Eating Animals is Making us Sick

Originally posted by habfan1968
Where exactly are you getting protein in your diet?

From fruits and vegetables? where do you think a cow gets it protein or a primate?

Originally posted by Lavey2
again all monkeys eat meat, all apes eat meat.

Less then 2% of there diet....

reply to post by Rawhemp


cows are herbivores they do not need meat because their internal organs are different then ours. we on the other hand not only need meat but we crave it. if we werent made to eat meat then evolution would have solved that problem long ago.

the point is that our bodies are made to function off the protein in meat. take any omnivore and but it on a strictly vegan diet to and see how long they last.

someone earlier mentioned that god gave them free choice and their choice is to not eat meat. well you have the free choice not to breathe either doesn't mean its beneficial.

Originally posted by Doc Tesla
reply to post by Rawhemp

 

cows are herbivores they do not need meat because their internal organs are different then ours. we on the other hand not only need meat but we crave it. if we werent made to eat meat then evolution would have solved that problem long ago.

the point is that our bodies are made to function off the protein in meat. take any omnivore and but it on a strictly vegan diet to and see how long they last.

someone earlier mentioned that god gave them free choice and their choice is to not eat meat. well you have the free choice not to breathe either doesn't mean its beneficial.

Main Entry: as·sump·tion
Pronunciation: \ə-ˈsəm(p)-shən\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Late Latin assumption-, assumptio taking up, from Latin assumere
Date: 13th century

1 a : the taking up of a person into heaven b capitalized : August 15 observed in commemoration of the Assumption of the Virgin Mary
2 : a taking to or upon oneself
3 : the act of laying claim to or taking possession of something
4 : arrogance, pretension
5 a : an assuming that something is true b : a fact or statement (as a proposition, axiom, postulate, or notion) taken for granted
6 : the taking over of another's debts

You aren't a scientist, you aren't a MD, your probably some 13 year old kid who knows nothing about nutrition. Come back with some sort of factual evidence to back up anything you say and i will think otherwise

reply to post by Rawhemp


it always the vegans who get angry and start problems. it must be that lack of protein.

Cattle are ruminants, meaning that they have a digestive system that allows use of otherwise indigestible foods by repeatedly regurgitating and re chewing them as "cud".

The cud is then re swallowed and further digested by specialized microorganisms in the rumen. These microbes are primarily responsible for decomposing cellulose and other carbohydrates into volatile fatty acids that cattle use as their primary metabolic fuel.

see how they have to use specialized microorganisms just to digest the grass they eat? they were designed to eat it. us humans do not have these organisms. we don't have them because we were not designed to eat grass. we can not digest cellulose. cows can digest cellulose.

[edit on 29-10-2009 by Doc Tesla]

Originally posted by Divinorumus
Maybe it's their anger showing through because of their lack of will power to break this connection they have with eating flesh and blood, death, and it's being vented upon us stronger willed and morally higher creatures of Earth, ha. Of course, murderers do have a lack of compassion, that much is obvious, and that could be showing sometimes too.

There, that might help to explain some of it.

Oh for Pete's sake. What makes you morally higher than me?

I didn't kill the animal, so i'm not a murderer. I ate its flesh and for that i'm very grateful. If you believe in reincarnation then that soul has served its purpose on the planet and will now probably become a professor on another planet teaching children about vegetarians and their ego's on the planet earth.

Please stop the melodrama and the intellectual egotism, it doesn't wash with me. Maybe the reason us omnivores get angry, is the fact that militant veggies judge us on our life styles and eating habits.

My gradnmother was a very peace loving woman, she cared a lot about her community, attended church every sunday, donated some of her savings to various charities and would volunteer her last days in a charity shop. Always helping, always working, always smiling...

Yet she ate fish and meat. Is she a murderer?

Get over yourselves.

reply to post by m khan


The elite do not want their slaves to grow strong. I have found out that protien from animal sources is the best thing to eat for the thyroid. Soy beans are the most terrible thing you can eat for the thyroid. When the thyroid does not function correctly the brain becomes cloudy and fatigue sets in. Our elites who are descended from snake oil sellsmen love cloudy brained tired people ,because they are so easy to con. The elites seldom if ever eat soy.

but wait theres more.

