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Saudis drop WTI oil contract

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posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 09:38 AM
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You are correct, they are hedging their bets. They know that they are selling oil in ever depreciating dollars and trillions they hold in dollar assets are losing value also. They want out as do the rest of the world without losing all their investment value.




posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 09:39 AM
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Why the Dollar Bubble is about to Burst?
IRAN HAS REALLY DONE IT...more deadlier than the nuclear..


www.thetruthseeker.co.uk...
The Voice (issue 264 -) ran an article beginning, ' Iran has really gone and done it now. No, they haven't sent their first nuclear sub in to the Persian Gulf . They are about to launch something much more deadly -- next week the Iran Bourse will open to trade oil, not n dollars but in Euros' This apparently insignificant event has consequences far greater for the US people, indeed all for us all, than is imaginable.

Currently almost all oil buying and selling is in US-dollars through exchanges in London and New York . It is not accidental they are both US-owned.

The Wall Street crash in 1929 sparked off global depression and World War II. During that war the US supplied provisions and munitions to all its allies, refusing currency and demanding gold payments in exchange..

By 1945, 80% of the world's gold was sitting in US vaults. The dollar became the one undisputed global reserve currency -- it was treated world-wide as `safer than gold'. The Bretton Woods agreement was established.

The US took full advantage over the next decades and printed dollars like there was no tomorrow. The US exported many mountains of dollars, paying for ever-increasing amounts of commodities, tax cuts for the rich, many wars abroad, mercenaries, spies and politicians the world over. You see, this did not affect inflation at home! The US got it all for free! Well, maybe for a forest or two.

CONT...



[mod edit: added source link, Required EX tags and clipped quoted content]
Mod Note: Quoting External Sources – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 29-10-2009 by 12m8keall2c]



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 09:40 AM
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[removed excessive quote continued from previous post]
Mod Note: Quoting External Sources – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 29-10-2009 by 12m8keall2c]



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 09:49 AM
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reply to post by SpacePunk
 



Unfortuneately that would probably work for a time. Just don't think anyone in the political arena would do it. Political/corporate alliances overseas would prevent it.


Pg



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 10:17 AM
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Please correct me or enlighten me if I'm assuming incorrectly,
but my thinking is, removing themselves from the standard, as a means to control,
positions us, to in fact see an immediate effect in supply,
namely a spiked shortage should their anticipated outcome not be realized.
My gut tells me listen for reports of fuel shortages and price increases here in the states...only.
>This premeditated move should set us reeling backwards rather hard on our rears, which is what its designed to do, this is just another step in a process.

[edit on 29-10-2009 by HappilyEverAfter]

[edit on 29-10-2009 by HappilyEverAfter]



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 10:19 AM
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Excellent post. I find your reasoning on the spot. I have read, and heard that the US oil companies have mucho reserves, and use them as an ace in the whole. That way, they can manipulate the price of crude as they see fit. I have also heard that the reason the price of crude has stayed where it has, is that the lower market price ruins the Saudi's , who nedd $100 a barrel plus to finance their empire.

look at what happened to Dubai. It's a bankrupt country full of empty shopping malls. They too needed the $100 a barrel plus oil.
Our oil barrons manipulate the price of crude as they see fit. We are just the unluckey recipients of that price control. But, I'm mistaken in saying luck has anything to do with any of it. Everything is controlled and manipulated. We just live with the results.

Also, in my opinion, don't think the US wouldn't send troops into Saudia Arabia immediately if they threated the suppy in any way. I feel like the US oil execs think they own that oil, but it just happens to be in another country. A small detail. The oil companies are part of the PTB, the elite, whatever you want to call them. They are calling the shots in the government, not the president. Why do you think we still have troops in the mid east fighting well armed camel jockeys? The government doesn't give a crap about or troops lives'. They just want to control the oil. There is no other logical reason. Can you think of anything other than oil of any value there? The armed insurgents are a major nuisance in every theater of operation. They must be dealt with to protect the oil, at any cost.

So , we arrive at our present situation, wasting countless lives to protect the oil. I'm not going to argue politics on this one. people will believe what they want. I just hate to see our guys dying for a bunch of ignorant armed terrorists, who hate us just as much as we do them, and we operate under the guise of nation building, and winning over the hearts and minds of the people. Please, does anyone believe that drivel??



