Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by John Matrix
I agree with Woopi when she says: "I don't like it when we're passionate about something and we don't have all the facts."

Oh, I definitely agree with this, too! We, as regular citizens, though, tend to "think" with our hearts sometimes. Legally, he committed statutory rape. There's no doubt. But I'm still on the fence as regards what should happen now. I see both sides and simply cannot make the decision. In my opinion, the victim's opinion should be taken into account. She's got kids and she's not crazy about being in the news again after 30 or more years. On the other hand, he committed a crime and did not pay for it.

I think I would have to know more about the case to make the decision, but we can't just say, "never mind" to the law... That's not right, in my opinion... It's a tough call for me.

I second this opinion .....more people should delay formulating opinions and spend more time gathering information.....and sometimes they should say ...you know it's just a bit too cloudy out there for me to have an opinion that i believe strongly in

When the facts are apparent, and you still can't make a judgement it is because you've either succumbed to the pressure of not wanting to offend or stand out against those whom you are afraid of, OR it is because you WANT to have another outcome. You want to believe that it is okay, even in the face of the evidence.

Originally posted by John MatrixThe purpose of punishment is deterrence and rehabilitation. There is no indication Polanski repeated his conduct, and plenty of evidence for his rehabilitation.

Do rehabilitated sex offenders sound like this?

“If I had killed somebody, it wouldn’t have had so much appeal to the press, you see? But… f—ing, you see, and the young girls. Judges want to f— young girls. Juries want to f— young girls. Everyone wants to f— young girls!”
-Roman Polanski, Interview with Martin Amis 1979

Originally posted by Darth Lumina
Actually 13 year olds aren't as naive as you think. I knew of sex at that age, in fact I know of many who were active at that age and even in this day in age. Thirteen year old girls are actually more developed brain wise and hormonally since a girl begins her period between 9-11 years of age. Plus there was also a time where it was common for girls even younger than this one to carry children and in some cultures this remains so. I'm not saying what he did was right, I just wanted to point out the flaw in your argument as far as development of a 13 year old.

Good points!

It was common in the late 60's for 13 year old girls to have sex, never mind the 70's 80's 90's and this last decade. Stats clearly show the numbers of girls having sex at a young age has steadily increased.

It was common for 13 yr old girls to marry 25 and 30 year old men when North America was being settled.

He did have sex with her....But it's not like he wasn't punished for it people!! There was time served, he endured a criminal trial, he was stigmatized, he suffered embarrassment, humiliation, financial loss, loss of friends and relationships, and ultimately was forced into exile when he was faced with a judge who backslid on his word/deal.

I don't know what else there is to discuss, The evil deed was done....And He pleaded guilty to it !

All that needs to be done now is the sentencing when he gets back in the US, Oh and possibly further charges for the evasion of justice.

No need for long stories.

Enjoy the rest of your life Mr Polanski.................Guards take him away

There is nothing about this case that is simple.

Frankly I am amazed that Polanski was able to hold on to his sanity.

His mother was murdered by the Nazis and his father died in a concentration camp during the War.

His wife and unborn baby were slaughtered by the Manson gang.

So I take no joy in seeing this man suffer and who knows perhaps he is a sociopath but it does not appear that way. He apparently has not committed any crimes since this incident and he has contributed enormously to society. Don't get me wrong he should face justice. Let's hope they can get to the bottom of this and render a fair verdict.

If the victim is willing to forgive him then I could as well. Perhaps this was one bad judgement on his part fueled by drugs. I am not aware of any pattern of criminality by Polanski. If you know of other crimes I would like hear about them.

Originally posted by John Matrix

Originally posted by Darth LuminaIt was common in the late 60's for 13 year old girls to have sex, never mind the 70's 80's 90's and this last decade. Stats clearly show the numbers of girls having sex at a young age has steadily increased.

It was common for 13 yr old girls to marry 25 and 30 year old men when North America was being settled.

No, it wasn't.

I know that the pedophile crowd says this alot.

But I actually look at these old pieces of paper while doing genealogy.

And it was not common.

The mean marriage age has consistently been in the mid twenties. From the 1500s on.


[edit on 2009/10/1 by Aeons]

Originally posted by Aeons
When the facts are apparent, and you still can't make a judgement it is because you've either succumbed to the pressure of not wanting to offend or stand out against those whom you are afraid of, OR it is because you WANT to have another outcome. You want to believe that it is okay, even in the face of the evidence.

No, it's because I know the justice system is anything but just.

My position was proven correct when I heard the judge flip flopped on the deal.

And, Polanski was punished by the entire process. Don't think for a minute his actions did not have a negative impact on his life or career. That he overcame all of it, and is successful proves he is rehabilitated, it does not prove he did not receive and experience punishment.

Originally posted by John Matrix

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Legally, he committed statutory rape. There's no doubt.

If there was solid evidence of any mitigating circumstances, there would have been no plea deal.

Not true. Many victims of rape would rather engage in plea than have the trial continue.

You could easily reverse your assumption and say that if he had acted with propriety and circumspect, let alone had a scrap of evidence on his side he with his lawyer he would not have pled at all.

There seems to be no doubt that they engaged in sex.

Coerced, inebriated, and quite possibly forced sex, yes.

For all we know, that girl could have been a very precocious 13 year old that used her charms to sexual arrouse and seduce Polanski, without him knowing she was a minor.

I don't quite no what to say to this besides: have you read the transcripts from the court case yet? Beyond the transcripts even...what you are arguing is close to obscene. This is pedophilia, however, you play it. Imagine Dick Cheney luring a girl to his swinging pad, plying her with drugs and then having sex with her. Even if you won't admit it here it paints a very different picture than this pathetic little director.

