have time I can detail some other scientists findings.

I just wanted to ask if you think that the possibility exists that this is a manufactured virus?

The first paper indicated a highly selective evolution that had closer resemblance to the most ancient strain in the data base?

After all there is no evidence for a pig to human transmission is there?

And this missing link was not in the data base and turned up after the fact?

I trust you are telling the truth with what you've been told. But are there any sources for this? I'd have to see how one find. fills a gap in all those genes stemming from different species and continents to be thrown off track.

I'm still baffled by the attitude towards Baxter, Jane maybe? but that I simple cannot comprehend.

This is what I mean.
Throwing the baby out with the bath water.
is it a non event because Jane may be a fraud?
Did it not happen at all?
You don't think Baxter would defend themselves if they could?

I'm starting to think the reasoning skills here are deficient and is leaving me with doubt on anything without sources. We shall see I suppose.

[edit on 21-11-2009 by squiz]

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 02:45 AM
reply to post by squiz

There are two pillars standing beneath the entire "bioweapon vaccine" conspiracy.

Jane Burgermeisters claims about the Baxter incident
The Joseph Moshe story.

In one case a real incident is being fictionalized into something else in order to provide the basis of the conspiracy and in the other the arrest of a mentally ill person has been embellished into something completely false.

Both of these were extremely easy to refute. Anyone investing any amount of time to look into it would see there is nothing there and most of the claims are coming from one source only - Jane Burgermeister.

Then, on July 23 she claims a German military and US govt exercise will kick off martial law in America and encourages people to strike out in violence against the government, preemptively.

In my experience, people who make up stories and try to get others to engage in violence without anything happening to them, no arrest, no questioning, nothing - are agent provocateurs.

Given she's the single source behind the Baxter incident "story" what point would there be in using her to make the EU report look valid? That's taking things to the extreme.

I like a good conspiracy but when I see such a huge amount of the alt media reporting false information I grow concerned. I don't want to be in the position of defending Baxter, not in any way but allowing outright lies to make up the basis for so many people's decisions is a much worse sin, IMO.

I think the plan is to convince people NOT to take the vaccine and to make sure there isn't enough to go around when they start changing their minds. The survivors will lose all trust in the alt media and patriot / conspiracy movements as well.

Every event and all the evidence supports my theory, nothing supports the popular one. It's held up by sheer faith and a desire for people to believe in it, nothing more.

Time will tell. It looks like we won't have to wait long to see if I'm right also.

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 02:59 AM
reply to post by ecoparity

I wasn't talking about any conspiracy. Did they or did they not release live bird flu, unlabeled, together with seasonal flu vaccine components?

I found a few more reputable scientists by the way who have a few things to say.

# Since 1997, novel viruses of three different subtypes and five different genotypes have emerged as agents of influenza among pigs in North America. The appearance of these viruses is remarkable because there were no substantial changes in the overall epidemiology of swine influenza in the United States and Canada for over 60 years prior to this time. Viruses of the classical H1N1 lineage were virtually the exclusive cause of swine influenza only from the time of their initial isolation in 1930 through 1998. [Virus Research 2002 May 10;85(2):199–210]

# Since 1998 triple reassortant swine influenza viruses have been isolated from pigs in the United States and a human case of a triple reassortant swine flu infection was reported in the US as early as 2005. This patient was exposed to freshly-killed pigs. [Emerging Infectious Diseases 2008 Sep; 14(9):1470–2]

# A report published in The New England Journal of Medicine in June of 2009 indicates triple-reassortant swine flu influenza A H1 viral infections were reported among a few humans who worked closely with pigs from 2005 to 2009. [New England J Medicine. 2009 Jun 18; 360(25):2616–25] However, this is not the exact flu virus that is currently sweeping globe with a late season onset in 2009.

# Michael Gregor MD claims crowding in pig farms is a factor in the development of the current triple reassortant flu virus infecting humans, asserting its precursor was first discovered in pig herds in North Carolina in 1998. North Carolina is the home of the nation’s largest pig farms. And it’s true, 3/4ths of the genetic material in the H1N1 human swine flu of 2009 comes from this 1998 pool of swine viruses. [Humane Society, August 26, 2009] But again, this may be a misdirection.

