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Number of victims to unknown virus growing! State of emergency to be imposed in Ukraine?

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posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 04:30 PM

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 04:32 PM
reply to post by ecoparity

So, less cases daily but more deaths. Excellent!!! Either the flu is infecting less people but becoming more deadly in the Ukraine or these stats are full of it.

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 04:34 PM
Dr Niman summarizes the current situation. Take from it what you will or disregard it if you have an issue with the source. He's not saying anything I'm not hearing from other, less public sources...

Many had asked why the WHO was dragging its feet on Ukraine and I had said they had two major problems. One was "mutation" and the other was Tamiflu resistance and both were happening when deaths were climbing and vaccine was is short supply. Therefore, they would try to keep those two shoes from dropping for as long as possible.

Now both shoes have dropped. The D225G in Ukraine was disclosed, followed by Norway, so the "mutation" shoe has dropped, and now the clsuters of Tamiflu resistance in the UK and NC have come out, so the other shoe has dropped.

Most of the world is as lost as ever. Media hasn't yet figured out that the same "mutation" is in Ukraine and Norway (and worldwide), and they also haven't figured out that the cat was out of the bag on Tamiflu resistance.

In both cases, agencies are still trying to spin "spontaneous mutation" and lack of spread, but those dogs won't hunt.

A vaccine panic is next, followed by real panic.

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 04:39 PM
reply to post by really

The percentage of infected being admitted to the hospital is on a steady upswing for the past week.

The virus will run out of hosts to infect in the area, especially as people start taking precautions.

I'm not surprised to see fewer cases but worse results - it fits the high viral load / smaller host population scenario perfectly.

The stats are what they are. Now that the WHO is involved it becomes almost impossible to know for sure. Going on history, the number of dead is probably being nerfed while the other stats will be ignored as not worth fussing over.

All the media cares about is that body count anyway.

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 04:43 PM

Originally posted by jedi_hamster
reply to post by Kailassa

baxter belongs to NWO. what's the problem in sacrificing their credibility? i've stated that many times already, what if NWO decided to look as badly as possible this time? what if baxter said that 'yeah, we did it' on purpose? what if it's all staged to make you believe that that is their agenda, to kill you with the vaccines? i'm not saying vaccines are good, and i'm aware of the problems that come with them. but at the same time, this can be the biggest hoax of all times, and you may be manipulated to believe that there's a conspiracy that in reality looks entirely different. also, hit that conspiracy world would receive because of that, would be much bigger than impact made by some folks posting BS on forums and blogs. because, hey, IT'S BAXTER. THEY SAID THEY DID IT, SO IT HAS TO BE TRUE, THEY WANT TO KILL US WITH VACCINES! well, guess what. if that's a hoax, you're all screwed.

So even though Baxter admitted they issued material contaminated with live avian influenza virus you don't believe them, because that goes against the agenda you pretend to not be pushing? You believe they are ruining their own reputation to further the aims of the "NWO"?

And Baxter belong to the NWO?
Proof please?

My apologies for trying to communicate with you on a level of sanity.
I didn't realise you just wanted to invent whatever conspiracy you could to support your theory that we're all gonna die of this terrible disease if we don't get vaccinated.

And what were you and Eco saying about conspiracy theorists earlier?

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 04:49 PM

Originally posted by wayno
reply to post by jedi_hamster

Of course there is room for much error in trying to determine numbers of people sick, numbers of people who died and even what they died of. There is even sufficient cause to wonder about motives of governments and agencies making reports. None of this questionable.

My only point is, regardless of data specifics, it does seem to me that while mutations and recombinations are occurring on an on-going basis, there appears to remain a mix of pathogens out there that is making people sick, possibly including bacteria that might or might not be sprayed from planes; but there is no one new super bug on the loose that is going to get us all.

Even if one develops, my impression is that it soon enough fades into something less harmful. I am of the impression that the need for vaccinating everyone is just unwarranted hype. Normal common sense precautions and reliance on our innate body defenses should do just fine for the majority of us.

I'm not offending you. I just took your post as starting ground:

Do I believe this is a bio weapon/artificially created and intentionally released bug? Yes!
Do I believe this is the superbug? No! Why?
Because boiling frog schema. TPTB use series of small stings. It took them 35 years to knock US middle class to knees economically. TPTB don't need to kill at one month because who will clean the mess? Do you remember nazi camps schema? Inmates did almost all work - even guard each other.
What we can expect? Continual outbreaks of "mysterious" diseases at different places. Continual push for legislation like Patriot act is. Pigs will be more arrogant day after day. You don't see this pattern around you? Yes, you see it very well. And it will be faster and faster.