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 11:04 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

reply to post by mrpotatohead

Exactly!

It's a chess game. In chess, the best offense is to move your pieces stealthily to set up unnoticed for a debilitating attack on your opponent. There is usually one move in that strategy that alerts your opponent to your plans, hopefully too late to avoid it. This is that move.

The Saudis have traditionally been the one country in the Middle East that was always on our 'side' in this struggle for dollar-dependent oil. Iran, Iraq, Syria, were always struggling to depeg from the American stranglehold they saw the original agreement as being. Saudi, not so much. The people may be as rabid in their beliefs that we are 'The Great Satan', but the rulers are not.

That's what is setting this move apart from the ongoing problems, in my mind. If our best 'friends' are turning away, then what do we have left?

I will take exception with one point you make: the wars are not for oil, but for something much greater: the dollar, the very basis of our economy. Oil is simply the only standard that is keeping the dollar from being green toilet paper... and our 'leaders' know that fact all too well.

TheRedneck

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 11:14 AM
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reply to post by TheRedneck
 


Oil fluctuates on the Dollar, for a long time it didn't really matter, the USA had an extreme control over the entire region...

Then came the Dotcom Bust .. not soon after the arrival of...

The Euro

Now America has a much weaker control over the region, some of the states moving against the Dollar (iraq) which could easily be disposed of. Still the price skyrockets as the dollar collapsed from 1999-2008.

Now the Dollar is collapsing again, yesterday it hit a 14 month low, we are now near the lowest point of the Dollar, ever.. and oil isn't at $150/b .. why? Because the us is leaning on finance institutions to NOT speculate oil, any further deflation of the consumer's financial base will be the death blow to the economy..

So Saudi lifts the benchmark, allowing them to in a sense set their own prices..

The benchmark through speculation raises prices, but speculation has been left out to dry by the mega bank corps (per governments request no doubt.. piss off the people to much to fast, they'll turn on you in an instant) .. so to drop the benchmark, the single largest speculated contract, saudis are now in a position to artificially raise their own prices in accordance with a weaker dollar..

It will be interesting to see how the dollar continues to react..



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 11:31 AM
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Originally posted by praxis

Originally posted by TeddiRevolution

Your little spiel had nothing to do with what he said. They can charge us more now, that's it. Take your sensationalism somewhere else.

Also, don't generalize the citizens of this country, just because you live here doesn't mean you speak for "we". I sure as Hell am no junkie pig who gets off on war, speak for yourself next time.


If you support the government's program of Perpetual War For Perpetual Peace, you are part of the problem. If you are not in the streets protesting or on the 'net protesting, you support this policy by your failure to act.

We have not had a legitimate government for a very long time.


I generally agree. Peaceful protest en masse which is something the Europeans do well and it's the smartest response to gov't and corporate greed and corruption that negatively affects their peoples. Why the American people as a whole don't have the guts to do this puzzles me. It just gives the gov't and corporations more incentive to loot the country for themselves while most standby and watch it all go down the drain.



Originally posted by SpacePunk
The way that I see it, the world can do what it wants. All the United States has to do is recall it's troops, shut down it's overseas bases, and end all foreign aid. Ending foreign aid would teach the world who really runs the show, and recalling all forces stationed elsewhere would let them know that they are on their own. Further actions would be to send all h1b visa workers directly to their home countries.


It would solve some problems and create others but it would be interesting to see what happens afterwards...in a cautiously optimistic way!



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 11:38 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

reply to post by Rockpuck

Great points!


Because the us is leaning on finance institutions to NOT speculate oil, any further deflation of the consumer's financial base will be the death blow to the economy..

...which could explain Obama's recent announcement putting caps on bank executive pay. A shot across the bow?


...saudis are now in a position to artificially raise their own prices in accordance with a weaker dollar..

Which is why I said this will result in a complete depegging of the dollar form Saudi oil. They already are hedging against future devaluation of the dollar via this move, so should the dollar drop too far (as seems likely the way the present Administration is writing checks), it would seem logical they would follow the lead of Iran.

As I mentioned, I am still trying to sort out the implications and connections with this move. So forgive me if my logic seems to skip a step here and there.


It will be interesting to see how the dollar continues to react..

Indeed it will!