# Sometimes the obvious is not recognized. With all of the prior discussion about swine-origin influenza, this H1N1 late-2009 flu season virus is not currently found in pig herds, says Vincent Racaniello PhD, Professor of Microbiology at Columbia University Medical Center. The virus may have originated in a human! Asking the question "where did ‘pig zero’ come from?" may be the wrong question. Wikipedia accurately acknowledges that "the 2009 H1N1 virus is not zoonotic swine flu (zoonotic = transmitted from animals to people), as it is not transmitted from pigs to humans, but from person to person."

# The tracking of the lineage of this virus has been perplexing if for no other reason than the misdirection to investigate herds of pigs. News reporters may have been misled from the outset. For example, Karen Kaplan of The Tribune Newspaper wrote on Sept. 13, 2009 that "Somehow, a single pig became simultaneously infected with that virus and a pure swine flu strain found in pigs in Europe and Asia. The two strains swapped genetic material to produce the new H1N1 strain, which then began to infect humans." But the virus has not been detected in swine herds so far. It is similar to other reassortant flu viruses, but not the same.

[edit on 21-11-2009 by squiz]

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 03:14 AM
Did I say I'd drop the vaccine issue? just one more. It's too important.

# Over-reliance upon vaccination and anti-flu drugs increases genetic pressure for flu viruses to mutate into treatment-resistant forms. Genetic mutation is accelerated with the use of vaccines and antivirals. [PLoS One 4(3):e4915, March 18, 2009; Virology Journal 5: 133–39, October 2008]

# Just how do flu viruses mutate within a human? It is known that bursts of free radicals can induce gene mutations in viruses. [FASEB Journal 2000 Jul; 14(10):1447–54] Vaccination of birds and humans against the flu has been shown to apply genetic pressure and induce more rapid genetic drifts. [Virology Journal 2008; 5: 15]

# Bursts of free radicals emanate from what is called a "cytokine storm." Cytokines are substances that are secreted by specific cells of the immune system and can increase 1000-fold during infection. Over-reactive cytokine response is attributed to the fatality rate of flu viruses. [Mikrobiyol Bulletin 2008 Apr;42(2):365–80]

# Whole inactivated or so-called "killed" viral vaccines, which are the most commonly used, are plagued by their inability to activate antibodies. So they generally require strong adjuvants and several injections to be fully effective. [Clinical Microbiology Review 2007; 20: 489–510] Adjuvants are pharmacological or immunological agents that modify the effect of other agents (e.g., drugs, vaccines).

# MF59, the favored squalene-based adjuvant employed in both swine herd and human vaccines, could possibly trigger mutations that make flu viruses treatment resistant. Researchers indicate MF59 does indeed induce greater immune response due to its ability to generate cytokines! [Proceedings National Academy Sciences U S A. 2008 Jul 29; 105(30):10501–6]

# It has been repeatedly shown that nutritional deficiencies, particularly of vitamin E and the trace mineral selenium, exacerbate the immune response to replicating flu viruses and that this then leads to alterations in the gene makeup of the viral genome, resulting in a mortal outcome. [Trends Microbiology 2004 Sep;12(9):417–23] Nutritional deficiency not only affects the host response to the virus but also the viral genome itself. [Proceedings Nutrition Society 1999 Aug;58(3):707–11] To limit mortality, public health officials should be fortifying foods with selenium and vitamin E to head off the possibility of gene mutations among flu sufferers. [J Trace Element Med Biol. 2007;21(1):52–62]


Some of the above stuff is already happening isn't it?

[edit on 21-11-2009 by squiz]

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 04:22 AM
If this whole swine flu pandemic is a concerted effort by nefarious forces to make people sick and die, I find this bit of news very interesting:

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:01 AM
reply to post by really

it can well be just another part of a hoax.
btw, if Jane is spreading disinfo on purpose - you should also know that she knows about this forum and this thread. i know how she reacted to our theory. no arguments, just laughed at it, then went silent. other popular team of 'whistle blowers', project camelot, after receiving 2 emails about it - guess what. SILENCE.

seems to me as they either cannot stand the truth and implications of it, or they know about it all too well...

she's putting whatever crap she gets her hands on, on her site. often stories that exclude each other. and almost always, stories bended to fit what she wants. for example, WHO said on their side that no big mutation occured, she posted an article that WHO said that no mutation occured at all, and that it's not a killer virus, and started talking about pneumonic plague. single click on the WHO link reveals how heavily manipulated information she posted - but of course people won't even notice. they trust her too much. after all, she revealed the baxter story, so she cannot lie, right? then why is she so damn nervous and aggressive when someone points out to her that she IS lying on her site?

you're all too naive. what saddens me most is that you're going to pay for this... with your lives.

