You will face ONE YEAR in prison for resisting ObamaCare

reply to post by Iseekthetruth!!!!!!!!


The government is not taking over anything, but private insurance will without public option.

Mandatory private insurance is not option at all without competition.

That is the problem that people seems to not understand after been drilled that is all about socialism.

No, is not when the some of the biggest benefactors in Washington are big insurance companies, oil and big pharma.

Now can anybody else see the agenda here.

Socialism propaganda is nothing but a hoax.

You didn't answer my question so I would be led to beleive that you do not have a job and are already bleeding the system. If Im wrong then forgive me.
I love seeing so many people ready to jump into somthing my brother, father and grandfather faught so hard to end. Before you jump and say that social security is the same and if I dont want the government health care then i shouldn't have SS eather, so be it I will gladly die without somone else picking up the tab and will never see what I have paid in anyway due to the fact that I have to be 75 to draw, be gone before then!

Originally posted by uspatriot109
You didn't answer my question so I would be led to beleive that you do not have a job and are already bleeding the system. If Im wrong then forgive me.
I love seeing so many people ready to jump into somthing my brother, father and grandfather faught so hard to end. Before you jump and say that social security is the same and if I dont want the government health care then i shouldn't have SS eather, so be it I will gladly die without somone else picking up the tab and will never see what I have paid in anyway due to the fact that I have to be 75 to draw, be gone before then!

Are you serious? Yes I have a job! Bleeding the system? Hardly, my tax rate is about the highest there is. Yeah, easy to make such absurd claims now, you just may feel differently if you are diagnosed with Cancer, particularly a curable form, But hey, you will just not get treatment if you can't afford it right? And cheerfully die! Yeah right. How amazingly foolish.

[edit on 1-10-2009 by OldDragger]

Easy to say you are in a high tax bracket on here to! If you have a job and are in a High tax bracket then you pay your own insurance? Do you realy believe that your rate will go down? And yes I am ready when my time comes thank you. I have Ins.

I do think that there needs to be heath-care reform. But there are better ways of doing it than the current health-care bill.

As for the grassroots letter? This was received in an email by a peer of mine who sent it to me.
I do not agree with everything in the letter. Mainly, I'm trying to formulate a concrete opinion on all of this. The bill itself is long, complicated and I do not have the time or inclination to slag through the thing. I have a life. I need paraphrase!

What parts of the bill do you like OR hate?

I do like that there will no longer be any pre-existing conditions. I've hated that since I was a child and now that my husband has severe asthma... yeah.

Ok I will not change your mind and you will NOT change mine, so lets call It a draw and I will back out of the forum. Thanks.

reply to post by uspatriot109


I personally have insurance through my Wife's law firm, as it's a much bigger entity and the rate is cheaper. Competition makes for cheaper rates, so does regulation. I not only am concerned for myself, but for poorer citizens of my country. Imagine that!
I know of one person that has to pay $2,500.00 a month for insurance for he and his wife, both over 65. That 30 grand a year folks! He can afford it, but many people don't even make the much yearly! Guess they are just out of luck huh?

reply to post by OldDragger


You can opt out of car insurance.

By not owning a car or not having a driver's license.

Can you opt out of living?

I understand the argument, but this is a line the govt. has NO RIGHT to cross.

seriously people...

health insurance and car insurance are two different things. i have car insurance because i may hit someone else. that is it. the only mandatory car insurance is liability, which covers me not... if i have liability only, and i go out and crash into a tree, the insurance does not cover the damage.

under obama care we are STILL PAYING FOR OTHERS!

they are going to increase taxes, they are not calling it taxes, but we will see an increase in out of pocket expenses. that is supposed to be for your health.

but what if i am a super healthy 27 year old who works out frequently and has zero health issues? and i dont for the next say 20 years? i am still paying all that time for services i will never be rendered, and by the time i need it my rates will be readjusted anyway.

this is simply a way for insurance companies and big pharma to survive.

think about it. no obama care + recession means americans choosing to simply stay at home and self medicate instead of going to the doc for a cold because, well, why not its free, and then when i get to the doc, i may as well get the pills, why not its free, even though i would most times be better off in the long run by staying at home because a) my immune systems strengthens by naturally battling the illness... b) my pocket book makes it easier for me to miss a few days of work... and c) less mutating viruses becoming drug resistant.

the majority of insurance claims are not life changing surgeries, its the flu, the common cold, minor accidents cuts scrapes and bruises. people pay 500 dollars a month in health insurance for years only to have the same insurance companies that obama care will be forcing on us say to them, "you gotta pay some of this bill too"

and as far as capping the doctors salary, dumb dumb dumb. bailout government is ok with letting companies give execs big bonuses with taxpayer dollars to keep the competitive edge, so what makes you think hospitals wont do the same for thier docs? and who could blame them? if i was a doctor and i had an option of staying in america making a capped salary or going to some other country and getting paid more, why the heck would i stay?