Bit off topic but this is conspiracy dungeon.

EDIT: just typo

[edit on 20-11-2009 by zeddissad]

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 04:59 PM
reply to post by Kailassa

Baxter did not issue contaminated material, they swapped one virus for another.

It was a virus to be used in testing a vaccine that was sent to 4 labs. Someone sent the avian flu sample instead of the swine flu sample.

There was no production vaccine involved and nothing involved was able to infect humans.

Someone made a mistake but this entire story about slipping live bird flu into a vaccine is false. People like Jane Burgermeister are turning it into something completely different.

Did you take the time to read the thread before jumping in? The internal EU documents on this have been posted several times.

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 05:23 PM

Originally posted by nikiano


Wow....I never thought about them spreading virus to those countries who refused to sign the vaccine contracts, to scare other countries into signing them.

Holy crap.

Did you think of that theory? If so, kudos to you. I never in a million years would have thought of that, but in a sick way, it make sense. It's like the terrorists killing the hostages one by one until their ransom demands are met.

Jesus....if that theory is true, that is just scary. Scary beyond all imagination.

If it's not true, it would make a darn good disaster movie.

It would make a bloody good movie.

You have the brains to put yourself in the shoes of those who control the world's finances. Imagine if you had been brought up to see everyone who didn't belong to an elite circle of families as a lower type of creature.
Imagine seeing the world as your private playground, and resenting the space taken up and the resources drained by the lower classes. Believing they could never be really intelligent and the only rights they had were the ones you condescended to give them.

My mother once, when making sure the police were evicting some Koories in Darwin (Australian Aborigines,) insisted on going over to chat to them, because, "It just makes their day if a white lady speaks to them." There are plenty of people like that in this world, who are so proud of being "nice", and have no idea what arrogant idiots they are, seeing nothing but a right to stay privileged and self-serving. The PWTB don't even know they are doing anything wrong if they spread DU throughout the middle east, poison the world's water supplies and surreptitiously inject sterilising hormones into girls, making them allergic to pregnancy.

Sorry I didn't answer you about that earlier. I started reading about the NSSM 200 and got sidetracked.

This is a decent summary of it.
It's the combination of hCG with the adjuvant that's the problem, it makes the body regard hCG as an enemy, and sets the immune system up to fight it.

The Known Facts
Here are the known facts concerning the tetanus vaccination campaigns in Mexico and the Philippines:
* Only women are vaccinated, and only the women between the ages of 15 and 45. (In Nicaragua the age range was 12-49.)
But aren't men at least as likely as young women to come into contact with tetanus? And what of the children? Why are they excluded?
* Human chorionic gonadotrophin (hCG) hormone has been found in the vaccines. It does not belong there -- in the parlance of the O.J. Simpson murder trial, the vaccine has been "contaminated."
* The vaccination protocols call for multiple injections -- three within three months and a total of five altogether. But, since tetanus vaccinations provide protection for ten years or more, why are multiple inoculations called for?
* WHO has been actively involved for more than 20 years in the development of an anti-fertility vaccine utilizing hCG tied to tetanus toxoid as a carrier -- the exact same coupling as has been found in the Mexican-Philippine-Nicaragua vaccines.

It may be a bit hard to believe the WHO has a depopulation agenda, so I'll post more on the topic. It's all relevant when the question is whether or not TPTB could be using swine flu to induce people to take a sterility causing injection. If there is a plan to do harm through the vaccine I believe that's how it would be done, not by killing people.

Oh, yes, I can't blame that theory onto any other source. I read and think and look for the patterns the information makes to find the truth. Sometimes the results are funny. My father, who had been in the airforce, mentioned that he's always wondered about a secret landing system used in the war. Thanks to picking up snippets amongst the 1000s of novels I read, I was able to explain it to him. When my son had a medical problem and I didn't like the medical solution, I was able to work out a new natural treatment and persuade the doctor to supervise it. So my XXY/XXXY son is physically normal, fertile and does not need the testosterone supplements normally needed by Klinefelter's men, despite the diploidy normally making the Klinefelter's more severe.

It's important to remember the difference between proven fact, indicated fact and theory, but one can come up with theories that have a good chance of at least containing some truth.

- Or at least being good movie plots.

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 05:26 PM

Originally posted by ecoparity
reply to post by Kailassa

Baxter did not issue contaminated material, they swapped one virus for another.

It was a virus to be used in testing a vaccine that was sent to 4 labs. Someone sent the avian flu sample instead of the swine flu sample.