[edit on 21-11-2009 by jedi_hamster]

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:08 AM
Well, I don't follow Jane's forum. Never have. This seems to be a fact. I really don't care what Jane has to say. Never listened to her to begin with.

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:09 AM
Not to worry about the email address Eco. I found it.
Thanks for the offer.

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:16 AM

Originally posted by really
Well, I don't follow Jane's forum. Never have. This seems to be a fact. I really don't care what Jane has to say. Never listened to her to begin with.

I keep reading that same statement from people who post about the Baxter incident, don't they realize Jane B is THE sole source behind the entire story?

Every element of the story going around that is factually wrong comes directly from her - that it was a vaccine that was contaminated, that 72 kilos of material were involved, that it was sent to 18 labs - all her assertions.

People are arguing about this when they haven't even checked into the source of origin, they're just getting it from Alex Jones or other alt news / blogs / forum posts without even looking at the source.

Here is her website: theflucase

I recommend people examine the information she's putting out and see where all this stuff is coming from. This could very well be a life or death decision, you all owe it to yourselves and especially your children to make it an informed decision.

[edit on 21-11-2009 by ecoparity]

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:19 AM

Originally posted by ecoparity

Originally posted by really
Well, I don't follow Jane's forum. Never have. This seems to be a fact. I really don't care what Jane has to say. Never listened to her to begin with.

I keep reading that same statement from people who post about the Baxter incident, don't they realize Jane B is THE sole source behind the entire story?

Every element of the story going around that is factually wrong comes directly from her - that it was a vaccine that was contaminated, that 72 kilos of material were involved, that it was sent to 18 labs - all her assertions.
[edit on 21-11-2009 by ecoparity]

Two things:
1. What I said is true. I've never been to her forum.
2. This is where I originally read about it:

Are you saying that Bloomberg news relied on Jane? I'm not sure what you're trying to insinuate. Whether it was a mistake or not it still a screw up. Didn't I mention colossal screw-ups by the drug companies? Yup, I did.

[edit on 21-11-2009 by really]

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:33 AM
reply to post by really

compare bloomberg info to what Jane says and to what all the loonies are spreading.

Feb. 24 (Bloomberg) -- Baxter International Inc. in Austria unintentionally contaminated samples with the bird flu virus that were used in laboratories in three neighboring countries, raising concern about the potential spread of the deadly disease.

The contamination was discovered when ferrets at a laboratory in the Czech Republic died after being inoculated with vaccine made from the samples early this month.

baxter has sent samples. NOT a vaccine.

The material was intended for use in laboratories, and none of the lab workers have fallen ill.

Jane keeps spreading BS that it was a test vaccine meant to be used on humans. also, there's not a single mention of 72kg of that contaminated material in bloomberg article - another thing claimed by Jane and all the loonies on ATS.

now do you see what we're talking about?

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:41 AM

Originally posted by squiz
I wasn't talking about any conspiracy. Did they or did they not release live bird flu, unlabeled, together with seasonal flu vaccine components?

What you say is very interesting regarding Jane But I was wondering if you can give a simple yes or no answer?

Actually never mind, you won't answer that because you cannot say "no" can you? Do you want the statement from Baxter?

My point is once again emphasized I think. So easily manipulated.

My apologies for dumping that lot in there, don't let it distract you from answering my questions. Just trying to learn.

[edit on 21-11-2009 by squiz]

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 05:48 AM
reply to post by squiz

they did contaminate SAMPLE material meant to be used IN THE LABS. not meant to be used on humans at all. Jane Burgermeister has blown it out of proportion with lies and false accusations - we're not trying to defent baxter here, but what she's doing is much worse - she's basically revoking a choice - to get or not to get a vaccine - from people who believe her. look at the other, huge thread, look at the behaviour of some of them - stubborn as hell, defending her like she's some holy cow - and spreading that disinfo to new visitors asking about vaccines - and think WHAT IF she's spreading lies, and they believe her. they trust her. think about the implications of it.

i'm almost sure that one day, if she won't die from the virus, conspiracy folks will just kill her when they'll discover the truth.

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