Ex-CIA Chief James Woolsey handed down gag-order to 9/11 Firefighters! , page 3

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reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 11:56 AM by Primordial

I can't comment on the validity of the OP but I will say this. I have heard fire dept. and port authority recordings from 9-11 and the fire dept. was not expecting a collapse.

They reported 'pockets' of fire that they believed they could easily put out, not the raging infernos we are told melted the buildings. They reported secondary explosions in the buildings, not afterword, but during their ascent up the building. (By reported, I mean said it over the radios during their operations)

During the live news coverage of the event, the reporters themselves told of hearing and being told of explosions.

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 12:38 PM by thedman

I can't comment on the validity of the OP but I will say this. I have heard fire dept. and port authority recordings from 9-11 and the fire dept. was not expecting a collapse.

About 1/2 hour before first (South) tower collapse one of the incident commanders was growing concerned about building stability

Ordered men out of North Tower, but do to radio problems many did not
hear him

FDNY Assistant Chief Joseph Callan: "Approximately 40 minutes after I arrived in the lobby, I made a decision that the building was no longer safe. And that was based on the conditions in the lobby, large pieces of plaster falling, all the 20 foot high glass panels on the exterior of the lobby were breaking. There was obvious movement of the building, and that was the reason on the handy talky I gave the order for all Fire Department units to leave the north tower."

Callan: "For me to make the decision to take our firefighters out of the building with civilians still in it, that was very tough for me, but I did that because I did not think the building was safe any longer, and that was just prior to 9:30."

The "two pockets of fire' is often cited by conspiracy types

This was radioed by Battalion chief Orio Palmer from 78th floor skylobby
in south tower

Most of the fire in south Tower was on floors 81-84, nobody made it that
far to report on conditions.

78 floor was sky lobby where people changed elevators - not a lot of
combustibiles as floor was marble lined walls and tile floors surrounded
by elevator machinery

Palmer was giving report on what he saw as made way up - again nobody
made it any farther before building came down

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 12:41 PM by OverSword

reply to post by PplVSNWO

I dissagree with your perception of that chinese video. To me it looks like they blew up the interior of the bottom and center of the building causing the top to fall into it, exactly what logic says you would do if you wanted a tall building to fall straight down into it's own foot print. Compare it to the trade centers collapse. Very different in the extreme.

Try and find even one video of a controlled demolition that collapses level by level like the Twin Towers did. I couldn't and I've looked for years.

[edit on 21-10-2009 by OverSword]

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 12:43 PM by nunya13

reply to post by praxis

Don't forget the matter of all three building that fell were the only ones of all the WTC buildings insured by the same guy who's on "record" as saying "pull it".

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 12:45 PM by nunya13

Originally posted by thedman

About 1/2 hour before first (South) tower collapse one of the incident commanders was growing concerned about building stability

Isn't it possible he was concerned about building safety due to the fact that bombs/explosions were going off?

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 12:47 PM by On the level

Before I add my opinion I have to say I am not one for believing the official story and have looked at a lot of the evidence on this site and made up my mind watching it that day, this convinced me 9/11 was an inside job, HOWEVER I really doubt that a lot of the police and firefighters are afraid to come forward and know about the bombs for a couple of reasons:

1. Surely any of the fireman or police that where dying from the material they where exposed to that day would have come out, what do they have to fear?

2. You cant tell me they would all be happy to go about their jobs knowing this someone would have made a stand.

I am sorry but I find this hard to swallow

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 01:15 PM by MaxBlack

I am amazed if not perplexed that so many so called media and governmental experts, professional corporate leaders, CIA, FBI, military experts from all walks of society are so intelligent and yet so leaderly that they can not see on their own or even question on their own the suspicious questions of the events of 911. This fact alone raises many questions.

If our elected officials and media heads are too stupid or too ignorant to think for themselves about the many anomalies of that eventful day, then I say they are too stupid to do anything meaningful in regards to bringing the real culprits to justice because in order to have real justice, one has to go into the rabbit hole and it appears that too many politicians and so called leaders are too scared to go there.

This failure to question or investigate by the media and government officials and the blatant failure of our judicial system says volumes of what is wrong in America.

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 01:20 PM by jprophet420

Originally posted by susp3kt
My worry is this:

If all of this is true and it was indeed a controlled demolition, surely they knew that they couldn't contain the truth about it forever. What event could be coming down the pipe to cover their tracks?

It would have to be a big enough catastrophe/event by comparison to make people totally forget the fact that this was staged. It would also have to be planned to occur within a short time span relative to September 11, 2001 to prevent private investigations from uncovering the truth. Because we all know they have not, and never will as long as this regime is still in power, conduct a proper internal investigation.

Just a thought.

If all of this is true it doesn't mean it was controlled demolition, it means that there were bombs in the building and the government is covering it up. That also happened in 1993.

They know for a fact they can contain the information forever. You can research Pearl Harbor right now and see for yourself that it was an inside job, but nobody cares. I learned the truth about that false flag MIHOP in 1998 from a Ph.D in military history. I researched again a few years ago and got into a debate with one of my good friends about it. After he researched it himself he came to the conclusion that "They did everything but actually carry out the attack". And he didn't care nor lose any sleep.

