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A fact called death

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posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 02:59 PM
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If there is one thing we know for certain about death, then it is that sooner or later it is going to happen. You are going to die.
It's a fact of life and yet most people tend to avoid the subject whenever possible, as if it's taboo and not a suitable subject for the common conversation...
People talk about birth all the time, so why not about death?

So here are a couple of questions for you:

Do you often think about your own death?
Are you afraid to die?
And would you rather:
- die first and let all your loved ones grieve over you?
- or go last and experience all the suffering from seeing your loved ones die?
-------------------------------------

The second part of my post is slightly related to the first part and is about an ethical question I got in highschool, it was debated in my class for weeks and because of the nature of the debate I often think back on it.
I offer it here as a question, feel free to express your thoughts on it (or not).

There is a sinking ship on the ocean with 9 people on it. The ship has one lifeboat, but it only has 8 seats. Putting all 9 people in the lifeboat would cause it to sink aswell, so that's not an option.

the passenger list:
The captain of the ship
A young intelligent lawyer
An 80 year old man
with his 6 year old grandchild
A single mother with chilren at home
A married man with a wife at home
A respected schoolteacher
A pregnant lady
An elderly single doctor

Who stays on the sinking ship?




posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 03:07 PM
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I don't think about it often. if anything just thinking about the ways i would most likely die. I've settled between a car accident where i fly off a bridge do a barrel roll land right side up float to a beach get rescued by a super model but then brick falls on my head and i die, either that or going to war and dieing.

I'm not really scared of death, i just can't get over the fact that one minute I'm here and the next i am gone. Where do i go? Heaven doesn't seem to be the right answer to an atheist. I've just learned not to worry about the inevitable and just live my life.

I would rather go last and save my family the trouble of crying over me.

as for part 2 the answer is the 80 year old man. he is oldest and lived his life the most. even if we rescue him he will probably die soon anyway. The 6 year kid will just go back to his parents with the knowledge that his grandpa was a hero.



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 03:21 PM
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reply to post by GypsK
 


This is a "no brainer" ... everyone gets in the lifeboat EXCEPT the lawyer.

2nd line "Lets Kill All The Lawyers" ... written by somebody famous !!! ... but very very dead a long time ago ... who also published some other stuff !!!



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 03:26 PM
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I thought the Captain always went down with his ship.

I am not particularly afraid of death and my life hasn't been remarkable enough for many people to miss me after I'm gone. I'm also at the age where I doubt that I have much to contribute except for some things like my humor and encouragement of others.

I know that in a few years after my death, the memory of me will slide into obscurity and no one will even know I'm gone except for very few people.

If I was on the sinking ship, I would willingly volunteer to drown and die so that others could live; Then perhaps I could be viewed as a hero that as of now; I'm not! Just an unremarkable man living a very ordinary life.

I just live one day at a time; trying not to regret the past or project into the future and cause as little disturbance in the cosmos as possible.



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 03:31 PM
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I am afraid of dying? it depends what kind of death, violent, unwilling and untimely, well yes I do.

Do I think about death? Occurs I do, after all is unavoidable, but how do I will die that worries me a bit.

What I think about death? well dying is a natural process and one that we all have to face one time in our lives because is not second chance.

But If I am to live a fruitful life well into my old age I guess by that time I will probably welcome death.

Occurs is always death by sickness and that also worries me a bit.

[edit on 3-10-2009 by marg6043]



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 03:39 PM
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I dont know if death is a fact.

Theres no reason your body shouldnt repair damage indefinitly. There is a easy potential in biology for immortality. Immortality is pandoras box.

Will an ignorant man givin eternity find ultimate understanding? Id like to hope so, but how much suffering would it take to teach one immortal? It just seems more logical to have a gained understanding imbue immortality. Maybe a council that imbues immortality upon those deemed fit, or just a state of mind?

I suppose if you didnt want to live forever... there would be no reason for you to. How much our brain effects our biology is still a mystery.

[edit on 3-10-2009 by Wertdagf]



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 04:03 PM
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i agree. i also dont buy into the whole death is a fact mentality. our use of the brain i believe is far different from our current understanding.

[edit on 3-10-2009 by onequestion]



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 04:13 PM
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Do you often think about your own death?
I think about death everyday, it keeps me grounded.
It helps you focus on the important things in life (like posting on ATS)

Are you afraid to die?
I have come close to death a few times and each time it has been very calming even a blissful time.

I trained to be a spiritualist medium and that proved to me that there is life after death. This has had a much more profound effect on me, I realise that I am fully responsible for my time here.

