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Topic started on 13-10-2009 @ 06:10 PM by Nosred
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 +1 more
You might be surprised to know that one of countries most beloved presidents was indeed a war criminal. Abraham Lincoln attacked the confederate
states without declaring war first, resulting in thousands of innocent civilian deaths. His presidency ended the limeted-powered government of the
past to replace it with this horrible controlling government we have now and he ended America's neutrality in foreign matters resulted in America's
occupation of over 144 countries today.
Continued below-
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:17 PM by Nosred
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Now before you start arguing over slavery take this into consideration; Lincoln was a self proclaimed racist who didn't believe in equal rights. He
didn't want to free slaves out of the kindness of his heart, he viewed it as a war tactic. He thought if he freed slaves it would result in an
uprising from past slaves that would weaken the confederacy. The primary cause of the civil war was disputes over land.
Continued below.
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:17 PM by poedxsoldiervet
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:20 PM by plumranch
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reply to post by Nosred
Abraham Lincoln attacked the confederate states without declaring war first,
The south was part of the then United States. Why would the president declare war on itself. How exactly would that happen? 
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:26 PM by Nosred
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Lincoln belongs in category with Hitler, Lenin, and Mao. They all killed their own countries people and left their nations in ruins. You only find
glorifications of Lincoln nowadays but would you have found anything critical of Hitler in Nazi Germany? You still won't find any truth on Mao in
China. In conclusion, Abraham Lincoln was just another Republican warmonger.
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:27 PM by StinkyFeet
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reply to post by Nosred
Yeah just think of all the innocent Southern Americans he had killed or injured. That is wayyyyy worse than anything Bush ever did and everybody
hates him.
[edit on 13-10-2009 by StinkyFeet]
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:29 PM by stevegmu
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Some may consider this post off-topic.
[edit on 13-10-2009 by stevegmu]
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:34 PM by Nosred
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Originally posted by plumranch
reply to post by Nosred
The south was part of the then United States. Why would the president declare war on itself. How exactly would that happen?
Exactly! Why would he attack his own country? By the way attacking someone without declaring war first was illegal then and now, this is why he's a
war criminal.
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:36 PM by SLAYER69
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Originally posted by Nosred
You might be surprised to know that one of countries most beloved presidents was indeed a war criminal. Abraham Lincoln attacked the confederate
states without declaring war first
First off get your time line correct. Who attacked whom first?
Continued below-
Time Line of The Civil War
January 1861 -- The South Secedes.
When Abraham Lincoln, a known opponent of slavery, was elected president, the South Carolina legislature perceived a threat. Calling a state
convention, the delegates voted to remove the state of South Carolina from the union known as the United States of America. The secession of South
Carolina was followed by the secession of six more states -- Mississippi, Florida, Alabama, Georgia, Louisiana, and Texas -- and the threat of
secession by four more -- Virginia, Arkansas, Tennessee, and North Carolina. These eleven states eventually formed the Confederate States of
America.
February 1861 -- The South Creates a Government.
At a convention in Montgomery, Alabama, the seven seceding states created the Confederate Constitution, a document similar to the United States
Constitution, but with greater stress on the autonomy of each state. Jefferson Davis was named provisional president of the Confederacy until
elections could be held.
February 1861 -- The South Seizes Federal Forts.
When President Buchanan -- Lincoln's predecessor -- refused to surrender southern federal forts to the seceding states, southern state troops seized
them. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina troops repulsed a supply ship trying to reach federal forces based in the fort. The ship was forced to return to
New York, its supplies undelivered.
March 1861 -- Lincoln's Inauguration.
At Lincoln's inauguration on March 4, the new president said he had no plans to end slavery in those states where it already existed, but he also
said he would not accept secession. He hoped to resolve the national crisis without warfare.
April 1861 -- Attack on Fort Sumter.
When President Lincoln planned to send supplies to Fort Sumter, he alerted the state in advance, in an attempt to avoid hostilities. South Carolina,
however, feared a trick; the commander of the fort, Robert Anderson, was asked to surrender immediately. Anderson offered to surrender, but only after
he had exhausted his supplies. His offer was rejected, and on April 12, the Civil War began with shots fired on the fort. Fort Sumter eventually
was surrendered to South Carolina.
[edit on 13-10-2009 by SLAYER69]
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:42 PM by Nosred
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I also know I was being a bit harsh comparing him to Hitler, etc. but there are similarities. And it's not propaganda, Abraham Lincoln does qualify
as a war criminal. Also he did not believe in giving slaves any rights after he freed them, look it up.
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:45 PM by SLAYER69
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Originally posted by Nosred
I also know I was being a bit harsh comparing him to Hitler, etc. but there are similarities. And it's not propaganda, Abraham Lincoln does qualify
as a war criminal. Also he did not believe in giving slaves any rights after he freed them, look it up.
