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Yet another nail in the coffin of atheism

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posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 01:59 AM
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reply to post by antithesis.
 


You'd probably understand it better, if you would have a look at the OP's link to the ATS post that inspired his own post. The title of that was "Another Nail in the Coffin of Christianity".

The OP had a good point. Too often, someone tries to "prove" a point, using some vague news item and poor reasoning. The poster for the "Coffin of Christianity" post was trying to claim that because one alleged Christian preacher used fraud, somehow this reflected on all of Christianity. This was not borne out by the evidence he offered.

So the OP in this present thread, in a sort of ironic response, posted a news item showing that some Christians were doing good works. The point of his post wasn't to prove that Atheism is false, or that somehow Christians trying to help people are going to kill Atheism. He was just using similar logic - or lack thereof - to make an equally lame counterpoint.

I don't perceive the OP of this thread to be a troll, even though is post was likely to start a bit of a flame with some who didn't read carefully.




posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 02:39 AM
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OP - while I understand you are not particularly making an argument - however I have a couple of comments.

I don't think people need god as an excuse to be good to each other.

If there were no religions - there would still be charitable groups who help people when they need it - its not supernatural - it is the conscience and empathy that we all share, we all know what suffering looks like - and we all feel a desire to help. (Unless we don't particularly associate ourselves with humans).

The absence of belief is not the opposite of belief (that would be disbelief) - it isn't even in the same dimensions - it is something else entirely.

The arguments from atheists are however often based on disbelief, rather than lack of belief - which is fairly short sighted. Agnosticism is of course my position - but I understand others need for certainty - though I disagree with it in principle, feeling that humans are too limited to ever know any truth.

The detractors of religion should focus, I think, on the behaviors of religious persons and institutions, not on the existence or non-existence of god, the former has a great and varied body of evidence - the latter only pure speculation.

While ignorance and intolerance blast out of them (religious persons and institutions) like gamma radiation, should moral people simply accept their list of 'good deeds' as justification for their existence?

Does the 'blessing' of hope extinguish the value of rational thought?

Does the faith feed the hungry? Or prayer heal the sick?

While it is possibly unfair to deny people their personal optimistic fantasies - while ignorance and intolerance are elevated as virtues, then there is a need to illuminate the adverse effects of those positions on society - especially on the minds of children.

Without practical action within the realm of our understanding - then all is simply wishful thinking.

Wishful thinking is precisely as effective as no thinking at all.



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 07:25 AM
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Some good questions there man; I do feel the compulsion to answer a couple of those questions.

1. While it is possibly unfair to deny people their personal optimistic fantasies - while ignorance and intolerance are elevated as virtues, then there is a need to illuminate the adverse effects of those positions on society - especially on the minds of children.

There are just as many idiots in religion as anyone else, sadly there are many many religious people to bring out the idiocy. That doesn't mean religion is bad though. Think of religion as a tool, you wouldn't call the hammer bad if it was used to kill somebody.

1. Does the 'blessing' of hope extinguish the value of rational thought?

2. Or prayer heal the sick?

1. No, of course not. Einstien said, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

They are brothers after all.

2. Yes, I've seen it happen. Power of suggestion or not, I've seen it happen.



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