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posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:27 PM
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I think this thread has many layers of subterfuge.

The highly esteemed members you speak of and their 'new site' was created not out of malice but suspicion that there are hidden agendas here on ATS.

I personally feel you have shot yourself in the foot by blowing off the 'crème de la crème' from the coffee cup of thread creators.

They were not in collusion with one another, but sought to bring truth to the ATS hive and yet the ex-members in question were falsely accused of nefarious intent.

Perhaps you could enlighten us as to your side of the story, so we can all understand the reason for banning some highly respected members in quick succession over a few days.

p.s. i always suspected you read u2u; kinda defeats the object if you can read them at will.




posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:27 PM
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Everyone who ever runned a website or a forum knows that it is hard work and it takes a lot of dedication to keep it running. Next you have your moderators who put in the time and effort and mostly do this on a volunteer basis. Do you ppl have any idea how many u2u's the mods get in one day? Or how much time they spend keeping thing in order around here? I think that deserves a little bit of respect and understanding.
Especially for sites as big as ATS, you simply need rules and keep to those or things turn into a chaos overnight.
Honestly, it isn't that hard to make a post or a statement within the set rules ppl...

as for the advertisement, well, if you owned a store and someone came in and put up an add for another store, then I'm sure you wouldn't like it. It's basically the same for links to other websites, especially when it deals with the same topics and steals your traffic. It surprises me that ATS even allows some links, because well, links steal traffic and traffic is what you need to keep growing and getting better.

last point, the privacy of U2U.
On the Inernet, nothing is private, not even your e-mails because every provider can access those. A lot of admins from some of the free forums out there even have access to your login and pasword.
If there are things you don't want others to know about, then don't msg them. It's as simple as that.

Personally I never had a problem with any staff of this site and everytime I u2u them with a question or a remark I received a polite and respectfull answer. I think at least they deserve the same in return.

my two cents to the thread

btw, can we have a star system in BTS aswell pls?



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:27 PM
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Originally posted by Hazelnut
I would still like clarification though on whether or not U2U's are private.

When you open the U2U panel, this is visible below... and has been for several years...


Please Note: Your U2U communications are subject to review in the event we receive reports of private communications outside the boundaries of the site Terms & Conditions. Abusive private messages may result in immediate account termination.



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by Hazelnut
reply to post by tothetenthpower
 


I would still like clarification though on whether or not U2U's are private. If not, it is deceptive to allow me to think they are. Which I did assume. Was I wrong?


U2U are totally private, until a complaint is made that U2U services are being abused. The staff can then access the U2U system to retrieve the U2U deemed offensive. Period.
On our part, as members, we cannot receive a U2U from someone and then post it in the boards without specific permission.
On our part as members, we are not allowed, by T&C, to use U2Us to solicit anything, from our own websites and competing websites.

Hope I've helped.
Cuhail



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:28 PM
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reply to post by Hazelnut
 



They are not openly monitored, but they are saved in a database which can be used in the event that any abuse of the system is taking place, such as the solicitation that occured over the past few weeks.

But they don't actively look at them.

~Keeper



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by Cuhail
reply to post by A Fortiori
 


I stand by my words, man. I'm not a fan of cutting people down. I am blunt and speak what I mean.
I'm not paid to be here.
I DO have ATS' best interests in mind.
I apologize I'm not up to your standards.


Here we go...

This is not what I mean. You do not have to be up to my standards. I didn't accuse you of being paid to be here. I was stating an absolute economic fact. Demand creates supply. People will demand a service if they feel they are treated fairly, if it is exciting, etc. Without a demand suppliers go out of business. The invisible hand of the marketplace reigns supreme. If you have ATS best interests in mind then rise to the occasion and the level of accolades you have been granted and choose not to label and generalize.



But, the point of my post is that SO stated his (clearly written) position on the original topic (No advertising without permission) and people (you???) replied to things pertaining to themselves, not the OT.


No, not myself. I have not "left" ATS. I have not solicited for other sites. I stated that there are reasons aside from outright solicitation that is causing a minor exodus. Minor in that you still have thousands of people on this site, but it is still good business, and this is a business, to ask yourself how to keep and retain customers.


Me? I say "Okay Skep, okay Springer, I understand your position and as long as I want to stay a member of ATS, your site, I will abide by these rules, should they come up."

What's left to say?


Others are saying that, as well. I am abiding the terms and conditions to the fullest. I have a lot of respect for SO's statement about online ecosystems and I was stating my opinion that the ecosystem has had some damage done and explaining the reasons some people have left. Again, this isn't "us" and "them". It is about US.



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:29 PM
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Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
I personally feel you have shot yourself in the foot by blowing off the 'crème de la crème' from the coffee cup of thread creators.


The gun was in their hands, and the foot was their own.

As has been repeatedly expressed, had those who were involved simply come to us first, expressed their intent, the outcome would now be very different.

This thread seeks to eliminate that scenario from happening again in the future.



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:31 PM
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Originally posted by Cuhail
U2U are totally private, until a complaint is made that U2U services are being abused. The staff can then access the U2U system to retrieve the U2U deemed offensive. Period.


Not quite right man. Only S.O. has that ability.



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:32 PM
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Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by Springer
It's very easy to gather IP information on our membership by having them join a new site and identify themselves with their ATS user name.



I use my user name and variance of it on numerous sites.
Does this mean I'm in some sort of violation?


[edit on 27-10-2009 by SLAYER69]





It's very easy to gather IP information on our membership by having them join a new site and identify themselves with their ATS user name.


