Number of victims to unknown virus growing! State of emergency to be imposed in Ukraine?

reply to post by martin3030


Well spotted Martin, I've been astonished by the lack of coverage on this, back in the UK.
The BBC's article seems to be not too bad.
They're admitting that it's unknown whether "swine flu" is the cause of the outbreak, and they've also covered the political angle, but I still find it surprising that no-one seems concerned at the 70 or so deaths, in just a few days there??

G

Originally posted by Gordi The Drummer
So, quick summary of the current situation in Ukraine...

It looks like approx 70 officially confirmed dead from "flu-like" symptoms.
Approx 1/4 million infected with cold/flu-like symptoms.

An official (Deputy Health Minister) announcing that this is NOT the same strain of H1N1 as USA/Mexico, therefore is likely to be a mutated strain.

Many of the dead appear to have indications of viral pnemonia, possibly as a result of weakened immune systems from the initial mutated H1N1 attack.

The (likely) specific mutation, (or any other cause) has not been identified yet.

Is this a fair summary? Anything missed out? Anything to add?

G

I hope this strain does not spread across the world. I am not ready nor is anyone ready for this. I mean come on a recession, rising costs, no raises in income, hardly any jobs available! I am not ready to have people start dropping dead around me. Enough is enough!

[edit on 3-11-2009 by dreamseeker]

UK Foreign office now seems to confirm quarantine status within Ukraine

On 29 October, the Ukrainian Health Ministry announced an outbreak of the A (H1N1) (Swine Flu) virus in western Ukraine . As of 1 November, there are reports of up to 191,000 people being infected, with up to 67 deaths. Nine regions of western Ukraine have been "quarantined". On arrival in Ukraine, those who are suspected of showing symptoms of A (H1N1) and those who have had contact with them are likely to be isolated and the medical authorities informed. This may cause delays at airports and other border crossings.

Source

I have a general "what if" question maybe some of the smarter people here can help me with.

If it is indeed shown that this outbreak in the ukraine is in fact a mutation and virulant and deadly strain of H1N1. Is it not way to late to be able to properly stop the spread of this new strain?

If I understand it correctly ukraine borders have not all been properly closed not to mention I was informed thier airline and trains are still running.

Just wondering what exactly we are going to be able to do to stop such a mutation from spreading very fast considering proper quarenteen protocols have not been taken.

Also, how long until we find out if this "mutation" (if thats what it is) has spread outside ukraine borders. My understanding is if it starts to show up in other countires, then there is basically nothing we will be able to do to stop it's spread by then.

Is my reasoning correct here?

As of the moment I am not prescribing to the notion that this is the plague. Not without proper documentation or proof. but thats just me.

Edit to put last sentence in there.

[edit on 11/3/0909 by Trayen11]

Originally posted by Amagnon

I don't need a damned stamp or brand - I'm not property.

In fact, people are considered property of the country they reside in, whereas Ukrainian citizens are required to pay taxes, serve in the military, and carry identification or they go to prison.

Article 67 - Ukraine Constitution

Everyone is obliged to pay taxes and levies in accordance with the procedure and in the extent established by law.

All citizens annually file declarations with the tax inspection at their place of residence, on their property status and income for the previous year, by the procedure established by law.

It's the same story in the USA. You are property:


Also, Refusal to be quarantined or obey quarantine laws, even if you are not sick , you will go to prison. So you can drop that illusion about not being property of the state and not having to show identification to being as such.

Panic in Ukraine over swine flu BBC

Officials in Ukraine have closed schools for three weeks, imposed travel restrictions and are limiting public events as the country battles to stop the spread of swine flu.

In other words: You are free to stay inside your home/cell and do as your are told. They call this action a "lockdown" in prison.



[edit on 3-11-2009 by Regenmacher]

Yes I have been amazed at the lack of coverage on this.

For Ukranians I also found this its a link to BBC Ukraine with some more info in Ukraine language.


www.bbc.co.uk...

Originally posted by ecoparity

The virus overcame Tamiflu months ago, do you want the US to send some useless Tamiflu also?

