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Number of victims to unknown virus growing! State of emergency to be imposed in Ukraine?

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posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 06:24 PM
reply to post by ecoparity

I did give links, didn't I? Check again, pimpin'. It's in the info of the youtube vid. I also gave the lookup numbers in the video itself.. Anybody can type that into google and get the result. What more should I have done, read the whole URL outloud?

and the article from 1989:

[edit on 10-11-2009 by seattletruth]

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 06:42 PM

Originally posted by ecoparity

The conclusions on influenza as a weapon were not "good" for their purposes. The virus is uncontrollable. A bioweapon has to be stable, slow or preventable mutation and so on. It has to be able to be limited to a target area - the flu virus is not any of the things they desire.

If the responsible party is suicidal, however the existing samples of various pandemic grade flus out there would be devastating. Quite a few studies were aimed at defense which looks a lot like offensive use as they work out transmission methods which could be used.

I keep waiting for someone else to see the big picture on this thing but as a community we conspiracy research types tend to follow more often than not. I'm surprised by that, actually.

You forget the fact that if they created the virus, they would have time to also create a vaccine, before releasing it.

It's important to remember that dangerous part of vaccines is the adjuvants, which in reality are only put there to save money. If money is no problem (which it isn't for these folks), CLEAN vaccines could be made with no harmful chemicals.

Now, you might say that the vaccine wouldn't be good enough security, because as you say, with influenza you can't predict the mutations. But what if they could also actually control the apparent "mutations" by planting increasingly more virulent strains, that had a competitive edge over the last strain?

Then they would know exactly what they were working with, how the mutations would progress, how to develope either a universal vaccine, or even many incrimental vaccines.. Remember, it's the adjuvants that are dangerous, it wouldnt hurt them to take a SERIES of *clean* vaccines, if they knew the full genome sequence for the entire array of "mutations" that would be introduced.

That is my theory.

Really I gotta thank you guys, you come up with the most interesting assesments of the situation, no where else on the net has as many critical and independant thinkers as I've found on ATS.

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 07:48 PM
reply to post by seattletruth

I'm aware of the things you mention, I just see a lot of "what if" in the theory, too much, IMO.

Try to continue thinking through what such an operation would require in a logistical sense, who would have to be involved, how many, etc. Think it all the way through.

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 08:22 PM
reply to post by ecoparity

I have thought it all the way through. They have had the money, the power, and the TIME to do all of this.

You have to admit, their plan is POSSIBLE, and if executed, it would be PERFECT. Do you not think that if they were going to execute a plan, there would be NO CHANCE of failure?? They only have one chance to do this and succeed. They would not settle for any plan that was LESS than perfect. We can all agree on that, I'm sure. These people are not stupid; sometimes they appear to be stupid, but only plays into their hand, so you will underestimate their true motive.

This plan cannot fail, because as even as millions die, mother nature is blamed. There can even be millions of people that know the truth, but society has been so 'programmed' and 'conditioned' that they will believe whatever CNN tells them, to their dying breath.

TPTB do not have the man-power to take over the world by force. They cannot quell revolts.. They have to control them BEFORE they start, psychologically. Look how the CIA was forced to return Chavez to Venezuala after they kidnapped him, because hundreds of thousands of people pleaded for his return.

Any known biological attacks would cause revolts if it was common knowledge their own government was lying. A biological attack would have to be disguised as a natural bug. Try releasing ebola on the entire world, they will know it was an attack, word will travel by mouth and distrust for government would gain quick, if they were lying about it. Influenza is the perfect cover.

Remember, the plans for the new world order started in the 70s. Plans were finalized by the 90s.

Our economy has controllably been shredded, all the power handed over to U.N. with the sign of a pin. The bankers swindled us by the planned collapse, and then loot our country for trillions in the bailouts.

It is all unfolding very fast, and people believe that it's impossible because the conspiracy is too complicated... But nothing is too complicated for BRILLIANT criminal minds that do nothing but scheme and conspire all day, every day. They are PROFESSIONALS at this, it's what they do for a living *and* a hobby.

Look how the U.N. and W.H.O was formed by the world bankers, look how our country was gutted and raped since 1913 by the world bankers. Look how every country in the world is controlled by these bankers, and every highest member of ANY corporation or lending institution around the world, or any affluent individual leading his respective field is coincidentally a member of one of their secret organizations.

They control any position of power in the WORLD. Nothing is too complicated to be possible for them...

If a piss-ant like me that has endured 25 years of brain programming can even reach the conclusion that this is possible, it's probably likely.

[edit on 10-11-2009 by seattletruth]

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 08:31 PM
After pages and pages of most post being mainly about this virus being H1N1,
I find it quite startling that most people on here have not considered that this mystery virus could actually be something else.