If its not in their backyard people just don't care.

[edit on 21-10-2009 by jprophet420]

[edit on 21-10-2009 by jprophet420]

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 02:06 PM by Nutter

Originally posted by susp3kt
If all of this is true and it was indeed a controlled demolition, surely they knew that they couldn't contain the truth about it forever. What event could be coming down the pipe to cover their tracks?

Or they could just place a gag order for 10-15 years and wait it out until all the first responders are dead from the poisons they breathed in those days and months.

Seems to be a really good motive for telling everyone the air was ok IMO.

[edit on 21-10-2009 by Nutter]

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 02:27 PM by Roid_Rage27

reply to post by jprophet420

The most brilliant post in this thread so far...perhaps even the entire forums.

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 02:43 PM by GenRadek

Originally posted by jprophet420

Originally posted by susp3kt
My worry is this:

If all of this is true and it was indeed a controlled demolition, surely they knew that they couldn't contain the truth about it forever. What event could be coming down the pipe to cover their tracks?

It would have to be a big enough catastrophe/event by comparison to make people totally forget the fact that this was staged. It would also have to be planned to occur within a short time span relative to September 11, 2001 to prevent private investigations from uncovering the truth. Because we all know they have not, and never will as long as this regime is still in power, conduct a proper internal investigation.

Just a thought.

If all of this is true it doesn't mean it was controlled demolition, it means that there were bombs in the building and the government is covering it up. That also happened in 1993.

They know for a fact they can contain the information forever. You can research Pearl Harbor right now and see for yourself that it was an inside job, but nobody cares. I learned the truth about that false flag MIHOP in 1998 from a Ph.D in military history. I researched again a few years ago and got into a debate with one of my good friends about it. After he researched it himself he came to the conclusion that "They did everything but actually carry out the attack". And he didn't care nor lose any sleep.

If its not in their backyard people just don't care.

[edit on 21-10-2009 by jprophet420]

[edit on 21-10-2009 by jprophet420]

Pearl Harbor? Inside job? sorry, noway Jose. What history books you took that garbage from? All that is proof of revisionists trying to rewrite history. I dont know how or what kind of "research" you did on it or who wrote it, but to use this blatant LIE as a jump off point to suggest that 9/11 could also be an inside job is wrong and dishonest.

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 03:02 PM by jprophet420

reply to post by GenRadek

How dare you accuse me of being dishonest, especially without researching it yourself. I am college educated and I learned the information from a Ph.D and researched it again.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

go debunk it if its incorrect, or post any information to the contrary.

and for the record you just completely reinforced my point.

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 03:30 PM by GenRadek

reply to post by jprophet420

I too am college educated, and WWII history has been a very large passion of mine since I was a little tyke.

about the only comparison i can find with 9/11 is just the illogical way of reasoning of those who think 9/11 was inside job as was Pearl harbor.

Hmm, provoke to get attacked by Japan, and then go attack Germany first and leave Japan on the backburner till Germany's defeat?
Sounds like the backward thinking for "9/11 inside jobbies": Orchestrate a fake attack by terrorists, who are then claimed to be the majority Saudi Arabians, then use that pretense to go and invade Afghanistan and Iraq, while no Iraqis or Afghans were involved?

Sorry, but that is just too illogical to take seriously. But hey, a PhD wrote it so it must be true right? Just like how a PhD wrote how he discovered cold fusion. Or a "PhD" claims he discovered thermite in WTC dust?

here is some better insite into the events:
www.straightdope.com...

[edit on 10/21/2009 by GenRadek]

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 03:31 PM by GovtFlu

Originally posted by impressme
reply to post by susp3kt

Because we all know they have not, and never will as long as this regime is still in power, conduct a proper internal investigation.

I agree but, who can be trusted to do an internal investigation to many people in our government are corrupt.

IMO A small team of mostly retired LAPD / LASD homicide detectives, DA's and DA investigators supported by like on-duty local sworn personnel with full subpoena power should investigate 9/11 as if it was just another murder case. With no federal police interference, or as the FBI (Famous But Incompetent) calls it: "assistance", of any kind.

Competent seasoned murder police with nothing to gain, no static from the feds, and no career to lose would have already have hooked & booked actual suspects, regardless of status, a long time ago.

I think a team of disinterested professionals with proven investigative track records would come to a much different conclusion than a commission of amateur clown DC lackeys and hacks.

With no statute if limitations on murder, I don't see why 9/11 victims families are not constantly submitting new evidence to NYPD homicide detectives.. if NYPD fails to follow it up, file complaints for dereliction of duty and sue the dept/city for rights violations.

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 04:09 PM by jprophet420

reply to post by GenRadek

You can research it or not. I am sure you will not as your mind is made up. You didn't even refute a single point I made. Its your word against my research.