Also the whole alien thing has helped me overcome nearly all fear, which is one of their aims. As fear holds us back and can paralyse us.



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 04:13 PM
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reply to post by GypsK
 


Do you often think about your own death? Yes, I do. I never really did before until I had a dream a couple years back were I was in an electric chair and the switch was flipped!
Are you afraid to die? No, I'm not.
And would you rather:... Though I can imagine it would be tough, I think I would rather die last so that no one would have to grieve over me.

Who stays on the sinking ship? The captain. He always goes down with the ship. It's probably his fault it's sinking anyway.



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 04:33 PM
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Pretty much sums up my feelings on the matter.



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 04:34 PM
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Well I actually think about Death probably as much as anyone does. Am I afraid? Of course I am. Its so unknown, nobody knows whats on the other side if anything, its a scary thought. For the question about rather dieing first or having to see all my loved ones die, I really dont know. I think either way you go, it sucks on both ends. Thats just the thing about Death. Its going to happen one way or another and it really sucks. But would I want to live forever? Probably not. But on the other hand we all wish we had more time to live out our hopes and dreams.

And for the other question, I would say the 80 year old man. I agree with the other poster who said he would be looked at as a hero from his grandchild.



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 04:35 PM
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1. Yes, I do think about my death. It is good to think about it - makes you work harder, want to seize life by the balls when you feel bored.

2. No. If you die, then you die. Since death is a fact and absolute then what is there to fear?

3. Hard question. I'd say I would take the second choice as I don't see death as something bad or suffering. If you believe in some form of spirituality then death is only a bridge and thus you can be happy for those who died because they are continuing on. Even if you don't believe in any spirituality, memory of a person is the immortality of that person. Whatever you believe. Let us not get into that one.

4. The 80 year old man by himself - me. I have lived a full life and the others have not so it is only fair. I would probably figure out something, build a raft and take the gamble.

S&F.



[edit on 3-10-2009 by DevilJin]



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 05:08 PM
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reply to post by GypsK
 


I think I worry about death as little as possible. When I'm dead, it won't matter to me anyway.



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 05:21 PM
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Or maybe fear doesnt even play a part in it at all. Maybe because of the fact we know its inevitable, is the reason we dont bother with the subject. I think people would rather just live there lives and avoid the subject completely. Whats the use in talking about it all the time? Talking about it isnt going to make it less scary and it sure isnt going to make it go away. Its better focus on life in the long run.



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 06:07 PM
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Originally posted by GypsK
Do you often think about your own death?


...rarely is accurate and those instances only pop up when some idiot asks me if i want to go on an ocean cruise with them or jump out of a perfectly functioning airplane...




Are you afraid to die?


...its not about fear... if i'm gonna die because of a stupid decision someone else made, that makes me angry enough to be a wee bit homicidal... if i'm gonna die because of a choice i made, well, then, thats fine - because - its my life and i'll do what i want... lmao...



And would you rather:
- die first and let all your loved ones grieve over you?
- or go last and experience all the suffering from seeing your loved ones die?



...the first option is narcissistic... people who think like that would be terribly shocked to discover that those they called their loved ones were glad and/or relieved to see them finally in a position where they could no longer be a "its all about me" pain in the butt...

...the second option presumes suffering is the only response to the deaths of loved ones and that doesnt work for me either...




the passenger list:
The captain of the ship


...the captain is NEVER on the passenger list - so - problem solved, lmao - but - what about the crew?... their fate is to be shark poop, huh?... gosh, how mean of the question thinker-upper to just ignore their existence - tsk, tsk, tsk...



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 06:14 PM
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i think i fear death more than most. it's probably one of the few things i am truly scared of.
i think about it everyday.

as long as i go before my son then i can handle it i suppose. i hate the thought of him grieving for me but i don't think i could handle having to deal with his death. i would probably commit suicide right there on the spot.
whats the point of living if my boy is not around



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 07:35 PM
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So here are a couple of questions for you:

Do you often think about your own death?
Totally, I wonder what it will be like, what religion is right as far as where we go when we die.
Are you afraid to die?
There is a certain fear of death that can be attributed to self preservation. I am not afraid to die, but I will do everything I can to survive.
And would you rather:
- die first and let all your loved ones grieve over you?
- or go last and experience all the suffering from seeing your loved ones die?
Hopefully either one depending on the way that either one would help others survive if they had a fighting chance.



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 08:23 PM
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I am not afraid of dying and in a strange way I am quite looking forward to it though not so much that I will go and jump in front of a bus. Death for me will be the ultimate next step and something amazing. I used to think about death when I considered suicide as a young man, mixed up with a bad life and bad people but these days I am on good terms with death and my mind is fully comprehensible on the subject.