At the very least considered a co-morbidity with the flu virus. Why can we not look at other options. Just because one virologist, Dr. Niman is claiming this is the H1N1 doesn't make it so.

Why are the stats. not matching up? Now we can throw out a variety of reasons, such as they are not testing all samples. How are they getting any positives back at all if the virus is not detectable postmortem according to one poster?

I decided to dig a little deeper into the theory that this could be a Leptospirosis outbreak that is mimicking the H1N1. Due to the nature of this pathogen the medical professionals are assuming the person to be sick with influenza. Makes logical sense. Therefore they do not look to any other invading organism, and the patient is diagnosed as having the H1N1.

Have a look at the co-morbidity of Leptospirosis.



Leptospirosis, a spirochetal zoonosis, is a globally re-emerging infectious disease that has disseminated from its habitual rural base to become the cause of urban epidemics in poor communities of industrialized and developing nations. This review addresses the issues in the epidemiology, clinical features, and management of the disease, as well as progress made toward understanding the pathogenesis of leptospiral nephropathy.

In developing nations, leptospirosis plays an important role as a potentially preventable cause of acute renal failure.

The data indicate that in certain developing regions, such as the city of Salvador, Brazil, leptospirosis is misdiagnosed with other infectious diseases such as dengue and the overall disease burden is likely underestimated partly because of the protean and nonspecific presentation. Severe forms of
the disease are associated with high case-fatality rate.

Outbreaks of leptospirosis can be predicted by heavy rain and flooding and this may serve to indicate which resources should be allocated to prevent the disease. Advancements in the basic research and epidemiology of leptospirosis should contribute to the development of more accurate diagnostic tests and of an effective vaccine. Policy makers should be urged to address the underlying conditions of poverty as well as environmental issues, which have led to the emergence of leptospirosis.

The accelerated growth and impoverishment of urban populations and lack of basic sanitation in certain regions have produced conditions favoring rodent borne epidemic transmission of leptospirosis during periods of seasonal heavy rainfall and flooding.

Although an infrequent cause of acute renal failure (ARF) in developed countries, leptospirosis is reported as one of the leading causes (24%–32%) of ARF in Thailand and Singapore. In developed nations leptospirosis is also a public health problem related to recreational activities and occupational exposure.

The following have been described as additional factors that have contributed to the re-emergence of this zoonosis: disturbances in natural ecological niches resulting from construction practices and paving; irrigation of formerly dry land; changes in climatic patterns perhaps due to global warming; increase in international travel and improvement in diagnostic facilities.

Although an infrequent cause of acute renal failure (ARF) in developed countries, leptospirosis is reported as one of the leading causes (24%–32%) of ARF in Thailand and Singapore.

In developed nations leptospirosis is also a public health problem related to recreational activities and occupational exposure.

The following have been described as additional factors that have contributed to the re-emergence of this zoonosis: disturbances in natural ecological niches resulting from construction practices and paving; irrigation of formerly dry land; changes in climatic patterns perhaps due to global warming; increase in international travel and improvement in diagnostic facilities.


Leptospirosis is distributed worldwide, except for the polar regions. The highest prevalence rates remain in the tropics.

Rodents have been recognized to be the most important and widely distributed reservoirs of leptospiral infection. The usual port of entry is through abrasions or cuts in the skin, intact mucous membranes and possibly also through water logged skin.

Humans usually become infected through contact with urine-contaminated soil or water. Incidence rates are likely underestimated partly due to lack of awareness of the disease and the lack of accurate tests to permit the rapid diagnosis of the disease. In endemic regions, symptomless leptospirosis presenting as a flu-like illness or sub clinical infection are COMMON.

Leptospirosis cases have been under- recognized and frequently misdiagnosed, especially in dengue endemic regions of the Caribbean, India, South Asia and South America.

Early phase leptospirosis and classic dengue fever have overlapping clinical presentations. Rapid urbanization and a lack of basic sanitationin the context of seasonal rainfall and flooding have produced favorable conditions for transmission of both diseases.

In 1996, an urban epidemic in Salvador, Brazil involving 326 cases of severe leptospirosis due to L. interrogans serovar Copenhageni was identified after heavy rainfall and flooding.

Individuals at highest risk were the urban poor living in the slums or city’s periphery, which lack basic sanitation. A concurrent epidemic of dengue apparently has contributed to misdiagnosis and consequently to late referrals and the high mortality observed during the leptospirosis outbreak.


Clinical manifestations of leptospirosis range from a mild influenza-like illness to severe life-threatening disease forms, characterized by jaundice, renal failure, bleeding and severe pulmonary hemorrhage.
The vast majority of infections caused by leptospires are either subclinical or of very mild severity and patients will not seek medical care.

Classic descriptions include a biphasic illness, with the acute or septicemic phase lasting about a week, followed by defervescence at 1–3 days. During leptospiremia, organisms can also be found in cerebral spinal fluid (CSF) and most tissues.

