A moment of silence for all the dead Jihadists

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posted on Oct, 1 2009 @ 11:33 PM
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Here is a email I just received. It's relevant to this thread.

This is for all Americans to hear...no matter what your politics are. Take time to read it....a frightening message.


Date: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 2:53 PM

Geert Wilders is a Dutch Member of Parliament.
America as the last man standing





Here is the speech of Geert Wilders, Chairman, Party for Freedom, the Netherlands, at the Four Seasons, New York, introducing an Alliance of Patriots and announcing the Facing Jihad Conference in Jerusalem.



Dear Friends,

Thank you very much for inviting me.

I come to America with a mission. All is not well in the old world. There is a tremendous danger looming, and it is very difficult to be optimistic. We might be in the final stages of the Islamization of Europe. This not only is a clear and present danger to the future of Europe itself, it is a threat to America and the sheer survival of the West. The United States as the last bastion of Western civilization, facing an Islamic Europe.


First I will describe the situation on the ground in Europe... Then, I will say a few things about Islam. To close I will tell you about a meeting in Jerusalem.


The Europe you know is changing.

You have probably seen the landmarks. But in all of these cities, sometimes a few blocks away from your tourist destination, there is another world. It is the world of the parallel society created by? Muslim mass-migration.

All throughout Europe a new reality is rising: entire Muslim neighborhoods where very few indigenous people reside or are even seen. And if they are, they might regret it. This goes for the police as well. It's the world of head scarves, where women walk around in figureless tents, with baby strollers and a group of children. Their husbands, or slaveholders if you prefer, walk three steps ahead. With mosques on many street corners. The shops have signs you and I cannot read. You will be hard-pressed to find any economic activity. These are Muslim ghettos controlled by religious fanatics. These are Muslim neighborhoods, and they are mushrooming in every city across Europe. These are the building-blocks for territorial control of increasingly larger portions of Europe, street by street, neighborhood by neighborhood, city by city.


There are now thousands of mosques throughout Europe. With larger congregations than there are in churches. And in every European city there are plans to build super-mosques that will dwarf every church in the region. Clearly, the signal is: we rule.


Many European cities are already one-quarter Muslim: just take Amsterdam, Marseille and Malmo in Sweden... In many cities the majority of the under-18 population is Muslim.. Paris is now surrounded by a ring of Muslim neighborhoods. Mohammed is the most popular name among boys in many cities.



In some elementary schools in Amsterdam the farm can no longer be mentioned, because that would also mean mentioning the pig, and that would be an insult to Muslims.



Many state schools in Belgium and Denmark only serve halal food to all pupils. In once-tolerant Amsterdam gays are beaten up almost exclusively by Muslims. Non-Muslim women routinely hear 'whore, whore'. Satellite dishes are not pointed to local TV stations, but to stations in the country of origin.



In France school teachers are advised to avoid authors deemed offensive to Muslims, including Voltaire and Diderot; the same is increasingly true of Darwin. The history of the Holocaust can no longer be taught because of Muslim sensitivity.



In England Sharia courts are now officially part of the British legal system Many neighborhoods in France are no-go areas for women without head scarves. Last week a man almost died after being beaten up by Muslims in Brussels, because he was drinking during the Ramadan.



Jews are fleeing France in record numbers, on the run for the worst wave of anti-Semitism since World War II. French is now commonly spoken on the streets of Tel Aviv and Netanya, Israel. I could go on forever with stories like this. Stories about Islamization.


A total of fifty-four million Muslims now live in Europe. San Diego University recently calculated that a staggering 25 percent of the population in Europe will be Muslim just 12 years from now. Bernhard Lewis has predicted a Muslim majority by the end of this century.


Now these are just numbers. And the numbers would not be threatening if the Muslim-immigrants had a strong desire to assimilate. But there are few signs of that. The Pew Research Center reported that half of French Muslims see their loyalty to Islam as greater than their loyalty to France. One-third of French Muslims do not object to suicide attacks. The British Centre for Social Cohesion reported that one-third of British Muslim students are in favor of a worldwide caliphate. Muslims demand what they call 'respect'. And this is how we give them respect. We have Muslim official state holidays.


The Christian-Democratic attorney general is willing to accept Sharia in the Netherlands if there is a Muslim majority. We have cabinet members with passports from Morocco and Turkey.


Muslim demands are supported by unlawful behavior, ranging from petty crimes and random violence, for example against ambulance workers and bus drivers, to small-scale riots. Paris has seen its uprising in the low-income suburbs, the banlieus. I call the perpetrators 'settlers'. Because that is what they are. They do not come to integrate into our societies, they come to integrate our society into their Dar-al-Islam. Therefore, they are settlers.


