'Take Military Action' Before They Get Nukes' Sen. Lindsey Graham

Why attack a country that as of yet has no nukes?
Why worry of a country which has announced that it is going to be assuming a "manned space program" immediately?

Can you say ICBM?

I mentioned in another thread, here on ATS, that the technology required to launch a person into orbit is comparable to the technology required to develop a launch vehicle of sufficient size to deliver a high-yield explosive device to any target around the world, a.k.a. an inter-continental ballistic missile.

Who cares if it's nuclear or not? Personally, I don't care.
2 kilotons of ... 5 kilotons... 10 kilotons explosives is exactly what it says.
Nuclear material though, has that fall-out aspect: the gift that keeps on giving... and lingers on... and on... and ... that other aspect we don't want to deal with.

The hypocrisy is still amazing. "Worry about Iran because they will attack Israel." Don't worry about Israel having one of the best military in the world and is capable of defending itself - just ask those dead Palestinians; don't worry about Israel having the Mossad - perhaps only 2nd to the CIA, or maybe first - who knows. And oh yeah, don't worry about Israel's nuclear arms.

You have much larger and better nations like China who could shake the world if war ever were to break between it and the West. You have a country ran by an insane cult leader in North Korea who could bomb Japan if he wanted to, and go on with plans to unite Korea but no, no, let us worry about a country whose people are very rational and sane led by a guy probably placed in by the U.S itself - conspiracy! It is a conspiracy but I think the whole Iran-Israel thing is just a coverup for something bigger that does not involve Iran.

And how come it seems casual to hear "Israel is ready to an air attack on Iran if Iran has nuclear arms" - they have been waiting for quite a few years actually. And nobody in the West goe s but Yet in the same hand, people want to talk about peace and a global society. Leave Iran alone. Never been to Iran but I do have Iranian friends and they are good average citizens like the rest of us.

I will never understand how backwards the government has made our society's thought process. I'm an American, but I hope Iran keeps the West's imperialism from choking them to death.

reply to post by Southern Guardian

So you supposedly trust the Chinese considering they and Russia have been to an extent supported North Korea

China yes the Russians could care less about North Korea. I think you're failing to understand the dynamics. The Iranians keep threatening and posturing.

The Indians, and Pakistanis as well as Israel (other middle eastern counrties) do not partake in this dangerous game. Comments from these countries are almost always a response to an edict or power play by rogue nations.

You see there's civility involved. If the Persians had asked the global community to assist them in a peaceful nuclear energy solution there would have been an outpouring of help.

If you want to be in the member's only club you have to play nice. Simple as that.

Becker

reply to post by soldiermom


The OP never stated his political stance. It wouldn't matter any ways. The Senator made the statement, and that is what We are debating here.

Your argument is rhetorical. Your downing one Person(the OP) for voicing his freedom of speech; by telling him to basically shut up because the Senator is only voicing his.

Your borderlining on Political bating, and I don't appreciate it. I am not Democrat, Republican, or Fascist as some are in this forum....apparently.

Oh, and I forgot, are You psychic???? How do You know anything about me?

Originally posted by Becker44
China yes the Russians could care less about North Korea.

Thats your opinion over the Chinese standing.

I think you're failing to understand the dynamics. The Iranians keep threatening and posturing.

So do the North Koreans, so do the Venezualens, so do the Sudanese, I could go on. And I'd suppose the European Union and Turkey are totally helpless to deal with this as well? Is it our job to police the world?

The Indians, and Pakistanis as well as Israel (other middle eastern counrties) do not partake in this dangerous game.

Israel has been partaking in this game for a very long time. If Israel was another oil-rich arab nation there would be a very different attitude.

reply to post by Southern Guardian


"anything but military intervention" is a little vague. Could you be more specific as to what you would do?

And staying out of it is not an option. Try again. What would you do?

Originally posted by soldiermom
"anything but military intervention" is a little vague. Could you be more specific as to what you would do?

Its not vague, you just choose not to listen. I will repeat myself again, any solution excluding military intervention. I am for any solution that doest include the involvement of the US military. I am for sanctions, I am for agreements. I am not for any direct military involvement period. The same as I was in the case of Iraq. We had no business in that nation, we have no business in Iran. Just like we have no "business liberating Israel" with their 200 nuclear missile they refuse to officially recognize.

SG

[edit on 4-10-2009 by Southern Guardian]

To all wanting war because there is something genetically, psychologically, or straight up Evil with Your ideological formations, here is a press release straight from the IAEA.

