Number of victims to unknown virus growing! State of emergency to be imposed in Ukraine?

400 police officers infected in Lviv only. Soon police will have not enough officers for checkpoints ...
4post.com.ua...

[edit on 1-11-2009 by ahemot]

Here's a "President's statement on the situation with spread of A(H1N1) flu":

www.president.gov.ua...

Highlights:

I have instructed the Minister for Health to develop a unified database, to prepare the official statistics, which would in real time inform primarily the Ministry of Health, the Prime Minister and the Government on the situation with the epidemics in all regions of Ukraine.

Separately I have instructed Regional Administrations to established info-centers for the population of every region to avoid panic or disinformation.

Question number two, which I think is the result of failures in the question number one, particularly the failure to establish the Flue Center, is determining the type of the virus. Today only one thing pulls the Health Ministry and effective system of actions back – determining the type of the virus. In many cases this question remains unanswered. There are even experts, who suppose it is another modified virus - the differentiated virus between the "bird flu" and the "pig flu". But only the operative analysis would answer that. The flu, which the risk group is suffering from, should be identified.

The supply of medicines that we currently have allows us to provide help to all those in need. I have addressed international institutions and partner countries so if the situation develops in such a manner and with such dynamics that it would threaten our capabilities, we will certainly get the required amount of drugs needed for treatment and prevention. At present the required number of medicines has been distributed to the affected people - this is the latest report of the Health Minister.

I would like to separately address you, dear journalists, because objective and responsible information, I think, helps the country and specialists to deal with this problem. So I ask you to refrain from agitating the country with unverified information and from using the information of dubious nature and the information that is untrue. More than ever before we now must be Ukrainians, help the nation with full responsibility to meet this problem, have a single national plan, support each other. I am sure we will be able to deal with this disaster. Obviously, in the next couple of days we will have the assessment of the issues that arose - why they turned out to be so acute like in no other country of the European community.

I have read that article yesterday but posting it here due to "conflicting reports" coming from people and the press.

Note that ENGLISH versions of Ukrainian press are different than original, so please use Google translate whenever possible if you are posting sources.

Here's Ukrainian Health Ministry site map if you need anything else.

Andrej Makrush, chief doctor at Ternopol hospital: 1500 dead from pneumonic plague in Ukraine, including 1000 dead in Ternopole only.
prawda.org.ua...

reply to post by hightowerx


So now there are 48 deaths? I clicked on the picture of the actor that looks quite ill and on the right hand side of the page was a description of the photo. In it it mentioned that 48 people have died so far. I thought the last known account was 30 people. The number seems to keep rising...

reply to post by ahemot


Good God it just keeps getting stranger and stranger. The only thing left to do is see how far of a reach this thing has.

Good luck to all because I have a feeling this is only going to get worse for everyone everywhere sooner rather than later.

alrighty, small request since there are over 46 pages....

what are the latest updates on this story? whats happening over there?

has anything changed as of yet, or any kind of details at all?

JW

So, Luppakorva: I understand you are questioning OP entirely. You see, i rather question MSM, poltiticians, posts like yours and TPTB than an eyewitness reporting "live" from ground z.
I found your very first posts on this matter a bit strange but now i really feel you are more like "working" here on this thread.
I give OP full 100% credibility, and i am not letting you discredit OP based on what MSM has NOT commented or confirmed.


And save me your patronising tone if you care to answer to this!

reply to post by ahemot


1500!?
Can you please translate that for us?
If 1500 can be confirmed we are all in deep sh..
I dont se why pravda should be questioned either..please try to find some other sources to this information.

EDIT: ok it is NOT pravda on that article. My wrong sorry.
Reagards

[edit on 1-11-2009 by gusan]

reply to post by gusan


here you go
translate.google.com...
edit to ad: but keep in mind it is Prawda

[edit on 1-11-2009 by derpif]

reply to post by JJay55

Prague is the spy capital of the world? Is that so? I wasn't aware of that and I've lived here for over 16 years...

But then, I suppose if I'm not involved in clandestine operations I wouldn't know about it.

How, then, do you know?

It's okay, I'm only stirring you up a little because I find your statement quite ...errrm... fascinating.

However, on a more serious and practical note, the Czech Republic is right at the crossroads of Central Europe and for that reason has long had a very strategic importance. It would not be difficult to move something from here to Ukraine -- or to anywhere else in Europe, for that matter. But on the other hand, Ukraine is probably better placed to clandestinely export or import anything than the Czech Republic is.

We had discussions about this conspiracy angle earlier in the thread: if someone wanted to release "something" (read: "infectious agent") in Europe and allow it to spread quickly, what was a good location? The Ukraine. Borders with seven other nations (including the massive country of Russia), through routes North (to Moscow), South (over the Black Sea to Turkey), East (towards the middle east), and West...

