confirming the son, is not the name 'jesus'

Within Christ the entire physical manifestation of God is embodied. Col 2:9
God is one Deut 6:4

confirming the son is (trying, intent)
seeing god in everyone,
you'll always fail,
but your trying is your cross.

seeing god,
is trying to forgive god,

seeing life,
is trying to forgive life

seeing truth,
is trying to forgive truth

that is salvation of living in the name
the name of one.
it is not namecalling.

it means even atheists are gods children.
everyone who tries, is a child of life.

[edit on 27-9-2009 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by pasttheclouds

confirming the son is (trying, intent)
seeing god in everyone,
you'll always fail,
but your trying is your cross.

GAL 1:13 For you have heard of my previous way of life in Judaism, how intensely I persecuted the church of God and tried to destroy it. 14 I was advancing in Judaism beyond many Jews of my own age and was extremely zealous for the traditions of my fathers. 15 But when God, who set me apart from birth and called me by his grace, was pleased 16 to reveal his Son in me so that I might preach him among the Gentiles,

Paul had a large cross, double portion, preach Jesus as the son and re-act part of Jesus' life. He knew he would be executed in Rome. He knew he would have to go to Jerusalem to be betrayed. He went even though the prophets warned him.

AC 21:10 After we had been there a number of days, a prophet named Agabus came down from Judea. 11 Coming over to us, he took Paul's belt, tied his own hands and feet with it and said, "The Holy Spirit says, `In this way the Jews of Jerusalem will bind the owner of this belt and will hand him over to the Gentiles.' "

AC 21:12 When we heard this, we and the people there pleaded with Paul not to go up to Jerusalem. 13 Then Paul answered, "Why are you weeping and breaking my heart? I am ready not only to be bound, but also to die in Jerusalem for the name of the Lord Jesus." 14 When he would not be dissuaded, we gave up and said, "The Lord's will be done."

The same as Jesus, captured by Jews, handed over to Gentiles to be killed.

paul is a mirror of the prophets,
the seal of prophet is glorification,
so everyone who ever will live in heaven (freedom)
will become a 'prophet', a teacher,
even when it's only to theirselves.

first they accuse
then they turn around.

people will not understand jesus,
if they don't know why the wine was his blood
and the bread his body. They are symbols,
but the symbols tell also something literal.

there is a difference between jesus as running around,
and we seeing his body as the person jesus
or jesus running around, always attached to the ALL,
which means being one in will with the father.
What is one in will can decide not to enter nirvana,
not to enter the father in it's freedom, the place of rest,
and stay with us to take another extra cross.

By worhsipping the jesus without his body as all,
we worship a lie, but if that lie makes us love
the body we can not see yet, the lie is not wrong,
but makes us evolve.

But the real jesus how he wanted to be worshipped,
is the 'ALL' = God. Thats why jesus did not want us
to kneel down for him, but for his father, because
he knew people could not see his father, only a
face of him. And God has many faces. And will
have many faces that will become one in his will.
After the paradise all in salvation will become like that.


[edit on 24-1-2010 by pasttheclouds]

take care with bible translations. You can or would throw away the real teachings of jesus, just to keep the peace IF not carefull.

5. For one is God and one is the reconciler of God and humanity -- (Jesus) Christ the Son of Man

It means (jesus) christ, the son of man
meaning CHRIST = annointed
meaning jesus AS/IN FUNCTION OF son of man,
and the son of man is the reconcilir. are all the prophets. is you.

the bible translations always put jesus where it is means (jesus) christ,
which is another meaning. Christ has another meaning then
just being the lastname of jesus, christ is not a lastname.
And a lastname is a family = family = elohim.
Why did the apostles call jesus christ, to give him a new lastname,
or to make him complete. Christ means son of man, he who is in the annointing. Jesus was glorified, that day he became the christ, not before.
glorified is being one in WILL with god. thats the meaning of christ, and thats where you wish to go to.

The friends of jesus called him the christ, the annointed one.
before glorification = jesus from nazareth/ Gal. /etc
after glorification = jesus (the) christ (jesus is only a translation, Eashoa) jesus christ = one with god = 1.

so jesus christ means = one being one with god
which means that there is only god.

reply to post by pasttheclouds

take care with bible translations. You can or would throw away the real teachings of jesus, just to keep the peace IF not carefull.

I'm realizing that. We can't just cut the Bible up.

I can understand why Paul preached the way he did. He knew he was not yet glorified. Jesus was glorified before the crucifixion, John 13, then spoke the Father's words directly John 14-17. The words from the Father to us.

