World’s third largest ice store vanishing!

[edit on 11/9/2009 by Blaine91555]

so what if some ice disappears from some place? Its just going to end up somewhere else.

If you honestly think the world is warming then tell me why Mars is following the same habits.

Maybe Al Gore will say that our carbon is reaching mars, so we should give him more money to stop it.

Originally posted by ZombieOctopus
Haven't you heard? The Americans have decided global warming is a hoax and the Earth is actually cooling. If the American public has something to say about science, surely it must be true!

If all the ice on the planet disappeared over night, global warming would still be viewed as a leftist conspiracy in the only country that can lead the rest of the developed world by example.

Take a good look at those glaciers, or what's left of them, we're the last generation to lay eyes on them.

Sigh

OH MY! We are the last generation! WOW! Dude if there is a beginning there is an end, but who said that there wasn't ANOTHER beginning. Glaciers formed there somehow and guess what? Glaciers will form somewhere else again or maybe even in the same place it is just a matter of TIME (which happens to be endless.) Let me assure you, we are surely not the last generation nor human age for that matter!

Originally posted by Avenginggecko
Temperatures haven't been statistically going down since 1998. 1998 and 2004 were the warmest temperatures recorded, and since 2000 we have recorded most of the hottest temperatures on record. Just because temperatures aren't as drastic as 98 doesn't mean they aren't still going up.

Earth's temperature won't always go up year-on-year. However, on average it does trend upwards.

Doing some cursory research on global temperatures will show you how erratic temperatures can be, but they do still trend up.

Source

No, temperates are not statistically going up. And 130 years of temperature records is hardly statistically relevant to make any kind of the assertion you just made.

“Total annual precipitation in Greenland ice sheet for 1958-2007 to be up to 24% and surface mass balance up to 63% higher than previously thought.”
co2science.org...

And perhaps you missed this?

Global Warming Hockey Stick Based on Fake Data
www.theregister.co.uk...

[edit on 9-11-2009 by Riposte]

wouldn't all the massive flooding in the places of the world from torrential rains, explain where all the water is going?

It seems there is a bit of controversy over this.

I
Jairam Ramesh, India's environment minister, released the controversial report in Delhi, saying it would "challenge the conventional wisdom" about melting ice in the mountains.

Two years ago, the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), the UN agency which evaluates the risk from global warming, warned the glaciers were receding faster than in any other part of the world and could "disappear altogether by 2035 if not sooner".

Today Ramesh denied any such risk existed: "There is no conclusive scientific evidence to link global warming with what is happening in the Himalayan glaciers." The minister added although some glaciers are receding they were doing so at a rate that was not "historically alarming".


..."My concern is that this comes from western scientists … it is high time India makes an investment in understanding what is happening in the Himalayan ecosystem," he added.

The government report, entitled Himalayan glaciers (pdf), looks at 150 years' worth of data gathered from the Geological Survey of India from 25 glaciers. It claims to be the first comprehensive study on the region.

Vijay Kumar Raina, the geologist who authored the report, admitted that some "Himalayan glaciers are retreating. But it is nothing out of the ordinary. Nothing to suggest as some have said that they will disappear."...





In a remarkable finding, the report claims the Gangotri glacier, the main source of the River Ganges, actually receded fastest in 1977 – and is today "practically at a stand still".


According to Raina, the mistake made by "western scientists" is to apply the rate of glacial loss from other parts of the world to the Himalayas. "In the United States the highest glaciers in Alaska are still below the lowest level of Himalayan glaciers. Our 9,500 glaciers are located at very high altitudes. It is completely different system."

"As long as we have monsoons we will have glaciers. There are many factors to consider when we want to find out how quickly (glaciers melt) … rainfall, debris cover, relief and terrain," said Raina.

Source

It’s a money making scheme and power grab. Your assumption that Gore or any other corrupt politician is looking out for you is naive. Why don’t you check Gores net worth before his “green agenda” and after?

See, this is what I am talking about. You are letting your hate of Gore or whoever else is making money off of this cloud your sight. You are not seeing the forest for the trees as it were. I did not mention Gore, or anyone politician, nor claimed anyone was spouting the gospel truth about any of this.

The FACTS are there, staring everyone in the face. And the only laughable response I hear is that the earth "goes through these cycles." It does? Are you kidding me? It does so VERY VERY VERY SLOWLY. Over tens of THOUSANDS of years. This occurs very infrequently.

For example: An arctic lake in the Baffin Island in Canada was supposed to be cooling off for another 8,000 years. It's heating up 4,000 years early.

These changes have happened over a mere 150 years! I don't think people realize how incredibly fast that is in grand scheme of global climate. It's unprecedented and very unsettling.

Almost as unsettling as people just "accepting" the changes as a natural and normal cycle of our planet. You'd think people would be smarter than this. It's not about politics or $$$, it's about our planet acting drastically different than usual in an INCREDIBLY short period of time.