CDC recommends using Tamiflu:
At this time, treatment with oseltamivir (trade name Tamiflu®) or zanamivir (trade name Relenza®) is recommended for all people with suspected or confirmed influenza who require hospitalization.
www.cdc.gov...

Oh, I forgot that CDC is lying too
Nethertheless, it is better to keep this "useless Tamiflu" for themselves (just in case ) than to send it to "second-class" Ukrainians.

reply to post by dreamseeker


Try not to worry too much Dreamseeker, it looks likely to be a mutation of the H1N1 with viral pneumonia causing complications, but there are still only 70 or so confirmed as dead, out of 230,000 (or so) actually infected. (That's about a 0.03% mortality rate for those infected, and only about 0.00015% of the population of Ukraine)

The Ukraine may not have been prepared as well as it could for this type of outbreak, and it is likely that the USA, UK and western Europe would probably have slighly lower mortality rates from the same virus, so please don't worry too much. It is upsetting that some people have died from this outbreak, but we all need to keep things in perspective a little.
"Normal" seasonal flu kills many more people than this every year.

It is right for you, and me, to be concerned, and to keep ourselves informed of these dangers, but it is also equally important for our own well being, to remain calm and focussed on the real numbers involved. It is quite a serious outbreak, but nothing for the general population in the west to panic about.
Hope this helps?
G

reply to post by ahemot


Just open your wallet, take your medicine and be quiet. This is how sheeple are to act.

Profits are first and people are last, where any critical thinking is not needed, as all thinking is already done for you. Sheeple don't need to think, just follow orders.

Originally posted by Trayen11
I have a general "what if" question maybe some of the smarter people here can help me with.

If it is indeed shown that this outbreak in the ukraine is in fact a mutation and virulant and deadly strain of H1N1. Is it not way to late to be able to properly stop the spread of this new strain?

If I understand it correctly ukraine borders have not all been properly closed not to mention I was informed thier airline and trains are still running.

Just wondering what exactly we are going to be able to do to stop such a mutation from spreading very fast considering proper quarenteen protocols have not been taken.

Also, how long until we find out if this "mutation" (if thats what it is) has spread outside ukraine borders. My understanding is if it starts to show up in other countires, then there is basically nothing we will be able to do to stop it's spread by then.

Is my reasoning correct here?

As of the moment I am not prescribing to the notion that this is the plague. Not without proper documentation or proof. but thats just me.

Edit to put last sentence in there.

[edit on 11/3/0909 by Trayen11]

From my understanding, when the H1N1 got past the Mexican border it escalated to world pandemic in a week. That means that the CDC, WHO decided that this thing was unstoppable and has to run it's course. There's nothing anyone could do except monitor and quell panic. They also said that it will mutate. That was expected. And again, it has to run it's course.

So in other words, there are no guarantees. We are all out there to fend for ourselves and make intelligent decisions based on our personal lifestyles according to the resources we have personally.
Nothing can stop this disease from spreading. No government can control this outbreak, it has to run it's course.

Look at it like Katrina. Everyone knew the course, there was plenty of warning, everyone did as much as they could, still 2000+ people died. Did everyone take advantage of what the government offered? no.
Did everyone listen to emergency plans? no.
Did everyone prepare personally? no.

So what are you asking?

reply to post by Regenmacher


that pretty much sums the new america. I am not sure about the world. I woke up to an america where paper has more value then the people who work for it and make it. DISGUSTING!

reply to post by JJay55


Thanks you basically reaffirmed my thoughts. That no matter what they do this was inevitable. I was just making sure my thoughts were the correct ones that once something like this starts you do you best to protect yourself but it's spred is unstoppable.

Thanks again for you quick response.

reply to post by JJay55


They could have contained it in the begginning. It wasn't only in mexico for days. The government did not want it to stop. Maybe they think having less people in this world will be less expensive to support.
Is this really concidence that we are going through a global recession? Maybe instead of supporting people they let them die?
Who knows I don't anymore. I live in a world where the government lies and confuses us; where money is the only thing that matters and their proganda is everywhere. Take the vaccine;listen to us; trust your government. YEah right!