I saw my first death as a nine year old boy and strangely enough nine people died right in front of me in horrific circumstances in the jungles of Guyana (Port Kaituma 1978). Since then I have seen many other deaths as a soldier and from friends who have committed suicide so I like to think that I have a well balanced and objective perspective on death. It is not the bogyman we are led to believe.

As I am not a believer in any god I wonder if all there is after death is simply oblivion and no more thought. If this is correct then it is of no worry to me because if that is what is waiting for the sentient then I see no reason to be concerned if oblivion is the end of all thought.

Death is something that should not concern or reason alarm in my opinion - unless death involves being forced to watch X factor whilst being fed feet first into a wood chipper set to slow of course.

I would rather die first for selfish reasons. I have seen the grief of others for those they love and it is the single worst thing to see, a look in their eye, a change in their character, like a diminishing of them at an emotional and physical level. I think of myself as a strong minded person but from seeing this more than once I imagine grief is the worst of any hells this life has to offer a person. For this simple and yes, selfish reason I would wish to die first and not worry about those I leave behind because as there is no definitive proof of an afterlife I happily assume that there is nothing but oblivion.

Therefore it will not matter who grieves for me because I assume I will be devoid of thought anyway. If there is a hell I will give any devil poking me into the fire a tough time and if there is a heaven I will be upset that I have more sets of rules I am expected to follow. If there is reincarnation I will not be pleased as I have no wish to come back to this sewer of pain anytime soon and will fight tooth and nail to stay carnated. If there a choice of where I can be reincarnated then I will be happier. I have been a good person with much empathy and I have helped many so I think I may have a few points to spend in that regard. Though it was never about gaining points, it was always about being able to look favourably at myself in the mirror when I shave or brush my teeth.

One man I knew (my wife’s father) who was dying said he would let us know what it is like and he never did. Once he was dead he was dead and no paranormal events took place. I assume oblivion was why he did not contact us so I hope to die first and never experience the pain of loved loss. I gave my father in-law incentive by telling him I would dig him up and kick his backside if he did not give us a sign but obviously this was not incentive enough.

Unfortunately (in the context of who dies first) I am very healthy and a non smoker, I eat well and train hard in cardio vascular. I meditate and I work out very hard in other ways and am always hill walking and out and about in the highlands. I rarely get sick and I heal very quickly.
My wife and my eldest daughter both smoke. My wife is not of a healthy disposition and she gets ill often. I have to concede that it is likely she will die before me but I keep my fingers crossed that I beat her to the death boat.

As to the sinking ship scenario I would prefer none to be left behind but if I had to choose then I would pick the captain because it was his ship and I put my life in his hands. He failed his duty in the most ultimate of ways by having his vessel slip out from under us. He is no longer a captain at that point; he is just another Joe looking for safe passage on a lifeboat. I would have been rather cross with him anyway so better he just stay on board like a gentleman and go down with his vessel.

[edit on 3-10-2009 by SmokeJaguar67]



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 08:43 PM
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actually, death is not a fact.

As a MATTER of Fact, death does NOT exist.

We are all taught that energy in a closed system cannot be destroyed, it can only change forms.

Therefore, how can you say death is a matter of fact, when their are no facts on death. Death is an assumption, and at the current state of technology, it cannot be proven.

All we know is that OUR LIFE FORCE leaves the body after it can no longer use it. God himself says we will not die, and i have no religious ties and i believe Him.

Pretty simple honestly, the world makes so much money off of this whole, "death" idea. people go crazy, but when they pass this life for the next, they realize, omgosh, death does not exist!



posted on Oct, 3 2009 @ 10:00 PM
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Originally posted by Codazzle
actually, death is not a fact.

As a MATTER of Fact, death does NOT exist.

We are all taught that energy in a closed system cannot be destroyed, it can only change forms.

Therefore, how can you say death is a matter of fact, when their are no facts on death. Death is an assumption, and at the current state of technology, it cannot be proven.

All we know is that OUR LIFE FORCE leaves the body after it can no longer use it. God himself says we will not die, and i have no religious ties and i believe Him.

Pretty simple honestly, the world makes so much money off of this whole, "death" idea. people go crazy, but when they pass this life for the next, they realize, omgosh, death does not exist!


Your reasoning still does not change death being a fact. You are merely stating that death is a pathway and that pathway must be cross in order to go beyond. A better statement would be death is a fact but not a complete end.




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