How would you convince non-believers?

Originally posted by Arbitrageur

Jkrog's advice is good, present what evidence there is of the Belgian case and a couple of others.

Arbitrageur,you make some good points -I'd say there are quite a few extremely strange UFO incidents to choose from -just off the top of my head theres the Coyne incident, the Tehran incident, the Alaska flight JAL 1628 incident, the Colares incident, the Portage County incident, the Gosford incident, the RB-47 Incident, the Lakenheath incident etc..

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
95% of sightings are attributable to known causes but that still leaves 5% of sightings that can't be explained.

I'd say its more like 20 to 30%.

"There are unidentified flying objects. That is, there are a hard core of cases - perhaps 20 to 30 percent in different studies - for which there is no explanation... We can only imagine what purpose lies behind the activities of these quiet, harmlessly cruising objects that time and again approach the earth. The most likely explanation, it seems to me, is that they are simply watching what we are up to." (Redbook, vol. 143)
Dr. Margaret Mead, world-renowned Anthropologist.



"The opposite conclusion could have been drawn from The Condon Report's content, namely, that a phenomenon with such a high ratio of unexplained cases (about 30 percent) should arouse sufficient scientific curiosity to continue its study."
"From a scientific and engineering standpoint, it is unacceptable to simply ignore substantial numbers of unexplained observations... the only promising approach is a continuing moderate-level effort with emphasis on improved data collection by objective means... involving available remote sensing capabilities and certain software changes."
Ronald D Story - American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics UFO Subcommittee -New York: Doubleday, 1980

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
Then pose some possibilities for what they could be and let people decide from themselves.I disagree with the poster who said if you rule out all the manmade causes they must be aliens, for example, how does he know they're not, say, time travelers for example?

Theres a good definiton of a UFO here from Dr J Allen Hyneck:

"The reported perception of an object or light seen in the sky or upon the land the appearance, trajectory, and general dynamic and luminescent behavior of which do not suggest a logical, conventional explanation and which is not only mystifying to the original percipients but remains unidentified after close scrutiny of all available evidence by persons who are technically capable of making a common sense identification, if one is possible."
The UFO Experience: A Scientific Inquiry by J. Allen Hynek, Henry Regnery, Chicago, 1972, p. 10.

www.ufocasebook.com...


As to the 'true nature' of certain unidentiifed objects ,I don't think anyone can say for sure - some UFOs could be extra terrestrial,extra dimensional or (as you say) time travellers - some could even be from under the sea.

Dr. Ivan T. Sanderson who suggested that aliens could remain undetected by building their bases beneath the world’s oceans.
Dr. Sanderson found that by actual count, over 50 percent of the UFO sightings had occurred over, coming from, or plunging into or coming out of water.

www.bluealien.net...

Cheers.

[edit on 02/10/08 by karl 12]

Originally posted by karl 12

Originally posted by Arbitrageur

Jkrog's advice is good, present what evidence there is of the Belgian case and a couple of others.

Arbitrageur,you make some good points -I'd say there are quite a few extremely strange UFO incidents to choose from -just off the top of my head theres the Coyne incident, the Tehran incident, the Alaska flight JAL 1628 incident, the Colares incident, the Portage County incident, the Gosford incident, the RB-47 Incident, the Lakenheath incident etc..

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
95% of sightings are attributable to known causes but that still leaves 5% of sightings that can't be explained.

I'd say its more like 20 to 30%.

"There are unidentified flying objects. That is, there are a hard core of cases - perhaps 20 to 30 percent in different studies - for which there is no explanation... We can only imagine what purpose lies behind the activities of these quiet, harmlessly cruising objects that time and again approach the earth. The most likely explanation, it seems to me, is that they are simply watching what we are up to." (Redbook, vol. 143)
Dr. Margaret Mead, world-renowned Anthropologist.



"The opposite conclusion could have been drawn from The Condon Report's content, namely, that a phenomenon with such a high ratio of unexplained cases (about 30 percent) should arouse sufficient scientific curiosity to continue its study."
"From a scientific and engineering standpoint, it is unacceptable to simply ignore substantial numbers of unexplained observations... the only promising approach is a continuing moderate-level effort with emphasis on improved data collection by objective means... involving available remote sensing capabilities and certain software changes."
Ronald D Story - American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics UFO Subcommittee -New York: Doubleday, 1980

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
Then pose some possibilities for what they could be and let people decide from themselves.I disagree with the poster who said if you rule out all the manmade causes they must be aliens, for example, how does he know they're not, say, time travelers for example?

Theres a good definiton of a UFO here from Dr J Allen Hyneck:

"The reported perception of an object or light seen in the sky or upon the land the appearance, trajectory, and general dynamic and luminescent behavior of which do not suggest a logical, conventional explanation and which is not only mystifying to the original percipients but remains unidentified after close scrutiny of all available evidence by persons who are technically capable of making a common sense identification, if one is possible."
The UFO Experience: A Scientific Inquiry by J. Allen Hynek, Henry Regnery, Chicago, 1972, p. 10.

www.ufocasebook.com...


As to the 'true nature' of certain unidentiifed objects ,I don't think anyone can say for sure - some UFOs could be extra terrestrial,extra dimensional or (as you say) time travellers - some could even be from under the sea.

Dr. Ivan T. Sanderson who suggested that aliens could remain undetected by building their bases beneath the world’s oceans.
Dr. Sanderson found that by actual count, over 50 percent of the UFO sightings had occurred over, coming from, or plunging into or coming out of water.

www.bluealien.net...

Cheers.

