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Originally posted by Copernicus
Originally posted by KarlG
You, Copernicus, can probably understand my happiness and joy when this law was passed, having lived in Europe and Asian countries before.
Absolutely. This is one thing I think all humans on the planet should have. How can we live in societies together if we dont want to be there for each other?
Isnt it ironic how Americans fight across the sea for democracy to help people but up until this point has not helped the millions of poor people within their own borders? This is one law that will help those people. Finally.
Originally posted by KarlG
I'm PROUD of my country! I am American, and I am proud of where America is right now, progressive and strong. She may have tripped and stumbled over the past few years under flawed leadership which you may think was good, but she got right back up and now is back to glory in terms of giving her people the best! Is that a bad thing now, to be patriotic?
And one quick question: Who is "our"?
Originally posted by KarlG
Okay, I'm American, so let's not bash my own country too much.
when this law was passed,
Originally posted by Philalethes
reply to post by KarlG
I think "our" was refering all Americans, even you from that which it so distant you don't comprehend yet.
Look, I see where you are coming from, it's a Noble thing to want everyone being taken care of and not cause harm. I would love to see those that are unfortuanate have HC insurance but not at the peril of my expense and freedoms. You seem well versed on the selling points, now take a look at the negative implications and weigh them out. Like I said in a previous post not only will they take your insurance choice freedom away they will start in with smoking, drinking, overweight, do you own a gun, etc...Sorry, can't just some here and talk about the good things be prepared to back up those bad things also.
Phil
Originally posted by KarlG
OK, tell you what.
Why don't all of you people who find fault with America and her politicians to either take a gun, shoot down EVERYONE on Capitol Hill, or maybe stage a violent protest, or MOVE TO ANOTHER COUNTRY. Or maybe, as Empire puts it, exchange all money in your government-prying-so-they-can-take-your-money-to-fund-alien-exchange-programs bank accounts for tangibles so you can live under a rock in Australia... Uluru, maybe?
...................
Originally posted by Copernicus
Originally posted by KarlG
Okay, I'm American, so let's not bash my own country too much.
Im not against America in any way, but you have things like Statue of Liberty and speak about freedoms and such, which is awesome, but when it comes down to showing whats behind the surface, the country doesnt take care of all its people. Im not bashing the country, but the governments so far has not done much for its people so im bashing them.
Its a country where they say everybody can succeed, but only 1% of the people really does. Succeeding is equal to getting rich. Its the very definition. While in other countries, succeeding may be more about living a good life with your family without being super rich. I think money is more worshiped in America than anywhere else.
[edit on 8-11-2009 by Copernicus]
Originally posted by KarlG
reply to post by ElectricUniverse
Are you sure you're not Sarah Palin in disguise?
Originally posted by Detailed Perfection
Most of you make good arguing points for both sides of the discussion. Honestly, I really don't know where I stand on the issue at the moment, because I'm still researching so I can make an honestly informed decision based on what I know, instead of what other people are claiming to know.
One thing that I have always felt was "unconstitutional" are the extremely high prices of medical care. While some of it may be justified, like the heart doctor that saved your life via a quadruple bypass, there are thousands of other items that are over priced. A combination of just a few of these items in a single visit to the Dr. could drive your bill up drasticly.
Take for example .. The price of an MRI scan, just the actual scan itself, can be upwards of $5,000. Then you have to tack on the additional fees of your Dr. and the "advising Dr." and it's even higher.
My question is ... WHY should an MRI scan be so ridiculously expensive when the work being performed is done by a machine? Same question for X-rays, CT Scans, etc.
I understand the fact that certain Dr.'s specilaize in certain areas that are outside of the norm for routine Dr.'s, and as such, their experience and knowledge should be properly compensated with higher prices.
The MRI machine takes a picture. It's up to the Dr. to analyze the data collected and to make his decisions based on his knowledge and the knowledge of others.
I think that if our government could step in and regulate the cost of medical coverage and the cost of medical care, then the normal everyday American would be able to properly afford it.
And then we have a problem with a lot of Dr.'s charging the insurance companies unrealistic prices for their services. I'll give you an example ..
I had no insurance, went to dentist to have a tooth pulled: $133 cash.
I had dental & medical coverage thru Aetna, went to the dentist to have a tooth pulled and they told me that I would have to pay $518 out of pocket. That was my cost, AFTER the insurance company had paid been charged.
This is the same dentist on both occasions and there were little differences to the situations in question.
I was charged $6.00 on a hospital bill because a nurse brought me a Coke that would have cost me 50 cents from the machine.
It's outrageous overbilling and practices like these that have driven up the cost of both medical care and medical coverage. These atrocities need to be stopped and regulations put in to place.
From what I have read so far, this new bill will help curtail such charges which would in turn help drive the price of care down. If the care is cheaper, then the coverage will be cheaper as a result. So this is something that I support with this new bill.
What I do not like and do not agree with is the fact that illegal immigrants will be given the same free healthcare, but will be exempt from taxation penalties.
There are other issues that I support and do not support as well, which is why I am still undecided.
Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
Originally posted by KarlG
reply to post by ElectricUniverse
Are you sure you're not Sarah Palin in disguise?
Are you sure you are not Karl Marx in disguise?...
You know, you calling yourself KarlG could be KarlM....
[edit on 8-11-2009 by ElectricUniverse]
Originally posted by Detailed Perfection
.................
One thing that I have always felt was "unconstitutional" are the extremely high prices of medical care. While some of it may be justified, like the heart doctor that saved your life via a quadruple bypass, there are thousands of other items that are over priced. A combination of just a few of these items in a single visit to the Dr. could drive your bill up drasticly.
Take for example .. The price of an MRI scan, just the actual scan itself, can be upwards of $5,000. Then you have to tack on the additional fees of your Dr. and the "advising Dr." and it's even higher.
...................