Much of this street violence I mentioned is directed exclusively against non-Muslims, forcing many native people to leave their neighborhoods, their cities, their countries. Moreover, Muslims are now a swing vote not to be ignored. I


The second thing you need to know is the importance of Mohammed the prophet. His behavior is an example to all Muslims and cannot be criticized. Now, if Mohammed had been a man of peace, let us say like Ghandi and Mother Theresa wrapped in one, there would be no problem. But Mohammed was a warlord, a mass murderer, a pedophile, and had several marriages - at the same time. Islamic tradition tells us how he fought in battles, how he had his enemies murdered and even had prisoners of war executed. Mohammed himself slaughtered the Jewish tribe of Banu Qurayza. (con't below)

[edit on 1-10-2009 by Muundoggie]




posted on Oct, 1 2009 @ 11:34 PM
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reply to post by oozyism
 




No nono the question again:

Why do you think the Jihadists are fighting you? Do you believe it is because they want virgins or because they want everyone to be Muslims? Or because they just hate you?


They are fighting us for several reasons.
1. They dont like our support of Israel.
2. They think we abuse the Palestinians, even though we give them lots of aid each year.
3. They think we are all infidels because of our lifestyles.

The point is we can support who we like and who we dont, and they can attack us for it, and we can hunt them down and kill them for attacking us. Its pretty simple. Two groups who disagree and cannot resolve it by talking must go to war to settle their differences or must agree to disagree.



posted on Oct, 1 2009 @ 11:36 PM
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If it is good for Islam, it is good. If it is bad for Islam, it is bad.


Let no one fool you about Islam being a religion. Sure, it has a god, and a here-after, and 72 virgins. But in its essence Islam is a political ideology. It is a system that lays down detailed rules for society and the life of every person. Islam wants to dictate every aspect of life. Islam means 'submission'. Islam is not compatible with freedom and democracy, because what it strives for is Sharia. If you want to compare Islam to anything, compare it to communism or national-socialism, these are all totalitarian ideologies.


Now you know why Winston Churchill called Islam 'the most retrograde force in the world', and why he compared Mein Kampf to the Quran. The public has wholeheartedly accepted the Palestinian narrative, and sees Israel as the aggressor. I have lived in this country and visited it dozens of times. I support Israel. First, because it is the Jewish homeland after two thousand years of exile up to and including Auschwitz, second because it is a democracy, and third because Israel is our first line of defense.

This tiny country is situated on the fault line of jihad, frustrating Islam's territorial advance. Israel is facing the front lines of jihad, like Kashmir, Kosovo, the Philippines, Southern Thailand, Darfur in Sudan, Lebanon, and Aceh in Indonesia. Israel is simply in the way. The same way West-Berlin was during the Cold War.

The war against Israel is not a war against Israel. It is a war against the West. It is jihad. Israel is simply receiving the blows that are meant for all of us. If there would have been no Israel, Islamic imperialism would have found other venues to release its energy and its desire for conquest. Thanks to Israeli parents who send their children to the army and lay awake at night, parents in Europe and America can sleep well and dream, unaware of the dangers looming.


Many in Europe argue in favor of abandoning Israel in order to address the grievances of our Muslim minorities. But if Israel were, God forbid, to go down, it would not bring any solace to the West It would not mean our Muslim minorities would all of a sudden change their behavior, and accept our values. On the contrary, the end of Israel would give enormous encouragement to the forces of Islam. They would, and rightly so, see the demise of Israel as proof that the West is weak, and doomed. The end of Israel would not mean the end of our problems with Islam, but only the beginning. It would mean the start of the final battle for world domination. If they can get Israel, they can get everything. So-called journalists volunteer to label any and all critics of Islamization as a 'right-wing extremists' or 'racists'. In my country, the Netherlands, 60 percent of the population now sees the mass immigration of Muslims as the number one policy mistake since World War II. And another 60 percent sees Islam as the biggest threat. Yet there is a danger greater danger than terrorist attacks, the scenario of America as the last man standing. The lights may go out in Europe faster than you can imagine. An Islamic Europe means a Europe without freedom and democracy, an economic wasteland, an intellectual nightmare, and a lo s s of military might for America - as its a llies will turn into enemies, enemies with atomic bombs. With an Islamic Europe, it would be up to America alone to preserve the heritage of Rome, Athens and Jerusalem.


