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Eating Animals is Making us Sick

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posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 11:00 AM
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Originally posted by Lexxica
reply to post by Divinorumus
 


Again, this thread is not about eating meat. It's about the negative aspects associated with modern animal farming practices. And no, I don't think that I would be against eating cheeseburgers if aliens started eating us. That was a ridiculous analogy, unless you just sound ridiculous stating an intelligently though out analogy.....mmmm I'm thinking no. Fail again. Sorry.


as is said before: it is not only a matter of heath, but also a matter of the 'health' of the planet, caused by meat industry, globalisation, global warming and so on... which is all related to meat/ dairy and leather 'consumption'.

best,
bertrand




posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 11:08 AM
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Originally posted by Lexxica

The reason people get angry is because we are sick of being told that we are evil for eating meat, or that we are making ourselves sick because of eating meat, and that we should, yeah, stop eating meat. I don't go out of my way to tell the vegetarians and vegans in my life that they need to eat meat, but they tell me a lot that I need to stop eating it.


Because your eating meat is not only killing yourself its taxing the # out of our environment, unless you happen to get it down the block from your friends organic farm like everyone on ATS claims
.

On top of this our taxes pay for your meat eating because of subsidies, if it wasn't for food subsidies a LB of meat would be $100+.

I personally think people need to know there is a better way, so many people are totally brainwashed into thinking they need meat or animal products which is completely false.

Especially people on ATS who know the government is absolutely [snip], why would you eat something that is so heavily marketed and pushed on you by the vary people that pretty much want you dead.


www.pcrm.org...

If it wasn't for these subsidies places like McDonalds couldn't even exist


[edit on 28-11-2009 by Rawhemp]

 


(Do NOT remove moderator edits)

Censor circumvention removed

Please read from the Terms And Conditions Of Use

1b.) Profanity: You will not use profanity in our forums, and will neither post with language or content that is obscene, sexually oriented, or sexually suggestive nor link to sites that contain such content. You will also not use common alternative spellings or net-speak alternative for profane words.

[edit on 28/11/09 by masqua]



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 11:38 AM
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Originally posted by Rawhemp

Originally posted by Lexxica

The reason people get angry is because we are sick of being told that we are evil for eating meat, or that we are making ourselves sick because of eating meat, and that we should, yeah, stop eating meat. I don't go out of my way to tell the vegetarians and vegans in my life that they need to eat meat, but they tell me a lot that I need to stop eating it.


Because your eating meat is not only killing yourself its taxing the # out of our environment, unless you happen to get it down the block from your friends organic farm like everyone on ATS claims
.

On top of this our taxes pay for your meat eating because of subsidies, if it wasn't for food subsidies a LB of meat would be $100+.

I personally think people need to know there is a better way, so many people are totally brainwashed into thinking they need meat or animal products which is completely false.

Especially people on ATS who know the government is absolutely [snip], why would you eat something that is so heavily marketed and pushed on you by the vary people that pretty much want you dead.


www.pcrm.org...

If it wasn't for these subsidies places like McDonalds couldn't even exist


[edit on 28-11-2009 by Rawhemp]


i totally agree, raw hemp.

and some more facts on that. in case of mac do and co. the cattle is feed in 2 or 3 world countries and waste the resources there (like with other 'products that we buy for cheap on our super/ markets.*). numbers: 80% percent of argentinan soil is used for anmial feed. and 80% kids starving there... but the burgers are dead cheap.
plus the emissions of the life stock... methan makes the ozon layer melt...

i don't give a toss abt what people eat, and i won't let anyone dictate my diet (which happens on and on and on, that i have to justify myself), but i expect people to realise the machine of the market and to take on the responsibility of how they act. and eat. there is plenty of information out there. films like 'we feed the world' (www.imdb.com...), 'earthlings' (www.imdb.com...) aso...

bon appetit!

best,
bertrand



* like beans from zimbabwe for 50p... and i doubt they were paid reasonably for them. beans do also grow in the uk.

 


Removed censor circumvention from quote

[edit on 28/11/09 by masqua]



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 11:45 AM
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reply to post by Doc Tesla
 


your sources are 1 murderer 1 13 year old kid with no MD 1 man who spends his time wondering whether jesus was a vegan 1 guy who worked at an ice cream parlor before writing books on how bad meat is. (i didnt see the connection either) 1 website that is as biased as you can get.