There should be no debate; the provocations for war are simple hype.
Press Release from IAEA
Recent Media Report on Iran
www.iaea.org...

At the Board of Governors´ meeting on 9 September 2009, Director General Mohamed ElBaradei warned that continuing allegations that the IAEA was withholding information on Iran are politically motivated and totally baseless.

Originally posted by sanchoearlyjones
reply to post by soldiermom

 

The OP never stated his political stance. It wouldn't matter any ways. The Senator made the statement, and that is what We are debating here.

Your argument is rhetorical. Your downing one Person(the OP) for voicing his freedom of speech; by telling him to basically shut up because the Senator is only voicing his.

Your borderlining on Political bating, and I don't appreciate it. I am not Democrat, Republican, or Fascist as some are in this forum....apparently.

Oh, and I forgot, are You psychic???? How do You know anything about me?

The OP's political stance is well known here. I'm not "downing" SG and no where did I tell him to shut up. I'm simply trying to get an answer as to what he would like to see done to Senator Graham for voicing an opinion. The same thing SG is doing here.

A thousand pardons that you think I'm baiting. For future reference, I'll try to learn what you appreciate and what you don't appreciate so as not to offend you, since you took such pains not to offend me.

We in the US don't have to do any such invasion of Iran.

The problem can be solved in fifteen minutes, and do so without putting one single boot on the ground.

But we won't because we have no intuition, and certainly no balls.

So we will pull a Chamberlain/Daladier.

We'll have to lose a city or two, but what the heck. It's like tradition here in the US. We have to get smacked in the mouth hard and spit out some blood before we can get off our asses to take care of things that should have been properly addressed much earlier.

We may even get lucky, and one of the cities that's taken out will be DC.

Of course, the prudent thing to do will have been long past by that time, but I'd hate for SG's delicate sensitivities to be upset.

After all, American deaths are not as important as raghead deaths.

God help us.

reply to post by soldiermom


I make no secret of my ideological stance. Thats not my concern however in this thread. Neither is it my concern of what "freedoms" you wish to protect for Mr Graham. My OP is regarding his warhawkish mentality and cost already to this nation. We had no business in Iraq, Bush lied about it, and yet individuals like this continue to spout the same warhawk talk to justify another invasion.

Originally posted by dooper
We in the US don't have to do any such invasion of Iran.

The problem can be solved in fifteen minutes, and do so without putting one single boot on the ground.

Can you be more clear? How can this problem be readily solved?

but I'd hate for SG's delicate sensitivities to be upset

I assure you theres no need for concern about my sensitives. I didnt know you cared so much my its rather heart warming. Just address the OP and be clear and that should do my friend.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
reply to post by soldiermom

 

I make no secret of my ideological stance. Thats not my concern however in this thread. Neither is it my concern of what "freedoms" you wish to protect for Mr Graham. My OP is regarding his warhawkish mentality and cost already to this nation. We had no business in Iraq, Bush lied about it, and yet individuals like this continue to spout the same warhawk talk to justify another invasion.

I'm not trying to protect anyone's freedom of speech. Just pointing out that he has it, the same as you. You're the one that thinks that something should be done to keep him from "spouting warhawkish rhetoric". That was the basis of your OP, no?

[edit on 10/4/2009 by soldiermom]

Come on' folks. Im bout' sure Israel has their 200 odd WMD's ready to be launched at any moment. Hows about we liberate them as well? I mean after all we are talking about two nations with gun toutin' regimes? What makes Israel or North Korea the exception?

The warhawks are obviously not concerned about the nuclear threat. Rather whats deep underground. I'd rather go hybrid than loose for more lives for another oil war.

reply to post by Southern Guardian


This is extremely pertinent to the thread:
Is Lindsey Graham gay?
Seven Minutes in Gay Hell: Is Lindsey Graham in S.C.'s airtight closet?
www.charlestoncitypaper.com...

At 52, the life-long bachelor has been fodder for such rumors for years, but with the resignation of Sen. Larry Craig, R-Idaho — the anti-gay politician who pled guilty to disorderly conduct after allegedly soliciting sex in an airport men's room — the internet is abuzz over who's next, and they're dying to know what's going on in Graham's bedroom

Now is this in, and of itself important??? NO, However, here is what Mike Rivero over at whatreallyhappened.com... had to say............Read it, and the reasoning behind why Graham may have said what was said.