bottom line, all this is gonna do is cause more people to go to the doc needlessly, get drugs that they dont need, cause profit increase for insurance and big pharm, and guess what, you still pay more in the end!!! all the while losing yet another bit of freedom and one more life choice that you as an individual can make.

next thing you know they are gonna make EVERYONE get a cellphone because it saves dollars and lives in cases of emergencies... or maybe everyone will be forced to vote in all elections to ensure true representation of the people. or maybe everyone will be forces to pay for college for thier kids? OOH! i know!! we are all forced to get gps tracking devices so that we are better able to find missing persons and thus save tax dollars! better yet! all people who have disease and disfigurement due to hereditery issues are forced to get snipped to prevent future drain on the economy! all illegal aliens are allowed to be citizens because its cheaper than deporting now that they are covered under obama care (and they are)!!

people dont get the basic concept. what is the cost of freedom? the freedom to make life decisions that affect your life without some big brother figure telling you what to do? when will people value this one life and the ability to live it the way they please with the only governing factor being the willingness to accept consequence?

our founding fathers would turn thier backs upon the american people for allowing the blood, tears, the lives of thier sons and daughters, brothers and sisters, even thier very own lives go to waste! they gave it all! risked it all! on PRINCIPLE! the principle that humans are not animals to be led around! that all people inherit upon birht certain rights! these rights that come with the gift of conciousness, free will, and the ability to communicate and reason! these things alone give you the ability to be free, you jut have to exercise it!

the principle of this is that first we lost our privacy, then we lost our domestic tranquility, now we continue to lose our liberties under the guise of a helping hand!

it seems that every time they impose upon this nation an all governing rule to better our lives, it hinders our freedoms! but freedoms are gained through risk, through sacrifice!

DO NOT SACRIFICE YOU RFREEDOMS FOR GAINS! GAIN FREEDOM THROUGH SACRIFICE!

i go to work every day, with my life on the line, i have served almost 9 years in the military, i joined before 9-11. i joined to honor my grandfather who sacrificed his health, his time, his safety, to fight on foriegn shores for the freedoms of others, this is the least i can do to pay him back!

you people owe it to all in you r family who bled and died in the wars of our past that earned us the right to say i am an AMERICAN and i am FREE.

YOU CANNOT SAY THAT ANYMORE! you do not have the right nor the circumstance to say this!

how are you free??????? in what way?

you can travel the world? but only under watchful eye!
you can communicate freely with your fellow americans? but only as long as you do not talk about cirtain things becaus e they listen!
you are free to defend yourself and bear arms! but only if they know exactly what arms you have and as long as it is in thier standard.
you have the right to own land! bt they can at ANY TIME lay easement and take it away for thier needs, or violate its privacy for thier OWN insecurities.
you have the right to print press!! but only through censorship and under scrutinous eyes!
you have the right to vote! but the people that represent you have their own right to disagree!
you have the right to petition your govenment! but they fear you not and do not listen!
you have the right to shelter! but not even that right is secure because now the government owns the mortgage!
you have the right to an oppinion! but you must live in fear of expressing it publically because you may be called a terrorist!

WAKE
UP
AMERICA

and reclaim the most important thing there is!!

the right, the ability, and the true PRIVILAGE to call yourself free, and the knowledge that when you say you are FREE, you are TRULY FREE.

Bwahaha...you made this thread because you received an e-mail, is that your verified factual source !!

Originally posted by Iseekthetruth!!!!!!!!
The public option is Not the only thing wrong with these bills.
I would encourage you ALL to go look at the origional bill and it's amendments. There are Much better answers out there than the Government takeover, or control of our health care.

What original bill? as far as I know there are two-four Bills and none of them have been passed yet.
As per the current Health Care reform there is no FACT suggesting people will be imprisonment. Here is what it says;[

Claim: Page 167: Any individual who doesn’t have acceptable health care (according to the government) will be taxed 2.5% of income.

True. This is the mechanism in the bill to enforce the individual mandate requiring everyone to have insurance. A person who doesn’t have insurance that meets minimum benefit standards (or other acceptable coverage, such as a plan that was grandfathered in) would pay a penalty of 2.5 percent of modified adjusted gross income for the year. The total penalty can’t exceed a national average premium for individual coverage, or family coverage if applicable.

Source: www.factcheck.org...

or if you would really like to educate yourself why is individual mandate needed

Improving the Individual Market.
Policymakers, as well as members of our community, are concerned that individuals with pre-existing conditions often have difficulty obtaining coverage. The flip side of this problem, however, is that many people put off getting insurance until after a medical problem has developed, thereby driving up coverage costs for everyone else. We propose to address this dual challenge head-on by making coverage broadly and fairly available:

• Combine guarantee-issue coverage with no pre-existing condition exclusions with an enforceable individual mandate: For guarantee-issue to work, it is necessary for everyone to be brought into the system and participate in obtaining coverage. Achieving this objective will require
specific attention to the mechanisms for making the mandate enforceable and may require coordinated action at multiple levels of government.