Thank you for posting this. This is awesome.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 12:23 PM
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reply to post by Rawhemp
 


Because your eating meat is not only killing yourself its taxing the # out of our environment, unless you happen to get it down the block from your friends organic farm like everyone on ATS claims .

Ok, like you really care about me killing myself by eating meat.... and taxing the out of our environment.... I care more about other issues in this world than the environment... like child rape, forced prostitution, killing for fun, etc. This seems like an issue that doesn't even come close. And I don't see why you would assume everyone on ATS saying they get meat from local organic farmers is lying. Wow.

I personally think people need to know there is a better way, so many people are totally brainwashed into thinking they need meat or animal products which is completely false.

I'm not brainwashed. I know I don't need meat. I like it. I don't eat it often,though. Some I get from a local farmer and some I get from what you might call an evil corporate grocery store. I am working on eating less meat, however, I don't think that eating meat is the cause of all the evil you speak of. It is the mass production of it, and what that brings about in the farming practices.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 01:36 PM
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reply to post by dzonatas
 


Maybe you didn't 'mean' to be, but you were.

Be honest with yourself.

I can't talk to people who can't be real, and have no desire to talk to people who have to support their ideas by crapping on mine.

good day.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 02:04 PM
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Originally posted by Lexxica


Ok, like you really care about me killing myself by eating meat.... and taxing the out of our environment.... I care more about other issues in this world than the environment... like child rape, forced prostitution, killing for fun, etc.


This is absolutely absurd, the environment is a million times more important then all those issues combined. Personally i would rather see forced prostitution then the whole human population going extinct, not that i condone that sort of thing.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 02:21 PM
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i tihnk we should have an ATS challenge!
veggieheads vs. fleshmongers
all the vegetarians can eat only fruits and veggies and all the vampires can eat only meat for the duration of the contest.
last team left alive wins!



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 02:24 PM
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reply to post by STFUPPERCUTTER
 


Nobody is arguing an all meat diet. This is a dishonest proposition.

It's about balance, and etxtremism.

I eat mostly non-meat meals. Eat meat about 3 times per week.

No use reducing my position to something it simply isn't.

Play fair.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 05:10 PM
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Originally posted by TrueTruth
reply to post by dzonatas
 

Maybe you didn't 'mean' to be, but you were.


I see you meant to avoid the question about meat, and you continue to ad hominem around it.



Be honest with yourself.


And you say, "No use reducing my position to something it simply isn't. Play fair."



I can't talk to people who can't be real, and have no desire to talk to people who have to support their ideas by crapping on mine.


Huh?

This how is about how eating animals makes us sick. I've already posted earlier how it effects the environment and effects vegetarians.

Have you ate unseasoned dry meat? Do you eat raw meat? These are the question I did intend to ask and did ask.

You thought vegetables communicator with you. I asked you a question about if you though water does. Only you took it in offense. Somehow you found reason to avoid vegetables because you felt they were alive when they communicated with you.

If you felt water communicates with you, would you not eat it?

If you felt animals communicate with you, would you not eat it?

Somehow you felt the communication thing was significant. Now you want to 'reduce people's position' of those that ask you about this significance. Go figure!

The entire planet is alive, to me. You think that is something to be taken in offense, however.



posted on Nov, 28 2009 @ 06:23 PM
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Originally posted by dzonatas

Originally posted by TrueTruth
reply to post by dzonatas
 

Maybe you didn't 'mean' to be, but you were.


I see you meant to avoid the question about meat, and you continue to ad hominem around it.



Be honest with yourself.


And you say, "No use reducing my position to something it simply isn't. Play fair."



I can't talk to people who can't be real, and have no desire to talk to people who have to support their ideas by crapping on mine.


Huh?

This how is about how eating animals makes us sick. I've already posted earlier how it effects the environment and effects vegetarians.

Have you ate unseasoned dry meat? Do you eat raw meat? These are the question I did intend to ask and did ask.

You thought vegetables communicator with you. I asked you a question about if you though water does. Only you took it in offense. Somehow you found reason to avoid vegetables because you felt they were alive when they communicated with you.

If you felt water communicates with you, would you not eat it?

If you felt animals communicate with you, would you not eat it?