As these microbes reproduce in the rumen, older generations die and their carcasses continue on through the digestive tract. These carcasses are then partially digested by the cattle, allowing it to gain a high quality protein source. These features allow cattle to thrive on grasses and other vegetation.

Cows also rely on those organisms for protein because they do not get enough of a strictly vegan diet. and yes humans do not possess that skill.

now i would like to see your proof that humans can strictly survive on fruits and vegetables alone.


the 13 year olds of the world rejoice.

Doc tesla seriosuly are you for reals? Cows are designed to digest grasses which are high in cellulose, humans can't digest grass go try to eat a handful. Grass=fruits and vegetables? NO! Why don't you stop before you make yourself look like a fool, maybe you should go back a page and actually read the links i posted.

Lets no forget babies only need 6% protein, everyone will agree babies need more protein then adults because that is the stage when your body is growing the most. All plant sources provide at least 5% protein....

reply to post by Rawhemp


Main Entry: as·sump·tion
Pronunciation: \ə-ˈsəm(p)-shən\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Late Latin assumption-, assumptio taking up, from Latin assumere
Date: 13th century

1 a : the taking up of a person into heaven b capitalized : August 15 observed in commemoration of the Assumption of the Virgin Mary
2 : a taking to or upon oneself
3 : the act of laying claim to or taking possession of something
4 : arrogance, pretension
5 a : an assuming that something is true b : a fact or statement (as a proposition, axiom, postulate, or notion) taken for granted
6 : the taking over of another's debts


i put my proof down on the table where is yours? so far you have made no convincing arguments although if you went and had a sandwich right now im sure your head would clear up.

Originally posted by eradown
reply to post by m khan

 

The elite do not want their slaves to grow strong. I have found out that protien from animal sources is the best thing to eat for the thyroid. Soy beans are the most terrible thing you can eat for the thyroid. When the thyroid does not function correctly the brain becomes cloudy and fatigue sets in. Our elites who are descended from snake oil sellsmen love cloudy brained tired people ,because they are so easy to con. The elites seldom if ever eat soy.

I will agree soy is one of the most terrible foods(can it even be considered a food?) you can put in your body. I don't get tho how you can think the elite don't want us to eat meat yet the elite are the ones making it possible for us to consume mass amounts of meat, factory farms wouldn't exist if it wasn't for these so called "elite"

Originally posted by Rawhemp
This thread just proves the majority of people on ats are completely ignorant and severely brainwashed...

Plants do contain all the essential amino acids in adequate quantities to meet human needs, and even those of children (Millward). Vitamin D is not found in milk or meat, unless it is added during manufacturing. Sunlight is the proper source of this vitamin. Plants manufacture beta-carotene, the precursor of vitamin A. The original source of all minerals (including calcium and zinc) is the ground. Plants are abundant in minerals; and they act as the conduit of minerals to animals. The scientific truth is protein, essential amino acid, mineral, and vitamin (except for B12 which is synthesized by bacteria, not animals) deficiencies are never caused by a diet based on whole plant foods when calorie needs are met. Ms. Planck's distortion of nutritional science is a serious matter that needs to be fixed. Reference: Millward DJ. The nutritional value of plant-based diets in relation to human amino acid and protein requirements. Proc Nutr Soc. 1999 May;58(2):249-60.

www.mombu.com...

hygienehealth.mydietblogger.com...

chestofbooks.com...

michaelbluejay.com...

Now lets see the evidence to back up some of the claims in this thread, mainly that vegans/vegetarians shorten there life's, meat is needed to fuel the body, vegans risk every deficiency in the book...

Yeah but dates are just plum awful tasting!!

I'm guessing by the smiley face your being sarcastic? Dates are one of the most delicious foods on the planet, better then any man made candy bar can ever hope to be.


[edit on 29-10-2009 by Rawhemp]

Already posted the "prove" Doc... maybe you need to go eat some fruit, from your post it seems like your blood sugar is dangerously low. Low blood sugar makes you go insane, not low protein....

[edit on 29-10-2009 by Rawhemp]

I don't like the idea of a factory farm either but I won't turn down a good steak offered by a friend. That is also why I buy my meat from a small traditional farm nearby. Whether it be chicken or beef or pork, I know what I am ingesting.

Furthermore, I agree with others who have stated that a vegan wouldn't last 2 weeks in a survival situation where no stockpile of meatless food was available. Really now, I know what I can do to survive in the North American wilderness an there is a lot of vegetable matter to be had in the spring summer and fall, but winter poses a serious challenge even for us meat eaters.