The neighboring countries are:
Russia, Belarus, Poland, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, and Moldova.

Also, Ukraine is not a wealthy country, has a medical system that is still being improved after years under Communism, has very strong pro- and anti-Russian political factions, and due to the low rates of income there often has workers who travel west in search of jobs. We have plenty of Ukrainian workers here, in fact. Some of them have even been doing renovations in our building the past several days...

I'm not saying that this outbreak was caused by deliberate "placement and release". I am simply pointing out that from the point of view of practicalities, it's not a bad place to choose if such a thing is ever attempted in this part of the world.

Regards,

Mike

Edited to add names of neighboring countries.

[edit on 1/11/09 by JustMike]

This reminds me more and more of the initial outbreak of H1N1 in Mexico. The social distancing, quarantines, and rapidly rising death tolls. It's worth remembering that even though at that time it seemed as though this was an unstoppable virus that killed within hours or days, we later learned that the virus had been spreading for some time, and that many had been ill for some time before their deaths.

Influenza of any kind - let alone H1N1, which has been shown to have a higher propensity to infect the lung tissue including alveolar tissue - can lead to a wide variety of secondary complications, including this so-called hemorrhagic pneumonia, and a wide variety of secondary bacterial pneumonia.

The fact that they have prescribed antibiotics doesn't rule out H1N1 for that reason. In fact, it's not uncommon for antibiotics to be prescribed in a prophylactic manner in patients who have influenza if there is reason to suspect a high likelihood of secondary pneumonia, or simply to make it easier for the immune system to fight off the virus without having to deal with bacterial pathogens as well.

Originally posted by ahemot
Andrej Makrush, chief doctor at Ternopol hospital: 1500 dead from pneumonic plague in Ukraine, including 1000 dead in Ternopole only.
prawda.org.ua...

That matches with people testimonies in this thread and other forums, but Ukrainian MSM does not say anything even remotely similar. Also, as you could see their Health Ministry does not report this. Although, their MSM also stated Ministry is covering up real numbers. Last but not least, Pravda newspapers are not to be trusted as their reports are usually based on rumours - but this time they gave a full name, Andrej Makrush.

Pneumonic plague infestation area:

Originally posted by Lazyninja
Why Ukraine?

They forgot to pay their Russian fuel bill again, and had to be bailed out by the rest of the EU member states.

Also, they still have no ratified the Lisbon treaty.

Just for your information, Ukraine is not an EU member country, so it has no part in the Lisbon Treaty ratification process. Map from EU agency that shows EU member states.

It's the Czech Republic that has not yet completed its ratification of the Lisbon Treaty. This is because the Czech Constitutional Court has to rule on the constitutionality of some of its provisions, and the Czech President (Vaclav Klaus) will not sign any law to ratify the treaty until it can be shown to be acceptable under this nation's laws.

Reference (in English from a UK paper) here.

Mike

Originally posted by SassyCat

Originally posted by ahemot
Andrej Makrush, chief doctor at Ternopol hospital: 1500 dead from pneumonic plague in Ukraine, including 1000 dead in Ternopole only.
prawda.org.ua...

That matches with people testimonies in this thread and other forums, but Ukrainian MSM does not say anything even remotely similar. Also, as you could see their Health Ministry does not report this. Although, their MSM also stated Ministry is covering up real numbers. Last but not least, Pravda newspapers are not to be trusted as their reports are usually based on rumours - but this time they gave a full name, Andrej Makrush.

Good morning people...woke up with a sore throat. Few strepcils did the job...I see nothing new has come up except for someone saying 3000 deaths and 1500 here. Wow. Someone also mentioned Malburg and SARS.
Waiting for Former_USSR top come...he will be able to translate some TV news for us...

If this is pneumonic plague, it's quite serious. However it's worth noting that the website calling it that ( translate.google.com... ) earlier also posted that there were antiseptics being delivered within Ukraine which in high concentrations constituted the people there being "poisoned like beetles," which leads me to believe that this is a blog and not a news outlet. Thus some caution might be in order when considering what it's saying. (That does NOT mean it's wrong, though. I'm just as worried as everyone else about this. I'm just hoping against hope that this is NOT what we're dealing with. An outbreak of antibiotic-resistant pneumonic plague is not what the world needs while in the throws of an already deadly pandemic that weakens the respiratory tract.)

[edit on 11/1/2009 by AceWombat04]

reply to post by JustMike

It's going to come from a central location and specifically something that can be explained to the media. For instance, the H1N1 in Mexico was traced to the point of origin a pig farm in Vera Cruz... one small boy... how convenient that the pig farm was sloppy and open and... sloppy, the perfect location for a film about the origin of the swine flu.
Then how did it spread to Mexico City? The story ended before that question was answered to make me think it was planted.