No question we're coming up on trying times. Instead of placing the blame on something or someone for getting us into this position in the first place, we should be doing all we can to prepare for these awaiting disasters.

reply to post by fleabit


Yes, the evidence is certainly out there - like here: www.ncdc.noaa.gov... - October '09 was the 3rd COOLEST October ON RECORD....again, in complete disagreement with the model of Global Man Made Climate Change - And Lil Drummerboy, it was also THE WETTEST October since records have been kept, which follows a trend of wetter weather - again, going against Al Gore's model. Global Man Made Climate Change is a FARCE. The SCIENCE does not support it, and in most cases, tends to disprove it. First Al Gore invented the Internet, now he's INVENTED Global Warming. NOTHING the powers that are pushing the Man Made Climate Change agenda have said would occur have actually come to pass, and no actual PROOF is ever offered, other than images of melting glaciers. Can anyone present a document signed by a significant number of actual Atmospheric Scientists SUPPORTING the Man Made Global Climate Change Model? I can present a single document (as did Ron Paul on the floor of the House in June of this year) signed by over 31,000 Atmospheric Scientists and Climatologists that states that the SCIENCE doesn't support the model. Let me ask you all ONE SIMPLE QUESTION - If there was SO much at stake, if our very existence as a species is at risk (as Mr. Gore's movie so eloquently put it) - do you really think that the proponents of this farce would still be jetting all over the world in their private planes and riding around in convoys of big SUV's continuing to add to the problem?

Originally posted by TSZodiac
reply to post by fleabit

 

Yes, the evidence is certainly out there - like here: www.ncdc.noaa.gov... - October '09 was the 3rd COOLEST October ON RECORD....again, in complete disagreement with the model of Global Man Made Climate Change...Global Man Made Climate Change is a FARCE.

The farce is that you can't tell the difference between US national data and global data. The last completed monthly NCDC global data for september is the 2nd highest on record for land and the 5th for oceans.

I'd wait a bit until you crow about October. El Nino is stalking the pacific and a new global yearly record in the near future would not be a surprise.

However, the model of 'global man made climate change' has no issues with local and short-term variation. It focuses on long-term changes.

[edit on 10-11-2009 by melatonin]

you will have to prove to me that this is not a local effect caused by all the smoke and pollution warming the area down wind from all the Chinese smokestacks.

All this Chinese pollution falling on the snow would discolor the snows causing it to melt faster.
This smoke in the air wound heat up the air in that area and cause the snow to melt faster.
This smoke can also change rain and snow fall patterns causing less snow to fall in those areas.
China has abundant supplies of coal and already burns more of it than the United States, Europe and Japan combined. But even many of its newest coal-fired power plants and industrial furnaces operate inefficiently and use pollution controls considered inadequate in the West.
geology.com...
www.cbsnews.com...
www.usatoday.com...
www.orthodoxytoday.org...

This may be a problem caused by china to themselves and unrelated to world wide global warming.

By the amounts of smoke and pollution from china that is found in the air in Calif they easily could be doing this to themselves without any help from global warming.

The fact that India put out pollution just as bad and this ice is between the two countries.

It may get to a point where to US EPA can not test accurately for pollution from US sources because of pollution blowing in from china

Yes, the evidence is certainly out there - like here: www.ncdc.noaa.gov... - October '09 was the 3rd COOLEST October ON RECORD....again, in complete disagreement with the model of Global Man Made Climate Change - And Lil Drummerboy, it was also THE WETTEST October since records have been kept, which follows a trend of wetter weather - again, going against Al Gore's model. Global Man Made Climate Change is a FARCE.

Again, you are looking at things like particular months and act as if this proves nothing is happening, while MAJOR events are occurring on a regular basis now. October was wet... while entire glaciers are disappearing. October was cool... while arctic ice is vanishing and ice shelves are threatening to collapse. How can you so blindly ignore these unprecedented events?

A global climate shift can cause different results around the planet. For example, when we would dive in California, the summer months meant.. colder water. The water was warmer in the winter. Because arctic ice melting and flowing with the current would make it colder during the summer. That's analogous to the global climate. Just because the temperature may do some things that seem normal, doesn't mean everything is "ok" in the world.

The planet isn't plotting against you to make Al Gore money. It's reacting to SOMETHING. I didn't even say it was a man-made result. I said it would be very irresponsible to just ignore that it might be so, and keep living like we are. I personally feel it is man-made, simply due to the very short time line in which all this is occurring, and how easily our disruption can affect nature. I work for a large environmental agency, and you'd be surprised how little effort it requires to completely throw stuff out of whack in the natural world.

