I would like to discuss the theory and idea that "Alien Abductions" are a spectral-phenomenon, or to use a word people are more familiar with, an astral-phenomenon. That would mean it...

a)...is not an extraterrestrial phenomenon (although I am not implying that extraterrestrials and beings on other planets dont exist. I firmly believe they do)

b)...is not a mere hallucinatory or psychiatric delusion (although I am not implying that such delusion dont exist. I firmly believe they do)

c)...is not the result of secret Government Experimentation (although I am not implying that Government Experimentaiton on humans doesnt exist. I believe it does).

Every Culture/Religion knows astral-beings and knows that they interact from another, non-physical (astral) plane with humans in either benevolent or malevolent ways. In Hinduism and Buddhism there are the Devas and Asuras in Christianity the Equivalent Angels and Demons, in Tribal Religions they are called good and bad Spirits. Actually there is hardly a Religion that does not mention them. In the middle-ages various beings are referred to as Fairies, Dwarves, Goblins, etc. What did they do? They played tricks on and abducted people. Or they visited them at night and performed experiments and forced sex. Here is an image from that time, depicting a "Hag" harrassing a woman at night:



So why do I think that the "Grays" are not actually ETs but astral-beings? Because:

* Almost all Abduction accounts take place in the bedroom in states of sleep, half-sleep, half-waking, etc. The only way the astral-world is accesible is in a state between waking and sleeping.

* Some Abductees talk of sleep-paralysis, which is a telltale-sign of an astral-experience.

* The only physical evidence that ever shows up is related to the physical body (scars, wounds, rashes). The astral-level, in conjunction with the mind is able to create such phenomena (if the mind is convinced of its reality) but unlikely to have any stronger influence on the physical realm.

* The actions performed are not immediately recognizable as those we might associate benevolence or a species that is ethically highly advanced with. Holding people against their will is more typical of astral-entities.

There is a more important reason I think alien-abductions may not be alien-abductions but astral-phenomenon: Because I experienced abductions myself, as a child. And I also experienced astral-projection. And sleep-paralysis. And they all tied in with each other. And the experiences were very real, even horrifying, but they did not seem to take place in the same reality as waking-life. And I didnt seem able to bring back evidence of the experiences as they all happened at night.

Now Im still willing to believe that these are ET-dudes if someone will show me abduction-experiences that took place in broad daylight with no altered-state involved. And Im still willing to believe that these beings may be benevolent, although that is not really the "vibe" one gets from them (it remains to be seen whether they are friend or foe).



The only problem with my theory is that Ive also seen UFOs in my lifetime. Flying silver discs. And Im pretty sure those were not astral but physical because I saw them in glaring, wide-awake daylight, not in that shadowy land of halfsleep. Unless the UFOs and the Grays are not related ...because I did not see those flying disc in the same years I had those abduction-experiences. I dont have any ET-experiences since childhood. But I do remember them and can re-count most of what happened without the need for hypnosis.

So what I am saying is that these are "aliens", but maybe not in the sense we understand the term "aliens"...

Thoughts?



[edit on 29-5-2010 by Skyfloating]

I think that most of them there probly some sort of night trama or sleep parayalsis. But theres still ones you cant rub off as that. People driving in cars, out walking... bla bla bla and stuff with physical evidence as well

good post. i tend to agree with most of what you said. having had some really weird experiences while sleeping, and knowing that i was never "taken" from my room, having things done on the astral plane makes sense.

as to the UFO aspect, i truly believe ufos didn't exist until the 40's, and are a direct result of Nazi design with perhaps information on how to build them with from astral beings.

Originally posted by superdebz
But theres still ones you cant rub off as that. People driving in cars, out walking... bla bla bla and stuff with physical evidence as well

But are the broad-daylight abductions really by Grays though? Ive heard of other species abducting people in daylight, but not Grays...(?)

[edit on 8-11-2009 by Skyfloating]

Wow, awesome thread. I think you make a valid argument. Some more examples such as the Hag, would be interesting to hear.