Dear friends, liberty is the most precious of gifts. My generation never had to fight for this freedom, it was offered to us on a silver platter, by people who fought for it with their lives. All throughout Europe American cemeteries remind us of the young boys who never made it home, and whose memory we cherish. My generation does not own this freedom; we are merely its custodians. We can only hand over this hard won liberty to Europe's children in the same state in which it was offered to us. We cannot strike a deal with mullahs and imams. Future generations would never forgive us. We cannot squander our liberties. We simply do not have the right to do so.



posted on Oct, 1 2009 @ 11:39 PM
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Originally posted by oozyism
Let's do this step by step because I'm getting the feeling that most of you are mis-informed.

Why do you think the Jihadists are fighting you? Do you believe it is because they want virgins or because they want everyone to be Muslims? Or because they just hate you?


I'm gonna jump in on this because I think defining this point is critical...


A small percentage of Muslims who are from the extreme, radical and violent wing of Islamic Fundamentalism, and who are "...passionate, [deeply] religious and anti-Western..." might dwell on passages or verses dealing with conflict, war, and resistance to oppression. Many conclude that the Qur'an expects them to engage in acts of terrorism, assassinations, suicide bombings, armed aggression against persons of other religions, oppression of women, executing innocent persons, etc.



Those Muslim Fundamentalists who are not extreme, violent and radical, and those Muslims from mainline or liberal wings of the religion might concentrate on passages and themes of spirituality, justice, personal struggle, peace, freedom, etc.


Extremists are not representative of the whole of Islam, TRUE, but they are who "we" are fighting under the label of terrorist and as such, I have zero tolerance for what they do...

Source



posted on Oct, 1 2009 @ 11:42 PM
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Originally posted by poedxsoldiervet
reply to post by oozyism
 


I was a Soldier who fought in Iraq, and by all means your entitled to your opinion. Now let me tell you mine, dont come crying to people like me when the boogeyman (feds or jihdist come looking for you.) I fought these men, they stand for oppression of women, rule by terror, the stand for spreading ISLAM worldwide. So if you want to honor these men, I will put you in there column.

By no means am I standing for the corruption known as the US goverment, I wouldnt piss on any of them if they were on fire (yes the beloved messiah included) the goverment goes in that category along with the Jidist, bankers, corperate greed, far left loons, far right loons, and now you.


Thank you for your service and I 100% agree with you.

Why would you want to honor individuals who load themselves up with TNT, walk into a coffee shop, and blow up 40-50 innocent people just due to a religious difference.

Why not have a moment of silence for those responsible for 9/11 as well...



posted on Oct, 1 2009 @ 11:52 PM
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reply to post by oozyism
 
Well, I see the predictable response is in full swing. Fair play to you, my friend.
On a personal note, I wouldn't bother to commemorate anyone who intentionally set out to kill someone, regardless of their motives. My heroes are those who stood unarmed against their aggressors to shame them into desisting, by their own death if necessary.
I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have the courage not to fight back. That said, I'll not criticise anyone who does, for doing so anyway; even if I do criticise their society.
This being the internet, if someone hasn't already, do please begin the contrived & context-free comparisons &/or references to Hitler et al.



posted on Oct, 1 2009 @ 11:55 PM
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reply to post by nenothtu
 





Wow. This thread blew me away. Had to step out and huff down a few smokes to get my nerves back in order.

Just so you know you are a great patriot





I was all set to ask Oozzyism, or whatever that handle is, just what rock he crawled out from under. Then he mentioned having lived in Afghanistan. THEN he mentioned living in the Peshawar Refugee Camp. I began to suspect what rock he crawled out from under.

WOW.. OK let's continue...




Then he mentioned "mullah" Omar.

OHH not Mullah Omar...




That sealed it, for me. Oozy, I KNOW what rock you crawled out from under. I don't know what country you live in now, but I'm willing to bet it ain't the USA, because I'm relatively sure you're on one of those "lists" of folks that don't make it past customs without a visit to the crossbar hotel.

I live in New Zealand


Yeah sure arrest me for expressing my views, I guess freedom of speech only applies when it is on the power's side. I hope you understand that





Your propagandistic attempt to equate Taliban and Al Quaeda "freedom fighters" killing civilians with US professional soldiers killing civilians is an epic FAIL. It has a fatal flaw, no pun intended.

Ohh we are going to see what that flaw is, soooo exciting.




US professional soldiers target MILITARY personnel, including your precious "freedom fighters". If civilians are being used as shield by your "brave warriors", they die too.

So they say, and Al-Qaeda says they don't target civilians.

Al Qaeda No. 2: We don't kill innocents


And what about the drone attacks:

Fourteen Iraqis were reported killed and five injured early yesterday morning after an American war plane obliterated a family house in the north of the country. The military said it was a mistake.

Were civilians being taken as human shields?