Seems that Baxter would be a likely place for an accidental leak. Oh the poor scientist didn't know that the test tube was switched. opps, human error. And yes, geographically Ukraine is perfect. But why was another deadly virus released? Did someone see how much money that was being made on H1N1 and make a play? I'm not willing to risk my health on games being played for money.

Another aspect. All governments have biologicals in their arsonals. Those governments who won't sustain the coming world economic crisis won't be able to sustain ranting populations might consider drastic measures. God complex comes into play. It's all very interesting.

Originally posted by dreamseeker
It is is their responsblity to report on things that are dangerous and impact our lives.

Dreamseeker, I've read all your posts in this thread and I appreciate them. I think we can understand your frustration that your friends just aren't interested. They are showing the attitude of people who only follow mainstream news.

Most mainstream news media do not really see it as their responsibility to report on things that are dangerous and impact our lives... Their first responsibility is to obtain good ratings and by this to generate advertising revenue and make profits for their shareholders or parent companies. (For example, did you know that General Electric is the parent company of CNN?)

They are in the entertainment business. They present interviews in carefully-edited "sound bites", they jump quickly from one story to another, and they do very little detailed analysis along the lines of the discussions we have here on ATS and in similar forums.

True, there are many times when they seem to be keeping us informed about dangerous or potentially dangerous events, but we always have to watch out for their bias, which is determined by the policies of their owners. Also, they are limited by their governments in what they can report; in almost every country, the governments place mandatory "gag orders" on certain types of news -- in the interests of protecting "national security".

Then there is the "NIMBY Syndrome". (Not In My Back Yard) If something is happening far away and possibly won't impact their viewers or readers personally (or not the majority of them anyway), they can release the news fast and give quite a lot of detail. But if it's close to home, they have to be much more cautious about what effects the news might have. The editors and producers get together for meetings and discuss how to run the story, what angles to report and what to leave out -- and even if they should report it at all.

Why was it that it took a full day for the western msm to start reporting this Ukraine story at all? Because it's very complex. The reports are coming in but they are conflicting, as often happens when there is a crisis in its early stages. And, Ukraine is a significant country in respect of its politics and relations with Russia. Then, there is the question of how much panic this might cause if they report the sort of information we have been reading here from our sources. And finally, there is their own governments' input.

There must have been a lot of discussion between the various msm and their govts so they could be sure to release a more-or-less cookie-cutter-style version of a watered-down story -- and that's what has happened.

Your friends want to be entertained by the news. They don't want to hear about things that might really kill them and which their governments could be helpless to protect them from. They just don't want to know. Bad stuff only happens to other people, never to them.

That's the common attitude these days and so, they get upset when you try to open their eyes.

Here's something interesting: the worse the TV news is at the time, the more likely you will see a "puppy" or "cute little kid" story at the end. This is a psychological trick to make the viewers smile and sigh "Oh, isn't that so lovely?" at the end of the news so they go away feeling happier, having almost forgotten all the bad stuff the network felt compelled to show. It's a trick and -- it works.

The more "cute stories" you get at the end of the news, the worse the real news actually was.

Looks like we might be seeing a lot of "puppy" stories in the coming days -- if the msm are actually allowed to report what's really going on.

Best regards,

Mike
Edited for typos. (Sigh!)

[edit on 1/11/09 by JustMike]

reply to post by JJay55

I followed your point in your earlier post. My argument was not in disagreement with your basic premise of a "central point", I was just saying that in the present day, there is no reason to move something to Ukraine from Prague. It's actually more effective to use Ukraine as the entry point, especially as it's not in the EU (while my country is) and therefore has less restrictions on such things as farming techniques, packaging, and even medical technology standards.

About that Mexico report with the little boy as "source 1", yeah. I think that was a put-up job and I talked about how odd this Mexico scenario was in a post earlier in this thread.

I think we're on the same page, really.

Edit to add: agree 100% with you on your "God complex" comments.

"Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

Regards,

Mike


[edit on 1/11/09 by JustMike]

From sources in Ternopol: the authorities have recently opened the animal burial ground ("скотомогильник") in the territory of the Ternopol area under the Decision of the Ternopol regional council. The burial ground contained corpses of animals with plague bacillus activators. Septic and pulmonary forms of a plague proceed, as well as any heavy sepsis, with disseminated intravescular coagulation syndrome: occurrence of small hemorrhages on a skin is possible, bleedings from a gastroenteric path (vomiting in blood), the expressed tachycardia, falling of arterial pressure are possible. These symptoms completely coincide with those symptoms, which had the diseased in the Ternopol area.

Edit: added link to source
poslezavtra.com.ua...

[edit on 1-11-2009 by ahemot]