Originally posted by Jakes51
Cool videos Slayer! That video with the Marines cornered in their compound was quite intense and scary. Not knowing where the enemy is must be hell. I saw them shooting that howitzer at that ridge, and it looked like they were firing at nothing. Then the Helicopter strikes as well, but the battle persisted. Those Marines looked deaf, dumb, and blind out there. Those mountains are truly the Taliban's playground, and if the US doesn't stop movement up there, they are sitting ducks in those valleys. It's easier said than done, because most of the Taliban are locals, and have grown up in those mountains, and know the terrain like the back of their hands.

Never let they enemy get a forward operating position on elevated ground. Isn't that one of the primary tenets of warfare? Why would planners have an operating base in such a vulnerable location in the first place? That war is making less and less sense everyday. It's beginning to look like an old re-run of the Afghan and Soviet War from the eighties. Just different actors and uniforms this time. Thanks for the insight and the combat videos. Hopefully, more will see the perilous predicament the US and Nato are slowly walking into.



[edit on 17-10-2009 by Jakes51]

The reason they don't have large bases on the high ground in the mountains is real simple. One, the impossibility of putting a heavy howitzer or alot of equipment in the area. And two the ability to defend an encampment without being overrun or getting sections of the base taken. You can't possibly defend or maintain a complete perimeter on a large force of men on a mountainous peak, parts of the base would be at points isolated. They would be strung out along the range and wouldn't have the effect of concentrated rifle fire. Then you have to think about digging into the mountain top if possible. Just because your on ground doesn't mean the ground under you isn't more boulders and large rocks. You would have a hard scrabble, stretched out command that would be open to attack and their positions known for assault and infiltration.

when you lack the ability to fight, just call in air support hahahaha. those vids are nice. but what i saw in the movies were different, they were heroic like rambo lmao.

Excellent thread. People used to say that war would never be the same after the media began televising the Vietnam war. They said the public could not stand to look at it and that future wars would not be fought with such haste. They were wrong. We were shocked and appalled to see it the first time, but we grew desensitized and apathetic to its horrors. We stopped counting the dead and, with regard to Iraq, we stopped carrying about an adequate justification for war.

Money is to be made and political points are to be collected by any politician seen strong on "defense." We will eventually accept the idea of perpetual war and we will sacrifice whole generations to fight in them. Young men and women will die for a cause they do not understand at the command of men who have never in their lives faced conflict before. These men will order their youth to do something they would never be brave enough to do on their own. As long as the war carries no personal risk to those who run them, the war will never end.

There will always be another enemy and it's only a matter of time before our ingenuity leads to the creation of new weapon wielded by a man who has no authority and is responsible to no one but his own conscious. Whether it be a virus or some anti-matter bomb 100 years down the line, rest assured that we will one day choose an enemy that doesn't care about destroying itself, giving it a significant advantage over those who do. When it happens, we will certainly not be prepared. If we dodge this bullet, even if only temporarily, it won't be as a result of the good graces of some divine being. Rather, it will only be due to blind luck.

Originally posted by Emerald The Paradigm
The war in Iraq and Afghanistan are just as useless as the Persian Gulf War, Vietnam war, World War 1, World War 2, etc "insert war here"...

Nothing will be accomplished by the Elite agenda.

However, this time around the U.S. economy will crumble (which is the real agenda), and a NWO will be placed, and then we will all realize we are One.

Sadly, and I mean sadly, you are exactly right. At the worst possible time for our nation, we are fighting a war that will ruin us. An unholy alliance will follow, which gives up all soverign rights since our country was formed. And I don't see anything that can be done. Many eyes will be opened up, but far too late I expect.

Our prayers and best wishes for our troops, as that support is about all we can do for them at this time. good luck guys.......

Why do you show those close ups of triggers, soldiers shouting, shooting... That's not to inform.
Instead, show the real war, the crying children in hospitals with big and dirty wounds, slowly dying. Show videos of moms and dads mourning in front of fresh graves, show girls and womens shovel dirt and heavy stones after one of thousand air strikes, that devastated their land, their home, their goats. The last things that remained in a country, where it is hard enough to survive without hundreds of rockets blowing the children, mothers to pieces. Show the beggars with open wounds from stray bullets shot by one of thousands of us rifles, show the tears of millions of people, show the statistics that say, that us troops killed over 1 million people in iraq alone. Show the crowded hospitals, the crowded graveyards, show the anger in the faces of professors, doctors, teachers, clergys who only want to live in peace, who work all day to support their loved ones...

No, that you won't show. Instead, you show us soldiers in heavy uniforms, that shout # and # and suck, words you dont want to hear and that you censor on this site. Why do you show that? You say you want to inform, get the info out, educate. But you lie. You know damn well that you lie. You have an agenda. You support the killing of civilians, the heavy war machinery that needs to be fed. You support blood money.

You make me sick. Stop your propaganda, you can't win, fool as many fools as you can get, the rest will win, the peaceful people that promote love and peace. Not your dirty money

Originally posted by hans kammler
But the main question is, from which nations military industrial complex are they acquiring these advanced and manufactured weapons, i was always under the impression afghanistan had no infrastructure, is it really the pakistanis?

I would have to say yes for the most part. I dont have a regional map handy but when you look at one the next chance you get. Look at Afghanistan. Notice who is their Western and Eastern neighbors...

Could Iran be in the mix supporting the fighters? Could be, it is well known they have stirred the pot in Iraq and why not Afghanistan in their eastern neighbor?