HUH? It that kosher?



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:36 PM
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reply to post by tothetenthpower
 


Thank you for treating me with respect. I am very appreciative of that. Thank you all for helping to understand and clarify where I may have overlooked important information regarding my participation on this board.

I appreciate the effort to clarify issues that rise. My interest, as stated earlier, is exposing lies. Alas, my human nature has flaws and I don't always see the small print (so to speak) when I should...its an epidemic I'm not immune to.

I don't see this thread as anything except a response to the recent banning of the most prolific contributors and their successful new venture elsewhere, of which I am proud to be a member. No one recruited me for this site or any other and I don't recruit. I searched for them and happily found them. I'm still a member here because I've made some friends here. Hope that's ok and if not, so what?



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:40 PM
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Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
***
The highly esteemed members you speak of and their 'new site' was created not out of malice but suspicion that there are hidden agendas here on ATS.

I personally feel you have shot yourself in the foot by blowing off the 'crème de la crème' from the coffee cup of thread creators.
***


Sorry, I can't help but laugh at this. They are (yes I know who they are) going around callingthemselves "the best posters on ats"... No-one else ever called them that. If they were really the best of the best of the best (sir!) then their new site will do just fine on its own - without having to spam ATS. (And yes we've all seen the spam, and we all hate the disgusting tactic of their spam in our threads.) Good luck to them.

Surely you can't blame SO for enforcing the t&cs?



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:44 PM
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reply to post by A Fortiori
 



No, not myself.


I didn't point at anyone in-particular out of politeness. For the record, I never inferred YOU in my first post in this thread. Please don't take my words personally.


I stated that there are reasons aside from outright solicitation that is causing a minor exodus.


I agree. I think it would be posting substance that hits us so hard. You make a good post, sir, and so you are an example of the more disciplined members. (Is that a generalization of the opposite kind of member?)

I've been around for a while. Always kept my good standing...good. When I post, I try and take the topic forward. I don't post as often as you'd think because I've found it's usually better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open my mouth and remove all doubt.
I only post when I actually care.
I care about this topic.

Cuhail



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:45 PM
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reply to post by Gaspode
 


Then why make this thread in the first place? If it is assumed we all know the T&C, what's the need for this post? Humor me.



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:46 PM
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I have a question and I don't think it has been addressed.

In a recent discussion, I posted a link to a website which had interesting information on it. The site wasn't selling anything and I am not affiliated with it in any way. I was not attempting to "steal membership" or drive traffic to another location. The site doesn't even have a forum. I simply felt that this information is truly important and I had found the link from another thread on ATS.

A moderator closed the thread and the reason (as far as I can tell) was that it was due to advertising a known hoax site. My link had nothing to do with that site and the other two links posted by another member didn't either, but the moderator was apparently fed up with the discussion of the topic or something. There was no real reason given.

My question is: How do you determine that someone is "advertising" their own website versus providing information regarding the topic being discussed?



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:46 PM
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reply to post by Gaspode
 


Why would anyone criticize the SO for enforcing terms and conditions? We all said "I agree". Enough said on that. As for others stating that "the best posters" were lost is a statement of their opinion that you disagree with.

As I read the follow up posts I believe we are disintegrating, once more, into the "us"/"them" I spoke of earlier. Teams and cliques should have evaporated post high school graduation.

Why is it that we cannot assume the best of someone's intentions and speak from there? If we did that we would accomplish a lot more than this "defense mode" style of posting that is once more infecting a thread.

Skeptic Overlord restated terms and conditions, perhaps, it was my fault for using this thread as an opportunity to address other reasons people have joined the alluded to web forum. For my part in the escalation, I apologize.



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:49 PM
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Originally posted by A Fortiori
Skeptic Overlord restated terms and conditions...


It's more than a restatement of our Terms & Conditions in the matter.

I wanted it to be clear that if any member has a desire to branch out and start their own online efforts, perhaps inspired by what happens on ATS, they should feel that we will be receptive to requests to help promote the new efforts.

Be up-front.

Don't be sneaky.

Simple.



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:51 PM
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Originally posted by Hazelnut
reply to post by Gaspode
 


Then why make this thread in the first place? If it is assumed we all know the T&C, what's the need for this post? Humor me.


People got banned, so obviously a reminder was in order? Some people need to be reminded more than others. We're not all the esteemed elitist top posters of ATS after all.



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:52 PM
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reply to post by SkepticOverlord
 


What if the prodigal sons returned and asked for your assistance?



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:52 PM
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Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Originally posted by tristar
That is not a problem, all passwords can bee seen and accessed by site owners, nothing is hidden from the back end of a site

Except that we (ATS) can't see your passwords. Your ATS password is encrypted in our database... so it's not possible for me or us to see what it is. However, many board have the option to leave passwords as plain text, and would be visible by unscrupulous admins.


I was referring to encrypted passwords.

Anything that is in digital format is open to those who posses the knowledge, trust me on this one. Obviously i am not stating you do or do not have access i am merely stating the truth regarding encrypted passwords and the access to back end systems which site owners are able to achieve. In any case, i have no issues nor should anyone else have any issues regarding this. I feel comfortable in here as my passwords has as much relevant to real life as the gsp coordinates of the last missile fired from the Atlantic ocean just last week. Ooops i bet i gave some people a hunch..so off we go to google search.



posted on Oct, 27 2009 @ 02:53 PM
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Originally posted by A Fortiori
What if the prodigal sons returned and asked for your assistance?

Until/if that happens, it's impossible to speculate.




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