No, actually you're the one making claims.
The burden of proof is on you.
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:48 PM by poedxsoldiervet
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Originally posted by Nosred
Lincoln belongs in category with Hitler, Lenin, and Mao. They all killed their own countries people and left their nations in ruins. You only find
glorifications of Lincoln nowadays but would you have found anything critical of Hitler in Nazi Germany? You still won't find any truth on Mao in
China. In conclusion, Abraham Lincoln was just another Republican warmonger.
A Republican War Monger huh... Hmmm lets take a Stroll down memory lane shall we..... Since the Civil War....
The Apache Wars were fight durning a Democrats term Grover Cleveland.
Ulysses Simpson Grant Republican- Battle of Little Big Horn and Indian Wars.
William McKinley- Republican- Spanish American War
Woodrow Wilson- hmm World War one-Democrat
Franklin Roosevelt- World War II- Democrat
Harry Truman- Last Days of World War II (also Nuke Japan) and the Korean War-Democrat
Dwight Eisenhower- Korean War, as well as Veitnam Advisors Planned the Bay of Pigs-Republican?
John Kennedy- Bay of Pigs as well as Vietnams Escaltion "Democrat
LBJ- Further Escaltion of the Vietnam War (hey hey LBJ how many kids have you killed to day?) Democrat
Richard Nixion- Repub- Vietnam Watergate- Scandal
Ronald Regean- Grenda, Lebanon, Lybia- Repub
Bush- the first First GUlf War- Repub
Clinton- Gulf War, bombings of Iraq, US sanctions on IRAQ, Somlia, Bombed a few countries in Africa, Kosvo, Bosnian,Serbia. Democrat
Bush the Second- Afgan- after we were attaked by terrirost, Iraq a war some say is pointless. Repub
Obama- Iraq, Afgan, and bombing of Pakistans tribal areas. Dem
So this has been since the civial War lets count int up shall we i count 8 Dem Presidents 7 Repub Presidents
So um who is the War Mongers?
[edit on 13-10-2009 by poedxsoldiervet]
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 06:49 PM by Just a guy hi
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Originally posted by Nosred
I also know I was being a bit harsh comparing him to Hitler, etc. but there are similarities. And it's not propaganda, Abraham Lincoln does qualify
as a war criminal. Also he did not believe in giving slaves any rights after he freed them, look it up.
Where is the proof he was a racist?
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 07:02 PM by pexx421
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+3 more
Lets not forget that lincoln also set the precedent for removing our constitutional rights during war. He set aside habeus corpus as well as trial by
jury. Any politicos in the north who opposed him he stripped of office and sent into exile in the south. He imposed martial law, and instituted
draft policies. He almost completely stripped american citizens of their constitutional liberties in order to enact his war, a war which contrary to
popular opinion was not about freeing slaves, but was actually about holding on to the taxes that the south provided to the north, 85% of the nations
total taxes, that went to supporting northern industrialization.
Then, as now, almost all wars are about money and power. We use ideology to convince the lay people to participate, such as freedom, war on
terror, etc, but in actuality its all about getting the poor to go fight so the rich can protect or expand their profits.
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 07:07 PM by poedxsoldiervet
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reply to post by pexx421
now I agree with this, I dont think Lincoln is a hero he saved the union but in the process destroyed our consitition.
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 07:15 PM by hadriana
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Sherman was a war criminal and a half.
He plotted his crimes with Lincoln.
I can understand how easy it is to glorify them in the name of getting rid of slavery, but what did they really do? They freed the slaves and then
the slaves had no place to go except for follow them - and they let them starve or just flat out killed them when and if they thought they were
competition for feeding the union troops. Bleh.
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 07:20 PM by Ahabstar
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reply to post by poedxsoldiervet
Nixon was a Republican. He lost to JFK in a close election. Not bad considering that Ike did not endorse his VP Nixon.
Just thought I would throw that out there. Fairly good post overall though. 
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 07:22 PM by Nosred
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 07:22 PM by Nosred
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reply posted on 13-10-2009 @ 07:28 PM by clever024
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reply to post by stevegmu
It is in fact not propaganda, as the U.S. stood at THAT time, the south was trying to succeed from the union due to unfair tariffs on cotton and other
textiles from northerners, when Lincoln declared war, there wasn't enough people in congress to actually make a declaration of war, there was a
thread, and lengthy one on it at that that detailed it great a while back i was looking for it recently and couldnt come across it, I was going to
find it and ask the Mods to actually put it in the american peril forum and bring it back to light to help us understand how we got to this point.
up someone beat me to the punch it looks like haha
[edit on 13-10-2009 by clever024]
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