Somehow you felt the communication thing was significant. Now you want to 'reduce people's position' of those that ask you about this significance. Go figure!

The entire planet is alive, to me. You think that is something to be taken in offense, however.


You didn't ask me a question. You just made judgemental statements.

What I mean by being honest with yourself, is about insulting people. Just be honest with yourself. You insulted me. Wo/man up, and own it.

"Have you ate unseasoned dry meat? Do you eat raw meat? These are the question I did intend to ask and did ask." - go back and read what you wrote. they aren't phrased as questions - they are stated as facts. You're not lookin for an answer, and you don't care what I think. You're just preaching. Questions are followed by question marks. Again - you should try being honest.

" Only you took it in offense. Somehow you found reason to avoid vegetables because you felt they were alive when they communicated with you." Again, this is not the truth. Please go back and quote where I said I don't eat vegetables. You won't be able to. Try reading what said instead of what you think I said.

"Somehow you felt the communication thing was significant. Now you want to 'reduce people's position' of those that ask you about this significance. Go figure!" This is becoming tiresome, pointing out your dishonesty. You asked what is known as a rhetorical question, designed as an insult. You're only fooling yourself.



When you're ready to be honest, and exercise respect, talk to me. Otherwise, please don't.



posted on Nov, 29 2009 @ 08:09 AM
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Originally posted by TrueTruth
When you're ready to be honest, and exercise respect, talk to me. Otherwise, please don't.


Sorry mods, I should have paid more attention to his name. I honestly thought I was in a serious discussion with someone, and now I see what I fed and should have known it would be unhealthy, as he obviously believes he is the only one right.



Originally posted by Rawhemp
Especially people on ATS who know the government is absolutely [snip], why would you eat something that is so heavily marketed and pushed on you by the vary people that pretty much want you dead.


www.pcrm.org...

If it wasn't for these subsidies places like McDonalds couldn't even exist


[edit on 28-11-2009 by Rawhemp]


From the pcrm article



“RESOLVED, That our American Medical Association support efforts (1) to reduce health disparities by basing food assistance programs on the health needs of their constituents, (2) to provide vegetables, fruits, legumes, grains, vegetarian foods, and healthful nondairy beverages in school lunches and food assistance programs, and (3) to ensure that federal subsidies encourage the consumption of products low in fat and cholesterol.”


After I read that last paragraph, I share your sentiments where you said "If it wasn't for these subsidies." Capitalism and food don't mix well!

People got to realize that vegetarians aren't upset because people eat meat. Vegetarians are upset because it takes governmental means like above to get healthy food into a capitalist driven market. Vegetarians are upset because they feel they are being starved when they have to run around to the more exotic places in town just to get decent food while you can find non-vegetarian food tossed out into the dumpsters behind every corner store (if they don't send dated food to 99cent stores first). When you find 99cent stores packed with meat and hardly any vegetarian food, you have to wonder just how much "encouragement" got through.

Is there an over abundance of meat on the shelves? It's one thing to kill to eat an animal, it's another to kill those animals and never eat them. Factory farms don't seem like that are being regulated in such a way that they have to be optimal about their process.


[edit on 29-11-2009 by dzonatas]



posted on Nov, 29 2009 @ 12:44 PM
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actaully, people eating meat does upset me.
but not everyone goes veggie for teh same reasons i guess, thats jsut aprt fo teh equation.



posted on Nov, 29 2009 @ 01:24 PM
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reply to post by dzonatas
 


you've got a lot of nerve.

you barge in, insult me, pretend like you didn't then do a drama danced for 'the mods'?

i seriously advise you to go reread your own posts, consult a basic grammar textbook, and look at the part that teaches you the difference between statements, and questions. I am honestly taken aback at how incredibly dishonest you are being.

i'm sticking you on ignore. you're in serious need of a time out. when you can calm down and say sorry, you can get up.

unbelievable.

[edit on 29-11-2009 by TrueTruth]

[edit on 29-11-2009 by TrueTruth]

[edit on 29-11-2009 by TrueTruth]



posted on Nov, 29 2009 @ 03:16 PM
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Forget about factory farms and intensive agriculture...these are the product of a self-destructive system which is unnatural to this Earth...the primary solution to these being, is to withdraw participation by Raising and Growing our own food!