Good luck to you all!

Originally posted by palg1

Furthermore, I agree with others who have stated that a vegan wouldn't last 2 weeks in a survival situation where no stockpile of meatless food was available. Really now, I know what I can do to survive in the North American wilderness an there is a lot of vegetable matter to be had in the spring summer and fall, but winter poses a serious challenge even for us meat eaters.

A vegan would have a lot better chances in a survival situation then a so-called meat eater. 90% of the plants of earth are edible.....

Originally posted by Rawhemp

Originally posted by ravenshadow13
When I was a veggie, I got sick, because I weigh 92 lbs.

maybe this has something to with the fact that you severley under ate, a common problem with vegans. Your gonna have problems if you don't get sufficient calories no matter what diet your on

Originally posted by ravenshadow13Anyhow, I'm an omnivore. Humans are omnivores. Like our close relatives.

What close ancestors? the primates who are frugivores? certain species of primates eat insects or small amounts of meat but this equates to 2% of there diet, 2%!!! The average Americans intake of animal protein constitutes 50% of there diet, often more...

Actually, I didn't under eat. I became anemic. I still weigh 92 lbs and I am not underweight. I'm 5' tall. I need to make sure that the food I eat is worthwhile.

Most primates that we are closely related to are omnivores. Although meat may comprise actually 3% of a chimpanzee's diet, many primates regularly consume large quantities of insects. Since humans in many Western cultures do not support the consumption of insects, we get our protein from beef and poultry, for the most part.

So, you are correct, but it does not support your argument very much. If you tell me that you support the regular human consumption of insects, and carry it through, I will join you and support you. If not, meat is the way that humans consume the majority of their protein.


ALSO. Many of the meat-alternatives are comprised of soy products. Right now, soy agriculture is being infiltrated by genetic modified soy plants. The best thing to do is stay away from the soy industry as much as possible, because Monsato and his friends are trying to place a global financial empire on food through the modification of soy and corn, and some other plants. Soy also contains a high percentage of isoflavones, which may be detrimental over time. And soy is responsible for a good chunk of food allergies. Soy is also responsible for a very high percentage of the deforestation for agriculture in the rainforest.


Go ahead and stop eating meat, but stop eating soy, too. And stop eating dairy (they're putting growth hormones in the cows, it might cause cancer to drink milk from those cows, but we won't know for a few decades). Only eat local, organic fruits and veggies.

I would feel more comfortable telling you to eat local, no hormone meat and poultry along with local fruits and vegetables. That is what I eat.

reply to post by Rawhemp


well doesn't it make you giggle when you get to prove someone wrong. hmm did a little research into your linkys.

chest of books link, the one with the excerpt by Herbert M. Shelton. i did a little research on him. turns out he was arrested several times for practicing medicine without a liscense. o and he killed a patient. apparently he "accidently" starved him to death. must have put him on a vegan diet

i can not find any names behind your blogger so i will write them off as 13 year olds with out MD.

John robbins from the MOMBU forum (which is btw ridiculous to cite a forum as proof) he speaks about how bad factory farming is not necessarily how bad meat is.

the other author. Ted Altar. i found that his most popular piece of work is whether jesus was a vegan. at that point i started laughing so hard that i couldn't continue working.

the last site is directly from a vegan guide. If we are having a MAC VS PC debate you cant link me Windows.com as proof of anything.

so lets tally it up. My sources come from encarta encylopedia. Well known unbiased source of information.

your sources are

1 murderer
1 13 year old kid with no MD
1 man who spends his time wondering whether jesus was a vegan
1 guy who worked at an ice cream parlor before writing books on how bad meat is. (i didnt see the connection either)
1 website that is as biased as you can get.

reply to post by Tallsorts


Here you would need to read the Urantia Papers

I haven't a clue about this, so not much I can offer either way, except to say that I think what you have posted is baloney. Of course, that is my uneducated in the Urantia way, opinion.


Vegans are no more spiritually advanced than any other group of people

You are the one that stated: Some people become more advanced spiritually, and give up meat, and many more don't.

You write like somebody wants to take your meat away.

Although I love meat, I don't eat it that often. Since natural meat is a bit more expensive, I can't afford to eat it as much as I would like.