There was no production vaccine involved and nothing involved was able to infect humans.

Someone made a mistake but this entire story about slipping live bird flu into a vaccine is false. People like Jane Burgermeister are turning it into something completely different.

Did you take the time to read the thread before jumping in? The internal EU documents on this have been posted several times.

Sorry Eco but this debate was done more then one time. It was 72Kg of material. I can hardly imagine that in biolab sec level3 is possible to "swap one virus for another" = swap 72Kg!!!. Document posted by JustMike [The internal EU document] say something different. I need some sleep now but tomorrow I'll read it again and discuss it with you.

BTW - Baxter did so many similar "mistakes" that I'll not believe them even if they say: "Yes! We are the bad guys!"

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 05:42 PM
The stats at the top of this page just say Influenza. The WHO are not asking for the specifics anymore. It is time now, that they bring in precise lab testing in all countries to show any different strains, or if there are even more new strains. The Ukrainian people should be entitled to know if the outbreak there is all of the "novel" swine 'flu or something even newer, labs all over the world should be testing from Ukrainian samples. Has WHO lost its mandate by pussyfooting, you can't even trust WHO's ability to control the transport of virus samples as shown by Baxter, to control The selling of Tamiflu, and who even have difficulties providing virus samples for making vaccines. This is a Quango organisation, WHO's emergency ambulance runs at the blinding speed of 2MPH at a cost of 0.0001 miles per gallon.

[edit on 20-11-2009 by smurfy]

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 06:05 PM
I posted this somewhere else I think -
but it's an interesting article on how the Ukraine were resisting vaccinations back in 2008 and why they were resisting...

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 06:33 PM
There has been a lot of discussion about the safety of immunisations against the swine flu virus.
It's my contention that the effort put into world depopulation over the last 50 years is peaking, and TPTB, frustrated that their goal of preventing further population increase after the year 2,000, have decided on desperate measures. So I chew over the question, could this be an opportunity, contrived by the WHO, to pressure countries into mass vaccinations of a sterilizing agent?

Kissinger's 1974 Plan for Food Control Genocide

On Dec. 10, 1974, the U.S. National Security Council under Henry Kissinger completed a classified 200-page study, "National Security Study Memorandum 200: Implications of Worldwide Population Growth for U.S. Security and Overseas Interests." The study falsely claimed that population growth in the so-called Lesser Developed Countries (LDCs) was a grave threat to U.S. national security.

NSSM 200 similarly concluded that the United States was threatened by population growth in the former colonial sector. It paid special attention to 13 "key countries" in which the United States had a "special political and strategic interest": India, Bangladesh, Pakistan, Indonesia, Thailand, the Philippines, Turkey, Nigeria, Egypt, Ethiopia, Mexico, Brazil, and Colombia. It claimed that population growth in those states was especially worrisome, since it would quickly increase their relative political, economic, and military strength.

Food as a weapon . . .

A second measure was curtailing food supplies to targeted states, in part to force compliance with birth control policies: "There is also some established precedent for taking account of family planning performance in appraisal of assistance requirements by AID [U.S. Agency for International Development] and consultative groups. Since population growth is a major determinant of increases in food demand, allocation of scarce PL 480 resources should take account of what steps a country is taking in population control as well as food production. In these sensitive relations, however, it is important in style as well as substance to avoid the appearance of coercion."

"Mandatory programs may be needed and we should be considering these possibilities now," the document continued, adding, "Would food be considered an instrument of national power? ... Is the U.S. prepared to accept food rationing to help people who can't/won't control their population growth?"

Kissinger Report: A Retrospective on NSSM-200

On December 10, 1974, the United States National Security Council promulgated National Security Study Memorandum 200 (NSSM-200), also called The Kissinger Report. This document explicitly laid out a detailed strategy by which the United States would aggressively promote population control in developing nations in order to regulate (or have better access to) the natural resources of these countries.

In order to protect U.S. commercial interests, NSSM-200 cited a number of factors that could interrupt the smooth flow of materials from lesser-developed countries, LDCs as it called them, to the United States, including a large population of anti-imperialist youth, who must, according to NSSM-200, be limited by population control. The document identified 13 nations by name that would be primary targets of U.S.-funded population control efforts.

According to NSSM-200, elements of the implementation of population control programs could include: a) the legalization of abortion; b) financial incentives for countries to increase their abortion, sterilization and contraception-use rates; c) indoctrination of children; and d) mandatory population control, and coercion of other forms, such as withholding disaster and food aid unless an LDC implements population control programs.