Forget about dietary preference...these are lifestyle choices of each individual on their own path of development...arguement only serves to further entrench persons in their belief systems.
Anyways, in the future we will be able to verify scientifically and spiritually, the very best foods for humans and Earth.

My preference is mainly vegan-raw-wild; yet these are not 'me'.
This diet will pass with the body which consumes it...what remains is the Soul...mine and yours.
We are ONE...whether we like it or not...let us be responsible and teach by actions rather than discursive and divisive word.
If we do not sway the opinons of others on this site, let us shine the Light of our Life to those immediately around us and be living proof of our opinions.

Let us recognize the factory farms and intensive agriculture are not the source of meat eatting or vegetarianism - both diets existed long before industry.

Perhaps it will benefit those here to recognize more the abundance of plant life all around us which heals our body...everywhere are vital and medicinal plants.
Learn of your local plants and their properties and it matters litle what your diet is because you have made a huge leap in relationship to Earth.

This is a thread started on the subject of wild and free...

LOVE
www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Nov, 30 2009 @ 08:55 PM
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Originally posted by STFUPPERCUTTER
i tihnk we should have an ATS challenge!
veggieheads vs. fleshmongers
all the vegetarians can eat only fruits and veggies and all the vampires can eat only meat for the duration of the contest.
last team left alive wins!


If the point of this 5th grade post was to suggest that an all meat diet is harmful, then you might need to have a look at pre-westernized eskimos. The Inuit are a group of individuals that had almost no incidence of cancer, diabetes or heart disease......and they consume/consumed a diet consisting almost entirely of meat.

This observation can not simply be ignored.



posted on Nov, 30 2009 @ 09:37 PM
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reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd
 


Good observation friend.
This fact must be given consideration.
And in light of the additional fact that there thousands living on the polar opposite side of the spectrum with a raw food diet with proven effects of erasing physical ailments and increasing vitality...suggests to me that perhaps there is another aspect missing from this discussion.
My initial presumption would be that of spirituality, or deep connection to the source of their food.
Is interesting you posted this because saw earlier today another post with an interview of a shaman Inuit on ats.
He explicitly stated at the end their profound connection with their food, and similarly the raw food collective each profess the same interconnection.
We must wonder about the real relationship with food substances.
Perhaps prayer and thanksgiving is more deep than religions understand...and apparently scientists for that matter.

Regardless let us understand one another...because not one of us here, or even on this planet now, with our 2009-year-to-date knowledge base of experience has definative scientific or spiritual validation for the corret path.
We obviously know that any lifestyle which is destructive to the Earth is so to ourselves...and its evident that one persons dietary choices may lead to their health, while complicate anothers - this is the area where our knowledge will increase in time to a real understanding of why the Inuits, and raw fooders, both show signs of health and vitality.


LOVE



posted on Nov, 30 2009 @ 10:17 PM
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Originally posted by bertand cantat
i became vegetarian at the age of 12, and i am vegan since 7 years.
my blood levels are better than of fellow human beings with a non vegan diet.


Unfortunately, your individual anecdotes are irrelevant in a debate such as this. Firstly, we have to take your word and hope you're not stretching the truth. Secondly, we have to assume that you've taken ALL factors into account. Thirdly, even if you aren't lying and you've considered all other factors, you still may have underlying conditions affecting your blood levels.


it's a cock and bull story, that humans need meat, or are meant to eat meat, since teeth and intestins are not appropriate for a carnivore diet.


Well, humans aren't carnivorous. We're omnivorous. Our ancestors? Were hunter-gatherers. That is the concensus among paleontologists and anthropologists. And do you think we were gathering nuts and seeds and hunting leaves and berries?


it is rather that the adverse effects of such a diet cause are so called 'life style' diseases...


This is garbage. I understand that the views opposing yours in this thread challenge that which is held by you as firmly as any religious belief but this is not an excuse to ignore the facts. Cancer is the only 'lifestyle' disease that is linked to meat consumption, and it's a weak link at that.

To quote Gary Taubes, Good Calories, Bad Calories:


The urge to simplify a complex scientific situation so that physicians can apply it and their patients and the public embrace it has taken precedence over the scientific obligation of presenting the evidence with relentless honesty. The result is an enormous enterprise dedicated in theory to determining the relationship between diet and disease while dedicated in practice to convincing everyone involved, and the lay public, most of all, that answers are already known and always have been--an enterprise, in other words, that purports to be a science and yet functions like a religion.


