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At Least 7 Dead, 12 Wounded in Shooting at Ft. Hood in Texas

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posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 09:58 AM
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WHY does everyone hate America?

Damnit. I feel like I'm in one of those afterschool programs where I don't really fit in and that I don't agree with the thoughts of everyone else.

America is A FANTASTIC place.

Wtf.




posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 09:58 AM
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Originally posted by JJay55
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 

More hate America because America is evil. Any followers of America are evil. Americans are brainwashed and evil. America and their foreign policy is evil. America blah blah blah.


I think America is cool, it's just the zionist backed American leaders that are annoying everyone.



The muslim was following his Islamic belief and killed non-muslims. He wanted to be a martyr in heaven with 72 virgins


Where does islam propagate the killing of non-muslims explicitly in context?



but we brought him back to life to stand trial in the best f'ing country in the world - AMERICA.


I am glad you bought him back, atleast now when he wakes up from coma we will find out what made him go bezerk.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 10:05 AM
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Originally posted by JJay55
Proof that there is no such thing as intelligent design.

The word was given in Islam. Prepare to survive. Good luck to all.


You are very much failling in trying to make your paranoia contagious
Just treat everyone as equals that's all

and I know what you will say in response
But no religion will treat you as an equal, islam, christianity or judaism

just treat people as equals and believe in individualism
I know this is hard for you to understand but try thinking about it

and by the way, you being extremely repetetive is NOT helping your cause



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 10:18 AM
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Originally posted by JJay55
Thread overrun by cherrypickers, anti-American sentiment and circular argument. heh. Always seems to happen. What a shame.

Prayers to those in Ft Hood. God Bless you all!




I dont hate Americans. I just dont like that they go and blame every one else all the time.

This guy killed unarmed soldier true. But that dont make them innocent at all. This might seam like a bad thing to say. But the truth hurts to.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 10:24 AM
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In case some people have a hard time udnerstanding how our own foriegn policy breeds our own terrorist problem this is a perfect example:


WASHINGTON -- President Barack Obama, facing a major new setback to his goals in Afghanistan as he weighs whether to send more troops, bluntly warned the country's leader Monday to get serious about eradicating official corruption and developing a stable government.

Obama administration officials have a more difficult job in pressing for reforms after election officials in Kabul canceled a scheduled runoff this weekend and declared President Hamid Karzai the winner of a new five-year term. The decision, more than two months following a fraud-tainted election, came after former Foreign Minister Abdullah Abdullah bowed out of the race on Sunday, saying the government-appointed election commission was biased in favor of Karzai.

The outcome left a shadow over Karzai and roused anti-war voices in Washington. Administration officials termed the end of the election uncertainty a step forward for Afghanistan. But it nonetheless could leave Obama more hard-pressed to justify major troop increases that American military officials have recommended to buttress the U.S. and allied effort to battle Islamic militants.



Too many years, and to many lost lives on both sides of the conflict and wasted dollars this is what we have created in Afghanistan.

A corrupt political regime clinging to power by fraudelent means that has very little popular support with the people of Afghanistan because it is a corrupt regime.

As a result it can't provide much safety and security to the people of Afghanistan as it seeks to cling to power to enrich itself.

To his credit Obama at least is putting them on notice.

Yet the reality is that we are practically ready to go to war with Iran over accusations it's elections are fraudulent and the government doesn't really represent the people, while at the same time we are in another Islamic country propping up a fraudulent government that doesn't really represent the people of Afghanistan that we installed militarily.

There is the hypocricy glaring us straight in the face. Condemning Iran's government for alegedly doing what we are doing for certain in Afghanistan in propping up and protecting a corrupt regime that is staying in power through fraud tained elections and our force of arms.

The Afghani Regime can't even raise enough Afghanis to support it and put in uniform to even protect itself let alone the Afghan people.

The people it does desperately shove into uniform are just as likely to attack our troops or the Brittish troops as they are to defend their corrupt government.

In the meantime we are there supposedly in part to provide security for the Afghani people, but they don't trust us because we have killed a lot of Afghani non-combatants through collateral damage to in essence install a regime that protects our desire to be there and our corporate interests and our allies corporate interests doing business there, but doesn't represent the people who actually have to live there.

Whole villages have asked our troops to stop coming into them every three or four months to protect them because all it does is invite the Taliban to attack them while they are there.

In the meantime what our troops are protecting is the corrupt seat of government some Chinese copper mines that the corrupt Afghani government awarded to the Chinese and to protect a oil and natural gas pipeline built for Royal Dutch shell to tranship oil and gas out of the old Soviet Union.

Ultimately who are we helping and who are we kidding. Our media might do a great job at the word game here in America convincing us this is all being done for the right reason to combat terrorists. Even though it was Saudi Arabian and not Afghan Terrorists that are aleged to carry out the September 11th attacks.

