Originally posted by okamitengu
sounds like the OP needs to read history.
until the refomormation the ONLY christians were catholic.
the romans killed ..... catholics. they BIRTHED the expression of christians.
protestantism is an OFFSHOOT of christianity.
if its done in the name of your god, then you all bear the blame. trying to say it wasnt us it was our cousins isnt good enough.
arent you your brothers keeper?
I second that !!!! Plus saying that Catholics are not Christians may be the most bigoted thing I've heard here at ATS....but just for fun lets look
at some quotes from Martin Luther, who by the way was responsible for the murder of some one hundred thousand German peasants...here is the great hero
of the Protestant reformation at his inglorious best - Thanks but I'll take Rome over this insanity any day of the week
Quotes from Martin Luther
"God does not work salvation for fictitious sinners. Be a sinner and sin vigorously.... Do not for a moment imagine that this life is the abiding
place of justice; sin must be committed."
"Sin cannot tear you away from him [Christ], even though you commit adultery a hundred times a day and commit as many murders."
"A large number of deaf, crippled and blind people are afflicted solely through the malice of the demon. And one must in no wise doubt that plagues,
fevers and every sort of evil come from him."
"An earthly kingdom cannot exist without inequality of persons. Some must be free, some serfs, some rulers, some subjects."
"As to the common people, ... one has to be hard with them and see that they do their work and that under the threat of the sword and the law they
comply with the observance of piety, just as you chain up wild beasts."
"Demons live in many lands, but particularly in Prussia."
"I almost feel like throwing Jimmy into the stove, as the priest in Kulenberg did."
"I feel much freer now that I am certain the pope is the Antichrist."
"I maintain that some Jew wrote it [the Book of James] who probably heard about Christian people but never encountered any."
"I should have no compassion on these witches; I should burn them all."
"Idiots, the lame, the blind, the dumb, are men in whom the devils have established themselves: and all the physicians who heal these infirmities, as
though they proceeded from natural causes, are ignorant blockheads...."
"In many countries there are particular places to which devils more especially resort. In Prussia there is an infinite number of evil spirits."
"Many sweat to reconcile St. Paul and St. James, but in vain. 'Faith justifies' and 'faith does not justify' contradict each other flatly. If any
one can harmonize them I will give him my doctor's hood and let him call me a fool."
"Reason must be deluded, blinded, and destroyed. Faith must trample underfoot all reason, sense, and understanding, and whatever it sees must be put
out of sight and ... know nothing but the word of God."
"Snakes and monkeys are subjected to the demon more than other animals. Satan lives in them and possesses them. He uses them to deceive men and to
"The damned whore Reason...."
"The fact that [the biblical book] Hebrews is not an epistle of St. Paul, or of any other apostle, is proved by what it says in chapter two...."
"This fool [Copernicus] wishes to reverse the entire science of astronomy; but sacred scripture tells us that Joshua commanded the sun to stand
still, and not the earth."
"We are at fault for not slaying them [the Jews]."
"We know, on the authority of Moses, that longer than six thousand years the world did not exist."
"We should throw the Epistle of James out of this school [the University of Wittenberg]....
"What shall we do with...the Jews?...I advise that all their prayer books and Talmudic writings...are to be taken from them."
"What shall we do with...the Jews?...I advise that safe-conduct on the highways be abolished completely for the Jews."
"What shall we do with...the Jews? I advise that their rabbis be forbidden to teach on pain of loss of life and limb."
"What shall we do with...the Jews?...set fire to their synagogues or schools and bury and cover with dirt whatever will not burn, so that no man will
ever again see a stone or cinder of them."
"What shall we do with...the Jews?...their homes also should be razed and destroyed."
Thats just a sample of the great Protestant reformer's thinking- now as to the Christians being blamed for mass murder and such like - hate to break
it there are unfortunately several examples of this - to say that the perpertrators were not Christians is BS - if they were baptised and believed in
Jesus Christ and the Trinity then they were Christians - perhaps not the best Christians but Christians never the less
The Spanish inquisition - mostly a political crime but done with the collusion of the church - Spain was trying to reunite itself after the Moors had
left unfortunately it did this at the expense of the Jews who were a wealthy and influential class of people at the time
A lot of people cite the Crusades but actually that was started by the Muslims and the Christians went to war originally to defend
territory....however some European Monarchs invoked this over the centuries whenever they needed to raise themselves in the eyes of their subjects -
much the way politicans of today like to invoke God for support of their modern "crusades"...
The witch burnings - I think the OP said this was Puritans - well the Puritans were heavily influenced by Martin Luther - what a surprise
witch burnings in Europe were not just done by the Puritans - there are many theories but my favorite is the one that shows how so many women were
left without husbands after the plagues of Europe - widows with land then became targets of unscrupulous officials who wanted to posses their
neighbor's property - this practice was fairly widespread but came under the fire of church officials in the end and was stopped all together in the
Then there are the practices of the various Christian explorers like Columbus who is held responsible by some for the genocide of the West Indies -
Cortez and the destruction of Indian culture in south America also comes to mind....
However all that said Christianity has also been responsible for some important advances in human rights, it played a major role in the abolition of
slavery around the world, and the Catholic church played an important role in the development of science including the scientific method - I know most
folk are taught that the church is at odds with science but this is a fallacy...
As a Christian I don't see any reason to deny the errors or crimes of Christian men and women - it's called "taking responsibility" , learning
from one's mistakes and moving forward - If we fail to do this then we fail Christ and our fellow humans...and they see us for the hypocrites we then
become having failed to honestly face our darker moments..thats my take - take it however you want.