I've looked into some Gnostic teachings. YHWH is called 'the ignorant one'. Which may be so, as far as I can tell. He is in the world but not of the world. Did he choose ignorance or was it no chose? And he's bound by chains as long as the Torah remains. I feel sorrow for him now. I wish I could free him. I don't think I can.

reply to post by pthena


yes, preaching before glorification,
means still trapped in accusing...

that's called sonship.
it's the fire phase.phase of understanding
and completing cross.

ignorance on earth is the sin against the spirit
ignorance in heaven is the natural state,
god lives there what he wants to see.

it's the earth, the beast out of the earth is ignorance/rest,
it is the false prophet keeping away the progressive revelations (gabriel)
coming in the world; like this the truth becomes the mirror
and the seven hills of jerusalem becomes rome, symbols.
Religions are dual, they are both jerusalem as rome.

[edit on 24-1-2010 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by pasttheclouds

it's the earth, the beats out of the earth is ignorance,
it is the false prophet keeping still the progressive relevations
coming in the world; like this the truth becomes the mirror
and the seven hills of jerusalem becomes rome, symbols.
Relgions are dual, they are borth jerusalem as rome.

Jesus was killed in Jerusalem, Paul was killed in Rome, both hold onto a static orthodoxy not allowing God to speak through the prophets. The prophets seem to be anti-christ to the orthodox. The false prophet is not a person, but a system of belief. People can be freed from the system. But the system itself will utterly perish in the end. The prophets must help the people and not the system.

It's true that what are the prophets will look to end up
in rome, when they are the new jerusalem. Thats why
paul died there, a symbol again.
It is very important to know daniel was the prince (regent)
of babylon, a symbol again where the prophets,the son
of man is to be found.

Rome was planned to be rome in that time,
there is a mystery in god that ignorant or still growing religion until this day does
not always understand.

Rome and babylon were not 'bad', they were destined to exsists.
Because they are symbols, just as jerusalem is.

Without the literal existing the abstract could not be explained.

Jerusalem is a symbol for the prophets, son of man.
But the old place of worship (literal jerusalem) becomes Bethel.
the place where jacob (before he became israel) started his way
into the heavens...his vision going up.

its the startpoint, not the endpoint.
Progressive revelation (gabriel) is exactly that what israel
played in its history by moving from worship place to another,
by moving the capital from one place to another.

Amos 5:5 - But do not seek Bethel, Nor enter Gilgal, Nor pass over to Beersheba; For Gilgal shall surely go into captivity, And Bethel shall come to nothing.


[edit on 24-1-2010 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by pasttheclouds

its the startpoint, not the endpoint.
Progressive revelation (gabriel) is exactly that what israel
played in its history by moving from worship place to another,
by moving the capital from one place to another.

I think that's what I was trying to show on my stone Temple thread. The true is moving like a tent, the false becomes stone.

The letter to Hebrews speaks of the tent as shadow of truth, while ignoring completely the stone temple. Physical Jerusalem is ignored completely and only Zion in heaven and in future is mentioned.

Paul compares physical Jerusalem with bondage. Physical Jerusalem to me represents a stone orthodoxy formed from literal reading of scripture without the anointing to understand. Rome also.

Especially important in Pauls letters is the usage of the family symbols,
used sometimes by not progressive or still in growth religion thinking it is still a literal explination. Even paul was in progression of truth.

Woman means you, the created
man means the spirit or the lie, your soul, the husband
that controls the woman.

Homosexuality is a man taken by behind,
it is the symbol of inversion, the lie taken instead of the truth of your created side, it's ignorance thinking to be in rest and raping god's truth by behind. (living desire instead of reflection)
the other man choosing instead of the (flow/going wrong/u-turn) honesty of the woman, even when she
first goes wrong and needs to be controlled to find the way back.

homosexuality is not wrong, it is a symbol, just as rome is.
the desire of woman, was the desire of the created to bring forth the messiah, in that time a desire literal desired by the woman of israel.

he will not regard the desire of woman means he will be free of that desire, because he will be annointed, the son reborn, and will have brought his desiring (womanside) under control because he becomes free.

The symbol homosexuality is a symbol of spirutality in bed with the inversion of the spirit, which is the lie, and it is exactly to them that jesus warned 'you shall do wonders in my name, but i will not have known you'
it is this sentence that makes very clear that salvation does not come by namecalling but by works, works are made by faith (choice as seeing= repenting, by hope building on what you can see growing towards what you can not see yet), they are one and the same.

a man loosing his female virtues and by desire taking other males
means ignorance, it is avoiding the positive-negative motor of growth = male/female interaction that grows the son.