[edit on 02/10/08 by karl 12]

thanks for your help mate, you are truly making this easier for me :]

reply to post by Belgiannewbie


If lol I was an alien race that was here PEACEFULLY, I would just interact with the beings above and below that are willing to interact. I would create places for EARTH BEINGS to gain knowledge of their new alien encounters, those who are willing. I would be compassionate to EARTH BEINGS WHO ARE FEARFUL and just leave a door for them to enter whenever they feel comfortable. I would show EARTH BEINGS what we eat so they could see that humans are not on the menu, mabey produce a chart showing all our foods were they are from and why we eat them. Next I would provide our energy sources to let EARTH KNOW we are not here to steal you precious metals or energy. Then I would show how it is we reproduce letting EARTH SEE we dont need you to reproduce our military/species. Finally I would offer a trade if some want for some of humanity to leave with us and leave some of my kind here, not for good temporary to share knowledge of the EARTH SPECIES AND OUR SPECIES.

[edit on 11/4/09 by Ophiuchus 13]

Originally posted by Belgiannewbie
thanks for your help mate, you are truly making this easier for me :]

No probs mate - there are quite a few very interesting aspects you could include in your project but ,due to the subject matter, you're bound to encounter a few conditioned responses (UFO =NUT etc..).
This is a good vid and deals with the corporate media 'treatment':

News Media Complicity and UFOs with Terry Hansen.

Google Video Link

"A mesmerizing account of his investigation into whether some of America's most influential news organizations, many having maintained close ties to the U.S. intelligence community, have willingly suppressed full and accurate news coverage of extraterrestrial related phenomena for a variety of "national-security" reasons. Hansen reveals the remarkable and persistent difference in UFO-related news coverage exhibited by local and national news organizations and reviews the history of censorship and propaganda during the twentieth century and the evidence for media-government collusion over the course of the half-century-long UFO controversy. Terry Hansen is an independent journalist with an interest in scientific controversies and the politics of mass media. He is author of The Missing Times: News Media Complicity in the UFO Cover-up. He has organized and moderated two symposiums about the science and politics of UFO research for the Science Museum of Minnesota. Hansen holds a bachelor’s degree in biology and a master’s degree in science journalism, both from the University of Minnesota. He was a founding partner of KFH Publications, Inc., a Seattle computer-magazine publishing company. This presentation covers some of the more recent and important stories that have been suppressed by the media cartels and powers-that-be. "

video.google.com...#

Cheers.

Originally posted by karl 12

Originally posted by Belgiannewbie
thanks for your help mate, you are truly making this easier for me :]

No probs mate - there are quite a few very interesting aspects you could include in your project but ,due to the subject matter, you're bound to encounter a few conditioned responses (UFO =NUT etc..).
This is a good vid and deals with the corporate media 'treatment':

News Media Complicity and UFOs with Terry Hansen.

Google Video Link

"A mesmerizing account of his investigation into whether some of America's most influential news organizations, many having maintained close ties to the U.S. intelligence community, have willingly suppressed full and accurate news coverage of extraterrestrial related phenomena for a variety of "national-security" reasons. Hansen reveals the remarkable and persistent difference in UFO-related news coverage exhibited by local and national news organizations and reviews the history of censorship and propaganda during the twentieth century and the evidence for media-government collusion over the course of the half-century-long UFO controversy. Terry Hansen is an independent journalist with an interest in scientific controversies and the politics of mass media. He is author of The Missing Times: News Media Complicity in the UFO Cover-up. He has organized and moderated two symposiums about the science and politics of UFO research for the Science Museum of Minnesota. Hansen holds a bachelor’s degree in biology and a master’s degree in science journalism, both from the University of Minnesota. He was a founding partner of KFH Publications, Inc., a Seattle computer-magazine publishing company. This presentation covers some of the more recent and important stories that have been suppressed by the media cartels and powers-that-be. "

video.google.com...#

Cheers.

Great presentation that is ! Also, have you any information on the history of UFO sightings? Like crop circles and stuff?

I found a thread on ats about crop circles being formed by the 'devil' in the Medieval ages but i kind of broke my pc and lost all my stuff ...

Anywho, it'd be great if you got any info about that,,

cheers

Originally posted by Belgiannewbie
Hello dear ATS'ers.

I have made this thread because i always wondered on how believers would convince non-believers, or people who just haven't thought about it clearly that the extra-terrestrial phenomenon exists.

The reason why i am asking you this is because i have a project that i'm working on for my finals. I have to talk about a subject infront of my whole school, and yes.. i have picked Aliens and UFO's.

I know a lot about it and i'm sure i can make people think twice before they decide on what to believe. But i'm wondering, how would you ( seriously ) confront an audience to aliens and UFO's

What would ( in your eyes ) convince them that they are real and are here on this planet and have been for many years, what kind of evidence would you provide and tell me in detail what profound footage or confessions of credible people you would choose.

I could use some of your advice to work into my presentation that will last about 40 minutes ( i know, way too short ) that's why i need the best evidence, the best footage, well everything that will start people thinking that i can use in the time that i have.

So tell me, what would you do if you stood infront of an audience, what would you say and utilise?

Thanks, i hope i'll get some good answers i can use !


-> Also, if you have any good story, a nice come-forth of someone or anything that i just have to mention in my presentation please share it with me with U2U or just comment it here

-Belgiannewbie.

You can't. You cannot convince a non-believer. You can convince a partial believer. Someone who might be skeptical to some alien mention things. But you cannot convince a die-hard skeptic. Even if an alien like this:



came up to them and had sex with them in her flying space ship and clearly showed it was a spaceship with the advance technology it had, they would still not believe in extraterrestrials.

They would just believe they had sex with an angel or it was all just a dream or hallucination.

:EDITED:

By the way skepticy is nothing more than an act of behavior against mental deviance.

[edit on 10-11-2009 by DrainMaster]