Mike Rivero-

Normally I would not waste space on a story about gay politicians. But further down there is a story where Lindsey Graham is championing the idea that the US should attack and crush Iran on Israel's behalf because Israel cannot handle the job themselves.

Now it is no secret that Graham is a recipient of pro-Israel pack money, at least $65,000 so far.

But it is also no secret that Israel seeks out gay politicians, even plants "Hney traps" on them, in order to control them. As just one example, New Jersey Governor McGreevey was forced to resign when his gay affair with an Israeli, Golan Cipel. Cipel used to work at the Israeli consulate in New York City (the radioactive one) and is a suspected Mossad agent. Prior to being outed for their affair, McGreevey had placed Cipel in charge of New Jersey's own Homeland Security efforts.

So, if Lindsey Graham is indeed gay, and if Israel has compromised him the way that they compromised McGreevey (given Lindsey's anti-gay voting record), then it may be that Lindsey is willing to send your children off to be killed and crippled in a war with Iran just to stay in the closet.

And that is a #ty reason to lose your kid.

Personally I think it is time for all the nasty little secrets of our politicians to be exposed, not out of vengeance, not out of prurient interest, but simply to remove the means for them to be blackmailed into sending our kids off to die in a foreign war for a foreign government.

Originally posted by soldiermom
I'm not trying to protect anyone's freedom of speech.

Yes you are, and it has nothing to do with the OP. Im not concerned about stripping Mr Grahams freedom of speech. Im concerned about addressing his warhawkish solution. Thats bout' the topic of the thread. So please control yourself and stay on topic. Im sure you can defend Mr Graham over his comments without the need of being off topic.

reply to post by sanchoearlyjones


Im not sure about that Sancho. His sexuality doesnt concern me that much. Its his warhawk solution that already got this nation in part to this crises that Im concerned about.

www.zwire.com...

In early March, Fox News reported that Senator Lindsay Graham had asked Attorney General John Ashcroft "to provide him with a legal assessment of those Americans headed to or already in Iraq to offer themselves as 'human shields.' " Graham compared Americans acting as human shields with John Walker Lindh.
"It is my opinion that any American who voluntarily engages in conduct to impede a potential American military operation, and who thereby endangers the lives of our nation's men and women in uniform, is participating in a program designed to weaken the power of the United States to wage war successfully. I strongly believe efforts to impede a potential military operation against Iraq should be strongly dealt with and I am seeking your assistance in this matter."
.

So what happened since Bush was in office till now that you should be prosocuted for going to a country against the US stance on that country to now when you have multiple republicans going to a country against the US stance on that country. So will Lindsay Graham stand up against those republicans and see about posecutig them.

www.breitbart.com...

Republicans visit Honduras despite US coup policy

TEGUCIGALPA, Honduras (AP) - Four U.S. Republican lawmakers met with Honduras' interim president on Friday in a challenge to Washington's condemnation of the coup that brought him to power.
The brief, amicable visit with the leaders of the coup that ousted President Manuel Zelaya highlights a divide in Washington, where the Obama administration is working to reinstate Zelaya but many conservatives side with the government installed after soldiers arrested the president in his pajamas and flew him into exile.

South Carolina Sen. Jim DeMint, the leader of the delegation, said before the trip that even calling Zelaya's overthrow a coup is "ill-informed and baseless."

DeMint and three representatives—Aaron Schock and Peter Roskam of Illinois and Doug Lamborn of Colorado—smiled for photographs in a book-lined office of the stately presidential palace with interim President Roberto Micheletti. They slipped out of the palace through a rear entrance, avoiding dozens of journalists waiting for a planned news conference that never materialized.

reply to post by Southern Guardian


Oh geez. If we invade Iran, it will be with the blessing of Obama and his cohorts. Not on the recommendation of Lindsay Graham. And I'll say it again, sanctions haven't worked thus far. There comes a time to back up words with actions. The belief that everything can be fixed with flowery words is a myth in this scenario. The saying "give them an inch and they'll take a mile" comes to mind.

reply to post by Southern Guardian


I could give a rats butt as well regarding his sexual orientation. I would suggest You read the opinion of Mike Rivero.

I don't care what anyone's sexual orientation is, but Graham as You pointed out did get elected based off of being a Conservative/family values.

Mike Rivero is giving reason for Graham's recent statements. He might have been forced to say what he did based off of being black mailed.