[edit on 24-1-2010 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by pasttheclouds

Woman means you, the created
man means the spirit or the lie, your soul, the husband
that controls the woman.

These are hard sayings. I don't understand homosexuality. I know the created being is woman. Since '96 when Athena(wisdom is part of my soul, straight from head of Zeus) my desire has been for the ever virgin (Artemis, moon). Therefore I have been celibate since then. To despoil the virgin is wrong to me.

Aphrodite (goddess of love, formed from a god's male member) seems the inversion to me. I avoid her even as Gilgamesh did.

It seems to me that heterosexual or homosexual is wrong or less than true (for me anyway) as long as the desire is for Aphrodite. I'm more fortunate than most I think since I already had 2 children and am a divorced grandfather.

To me wisdom(female) and spirit(male) make my soul complete, yet my desire is for the virgin.

Am I wrong in this? I don't think so. The son marries the virgin I think.



[edit on 24-1-2010 by pthena]

when you enter salvation, will you not marry a new virgin then ?
not defiled. =
will you get a new body ? a new earth ?

does god have many woman ? joshuas stone with seven eyes = harem
or the seven virgins you will marry seven heavens.

Every symbol has a meaning on personal level, and on general level.
A plant can be you, but also a belief. you are a beliefsystem, so this is in general level as personal level. beliefs are spirits are the waters = sea.

when you become the son (before glorification this is)
you marry the spirit, you become without guilt,
and god becomes the husband.
that undefiled virgin brings forth the son of man by the spirit.
and brings forth the son of the son that you are at that time = salvation.
salavtion means being one with the father,
it is not the son anymore but still called the son of man or christ as in glorified.
(you have a family in generations)

still those fathers together are the son of man.


there are many meanings together in the family.
because you have servants, you have free,
you have free ones that choose to be servants,
you have servants becoming free

the son of man in different levels.


when there was been said, not the son knows the hour,
it did not mean the father will not know by the harem he has,
and the woman he sends to sends the rays of the sun.
those rays will cry into the wilderness. elijah knows.
but elijah is not here yet. elijah is here when he knows himself.
for that his old body needs to die.
just the same for the whole son of man.

remember as paul was progressive in teachings,
so are we. when it happened then you'll know.
jesus when he was the son, not yet glorified, not yet the son of man,
was also in progression. revelation is gabriel,
integration is michael.

the son that becomes father is the total body of the son of man,
like this it is possible for the son of man to be on the earth
before it is in glorification.



[edit on 24-1-2010 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by pasttheclouds

when you enter salvation, will you not marry a new virgin then ?
not defiled. =
will you get a new body ? a new earth ?

That's how I understand it.

does god have many woman ? joshuas stone with seven eyes = harem
or the seven virgins you will marry seven heavens.

I don't know about seven heavens yet, or seven virgins. I don't think I'm the Father.

when you become the son (before glorification this is)
you marry the spirit, you become without guilt,
and god becomes the husband.
that undefiled virgin brings forth the son by the spirit.
and brings forth the son of the son = salvation.
slavtion means being one with the father,
it is not the son anymore

I can't speak as the Father like Jesus did until glorification. Which I think you said is the sealing on the forehed.

there are manny meanings together in the family.
because you have servants, you have free,
you have free ones that choose to be servants,
you have servants becoming free

The pierced ear is a physical sign of former bondservant serving freely. Is there significance to pierced ear?

reply to post by pthena


the earring literal signified the trade of the salesman.
it is the sign/label of where you belong too.
it's good to take of your jewelry (allow doubt)
to receive it at the end.
the same story as earth.
earth is the destiny, but if you do not enter the waters,
and stay on earth, you are in rest/ignorance
when you have to flow through the waters.

pierced will be the lie on the cross.

details do not stay in my head. they pass to point towards the structure.
big lines i can show.

sealing is in head and hands.
faith and works.

but be sure when you wish to give,
there will be taken,
as a result you will not soon be able to give much,
and look inversed to those that have
the space to give.
If there is space to give, you are closer to rest.
If you give when you do not have space,
the small you give is a treasure from heaven.
to give is not only material.
by SEEing you also give.
forGIVING is to give.
when you feel you can't give it's because you are out of rest
allready. Not everything looks how it sounds.
Giving alms can be by sight alone. By seeing them.
The spirit will decide in and by you what to do.

thats why the most poor or miserable people can give to the world
just by being themselves. even without giving anything material.
they give their life of pain and they give reflection to us.
Thats why we have to value their pain.
A 'looser' never chose to be a 'looser'.
If you give you will loose.
He is a slave to god.