37. There is an alternate view which holds that
a growing number of experts believe that the population
situation is already more serious and less amenable
to solution through voluntary measures than is generally
accepted. It holds that, to prevent even more widespread
food shortage and other demographic catastrophes than
are generally anticipated, even stronger measures are
required and some fundamental, very difficult moral
issues need to be addressed. These include, for example,
our own consumption patterns, mandatory programs, tight
control of our food resources. In view of the seriousness
of these issues, explicit consideration of them should begin
in the Executive Branch, the Congress and the U.N. soon.

National Security Decision Memorandum 314

AID Programs

Care must be taken that our AID program efforts are not so diffuse
as to have little impact upon those countries contributing the largest
growth in population, and where reductions in fertility are most
needed for economic and social progress.


Sadly, there was nothing new about plans to decimate populations of the countries we intended to keep dominating.
Even in 1947 one of my most famous countrymen was recommending the use of bioweapons against Asian countries.

Burnet's solution: The plan to poison S-E Asia

World-famous microbiologist Sir Macfarlane Burnet, the Nobel prize winner revered as Australia's greatest medical research scientist, secretly urged the government to develop biological weapons for use against Indonesia and other "overpopulated" countries of South-East Asia.

The revelation is contained in top-secret files declassified by the National Archives of Australia, despite resistance from the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade.

Sir Macfarlane recommended in a secret report in 1947 that biological and chemical weapons should be developed to target food crops and spread infectious diseases.

More recently there appear to have been efforts to make a pathogen which would specifically target negroes.
The late Dr David Kelly appears to have had a connection with this.

It was further alleged that Project Coast had conducted active research into the fabrication of "ethnic weapons" that would specifically target South Africa's black population.

Kelly was said to be involved in the apartheid regime's most secret project. According to a previous London press account, Kelly was involved in Code-named Project Coast, trying to create a genetically engineered weapon to attack only the country's black population and to develop a vaccine to block human fertility in blacks.

Dr. Kelly had visited the project's headquarters soon after he was appointed in 1972 to be head of the microbiology department at Porton Down, Britain's top-secret biological warfare establishment in Wiltshire.

Other new developments from insiders close to the July 20, 2003, death of Dr. Kelly reveal one he may have been killed due to his knowledge of covert research of the “black only bomb” in South Africa.

Although this has been reported once in a Sunday Express 2004 article, new information is now linking the connection to assignments directly from former Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher and former Prime Minister John Major.

Kelly was said to be involved in the apartheid regime’s most secret project. According to a previous London press account, Kelly was involved in Code-named Project Coast, trying to create a genetically engineered weapon to attack only the country's black population and to develop a vaccine to block human fertility in blacks.

So we can at least see that there is quite a history of efforts to lower the population in targeted countries.

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 06:49 PM
You know, I don't care what the WHO says....I don't believe for a second that this D225G mutation just "spontaneously" mutated in several people in Norway, and in the Ukraine, and is not being trasmitted person to person.

Do they think we're just stupid?

Ok, if it spontaneously mutated in one person in Norway, and one person in Ukraine, and one person in Afghanistan, and one person in California....sure, I could believe that it was not being transmitted person to person.

But how can they say that it just "spontaneously mutated" in quite a few people in the same area at once? That is not spontaneous mutation...that is spontaneous mutation followed by person to person infection.

Maybe the little virology education I got in school wasn't as good as I thought it was, but their explanation seems far-fetched to me. I don't buy it.

[edit on 20-11-2009 by nikiano]

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 07:00 PM
It's MAINSTREAM! At least the Norwegian part of it is:

ALSO, the same mutated virus just TEN miles from me in Central Texas USA! Seems the guy was infected a month ago. Everything sounds the same though.

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 07:02 PM
reply to post by Kailassa

Actually, I can very easily imagine the WHO having an alternate agenda very easily, especially after all the time I've spent working in healthcare. The longer you work in it, the more you realize how corrupt it is at the top levels!

Excellent deduction skills, though. I had never heard of that vaccination program happening in Mexico, Phillipinnes, et. Yes, it doesn't make sense to give a tetanus vaccine that many times...once in 10 years is enough. And why only women? And why is HCG in the tetanus? Very, very interesting. Again, good job putting together that theory.

You should seriously write a book or a screenplay on that theory. It might make the rest of the world up a bit.

My brain thinks the same way in coming up with many other conspiracy theories, too....I don't really think linearly....rather I find myself putting together bits and pieces from all over the map, like a jigsaw puzzle. The benefits of a good imagination is that it works enhances intelligence. The drawbacks of a good imagination is that sometimes I can't turn it off! lol!