In contrast, your "holy warriors" target CIVILIANS, and if a WARRIOR is in the way, he dies too.

That is something you have to prove:

Al Qaeda No. 2: We don't kill innocents





BIG damn difference. The only military target on 9-11 was the Pentagon, and most of those fellows (but not all) are just "chairborne commandos", and thus not much of a threat.

ATS is still cautious to blame Al-Qaeda for the attacks.




In the WTC, 50,000 CIVILIANS were targetted. Maybe your intel told you it was a seething nest of Rangers and Special Forces disguised as civilians, eh?

And we are still investigating the attacks. New York citizen filled a petition you should know that





That was a PATHETIC attempt at propaganda, accidentally targetted at an audience that is accustomed to THINKING.

Propaganda, nothing I wrote was propaganda, since you are accusing me of such you need to prove it





I'm acquainted with an older generation of mujahideen. Men with honor, unlike the current crop. I can think of NO instance in which those men intentionally targetted civilians. Not so with your current "holy warriors".

The older generation of mujahideen served America's purpose, the new generation doesn't. That is why the propaganda against them. See it is very simple but people seem it is complicated. How can you start an unjustified war? By demonizing your enemy, and that is what America has done. In your head the Jihadists are some sort of demons who want to take over the world and kill who ever doesn't convert to Islam.




THEY are cowards. THEY choose to fight those whom they hope can't fight back.

So many people call them cowards but the truth is that they are the only one fighting the worlds most powerful nation. Common, get real. Are you living in a dream world? Not even Russia has the balls to step against the Great Almighty US.




Your fathers were MUCH better men, and I wish they had raised you better. I reckon they were too busy killing enemy SOLDIERS to give you the attention you needed.

Our fathers fought for the same cause, to get rid of foreign occupiers and their sons are doing the same thing. The only difference is that our fathers were fighting your enemy, see at this point I could call you guys cowards for letting the mujahideen do the fighting, the same mujahideen who are fighting America right now.

[edit on 2-10-2009 by oozyism]



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:05 AM
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reply to post by oozyism
 




Our fathers fought for the same cause, to get rid of foreign occupiers and their sons are doing the same thing. The only difference is that our fathers were fighting your enemy, see at this point I could call you guys cowards for letting the mujahideen do the fighting, the same mujahideen who are fighting America right now.


You could just call us smart, instead of cowards. We never trully supported the mujahideen. We were just living by the enemy of my enemy is my friend. The only support you received in Afghanistan was to support our goal of knocking the USSR down a peg.

Its kind of like what Iran is doing with HAMAS. They dont care about the Palestinians, they are just using HAMAS to attack their enemy Israel. It is a smart tactic if you are on the winning side. Too bad for you that HAMAS can only lob a few missles at Israel or send a few suicide bombers before Isreael has enough and kicks the living crap out of them.

The mujahideen needs to wisen up and quit being used by everyone else and quit getting the poor Palestinian civilians mixed up in the middle of it.



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:06 AM
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Originally posted by oozyism
ATS is still cautious to blame Al-Qaeda for the attacks.


ATS has nothing to do with whether Al-Qaeda did it or not...

I honestly don't care if ATS does or not. That's not what they are here for. They are here to present a fair, open and honest forum in which people should be able to debate and discuss openly any subject as long as it doesn't violate the T & C. Other than that ATS will never choose sides. If they ever did they would loose 50% or more of their members.

Lame!


[edit on 2-10-2009 by SLAYER69]



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:08 AM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


I just dont see how he can accuse ATS of taking sides against him for his posts when they havent deleted one of them, given him a warning or anything.



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:09 AM
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hey military guys,

is there a US equivalent to the al qaeda rule number 2? if so can you post it dozens of times with clips from articles of little significance to the topic?

i cant blame people who are actually defending their homes...whether they need to or think they need to...but other than that...i respect the enemy(as human beings) but i dont revere them



[edit on 2-10-2009 by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest]



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:12 AM
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Yes the jihadists definately deserve a moment of silence

In said moment of silence, I believe the jihadists will probably be convincing another mentally retarded person to blow themselves up... or giving somone a backpack full of explosives, not telling them whats inside and using a remote detonator when the subject is close to Coalition Forces...

perhaps they will be looking for a pregnant lady to blow herself up, because of restrictions U.S. Soldiers have when it comes to handling and searching a female...

hmmm...

Maybe I'm wrong, but honor definately seems to be lacking here...



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:14 AM
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Oh and one more thing Oozy, if we didnt support your fathers in Afghanistan, they would all either be dead or living in some Russian prison camp for the rest of their lives. I guess we made a mistake.



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:15 AM
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Oozy, just a quick question.