The second or immune phase lasts for 4 to 30 days and is characterized by disappearance of the leptospires from the bloodstream, leptospiruria and the emergence of antibodies.

Weil’s syndrome, seen in only 5%–10% of cases, represents the most severe form of the illness and may develop during the immune phase or present as a single, progressive disease.47 Fever, chills, headache, prostration, nausea, vomiting, muscle tenderness more prominent in lumbar areas and calf, and conjunctival suffusion are common findings in acute leptospirosis.

The latter two are considered the most distinguished physical findings. Renal involvement, the most serious complication, varies from sub-clinical course to severe ARF and accounts for the large proportions of death from leptospirosis.

Leptospirosis is unique among infectious causes of ARF in that patients frequently develop hypokalemia, natriuresis, kaliuresis, non-oliguria and even polyuria.9,13,39,40,49


posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 08:35 PM
What if an antidote was designed first, then a virus to accompany the antidote. After poisoning the air with pesticide, breaking out the aerosol and dusting death could be blamed on a seasonal flu mutation. That counts as a theory don`t it?

[edit on 10-11-2009 by Antoniastar]

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 08:50 PM

TREATMENT The initiation of effective treatment is recommended as soon as the diagnosis of leptospirosis is suspected and preferably before the fifth day of illness.

The World Health Organization and International Leptospirosis Society recommend that clinicians not wait for the results of laboratory tests before starting treatment with antibiotics, when clinical findings and epidemiological exposure history suggest leptospirosis.

Severe cases of leptospirosis should be treated with high doses of intravenous penicillin.


It is of crucial importance that a high index of suspicion and increasing alertness of leptospirosis be maintained in endemic areas so that timely therapy can be administered to patients. The continued elucidation of pathogenetic mechanisms of the disease should lead to improved patient treatment and the development of efficient diagnostic tests and vaccines. Determinants of poverty, such as poor sanitation, as well as the issues of global warming, which may lead to climate changes, should be promptly addressed by policy makers around the globe.

link: // dity+leptospirosis+&ei=AyT6SuzkIoeFnQfe3JCJDQ&usg=AFQjCNFs5tG5sHGzKYGMd-q0UGrnKDKCOw&sig2=3xgYl8oXI1T8iOUbIHaLyA

Call me crazy, but I think there is every possibility this is NOT H1N1 ALONE and actually a co-morbid infection.

They certainly have the poverty, and the huge sanitation problem this was bound to happen at some point.

I realize this is a long read, however, it is worth researching.


posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:01 PM
reply to post by paxnatus

I for one agree with you and cannot still understand the amount of let's stand on this one platform issue to prove something dam if i know what's wrong with them but you certainly have a strong point

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:11 PM
reply to post by BLUESHADOW747

I guess it's easy to assume only Dr Niman is calling it swine flu given he's the one virologist actually talking about it. All the virologists at the WHO, several Drs from the region, medical teams from Poland, Russia, etc - all call it swine flu.

I think it would be easier to find one virologist who differs on the swine flu diagnosis than try and claim only Dr Niman is calling it swine flu.

Bacteria pathogens cause illness all the time, no question but not in these numbers and not in multiple locations with no common vector. All of Ukraine does not share a common water supply so even "if" there was a bacterial outbreak in Lviv the fact the infection spread across the entire country and into neighboring ones makes that theory very, very unlikely.

The hospitals in Ukraine did not have the proper test kits for swine flu but they can easily detect bacterial infections. We've discussed this at length, several times but no one's stopping anyone from continuing to believe and push the theory, just like the plague theory before it.

If the government of Ukraine is allowing people to die from a bacterial infection while begging for swine flu medication and vaccines - well, that would be one unprecedented screw up.

[edit on 10-11-2009 by ecoparity]

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:16 PM
reply to post by BLUESHADOW747

Thank you Blueshadow. It's just a theory, but anything is better than just saying it has to be this and could not be something else.

Oh well old habits die hard I guess!

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:21 PM
hey, got a question for the forum that likes stats and figures instead of the core issues; H ow you going to feel when this s---- hits you and your family, and folks are crunching numbers and stats as opposed to making an impact on the various multiple ways to deal with this and ?

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:23 PM
reply to post by paxnatus

It's possible of course, The PB1-f2 gene is known to accelerate and inflame secondary viral infection.

However it may further indicate that virus has changed because the PB1 gene in the current strain is incomplete.
It would reek havoc throughout the third world otherwise. Well actually the entire world.

Can't be sure, just based on what I've found so far. An uneducated guess.