So when 'researching' you should be careful as not to confuse science with assumptive based literature.

-Dev



posted on Nov, 30 2009 @ 10:49 PM
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This is what is going to happen to fix all this, okay.

First, inflation and the devaluation of the dollar and unemployment is going to become so bad that everyone will become too poor to afford much meat to eat, if any. Trust me, that day will soon be upon us all, I promise. There are just too many people to feed to waste so much farm land and water to raise cows and pigs and chickens for food. Overpopulation and lean economic times will drastically reduce your meat consumption, wait you'll see. A few years from now that cheeseburger will be costing you around $20-$25. You might be able to eat cheaper if you don't mind recycled meat.

Secondly, these disgusting meat farms are without a doubt the breeding ground for these annual influenza attacks and other diseases ever since man began keeping animals for food. You would be sick too if you lived in such conditions! And, these viruses are mutating and becoming more dangerous each year because of these annual flu shots that attempt to combat these viruses, but which only make these viruses more deadlier year after year as they become resistant to last years vaccine instead. Eventually you will end up with a virus that you will not be able to stop because the cure will be so strong it will kill you too and then you will have another major plague on your hands. There will come a day when, to stop this plague by other means, you will have to STOP raising animals in close-quarter feces-filled meat-factory prisons just to have your cheap meat.

These two things will bring an end to this barbaric dietary habit which is literally killing people with countless diseases. And it will happen pretty soon. If you love the taste of flame broiled flesh and blood, well, I'm sorry to tell you that your meat eating days are numbered, so enjoy it while you can. Wait, you'll see, it will all become true pretty soon.


[edit on 30-11-2009 by Divinorumus]



posted on Nov, 30 2009 @ 11:14 PM
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Originally posted by dzonatas


Wikipedia is only a reference, not a source.


Good lord.
Let's just argue trivial matters, shall we?

This is the exact response I get from everyone else in this thread when I author an informative post. Instead of reubuttals, I get personal attacks, trivial arguments and off-topic baiting. What's even worse......a simple, "That's just not true." --type of statement without providing any real reason or evidence suggesting anything otherwise. A basic, "your wrong and I'm right."

This place is for intelligent discussion and debate....but, much like the religion and politics forums, this thread has become a litany of thoughtless, biased posts that lack any real substance and provide nothing to the conversation.

You didn't answer my question.

In case you missed it, I'll make it clear...


Just what book did you find this "design"?


I said I've read it before. From which books I can't recall.


And, by who's authority?


It's called veterinary physiology and biochemistry. There is no controversy.


Was this design authorized before cattle became into existence?


If they were 'designed' then I'm sure. If they've evolved then surely not. Of course, there is no way of knowing for sure.


More and more people seem to treat science theories as solid proof.


And more and more people completely disregard this thing called the scientific method. Determining the anatomy and physiology of an animal is nothing but a compilation of observations. It's not a theory, it's an observable, physiological fact.


You basically stated that cattle were designed, so I wanted to see any of such proof they were design.


Once again, more trivial, off-topic arguing. It was quite clear that my use of the word design was simply a figure of speech and in no way was placed to cconnotate the presence of a designer. Focusing on the topic, however, it's completely irrelevent.


In other words, you have faith that cattle were "designed" to eat, yet you have no scientific proof that they were "designed."


Now you're putting words in my digital mouth. The process in which cows came to be is irrelevant.


I have faith that humans that eat meat also condone themselves to be eaten.


And there is no room for faith in this scientific discussion, at all. Faith is part of the problem with the way researchers make their conclusions now days. It has no place in science.


Somehow you think you can't eat vegetables directly from the Earth, so you eat vegetarian cows. Hmmm. If cows are what they eat, and you claim you need meat from cows, then really you could just skip the cows and go straight to vegetables.


I'm sorry, I must have missed the post where I stated that I can't eat vegetables. In fact, I have yet to post any information on the specifics of my diet......because it's irrelevant.

I never said I or anyone needs meat from cows. I also never said meat is needed. But, even if meat is essential for human survival--and the jury is still out on that--cows are not the only source of it.

-Dev



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