[edit on 18-10-2009 by SLAYER69]

Originally posted by Wachstum
Why do you show those close ups of triggers, soldiers shouting, shooting... That's not to inform.
Instead, show the real war, the crying children in hospitals with big and dirty wounds, slowly dying. Show videos of moms and dads mourning in front of fresh graves, show girls and womens shovel dirt and heavy stones after one of thousand air strikes, that devastated their land, their home, their goats. The last things that remained in a country, where it is hard enough to survive without hundreds of rockets blowing the children, mothers to pieces. Show the beggars with open wounds from stray bullets shot by one of thousands of us rifles, show the tears of millions of people, show the statistics that say, that us troops killed over 1 million people in iraq alone. Show the crowded hospitals, the crowded graveyards, show the anger in the faces of professors, doctors, teachers, clergys who only want to live in peace, who work all day to support their loved ones...

No, that you won't show. Instead, you show us soldiers in heavy uniforms, that shout # and # and suck, words you dont want to hear and that you censor on this site. Why do you show that? You say you want to inform, get the info out, educate. But you lie. You know damn well that you lie. You have an agenda. You support the killing of civilians, the heavy war machinery that needs to be fed. You support blood money.

You make me sick. Stop your propaganda, you can't win, fool as many fools as you can get, the rest will win, the peaceful people that promote love and peace. Not your dirty money

Hey! Look! It's one of those recently tamed (60 years ago) Germans telling everyone how war is wrong and such a horrible, horrible thing. Apparently he has forgotten WW2 and the Holocaust. Word to the wise chief, the ONLY reason you have all of these ideas of peace and love and this concept that war is so wrong is that Americans and other countries in Europe stopped YOUR war machine and re-engineered your society to be adverse to such thing. We did the same with the Japanese. Guess it's a good thing we were such "War Mongers" then eh?

Originally posted by Zenagain

Originally posted by Wachstum
Why do you show those close ups of triggers, soldiers shouting, shooting... That's not to inform.
Instead, show the real war, the crying children in hospitals with big and dirty wounds, slowly dying. Show videos of moms and dads mourning in front of fresh graves, show girls and womens shovel dirt and heavy stones after one of thousand air strikes, that devastated their land, their home, their goats. The last things that remained in a country, where it is hard enough to survive without hundreds of rockets blowing the children, mothers to pieces. Show the beggars with open wounds from stray bullets shot by one of thousands of us rifles, show the tears of millions of people, show the statistics that say, that us troops killed over 1 million people in iraq alone. Show the crowded hospitals, the crowded graveyards, show the anger in the faces of professors, doctors, teachers, clergys who only want to live in peace, who work all day to support their loved ones...

No, that you won't show. Instead, you show us soldiers in heavy uniforms, that shout # and # and suck, words you dont want to hear and that you censor on this site. Why do you show that? You say you want to inform, get the info out, educate. But you lie. You know damn well that you lie. You have an agenda. You support the killing of civilians, the heavy war machinery that needs to be fed. You support blood money.

You make me sick. Stop your propaganda, you can't win, fool as many fools as you can get, the rest will win, the peaceful people that promote love and peace. Not your dirty money

Hey! Look! It's one of those recently tamed (60 years ago) Germans telling everyone how war is wrong and such a horrible, horrible thing. Apparently he has forgotten WW2 and the Holocaust. Word to the wise chief, the ONLY reason you have all of these ideas of peace and love and this concept that war is so wrong is that Americans and other countries in Europe stopped YOUR war machine and re-engineered your society to be adverse to such thing. We did the same with the Japanese. Guess it's a good thing we were such "War Mongers" then eh?

Bad guys never care about the innocent. How can you tell which side you are on?

My dad was in WW II -- you, however, were not. The people who "re-engineered Germany" were doing it by building trains, schools and bridges and HELPING. The Marshall plan was opposed by Conservatives in the US -- a good thing decent people didn't listen to them then -- and even more reason to not listen to Conservatives now.

This ONE Good war, helps support the lie for all the bad ones. Other than WW II, there has been nothing but continuous occupation and misery in any country we've "helped."

We lost the Vietnam war for all intents and purposes. And guess what? The country eventually modified it's behavior with prosperity. We trade with them now.

>> I think a German has a GREAT perspective on war -- and people like yourself sound like the arrogant fundamentalists that led their country to insanity.

Before the World Wars, Germany was one of the most advanced, decent and Democratic countries. WW I was not a "Good war" and the Germans were left poor and humiliated -- the Conservative way. The same way we left Afghanistan.

People look at the old war movies, and think that everybody knew how bad the Nazis were -- but you know, we were almost as callous about torture and massacres then as we are now -- and there was no video. The US has supported huge massacres in Ethiopia and other countries (we look the other way with Darfur because we owe China). If we had been on the side of Germany, we would have movies to day, that showed how backstabbing all their enemies were, and we would be comfortable with that decision. Before WW II, Hitler was on the cover of Time magazine as "Man of the Year."

The fight against German aggression, was NOT an obvious path for the USA. Conservatives, powerful industrialists, and most of Wall Street were on the side of Germany. It was only through a fluke of fate that the Liberals won the intellectual argument, and managed to put up enough propaganda so that today -- everybody things that we were all united against the Germans. It could not be further from the truth. If Bush's grand pappy, and his club of Robber Barons had not asked General Smedly Butler to lead a team of disgruntled military troops against FDR -- and then told the administration about the plot, then FDR would not have been able to extort them into doing the right thing.

Philosophically, there isn't any difference between the Chicken Hawks extorting us to blast Afghanistan and the people who thought Germany should follow its destiny.