[edit on 10-11-2009 by squiz]

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:32 PM
reply to post by ecoparity

hey I read you loud and clear but I for one DO NOT DISCOUNT anything and there is a very STRONG possibility iand strong point that pax makes due to the fact we are dealing with corruption on a major scale and the facts more than likely the figures also and the fact DO YOU REALLY THINK THEY WANT YOU OR I OR ANYONEfor that matter to be able to sort this out? c,mone ecoparity I think you know what IM saying and as a rule or common knowledge they know someone is going to jump on the band wagon and try to present things as such give these ideas some options there.s a lot of good insight and info given everyone can jump in with relation to what the hell we are dealing with

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:35 PM
reply to post by ecoparity

Eco, have you even looked at this diagnosis? Leptospirosis mimics the pneumonic plague and influenza.

If someone is presenting with the same symptomology of the disease of a pandemic, why would anyone look any further, for a bacterial infection? It makes no sense.

Even then high titers are not going to be detectable for at least 30 days, it often goes undiagnosed! If you had read the research you would know this.
It's not like their is a "rapid Strep test". The Elisa is what they use, but think about how many times Lyme in this country goes undetected. Even then the Elisa test is not definitive.

The one thing the entire area has in common you asked? A Huge Sanitation problem, I am talking about raw sewage that is leaking into the soil!

Here see for yourself. zrvPbv4&hl=en&ei=sbD5SqGgCovXngen7-z_DA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CAgQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=lviv%20ukraine%20waste%20problems&f=false

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:44 PM
reply to post by ecoparity

ecoparity you make some very good points and not to go around them but, look at this THERE IS PROBABLY AND I SAY PROBABLY A multiple system in place here "foolw me? this is not in all probability a just let's look at this kinda" thing!@ there are going to be HUGE variables and as even you pointed out THINK IT THROUGH there's more going on here than facts and figures just kick back breathe in and think about what the hell this is really all about aand what the agenda is!

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:45 PM

RSOE Emergency and Disaster Information Service

Situation Update No. 34
On 10.11.2009 at 18:38 GMT+2

Ukraine's epidemic of flu and acute respiratory disorders has now affected more than a million people, the country's deputy health minister said on Tuesday. Vasyl Lazoryshynets said the death toll from the epidemic had risen to 174, as President Viktor Yushchenko warned the country must brace itself for a second wave of infections. Nearly 53,000 Ukrainians have now been hospitalized, Lazoryshynets said, but the number in intensive care has fallen by nearly a quarter to around 330. A total of 67 cases of swine flu have been reported in Ukraine, he said, 14 of which had been fatal. "Ukraine must prepare properly for a second wave of respiratory infections and flu," including A(H1N1), Yushchenko said Tuesday, according to the Interfax news agency. A World Health Organization (WHO) team in Ukraine said on Monday the epidemic had slowed, but warned a second wave was likely. On Monday the health ministry's previous bulletin on the epidemic, which began in mid-October, reported 969,000 infections, with 155 deaths and 65 cases of A(H1N1).

OK, let’s look at the numbers.

Lazoryshynets said, but the number in intensive care has fallen by nearly a quarter to around 330.

So if you end up in intensive care, your chance of dying is 4.3% and that is not an ordinary flu.

A World Health Organization (WHO) team in Ukraine said on Monday the epidemic had slowed,

OK, 19 more deaths overnight, is a 12% increase in the death toll. At that rate by December 31st there would be 50,258 dead. Slowed, yeah right. In addition, 53,000 Ukrainians have now been hospitalized which is a 7.6% increase OVERNIGHT.

It reminds me of the US government and the “green shoots” talk. They know we’re screwed; they just don’t want the panic because they can’t control it. Our panic would surly turn to anger at those that brought us here.

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 09:56 PM
reply to post by Absum!

DAM GOOD STUFF now that's what I 'M TALKING ABOUT get to the point brace warn , prepare and dammit help people reinforce for GOD'S sake!

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 10:06 PM
reply to post by BLUESHADOW747

I deal in figures all day, and as you stated it can be brash to reduce lost lives to numbers. But as this is unfolding numbers and stats are our only measure to protect our own. This event maybe starting around the world, but at that growth rate it will be here within 30 days. Heck, it is already showing up in Alaska, of all places.

It is so difficult to comprehend what is truly happening, because I have little faith in the MSM reports and less in any government reports.

edit SP

[edit on 10-11-2009 by Absum!]

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 10:11 PM
reply to post by BLUESHADOW747

So what exactly are you getting at? Are you claiming the WHO, multiple governments, every Dr in the region and every virologist who has examined the issue are all lying as part of some massive conspiracy?

I believe conspiracies take place but that doesn't mean accepting any old fairy tale. IMO people are so busy chasing wild theories around that they're missing the real one.

As for being prepared, I took care of that months ago. Anyone who is still unprepared only have themselves to blame. How much more warning do people expect?

posted on Nov, 10 2009 @ 10:17 PM
post removed for serious violation of ATS Terms & Conditions

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