Our excuse for attacking Afghanistan was because it was harboring Bin Laden yet with Sattelites and Aircraft and Special Forces that have covered every inch of the country in 8 long years of war we haven't even found Bin Laden.

It's hypocracy and deception ontop of hypocracy and deception and the reality is we are going to have blowback as long as we conduct this kind of insane foreign policy.

We have attacked an entire nation of innocent people based on the actions of 19 criminals who weren't born there, didn't live there, and are long dead.

Now ask yourself would you like America to be attacked and invaded and occupied for 8 years and forced to live under the rule of a corrupt puppet regime that was installed by the invaders for the actions of 19 criminally minded Americans?

It's nothing but word games and emotional manipulation that keep Americans from seeing the falicy and hypocracy of our own government's actions.

It's why the media wraps all this into a thinly veiled religious crusade to take advantage of the fact that a slender majority of Americans are religious enough to buy into that for religious reasons. Their religion is out to get our religion.

Not, people in the region who happen to be very religious really just want us to apply our foreign policy evenly and fairly to all the nations we conduct business with and we don't.

That doesn't make anyone's criminal behavior excusable in attacking innocent people in America but it does provide them a very powerful and compelling motive and reason to do so. Much more so than a passage in a book that obviously the majority of Muslims pay no attention to and don't live by, just like a majority of Jews don't pay attention to some of the more violent and prejudicial passages in their ancient texts, just as many Christians pay no attention to some of the more violent and prejudicial passages in their ancient texts.

At the end of the day it's politics exploiting religion and not religion driving politics. It's powerful corporate interests exploiting religion and a few desperate people seeking a warped sense of justice on both sides exploiting religion.

Most people of every religion just want to live in peace in a safe and secure environment.

The reality is Muslim nations loose big when these kinds of incidents happen. Corporations and the American and Israeli and Saudi Governments win big when these kinds of incidents happen. It's those latter entities more than any other that then seek to play the word games for the point of emotional manipulation to sell tragically flawed foreign policy that benefits the corporations, Israel and Saudi Arabia that too many people have to pay too much for.

It was the criminal action of one man who is alegedly behind these dispacble attacks but in reality we are all responsible for it when we let ourselves be ruled and exploited by words and emotional manipulation.

It takes two to tango.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 11:01 AM
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reply to post by KarlG
 


America is a fantastic place. Your not alone in believing so. One of the best parts about living in America is that we are free to bitch and complain on how crappy it is to live here.


America Rocks!



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 11:43 AM
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Yet another interesting article that demonstrates how religious fundamendalists are not restricted to Islam.


The Military Religious Freedom Foundation, an organization founded to combat religious fundamentalism in the U.S. armed forces, has been nominated for the 2010 Nobel Peace Prize.

"It's one of those things -- like an Academy Award -- even if you don't win you're always a nominee," MRFF founder Mikey Weinstein, a former Air Force lawyer, told Military.com Monday. He said he felt the nomination would boost the credibility of MRFF and expected those who support the foundation's work will be reenergized by the nomination. He also predicted that those opposed MRFF will criticize it.

"My hope is the average American will look [at the nomination] and say, maybe there's something we should look at here," he said.

Weinstein worked in the White House as a general counsel lawyer during the Reagan administration. He established the MRFF in 2006 after first going to court over instances of proselytizing at his alma mater, the Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs, where his sons were cadets. Since then the foundation has been on the front lines of the fight against what Weinstein calls a “fundamentalist Christian, military-parachurch-corporate proselytizing complex.”

Air Force Academy officials did not respond to Military.com's request for comment by publication time.

Weinstein has been criticized by some both inside and outside the military as anti-Christian or anti-religious. Some argue that Christian chaplains have a right and duty to evangelize, and view rules and regulation restricting those efforts as unlawful.



Military.com

It wasn't that long ago that a Chaplain in Afghanistan was in the thick of a controversy for encouraging U.S. Troops to proselytizing in Afghanistan by handing out Holy Bibles specially written in Afghanistans two native languages to Muslims as extolled troops gathered at his sermons it was their duty as Christians to do this even though the Afghani Constitution makes any proselytizing by any religion an illegal act.

I did a thread on that here on ATS a few months back when it occured.

GIs Told to Bring Afghanistan to Jesus


May 04, 2009
Knight Ridder/Tribune

DOHA, Qatar -- U.S. Soldiers have been encouraged to spread the message of their Christian faith among Afghanistan's predominantly Muslim population, video footage obtained by Al Jazeera appears to show.

Military chaplains stationed in the U.S. air base at Bagram were also filmed with Bibles printed in the country's main Pashto and Dari languages.

In one recorded sermon, Lt. Col. Gary Hensley, the chief of the U.S. military chaplains in Afghanistan, is seen telling Soldiers that as followers of Jesus Christ, they all have a responsibility "to be witnesses for him".