Anyway, thanks for the information!

[edit on 20-11-2009 by nikiano]

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 07:08 PM

4 N.C. H1N1 Positive Patients Resistant To Tamiflu

Four North Carolina patients at a single hospital tested positive for a type of swine flu that is resistant to Tamiflu, health officials said Friday.

The cases reported at Duke University Medical Center over six weeks make up the biggest cluster seen so far in the U.S.

Tamiflu -- made by Switzerland's Roche Group -- is one of two flu medicines that help against swine flu, and health officials have been closely watching for signs that the virus is mutating, making the drugs ineffective.

More than 50 resistant cases have been reported in the world since April, including 21 in the U.S. Almost all in the U.S. were isolated, said officials with the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

The BBC reported another cluster of five Tamiflu-resistant cases this week in Wales, in the United Kingdom.

The CDC has sent three disease investigators to North Carolina to help in the investigation there, said Dave Daigle, a CDC spokesman. CDC testing confirmed the Tamiflu-resistant cases

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 07:13 PM

WHO Investigating Norway Swine Flu Mutations
The same mutation has been found in both fatal and mild cases elsewhere, including in Brazil, China, Japan, Mexico, Ukraine, and the United States, said WHO.

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 07:19 PM

ALSO, the same mutated virus just TEN miles from me in Central Texas USA! Seems the guy was infected a month ago. Everything sounds the same though.

A month ago? You know, that sounds strangely like that guy in Oregon someone posted about earlier in the thread. He said that this guy went to the Ukraine 6 weeks before he ended up in the ICU with hemorrhagic pneumonia, and the doctors couldn't figure out what he had.

Wow. According to one source I read, the normal incubation for the garden variety flu is about 5 days, and the normal incubation period for the swine flu is about 8 days.

Do you have a link to the story about the guy in Texas? Did his symptoms begin 4 weeks later, or did he just get sicker and sicker and end up in the hospital 4 weeks later?

Four weeks is a long time to get sick from exposure. Maybe it's a secondary infection that set in after the flu....or maybe it's something else entirely, masquerading as the flu.

Or maybe he got his dates wrong, and was wrong about when he got infected.

Or, maybe he started getting sick earlier, but the flu just hung on for weeks, finally getting bad enough for him to get treatment.

Because if his illness truly, truly had an incubation period of 4 weeks....that doesn't sound like the flu to me.

Edit to add:

Oh, boy....with all these new posts about this mutated strain showing up in the US now, I have a feeling that things are going to start getting a lot busier at the hospital soon....

[edit on 20-11-2009 by nikiano]

[edit on 20-11-2009 by nikiano]

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 07:37 PM

Originally posted by nikiano
You know, I don't care what the WHO says....I don't believe for a second that this D225G mutation just "spontaneously" mutated in several people in Norway, and in the Ukraine, and is not being trasmitted person to person.

Do they think we're just stupid?

Well, most seem to be uninformed and believe the WHO, CDC for what they say. Was really ticked when CDC said that there was no MAJOR mutation in the swine flu virus. No, not recombination, agreed, but the mutation that did occur was huge in it's own way. It's much more deadly! Lie by omission. Deception. Bastard people!!

[edit on 20-11-2009 by unityemissions]

posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 07:42 PM
reply to post by nikiano

No Internet source news on the Texas fellow. It was on our local TV news ... a good long news story about it ... because there's a local fundraiser to pay for his near million dollar hospital charges.

He was comatose in the hospital a month (plus) ... that's what I meant by saying he got it a month ago. Had to have had it that long ago if he was in hospital with it more than a month.

He got sick suddenly. A local hospital diagnosed him with pneumonia and sent him home. He KNEW it was worse than pneumonia and went to the closest town and got a second opinion. He was admitted and found to have swine flu, even though the first hospital tested him as negative for it. (Guess they did the nasal or throat swab stuff that misses the nasty critter.) He quickly degraded and was on respirator that whole month. (SARS and ARDS I presume ... not the China bug SARS ... I means Sudden Acute Respiratory Syndrome.)

I knew about SARS and ARDS 20 years ago (long story) and this fellow got those just suddenly, right away.

His (wife?) wrote a journal everyday as she visited and the whole family expected this previously healthy young man (early 40's???) to die. They were surprised he survived each day ... day to day.

One day, he opened his eyes! Then he got better.

Point is, a negative swine flu test almost KILLED this swine flu man.

PS Edit: - The first hospital gave him "antibiotics". So, I'm guessing these anti-biotics actually aggravate the new swine flu?

[edit on 20/11/2009 by Trexter Ziam]

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