[edit on 3-11-2009 by dreamseeker]

Originally posted by dreamseeker
They could have contained it in the begginning.

Since H1N1 can be spread by migratory birds, how do you think it could of been controlled? Kill all the wild birds, impose a global travel ban and test everyone? LOL, come on.

Same logic can be applied to driving an auto, since traffic fatalities are one of the the biggest killers on the planet. Banning motor vehicle travel would do more damage to a country's GDP than all its traffic accidents. So we can only do so much before the cure becomes worse than the disease.



[edit on 3-11-2009 by Regenmacher]

I think we are all on the same page. The world is a tough place. We can't depend on government nor should we. And be prepared.

Meanwhile, let's have some fun while we are on the planet for a short time.

----INSIDE NEWS----

Just spoke to my my therapy(internal medicine) teacher who was in a meeting with Health Misnistry yesterday.

He is a busy man so I did not get much details out, these are the words he used-

Situation not in control, it is SERIOUS,

We do not know what is going on,

If you can leave the country it is the best option.

We don't know when the situation will be in control.



[edit on 3/11/09 by asen_y2k]

Originally posted by ahemot

CDC recommends using Tamiflu:
At this time, treatment with oseltamivir (trade name Tamiflu®) or zanamivir (trade name Relenza®) is recommended for all people with suspected or confirmed influenza who require hospitalization.
www.cdc.gov...

Oh, I forgot that CDC is lying too

Nethertheless, it is better to keep this "useless Tamiflu" for themselves (just in case

) than to send it to "second-class" Ukrainians.

At present there has been a low percentage of N1H1 that has the specific mutation that makes it resistant to Tamifue. How wide spread this mutation is has not been clarified by WHO or the CDC. However there are a number of documented cases where it was ineffective. Relenza is being used more and more at this point in time however I am not sure of the stocks available.

Very few countries had purchased a full course of the Tamiflu for all their population. Most intended to use it as a tool to create a buffer zone around areas of out breaks and contain the virus that way. IMO it was a poor plan but it was what they came up with during the planning for a pandemic. The original plan was not to use it to keep people alive that were in the hospital it was to prevent further spread.

Looking at this from a Public Health view I think that the world leaders have taken the tact that the outbreak is too far advanced in the Ukraine to treat it. In one of my other posts here I went on a rant and said that some times the only way to stop a virus outbreak is to let it "burn itself out" in a population after isolating it. If you read between the lines in the posts coming out of the Ukraine this is what is happening. They are isolating areas, restricting travel internal to the country and other countries are starting to close boarder crossings and limit travel to and from Ukraine. IMO I think that the world has pretty much decided to let the people of that country live or die without much in the way of outside help.

I hope I am wrong but that is the way I see it.

Originally posted by asen_y2k
----INSIDE NEWS----

Just spoke to my my therapy(internal medicine) teacher who was in a meeting with Health Misnistry yesterday.

He is a busy man so I did not get much details out, these are the words he used-

Situation not in control, it is SERIOUS,

We do not know what is going on,

If you can leave the country it is the best option.

We don't know when the situation will be in control.
[edit on 3/11/09 by asen_y2k]

Good advice. Good luck getting out now that the borders are locked. I feel bad for you. I wonder why you waited so long for word from authority.

reply to post by JJay55


No the airports are open...all my friends have left...there are only 7 rooms occupied in my hostel out of more than 200

reply to post by JJay55


Come on now? He has been very generous in sharing info and honestly,who could decide when such conflicted and un-certain info is flying around?

I wish him well and please stay healthy no matter what course you take? Not eveyone is in an immediate "position" to simply flee: it takes access to cash and somewhere to go.

It sounds like the situation escalated very quickly and I'm sure those in the heath-fields who DO genuinely care about patients are slammed and exhausted.

Hoping this will calm down soon,no one should have to live with such un-certainty and fear.