"The special forces guys -- they hunt men basically. We do the same things as Christians, we hunt people for Jesus. We do, we hunt them down," he says.

"Get the hound of heaven after them, so we get them into the kingdom. That's what we do, that's our business."




Military.com

We hunt souls that's what we do? Can't get much more religiously fundamental than that!

I also did this thread on Cursader Talk on 2003 Pentagon Reports


WASHINGTON -- The Pentagon said Monday it no longer includes a Bible quote on the cover page of daily intelligence briefings it sends to the White House as was practice during the Bush administration.

Pentagon spokesman Bryan Whitman said he did not know how long the Worldwide Intelligence Update cover sheets quoted from the Bible. Air Force Maj. Gen. Glen Shaffer, who was responsible for including them, retired in August 2003, according to his biography.

For a period in 2003, at least, the daily reports prepared for President George W. Bush carried quotes from the books of Psalms and Ephesians and the epistles of Peter. At the time, the reports focused largely on the war in Iraq.

The Bible quotes apparently aimed to support Bush at a time when Soldiers' deaths in Iraq were on the rise, according to the June issue of GQ magazine. But they offended at least one Muslim analyst at the Pentagon and worried other employees that the passages were inappropriate.


Military.com

So all in all I would say both Muslims and Christians alike are known to exploit religion for politcal aims and to bolster support for violent solutions instead of peaceful solutions.

The reality is people bent on violence are always going to find some excuse to justify it in their own minds and attempt to justify it to others.

This is not American bashing or Christian bashing it is rather extolling people to look in the mirror and be honest that tragically each side exploits religion and spirituality for political and violent reasons.

Some people might view this is a mistake and wrong on the Muslim side and if true it would stand to reason it's just as wrong on the Christian side unless you are just as guilty of supporting violence for religious reasons as the other side you are condemning.

If you can't be honest about our own mistakes then how can we ever correct our own mistakes. That's not America bashing, that's how democracy keeps a democratic nation strong.

Exploiting religion for violent ends is wrong period, any religion, and every religion does it.

The tragedy that happend at Fort Hood happened because of a man's murderous rampage for reasons of one man, not a religions.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 11:45 AM
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merkava.


Does that mean when kids in US go shooting in their schools killing dozens, their motivation to do this comes from christian theology?


Merkava,

You make a very obvious mistake here in this presentation as regards kids..especially here in America.

Most of them get thier education and worship at this altar....

www.sears.com...

if not the altar above..than at this one.....

configure.us.dell.com...

And some of these people are now our leaders.

Many if not most American adults get thier religion and beliefs at this altar. This should be obvious by the nature of many of the posts on ATS.
Not only American posts but many non American posts as well.

Pulic education has become heavily intertwined with worship and beliefs at this altar.

Protoplasmic Traveler has some good points as regards this concept.

What religion do you call this one I am describing. Also what religion do you call the religion currently carried out by our politicians/leaders who also finance public education and of which Protoplasmic Traveler aptly describes??

Think on this one awhile.

Thanks,
Orangetom



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 12:06 PM
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This is also an interesting article


Conservative Christians who are opposed to the war in Iraq and the trigger-happy nature of the Right in general need to speak up. There is no reason that our voices should be drowned out by a loud chorus of hawks. While Hagee and others are influencing thousands, we are influencing few. These hawkish believers need to realize that their opinions on these matters are not the only viable option for traditionalist Christians. More importantly, the Church on a whole needs a renewed debate on matters of war and peace.

Thoughtful conservative Christians who believe in peace need to add better balance to the troubling fatalistic obsession with war, violence, the Middle East, Israel, and the rapture that is currently dominating conservative circles of the Church. What we need is not another sermon glorifying war or another doomsday prophecy book, but rather some thoughtful defenses of peace from conservative Evangelical perspectives to add some balance on this issue.

Entire Article:
www.lewrockwell.com...


This article makes a good point
It's time for people to speak up
People of all religions



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 01:05 PM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 


I agree, the real people of the faiths don't speak up enough, partly because the real people of the faiths believe in tolerance.

The real people of the faiths all probably believe that the extremists should kill each other off as they wish and leave the rest of them alone.

A real Christan, a real Muslim and real Jew, are walking down the road, they all meet each other at a crossing, they each declare their faith, each says "cool, hope that works out for you" and keep going on their paths.

The lessons they learned are supported.

It's the extremists of each faith that are so hell bent against each other.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 01:13 PM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 


To both ModernAcademia and Whatukno (love your avatar by the way - fun book!),
I agree. The problem is that tolerant people usually don't have an agenda. It's more of a live and let live philosophy. They go on with their lives and usually leave others alone. Extremists and radicals usually have an agenda and are trying to bring it to fruition. This is true in religion, politics, sports, whatever...