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 06:11 PM by impressme

reply to post by thedman

FDNY Assistant Chief Joseph Callan: "Approximately 40 minutes after I arrived in the lobby, I made a decision that the building was no longer safe. And that was based on the conditions in the lobby, large pieces of plaster falling, all the 20 foot high glass panels on the exterior of the lobby were breaking. There was obvious movement of the building, and that was the reason on the handy talky I gave the order for all Fire Department units to leave the north tower."

Yeah, with all of the explosions going off in the building and the lobby blasted to pieces.
How would the building move while still standing?

Do you want to explain? What is FDNY Assistant Chief Joseph Callan leaving out?
How about explosions.

Callan: "For me to make the decision to take our firefighters out of the building with civilians still in it, that was very tough for me, but I did that because I did not think the building was safe any longer, and that was just prior to 9:30."

Wow, Joseph Callan must have an engineer degree. Humm, I guess all the explosions that were going off in the basement must have alert Joseph Callan to evacuate the building. I get the feeling that his story has been edited to fit the OS because, something major is missing for Joseph Callan to think the WTC were going to collapse.

The "two pockets of fire' is often cited by conspiracy types

That is your opinion.

Most of the fire in south Tower was on floors 81-84, nobody made it that
far to report on conditions

Palmer was giving report on what he saw as made way up - again nobody
made it any farther before building came down .

Do you have a source for this information? In fact, do you have any sources for any of your information?

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 06:19 PM by impressme

reply to post by GovtFlu

With no statute if limitations on murder, I don't see why 9/11 victims families are not constantly submitting new evidence to NYPD homicide detectives.. if NYPD fails to follow it up, file complaints for dereliction of duty and sue the dept/city for rights violations.

I love your idea

why hasn’t anyone else come up with this before I think you are on to something good here, great post.

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 06:38 PM by impressme

reply to post by jprophet420

They know for a fact they can contain the information forever. You can research Pearl Harbor right now and see for yourself that it was an inside job, but nobody cares. I learned the truth about that false flag MIHOP in 1998 from a Ph.D in military history. I researched again a few years ago and got into a debate with one of my good friends about it. After he researched it himself he came to the conclusion that "They did everything but actually carry out the attack". And he didn't care nor lose any sleep.

You are correct,

Pearl Harbor was orchestrated by the powers that be, to be allowed to happen just so the United States could have their war and that is what the evidences supports for anyone who has done some research into Pearl Harbor. It is a well known fact that the President was telegraphed for two week that our military scouter pilots spotted the Japanese fleet a few hundred miles from Pearl Harbor. For two weeks telegrams where being sent back and forth from Washington to Pearl Harbor, in fact Generals at Pearl Harbor kept asking the President should our miliatary be making preparation to defend Pearl Harbor from an attack. the Presidents orders was to stand down and do nothing. This information came out under the FOIA years later.

[edit on 21-10-2009 by impressme]

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 06:55 PM by scott3x

reply to post by jprophet420

Originally posted by jprophet420
You can research Pearl Harbor right now and see for yourself that it was an inside job, but nobody cares...

If its not in their backyard people just don't care.

Some people care. I believe that at some point in time, the mainstream history books will reflect what truly happened at Pearl Harbor, as well as what happened on 9/11. Atleast Oliver Stone got out "JFK" :-).

reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 06:59 PM by impressme

reply to post by GenRadek

Pearl Harbor advance-knowledge debate

Several writers, including journalist Robert Stinnett[1] and former United States Navy Rear Admiral Robert A. Theobald[2], have argued that various parties high in the U.S. and British governments knew of the attack in advance and may even have let it happen or encouraged it in order to force America into war via the "back door."[3] Evidence supporting this view is taken from quotations and source documents from the time[4] and the release of newer materials.
Examination of information released since the War has revealed there was considerable intelligence information available to U.S. and other nations' officials. Rather than attribute the lack of preparedness at the base to failure-to-process, it has been argued that the U.S. must have had some degree of advanced knowledge of the attack

en.wikipedia.org...

PEARL HARBOR
MOTHER OF ALL CONSPIRACIES
President Roosevelt (FDR) provoked the attack, knew about it in advance and covered up his failure to warn the Hawaiian commanders. FDR needed the attack to sucker Hitler to declare war, since the public and Congress were overwhelmingly against entering the war in Europe. It was his backdoor to war.
FDR blinded the commanders at Pearl Harbor and set them up by -
1. denying intelligence to Hawaii (HI)
2. on Nov 27, misleading the commanders into thinking negotiations with Japan were continuing to prevent them from realizing the war was on
having false information sent to HI about the location of the Japanese carrier fleet.

3.
whatreallyhappened.com...

I too am college educated, and WWII history has been a very large passion of mine since I was a little tyke.

about the only comparison i can find with 9/11 is just the illogical way of reasoning of those who think 9/11 was inside job as was Pearl harbor.

LOL I don’t have a degree but I have GOOGLE! I would sue the school if I where you because, they taught you the wrong information looks like your history professor has his own agenda don’t you think because, they have terribly misinformed you.

[edit on 21-10-2009 by impressme]

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