Whether I eat meat or not, it is quite clear that there ARE people would want to take meat completely out of our diets. They use a number of ways to do it. As evidenced by several posting on this thread, they use the "guilt" factor, calling meat eaters murders. They also use the "meat is bad for you" method, also evidenced on this thread. And how about PETA? They not only would like to remove meat from our diets, they don't even want people to own pets! So, yes, there are people that would like to take meat away.

Fortunately. I have a cast iron stomach and digestive system and can eat anything that tastes good to me. I'm healthy and always have been. Can consume all the calories I want (although I never pig out!) and stay slender because I get plenty of exercise. Thank goodness cause there's alot of stuff loaded with calories that I dearly love!

Bottom line...Just in my opinion

Niether a vegetarian diet or the current amount of meat consumption is healthy.

Traditional people eat meat once in a while and on special occassions...as did most modern societies, including the US until the modern industrial food era arrived.

Thanksgiving, Christmas, Easter etc. those where when the average american could expect to "feast" on meat a hundred years ago. The well off might eat meat once a week.

Not a Big Mac for lunch everyday. That will kill you.

Most primates eat meat...on occassion...but the fundemental diet is vegatables etc.

So for me the truth is in the middle...Meat is OK IN MODERATION...and ideally not something like fast food.

A single big mac can contain the meat from thousands of animals...they like to have consistency in taste...so they mix it up...and those animals have been pumped full of growth hormones to move them to market faster.

Originally posted by ravenshadow13

Actually, I didn't under eat. I became anemic. I still weigh 92 lbs and I am not underweight. I'm 5' tall. I need to make sure that the food I eat is worthwhile.

Unless you actively mapped out your daily meals on a site such as fitday or other calorie counting site i can almost guarntee you were under eating. What did you daily meals consist of??

Most primates that we are closely related to are omnivores. Although meat may comprise actually 3% of a chimpanzee's diet, many primates regularly consume large quantities of insects.

The 3% you claim includes insects! They don't eat 3% meat and also eat insects...

So, you are correct, but it does not support your argument very much. If you tell me that you support the regular human consumption of insects, and carry it through, I will join you and support you. If not, meat is the way that humans consume the majority of their protein.

Humans aren't monkeys we have brains and complex reasoning, we don't need insects because we can use other plant sources that replace the need for insects. Furthermore most primates don't eat insects instinctively they eat them solely because they happen to be living in the fruit they want.

ALSO. Many of the meat-alternatives are comprised of soy products. Right now, soy agriculture is being infiltrated by genetic modified soy plants. The best thing to do is stay away from the soy industry as much as possible, because Monsato and his friends are trying to place a global financial empire on food through the modification of soy and corn, and some other plants. Soy also contains a high percentage of isoflavones, which may be detrimental over time. And soy is responsible for a good chunk of food allergies. Soy is also responsible for a very high percentage of the deforestation for agriculture in the rainforest.

I don't eat soy, corn, grains or legumes. My diet consist of 95% fruits and 5% tender leafy greens (lettuce, celery, cilantro etc.)

Originally posted by Rawhemp


I don't eat soy, corn, grains or legumes. My diet consist of 95% fruits and 5% tender leafy greens (lettuce, celery, cilantro etc.)

are you monitored by a doctor on a monthly basis? because it sounds to me, depending on how long you have been starving yourself, you would be pale and sickly looking. vegan diets are quite literally starving your body. Fast food is not realty meat but an occasional home made burger can do wonders for the body.

THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO PROOF THAT YOU CAN GET ALL THE VITAMINS YOU GET IN MEAT FROM FRUIT AND VEGGIES.

Find me that proof and i will convert to vegetarianism. unbiased proof that is.

[edit on 29-10-2009 by Doc Tesla]

Originally posted by Doc Tesla

John robbins from the MOMBU forum (which is btw ridiculous to cite a forum as proof) he speaks about how bad factory farming is not necessarily how bad meat is.

So my source which cites references from medical journals and scientific studies is ridiculous, ok... The other sources are negligible because this one proves them all and it has all the sources to back up every piece of information in the article

Originally posted by Doc Teslaso lets tally it up. My sources come from encarta encylopedia. Well known unbiased source of information.

Your source for what? that humans can't digest grass? You never gave me the source i asked for which is that humans need meat.