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 01:19 PM
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reply to post by really
 


(Thanks, Semperfortis helped me with the avatar)

Can you imagine extremist tolerance? If people were militant about tolerating other people's beliefs?



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 01:29 PM
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Originally posted by KarlG
Ok, just something quick...

PLEASE PLEASE understand that this is in no way representative of all Muslims... I have a feeling dumbass sh*tz are gonna start targeting random Muslims living around Texas in retaliation for this nutjob's actions.

I'm not Muslim myself, but I have a bad feeling. SO PLEASE, lets start with you guys, notably the most-Republican, most-radical bunch of people. Understand that he is NOT representative of all Muslim-Americans, and that NO ONE should be targeted for this.

NO HATE. Please.


I'm EXTREMELY conservative. Your worldview would call me a "radical", per the above. Politically, I'm just to the right of Atilla the Hun. I'm so far to the right that I LEFT the Republican party, because it got overrun with liberals who took it over and abandoned conservatism.

I say that to explain how much of an "extremist, right-wing nut job I am", so that you'll be aware.

Even in my political state, I know beyond doubt that he is not representative of ALL muslims, any more than radical islam is the religion of ALL muslims.

No sir, rest assured that not ALL conservatives have been brainwashed by fear of what they don't understand. That's the provenance of certain one-track ponies in this thread, and there ain't room for all of us in that small mind.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 01:30 PM
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Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by really
 


(Thanks, Semperfortis helped me with the avatar)

Can you imagine extremist tolerance? If people were militant about tolerating other people's beliefs?


HA! As a lover of comedy, I think that would be awful. Nobody ever able to make a racial, political, philosophical joke without being jumped on by Extremists for Tolerance. Which is pretty funny because like most extremists they'd just be tolerant when you agree with them.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 01:48 PM
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Originally posted by starviego
They tell us Hassan got his BA degree back in 1997. If he graduated from High School around 1987, and entered college about 1993, what was he doing in those interim years ? I'll bet he was in the army.

Perhaps I was right on this point--
news.yahoo.com...
He served eight years as an enlisted soldier.

If true, why has no info come out about Hassan's time in service after high school until when he went to college via the ROTC? For the government to have paid for four years of college and another four years of med school indicates that Hassan was no ordinary soldier. What was his military occupational specialty? If he enlisted at the end of the '80s, he probably would have been deployed to the Persian Gulf in the first gulf war, especially as he knew a smattering of Arabic.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 02:24 PM
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At the end of the day it boils down to this.

When people experience loss, they turn to religion.

When crazy people turn to religion, they feel justified to do whatever they "feel God wants them to".

A Cult is a Cult.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 03:08 PM
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This is for all you anti-Americans.
"Officials Begin Putting Shooting Pieces Together," by Tom Gjelten, Daniel Zwerdling and Steve Inskeep for NPR, November 6 (thanks to all who sent this in):

They have grand rounds, right? They, you know, dozens of medical staff come into an auditorium, and somebody stands at the podium at the front and gives a lecture about some academic issue, you know, what drugs to prescribe for what condition. But instead of that, he - Hasan apparently gave a long lecture on the Koran and talked about how if you don't believe, you are condemned to hell. Your head is cut off. You're set on fire. Burning oil is burned down your throat.
And I said to the psychiatrist, but this cold be a very interesting informational session, right? Where he's educating everybody about the Koran. He said but what disturbed everybody was that Hasan seemed to believe these things. And actually, a Muslim in the audience, a psychiatrist, raised his hand and said, excuse me. But I'm a Muslim and I do not believe these things in the Koran, and then I don't believe what you say the Koran says. And then Hasan didn't say, well, I'm just giving you one point of view. He basically just stared the guy down.


According to this, Hasan made four assertions about the Koran:
1. "If you don't believe, you are condemned to hell";
2. If you don't believe, "your head is cut off";
3. If you don't believe, "you're set on fire";
4. If you don't believe, "burning oil is burned down your throat."



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 03:11 PM
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reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 

Yeah, just last week there were Christians killing people because the bible told them to. And the week before that. And so on.
And of course no muslims followed the Koran and killed anyone because they are so peaceful. Let's embrace them and welcome them into out homes and give them our 12 year old daughters.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 03:15 PM
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I know some of you on this thread are experts about this guy so just disregard this post.
"The cousin of the man held in the massacre at Fort Hood, Texas, says the Army major had wanted to leave the military because he felt disrespected over his religion" from CNN.



posted on Nov, 7 2009 @ 03:15 PM
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Originally posted by HunkaHunka
At the end of the day it boils down to this.

When people experience loss, they turn to religion.

When crazy people turn to religion, they feel justified to do whatever they "feel God wants them to".

A Cult is a Cult.

No, in Islam it is mandatory. Islam is not like Christianity. And Islam is not plural.



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