Anyone surprised that many men are easily sexually arroused and therefore easily seduced by young women?

Young women, yes. Children...if you are telling me that men in general are aroused by 13 year olds I will become a lesbian today.

The reality is that many women have that sexual seduction power over men and many know how to use that power to get what they want....some even at a young age.

A thirteen year old is a seventh grader. MIDDLE SCHOOL. I don't care how sexy a "middle schooler" is it is STILL PEDOPHILIA!!!! And this event did not happen in her home, he wasn't drawn to her bedroom, she didn't take him to a hotel. None of the facts of the case support this, and EVEN IF SHE DID she is a child. Did you see her picture then and compare it to now? She hadn't developed her breasts yet, she was not a early bloomer. She looked like a kid that should be out skateboarding.

The bottom line is that Polanski's cranium was preempted by his other head. So in the strinct legal sense, he did have sex with a minor. Whether it was forced or not....I don't know yet.

And why do you have to know, exactly? He was convicted in a court of law after two lawyers presented their legal arguments. Enough is said. He is a convicted felon. The case does not have to be rehashed. It is done. The individual in question has never recanted her story, she only said she would like to not have to think about it. Many victims of rape feel the same way. Read some psychological studies on it.

Originally posted by John Matrix

Originally posted by Aeons
When the facts are apparent, and you still can't make a judgement it is because you've either succumbed to the pressure of not wanting to offend or stand out against those whom you are afraid of, OR it is because you WANT to have another outcome. You want to believe that it is okay, even in the face of the evidence.

No, it's because I know the justice system is anything but just.

My position was proven correct when I heard the judge flip flopped on the deal.

And, Polanski was punished by the entire process. Don't think for a minute his actions did not have a negative impact on his life or career. That he overcame all of it, and is successful proves he is rehabilitated, it does not prove he did not receive and experience punishment.

Being a SUCESSFUL perv proves it is all okay?

Excellent reasoning.

Originally posted by Aeons

Originally posted by John Matrix

Originally posted by Darth LuminaIt was common in the late 60's for 13 year old girls to have sex, never mind the 70's 80's 90's and this last decade. Stats clearly show the numbers of girls having sex at a young age has steadily increased.

It was common for 13 yr old girls to marry 25 and 30 year old men when North America was being settled.

No, it wasn't.

I know that the pedophile crowd says this alot.

But I actually look at these old pieces of paper while doing genealogy.

And it was not common.

The mean marriage age has consistently been in the mid twenties. From the 1500s on.

Then my female highschool history teacher was wrong, as were our history books. I'll do some research and see.

Please don't stereo type me with your comment about pedaphiles.

That's just plain nasty and doesn't really help you look all that rational either.

Then my female highschool history teacher was wrong, as were our history books. I'll do some research and see.

Do. Betrothals occurred at an early age, but the child would not live with the individual until a woman.

Please don't stereo type me with your comment about pedaphiles.

Then perhaps you ought to not speak of thirteen year old seductresses then, or if you do accept that most people will disagree that if the child is "sexy" then that absolves a grown, 44 year old man from guilt.

It does not.

As a victim of sexual assault in my teens, allow me to tell you that it absolutely does not.

That's just plain nasty and doesn't really help you look all that rational either.

If rational is justifying abhorrent behavior then allow me to be irrational.

Here is a rational man:

“This is a man who I love a lot and know a little bit,” Mr. Besson said in a radio interview with RTL Soir. “Our daughters are good friends. But there is one justice, and that should be the same for everyone. I will let justice happen.” He added, , “I don’t have any opinion on this, but I have a daughter, 13 years old. And if she was violated, nothing would be the same, even 30 years later.”

Bravo, Luc Besson! Bravo.

Honestly I wouldn't expect Hollywood to not think this way, I mean Most of these people have been ROYALLY Screwed up from their stardom. Im willing to bet they also had inappropriate underage relations while trying to get into the big time. Most of Hollywood is built upon lies, greed, blackmail and tasteless drivel.

If the Victim, has settled out of court already, and has this guys back, I honestly do not think anymore will come from this. Sick though, that money is always what follows acts like this. Sorry you got raped, heres some money, ???!!!

RAPE pure and simple.

He started to have intercourse with me.
"He asked, he goes, 'Are you on the pill?'”
"And I went 'No'… he goes, 'Would you like me to go in through your back?'
"And I went 'No'. I think he said something like right after I said I was not on the pill, right before he said, 'Oh, I won’t come inside of you then'. Then he lifted my legs up farther and went in through my anus."

Disgusting pig needs to be executed!

I can't believe that people are actually defending the perverted criminal actions of this man and the words uttered by a fool named Whoopi.

One more time for those who don't understand. Polanski plead guilty to a lesser charge. In his own words, he detailed how he got his VICTIM drunk and gave her qualudes, a sedative drug whose effects are compounded by alcohol. He then detailed the sex acts that he performed on her.

The man was sent away for 40 days of evaluation and upon his release prior to sentencing he fled the country. He confessed and arrogantly and cowardly fled his fate. He lived the last 30 years in comfort, wealth and fame in the bizarre world of the European film making elite.

Time to face up to your admitted crime of raping a 13 year old and to your crime of jumping bail and fleeing arrest.

I suppose that all of you who are defending this man should also line up to defend the sexual deviants who prey on children in your own neighborhoods. But, defending them isn't as cool as defending a has been director who also happens to be a child rapist.

[edit on 1-10-2009 by jibeho]

[edit on 1-10-2009 by jibeho]