I realize that the US military has indeed caused A LOT of civilian casualities and it cannot be denied.

What about suicide bombers who attack PURELY civilians targets? Suicide bombers who target areas wherein US military units are absolutely NOT PRESENT? What is your opinion on this?

Example: A suicide commando bombs a nursery school, with no US soldiers in that specific target.

Consequence = Schoolchildren die. US army/marines stay chilling back in camp.




[edit on 2-10-2009 by btyoung21]

[edit on 2-10-2009 by btyoung21]



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:16 AM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


Glad to see you backk oozy. Thought Slayer was chasing you off. Got a question for you.

You keep talking about Al-qadea being at a disadvantage. Don't you think it is Al-Qaeda's fault for being at a disadvantage?

Maybe they should have thought twice as hard before picking a fight.

[edit on 2-10-2009 by jam321]



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:18 AM
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Originally posted by TacoBellMakesGas
reply to post by oozyism
 


They are fighting us for several reasons.
1. They dont like our support of Israel.
2. They think we abuse the Palestinians, even though we give them lots of aid each year.
3. They think we are all infidels because of our lifestyles.

The point is we can support who we like and who we dont, and they can attack us for it, and we can hunt them down and kill them for attacking us. Its pretty simple. Two groups who disagree and cannot resolve it by talking must go to war to settle their differences or must agree to disagree.


What about Saddam, who do they blame Saddam for?

In 1959, there was a failed assassination attempt on Qasim. The failed assassin was none other than a young Saddam Hussein. In 1963, a CIA-organized coup did successfully assassinate Qasim and Saddam's Ba'ath Party came to power for the first time. Saddam returned from exile in Egypt and took up the key post as head of Iraq's secret service. The CIA then provided the new pliant, Iraqi regime with the names of thousands of communists, and other leftist activists and organizers. Thousands of these supporters of Qasim and his policies were soon dead in a rampage of mass murder carried out by the CIA's close friends in Iraq.

Link

Qasim was democratically elected. Now who do you think they blame for Saddam's atrocities? The killings of Shias and Kurds? The Iranian war? Why do you think Iran hates America?

What about Venezuela? America is directly responsible for so many atrocities all across the world. The fact that America is backing dictator to stay in power in middle east is another problem as a whole.

Now to be fair, America has also taken positive steps. We can't just focus on the negatives, but for the sake of staying on topic we must.

These Jihadists are fighting against the negatives of America.



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:23 AM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


This is the thing Ooz, what they see as things we have done wrong are things that can be seen as doing what is in our best interests at any particular time. The world is complicated. We make mistakes from time to time. The thing is we are doing what we believe is in our best interests and the mujahideen/AlQueda/Extreme muslims are doing what they think is in their best interests. This is why you have war, because our interests dont match. The problem is when they attack us then it is our right and even duty to do our best to destroy them before they destroy us. We are all innocent and we are all guilty on both sides. It is just the way it is. I just hope we come out on top and they dont.



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:23 AM
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Originally posted by SLAYER69


ATS has nothing to do with whether Al-Qaeda did it or not...

I honestly don't care if ATS does or not. That's not what they are here for. They are here to present a fair, open and honest forum in which people should be able to debate and discuss openly any subject as long as it doesn't violate the T & C. Other than that ATS will never choose sides. If they ever did they would loose 50% or more of their members.

Lame!


[edit on 2-10-2009 by SLAYER69]

I'm already overwhelmed with replies, you should wait your turn
Any comment can be taken out of context and turned to what it is not. My comment relates to the fact that ATS is still asking questions just like me.



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:23 AM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


Another question

based on your words below.


These Jihadists are fighting against the negatives of America.


Do you not feel that the Jihadist could have found a better way to rebel against the negatives of America rather than fighting and suicide bombings?



posted on Oct, 2 2009 @ 12:27 AM
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Originally posted by TacoBellMakesGas
reply to post by oozyism
 


This is the thing Ooz, what they see as things we have done wrong are things that can be seen as doing what is in our best interests at any particular time. The world is complicated. We make mistakes from time to time. The thing is we are doing what we believe is in our best interests and the mujahideen/AlQueda/Extreme muslims are doing what they think is in their best interests. This is why you have war, because our interests dont match. The problem is when they attack us then it is our right and even duty to do our best to destroy them before they destroy us. We are all innocent and we are all guilty on both sides. It is just the way it is. I just hope we come out on top and they dont.

Do you have any idea what you are saying? You are saying disagreements are solved through war, that mentality should be called terrorism.

I guess the reason why speak in that manner has to do with your arrogance, you probably think that America will never be in disadvantageous position.





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