[edit on 24-1-2010 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by pasttheclouds
You see how I must still use Greek mythology to explain my deepest self. That proves I'm still a Pagan.

In the Gnostic and other lost stories, Jesus was married to a prostitute. Even as Hosea was told to. He even had to get her back from slavery after he cast her off.

By logic I understand the story of Jesus when a woman is at the edge of a crowd and she sends her children to go to Jesus. The disciples try to stop them because they are children of prostitution. But Jesus says, 'don't stop them from coming to me, because these are of those who make up the kingdom of heaven.'

There are other stories too where the disciples stand as orthodox as if they control who gets to see Jesus or not. God allows any to see, no matter their religion.

jesus did not think in religion, he thought in growth.
there is growth or ignorance (which is still a slower growth,
but throwing away of the opportunity to pay the penny)

someone who does everything wrong and is in pain,
will have to reflect every second, that is paying the penny !

god would pay all the same value of penny, this is very clear
in the gospel. God can not be one, if his cross is not one for all.
The only extra is those in salvation taking an extra cross,
because they received from god the opportunity to become free before
the end of times, they will give it back and as jesus did not enter heaven yet. They had a life of stress and pain, but they were protected always,
by realising this they will give back.

The gnostics are also very symbolic, a prositute is someone who sells
her body...what is it what we do to receive slavation ? we sell ourselves. Even our desire to be dead to save others is selling of the old body.
a slave will be freed at the end of the work.
If you loose you will hold fast on the things you still can get,
this will make you guilty, and will make you able to forgive the others.

God loves the sinners.
there are no sins except the choice to live in ignorance.

IF you give because you believe in love, you are still egoistic,
egoistic is what god is, he gives to make his ALL free.
everythings is dual. you can take or give, but it will always
be selfish. the bad selfishness is ignorance, it is so (not) selfish
it can not work for itself. it does not care about itself, it does not have
survivalinstinct, it gives itself over to randomness.

my words are sometimes a bit harsh, very black white wording,
but it is because it created logic in me. that logic is what is important.
the gospel is pure logic.


[edit on 24-1-2010 by pasttheclouds]

this is a thunder...

before you will give you will take,
it will make the u-turn.
it depends on your start position
what you still will take,
but there is no growth
without going from left to right

ignorance avoids the left,
avoids seeing the truth about tiself.
before salvation, human is between
instinct and reflection, that is the choice.

[edit on 24-1-2010 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by pasttheclouds

my words are sometimes a bit harsh, very black white wording,
but it is because it created logic in me. that logic is what is important.
the gospel is pure logic.

Logic is better than visions and dreams and mythologies. Still I use them all. I am still behind. I'm going to read some books now.

reply to post by pthena

A god that is everything is not bad,
the paradox of god is here to allow god
to be complete white, totally good,
WITHOUT duality.

god has a part in him, a pit,
that is exsisting by allowance,
not by choice.

thats why doing your best,
erases choice and makes you one with god.

God was always there, without choise to exsist,
it means this world was always there with him,
and still alowing him choice to erase this world,
consequence is that he erases himself with it.
that's why choice is between seeing and growing
or seeing and deciding to not see anymore,
ignorance comes after you saw,
not before you saw
there is no guilt if you didnt see yet,
only when you reject what you received to see.

The law, the torah is the law of one.
Who does not read this, does not read the law YET.

Who takes away from this law,
from a god that loves himself,
from an absolute that accepts itself and sets itself free,
by making a u-turn,
takes away from himself.

sonship is grown by setting god free,
one day the result is he will set you free of ignorance,
this last sentence is the law.

Love god, who is all,meaning one, with all your heart,
all your strength and all your possibilities.

Find in this oneness the lie of division,
and you have your proof to accuse,
which is impossible for god to do.

Gods wrath, taking away your life,
is peoples choice, by that part of god in you,
it is god shutting himself down in you,
by ignorance. It is god deciding not to
take his cross. that is ignorance.
It allows god to be everything.
If god decides to take its cross by you,
one day you will become one in the kingdom with Him.
god in you is the husband you choose,
god, the real oneness, or baal, the division.
by your power of being one with god,
you can decide to become baal. the antichrist.
A godpart, you, that chooses not to take
cross decides not to be one,
one is the only possibility for god.





[edit on 24-1-2010 by pasttheclouds]