Indeed, the importance of combining guarantee issue with an enforceable individual mandate is borne out by research and experience from the states. For example, a report by Milliman, Inc. found that states that enacted guarantee-issue laws in the absence of an individual coverage requirement saw a rise in insurance premiums, a reduction of individual insurance enrollment, and no significant decrease in the number of uninsured.

Source: www.americanhealthsolution.org...

So clear the cobwebs from the shutterbug and know the FACTS before falsely creating or supporting hoaxes.

[edit on 1-10-2009 by December_Rain]

Health care insurance is the new big scam. I have my drivers liscense, because i am required to by law, here in CT. IF id o not have drivers insurance, they will simply make me go to court IF i dirve without insurance. its up to the officer to decide, wether or not its a ticket* or a proise to appear in court. I remember 3 or 4 years ago, trying to get my insurance re enstated* allstate was a joke,,$220 a month! for a 95 plymouth neon...state farms quaoted me at about $240! checked out progressive auto insurance, ive been around $87-$91 a month, it varys. In my opinon, allstate has gone totaly corporate...thats a HUGE price difference, especially since i have never had an accident!
Health insurance seemst o be the same thing. Fidning the cheapest competitor. I do not have health insurace right now, cant afford it. The cost of living is going up, all these new taxes are here and coming, its kinda hard to pay everything off with what they all want! tis downright sick actually.

reply to post by wx4caster


You just got a blue star my friend!

When does the "takeover" of the government stop? Will we have ANY rights left when it does? I wrote in an essay once (in seventh grade no less, how smart am I?) That Freedom is the thin line between anarchy and dictatorship. I still believe that and I also believe that the Obama administration is swinging a little bit too far towards one side of the line.

It's slippery up there. We might just fall off the line altogether.

[edit on 1-10-2009 by sisgood]

reply to post by OldDragger


Oh, and forcing people to buy health insurance will make it affordable. What a crock.

reply to post by wx4caster


You are already paying for others, is call Medicare and Medicaid, are you happy with that? guess what the bill also include taking out limitations on those two entitlement programs to cover the poor.

If the public option is not available.

that still means more money taken out of our pay checks when the Medicare and Medicaid recipients needs increases.

So what is better, still paying for the two entitlement programs we have right now or having to be forced to pay for private insurance or else.

Yes many forget that we already pay for the poor and we can no say no unless you don't hold a job as long as you have an income you have to pay.

reply to post by December_Rain


I believe that I stated in my first post that I thought that the letter was a little "alarmist" and that I didn't believe everything in the letter.

I just thought it was interesting and wanted to know what others thought of it.

Originally posted by sisgood
reply to post by December_Rain

 

I believe that I stated in my first post that I thought that the letter was a little "alarmist" and that I didn't believe everything in the letter.

I just thought it was interesting and wanted to know what others thought of it.

Doesn't it make you wonder who wrote this propaganda and why?
Does it make you wonder why the Republicans are so franticly opposing reform? Does it make you wonder whose interests they are representing? Is it yours?
The first question should always be: who benefiets?
Now who do you think?

reply to post by sisgood


Alright I'll accept that statement. But I hope now you do realise it was pure rhetoric & propoganda. Please always look for facts in future, supporting and spreading the hoaxes will only weaken US not anyone else.

Originally posted by Brad Watson
We all have our different perspectives on the Federal Healthcare issue. My girlfriend and I are uninsured. Were both musicians and are considered self-employed. At the moment, neither of us can afford health insurance. I have gall stones and might like to have my gall bladder removed, but it would cost $5,000-$10,000. Because I have a pre-existing condition, I can't get insurance to cover it.

It's just amazing how many decent Americans don't make enough money to get coverage. The obvious solution would be the National Health Service, but the lobby successfully killed that idea in the beginning.

I seriously resent proponents of private health care for reasons that Brad has no choice bu to suffer until he's finally admitted to ER, and if he makes it. America seems to be stuck in Stone Age.

reply to post by sisgood


You should email this to all those who think it won't happen . Every polotician who is going to be hel responsible for this. And tell them if they let this happen, they are all fired.

reply to post by wx4caster


I was going to post, but wx4caster has it covered. And by the way how did you read my mind. Our you from the future.

GET OUT OF MY MIND

Taxes and regulations. Regulations and taxes. Taxes and regulations.

Mandated anything is unconstitutional. We are no longer free. We are in a 50 state PRISON.

THE ENDISNIGHE THE ENDISNIGHE