Why is there so much secrecy with free-masonry? , page 1

I just watched the first disc of a documentary on free-masonry. I learned a lot about free-masonry. It doesn't sound like a bad thing really. They have masonic rituals- like the one after Hiram Abiff (en.wikipedia.org...). Free-masons try to achieve a higher order. What I find interesting is that free-masons aren't told what to think about their own organization. So if they're not told about their own organization how do they know what they're doing the bidding of others?

They're also the descendants of the knights of templar- a group- that has done some bad things (www.masonicinfo.com...). So is the skull and bones.

On its face value the free-masonry society doesn't seem that bad. But it's so closed. Perhaps if the free-masons themselves would reveal the members of historical figures who were involved in historical events that there would be less speculation about free-masonry? Free-masonry sounds really attractive- and any attractive organization is bound to have roots that are somewhat evil. Free-masons were actively involved in the American revolution- most founding fathers were free-masons and quite a few of our founding fathers were free-masons (bessel.org...). I have yet to investigate the conspiracy theories about the French revolution but based on what I know about the French-revolution ideals the free-masons were probably involved.

So if the free-mason society would be more open about the events that it was involved in throughout history I would have no problem about it. I do not doubt that it had enormous influence and that it helped people become better people. However, the philosophy of the organization... would incline one to think that free-masons have intervened in events throughout history that match the free-masonry ideology.

I think that there needs to be truth to these matters. The free-masons needs to be more open about their history. They don't have to tell about their secret oaths. They just have to talk about their past.

As a whole- I don't think the free-masons are evil. Their rituals aren't secret- they're just misunderstood. I think the problem is with the free-masons always denying that their organization had anything to do with any event in history and speculators always saying they're the cause of all of our problems- when in reality the free-masons had some very good ideas.

So I wanted to ask why there is so much secrecy with free-masonry with regards to this. I would love to know why.

[edit on 16-10-2009 by Frankidealist35]

reply to post by Rockpuck

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I thought about that- that the secrecy could just be to keep the ignorant masses from joining the group and it being prestigious. I however want to know more about Masonic history. I understand that it's more of a philosophical movement now.

Anyone who has studied history would probably know about the size of the Masonic movement in the past. What troubles me is the fact that many Masons deny their involvements in historical events like the French revolution or the American revolution. I think it would be great if they came together and decided to reveal to us what really happened and what hasn't happened.

I think that so much of the conspiracies about masonry are around that. So I would like to know their goals and reasons for doing various things- it doesn't help to just deny things all the time.

Originally posted by Frankidealist35
reply to post by Rockpuck

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I think that so much of the conspiracies about masonry are around that. So I would like to know their goals and reasons for doing various things- it doesn't help to just deny things all the time.

If you went up to the average person on the street and said :"We are seeking to bring humanity closer to equivalence of form with the Creator, no matter what it takes"
... they would think you are insane and not trust your judgment.

hence do it in secrecy, until there is no threatening resistance to success.

-

Originally posted by Frankidealist35
So if they're not told about their own organization how do they know what they're doing the bidding of others?

Why would anyone want to join an organization which told them what to think? I'd much rather join an organization which encourages people to think for themselves. Freemasonry is one such organization.

They're also the descendants of the knights of templar- a group- that has done some bad things

Bad things such as...?

Perhaps if the free-masons themselves would reveal the members of historical figures who were involved in historical events that there would be less speculation about free-masonry?

Knock yourself out.

Free-masonry sounds really attractive- and any attractive organization is bound to have roots that are somewhat evil.

How on earth do you come to that conclusion?

Free-masons were actively involved in the American revolution- most founding fathers were free-masons and quite a few of our founding fathers were free-masons. I have yet to investigate the conspiracy theories about the French revolution but based on what I know about the French-revolution ideals the free-masons were probably involved.

Masonic ideals are strongly against tyranny, and strongly for separation of church and state.

I do not doubt that it had enormous influence and that it helped people become better people. However, the philosophy of the organization... would incline one to think that free-masons have intervened in events throughout history that match the free-masonry ideology.

You're welcome.

Originally posted by CookieMonster09
While I agree with most of the answers posted here, I also think that the Freemasons have some degree of fear of persecution given their history as allegedly stemming from the Knights Templar.

There have been historical rifts between the Catholic Church and Freemasonry, as well as rifts between the Freemasons and various dictatorships.

I think the best answer is that the Freemasons have esoteric knowledge, and to a certain extent, a network of generally influential fraternity brothers. To any petty dictator, they would view the Masons as a threat politically, and as having the ability to potentially undermine a dictator's power structure.

Hence, the need for secrecy in difficult times.

You are right on all counts. Except for perhaps the bit about "generally influential fraternity brothers." I'd say our membership spans a fairly wide spectrum, and the number of truly influential members is not disproportionately high when compared to other groups with similar demographics.

Originally posted by Frankidealist35
Anyone who has studied history would probably know about the size of the Masonic movement in the past. What troubles me is the fact that many Masons deny their involvements in historical events like the French revolution or the American revolution. I think it would be great if they came together and decided to reveal to us what really happened and what hasn't happened.

I don't think any Masons deny that the founders of America, and a number of significant players in the American Revolution were Masons. We're quite proud of that fact. (and, incidentally, the Texas revolution from Mexico...)

I'm personally not well versed in the history of the French Revolution, so I really can't tell you anything one way or the other. I do know that authors like Nesta Webster and Edith Starr Miller (aka Lady Queensborough) wrote a lot of crap lying about Masons, the Illuminati, and other groups which was simply fiction, and more modern conspiracy theorists cite their books (World Revolution and Occult Theocracy, respectively) without acknowledging the errors they perpetrated. (Miller was one of the authors who's responsible for aspects of the Taxil hoax still being around in CT circles...)

[edit on 10/16/2009 by JoshNorton]

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