reply to post by melatonin


That's because I live in the US and the NOAA is the weather authority here - the Farce is that you are so easliy taken in by this Scam. I would like to see ANY evidence of "Man Made Global Climate Change"...other than people making statements like "Artic and Antarctic ice is melting at an alarming pace" when, if you check the Snow and Ice Data Center's website (at the University of Colorado) the SCIENCE clearly shows that Arctic ice has increased in volume every year since the low point in 2005 (BTW - Arctic ice has only been measured since 1979, so your "long term" data is a myth also) and is expected this winter to increase by 30% over last year - and Antarctic ice is WELL above the average for the period 1979-2000 over the last 5 years. Again, the SCIENCE does not support the conclusions reached by the POLITICIANS fielding the SCAM formerly known as "Global Warming". I await not SOME proof, but ANY proof that Mankind has had any effect on the long term climate of the Earth. There are certainly examples of short term effects - like the "dust bowl" in the Mid West in the 1920's, guess what - 90 years later, no dust bowl - in fact, the areas where the dust bowl was most prevalent have seen more than their share of floods over the last few years...back to the OP, as I posted earlier, the Tibetan Plateau melting has been documented for more than 16 years, and is the result of a steady techtonic uplift in the area - causing heat to transfer from the asthenosphere to the surface, which causes the melting. Not because Al Gore drives around with a convoy of SUV's, but because of a progressive NATURAL force. The OP is just another example of how the world is being mislead into believing in this SCAM - you are shown a photo and told, "YOU are causing this!" - you are not given any proof, but since you are SO important in the cosmic scheme of things, it MUST be you causing it....Horse manure - Stop listening to POLITICIANS, CELEBRITIES, and TALKING HEADS and listen to the SCIENTISTS.

Originally posted by crimvelvet
It seems there is a bit of controversy over this.
.............

Of course there is. There are people that will try to do ANYTHING to revive their dead AGW (Anthropogenic Global Warming) ideology.

They did the same with that famous polar bear photo, and they are doing the same with what is happening to SOME glaciers, but of course they don't mention what happens to other glaciers, or that this is not unprecedented....

Originally posted by melatonin
............
However, the model of 'global man made climate change' has no issues with local and short-term variation. It focuses on long-term changes.

[edit on 10-11-2009 by melatonin]

Aaah, here comes MINI Al Gore...

Yeah, sure Mini Al, I guess that's why there was no "free ice" on the summer of 2008, or 2009 in the Arctic, and I guess that's why we are not experiencing unbereable heat"...

Give it up MINI Al, Climate Change is NATURAL....

Temperature Highlights - October
The average October temperature of 50.8°F was 4.0°F below the 20th Century average and ranked as the 3rd coolest based on preliminary data.

For the nation as a whole, it was the third coolest October on record. The month was marked by an active weather pattern that reinforced unseasonably cold air behind a series of cold fronts. Temperatures were below normal in eight of the nation's nine climate regions, and of the nine, five were much below normal. Only the Southeast climate region had near normal temperatures for October.

Statewide temperatures coincided with the regional values as all but six states had below normal temperatures. Oklahoma had its coolest October on record and ten other states had their top five coolest such months.
Florida was the only state to have an above normal temperature average in October. It was the sixth consecutive month that the Florida's temperature was above normal, resulting in the third warmest such period (May-October).

www.ncdc.noaa.gov...

BTW mini Al, there is no need to try to keep deceiving people.



[edit on 10-11-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

And before Mini Al Gore starts claiming that is just happening in the U.S....

Coldest October in over 25 years
The New Zealand Herald, 4:00AM Monday Nov 02, 2009

New Zealanders have just shivered through the coldest October in more than 25 years – not long after they enjoyed the warmest August on record, says a climate analyst.

After a winter of wild swings, temperatures are expected to be closer to normal in November, December and January.

The October mean temperature of 10.7C was 1.4C below average making it the coldest October since 1982, climate scientist Jim Salinger has calculated.

globalfreeze.wordpress.com...

Nature = 10,000,000 Points.
AGWers (Anthropogenic Global Warmers) = 0



[edit on 10-11-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Originally posted by TSZodiac
- Stop listening to POLITICIANS, CELEBRITIES, and TALKING HEADS and listen to the SCIENTISTS.

lol

Talking heads are great. I'd assume you're a big fan of Stop making sense.

I listen closely to the scientists, but I firstly follow the data. And both the scientists and the data say you're in flatearther zone.

[edit on 10-11-2009 by melatonin]

reply to post by HotSauce


they say that the ice fields are melting in the lands of the vikings . but they forget to tell you that in the hey day of the vikings there was no ice fields just lush green land. global warming is a natural thing the earth evolve just as everything else. yes we are harming our planet. but please don,t blame mankind for everything

To all the global warming hippies, I have a question for you.

While the rest of us know that “Climate change” is a natural cycle, as also seen on other planets. While we know that some glaciers are melting (they are ice, that’s what ice does) there are many more glaciers that are growing. While we know that the Earth has had Ice Ages before, and has gone in and out of them.

While we know all this, and you can’t seem to get it (or only point out melting glaciers and forget to mention the growing ones).

While you fall for the whole “Carbon footprint” scam, I ask.

What are you doing on ATS? Because apparently using the Internet increases your carbon footprint. 2 Google searches alone causes as much CO2 as boiling a kettle!

So what are you doing on ATS?

Log off now, before the world melts.

Mikey

Big deal. It happened in the Sahara millenia ago and it wasn't man made global warming that caused that.
Big fuss over a natural occurance.