Since there is no strong evidence of an ET/US agreement to exchange technology for human experiment , I think your explanation is pretty reasonable.

Just as most UFO photos are grainy and out of focus, most abduction cases are missing hard evidence and cold hard facts.

There has NEVER been a missing person, kidnapping, or abduction case with the conclusion: the victim was abducted by beings not from this earth and taken aboard a space craft.

If such a case exists, please point me in the right direction.

It is the first time i see this theory posted on this forum. Indeed, a lot of abductions are astral in nature. It's all part of the domination of the astral sphere on the human race.

When humans are abducted and they can remember the event taking place, it is astral in nature. As for the other kinds of abductions, the memory of the event is erased from the mind of the subject being abducted. This is the biggest difference between the two forms of abductions. To remember the event, the only way is through hypnotic regression. Some of the details may surface, but most of the time, the subjects are in a state of fear and confusion.

Originally posted by governmentsecrets
good post. i tend to agree with most of what you said. having had some really weird experiences while sleeping, and knowing that i was never "taken" from my room, having things done on the astral plane makes sense.

I actually saw my first "gray alien" at the age of 5 or so. I was unable to move, sleep paralyized and had these huge dark eyes looming over me.

Originally posted by lagenese
It is the first time i see this theory posted on this forum

I did a search because I wanted to read up on the theory and lo and behold...of thousands and thousands of threads, not a single one discussed the alien-astral idea. Thats surprising.

The reason is probably, that all the time is wasted with Skeptics vs. Believers discussions where the Skeptics say "dont exist" and the Believers say "are physical aliens".

So one misses the other possibilities out there...

They are two different things. An astral projection is just that; a divergence of the normal mind/body relationship.
And abduction of the physical body is completely different. It is kidnapping in so many words.
I don't know about greys or mj12 , but a meeting between earth humans and extraterrestrial humans has taken place on this planet before and probably it still takes place. Not every government knows everything. There is no one single organization, nation, or company which has a voice for humanity.
Humanity is rich in diversity and there are humans on other worlds. I believe that to be the case I should say.

i think its a very plausible theory actually. this is an eye opener to me actually because i have persian relatives (some very elderly) that have told me stories of these bakhtak's. another common astral-being in persian culture are called "jinns" which our dawrf beings that look very similiar to the british and european dipiction of these astral beings.

but im open to a couple possibilities. it could be perfect plausible that these astral-beings could be pulter-giest manifested in physical form, or ghosts projecting a hallucination to you. the mind is very powerful and can be easily manipulated under the wrong hands.


but to those that have been abducted, i ask this....


are any of you frequent smokers?
that includes ciggaretes and drugs

this could give us an idea if their looking for healthy ppl or just any human.

Good theory,

but I hate to break the party a bit here.

What happens to people who get abducted in a car, even while awake?
Also multiple people? They aren't always in a sleeping condition.

Originally posted by dragonsmusic
They are two different things. An astral projection is just that; a divergence of the normal mind/body relationship.
And abduction of the physical body is completely different. It is kidnapping in so many words.

My personal experience indicates differently.

I don't know about greys or mj12 , but a meeting between earth humans and extraterrestrial humans has taken place on this planet before and probably it still takes place.

I didnt say that it doesnt take place.

Humanity is rich in diversity and there are humans on other worlds. I believe that to be the case I should say.

I didnt say ETs dont exist. Ive made several threads on ATS saying they do. But this thread is about Grays specifically.

There is some evidence that Grays may be astral. We shouldnt let our enthusiasm for real extraterrestrials get in the way of research.

Originally posted by bananasam
but I hate to break the party a bit here.
What happens to people who get abducted in a car, even while awake?
Also multiple people? They aren't always in a sleeping condition.

Ive only read about 2 or 3 cases on that up to now, but hundreds that involve bedrooms.

In finding truth one has to look at the rule not the exception.