TheRedneck

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 11:38 AM
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My family has one oil well producing in West Texas as we speak. It produces about 300 barrels of oil a day. We are getting ready to drill another one about 1/2 a mile from that one. It's in an are where there is canyon reef. It's basically a lake of oil. God I hope the price of oil goes back up to $150 a barrel! I'm going to start buying gold by the pound. Screw the dollar.



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 12:11 PM
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Would the fact that oil is up $2.54 and gold up $17 already today be a part of this whole thing? I checked the dollar and it doesn't seem to be losing ground to badly right this second. Unsure myself of how all this will tie together.



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 12:21 PM
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reply to post by iggster
 


The report just came out that the GDP rose by 3.5% in the 3rd quarter.

The strong GDP report weakened demand for safe-havens like Treasurys, and a drop in the dollar pushed commodity prices higher, helping to lift materials and energy stocks.

[edit on 29-10-2009 by dimensionaljumper]



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 12:32 PM
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Iran opens exchange to trade oil, products-ISNA

Iran officially OPENED it's awaited Oil Bourse this week!

I can't believe this is not yet been posted here on ATS but from what I have been following this news is significant...



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 12:44 PM
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reply to post by TheRedneck
 




Which is why I said this will result in a complete depegging of the dollar form Saudi oil.


I don't think so.. I think it's just a way to milk the Americans for every penny they got. I sort of *** you America. Kicking the beastie while it's down so to speak.


There is nothing we can do about it.

The price of oil will continue to rise. Saudi Arabia had said last year they wanted no less than $100/b for their oil, which is amazing considering when I started driving (and im only 23) oil was $20/b on a bad day.




As I mentioned, I am still trying to sort out the implications and connections with this move.


The way I see it America is on it's knees clutching it's gut from the economic crash that brought us down a peg. Saudi Arabia just walked by and sucker punched us and stole our wallet.

reply to post by iggster
 


US GDP grew at 3.5%, thus speculators bought oil thinking demand will raise prices, yadda yadda, the usual spewing of garbage. Ironic how GDP grew while Retailing plummets.. wonder what we were producing.. oh that's right, it was the Banks making billions from the stock market that they themselves inflated with our money.. they represented 41% of ALL profits. Somehow, I don't think that's going to be making people drive more..



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 12:51 PM
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I thought I would bring this thread to light... would seem to me this is significant if the Iranian Oil Bourse is infact really now open for business?

I hope the ATS community will dig in and find out what the impact of this story is. Is it related to the Saudi decision? Saudi's wouldn't be siding with Iran would they?



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 12:52 PM
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Sorry forgot to post the thread linky

Iran opens exchange to trade oil, products-ISNA



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 12:59 PM
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Originally posted by Zosynspiracy
reply to post by Rockpuck
 



Well you sir can send your sons and daughters off to die for such a stupid justification. I refuse. I mean my god........the sad thing is there are other Americans sharing your same twisted argument of dollar hegemony. Pathetic. A country doesn't survive by killing people who don't want to play their game..........they survive by taking care of their own, innovating, adapting, living within their means i.e. DISCIPLINE! America has lost all discipline..........we have turned into 'junkies' and gluttonous pigs.


Well said... I blame the school system. Ever since the disgusting "No Child Left Behind" crap, kids have been learning even less. I was in middle school when it was signed, and GODDAMN it if half the time after that we weren't 'prepping' for some bs test that the school needed for better funding. I literally felt myself get stupider throughout high school. It just got depressing.

These people won't know what hit em.

Edit: T&C violation removed.

[edit on 30-10-2009 by intrepid]



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 01:00 PM
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Originally posted by Zosynspiracy
reply to post by TeddiRevolution
 


I'm sure you live in excess like most gluttonous junkie pigs thirsty for their Ipods, Monday night football and latest and greatest gadgets and widgets no? Most Americans do........I am guilty of it myself and so are you. At least I have the balls to realize it and admit it. Will you?


we all do, we just don't feel a need to apologize to the rest of the people out there for doing well. Now, we just have to work on that whole white guilt thing, and we'd be good.



posted on Oct, 29 2009 @ 01:04 PM
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Yep here it comes, all we've worked for all we've saved upover the year all up in smoke. So what the hell is the President and his cracker jack group in congress going to do? Nothing...fortunately they for sure have pleanty of foriegn investments and are swimming in Euros to sail this one out and survive...for the rest of us? Nothing



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