Does this look like America to you?

reply to post by SonsOfAnarchy


Yeah, that's not very helpful...



Start by just sharing these videos with with people and explaining their rights to them.

Originally posted by December_Rain When you sanction the right to use such policies against "foreign" you sanction them to use it "domestic" too otherwise it's sheer hypocracy.

Agreed.

And we're learning that lesson hard right now.

Youtube Videos are great arnt they?

LOL, very nice way of taking the whole situation out of context. You have no idea what is actually happening. Why the crowd is there, what they are doing and why the police were forced to show up. The way it is edited you lose all understanding of the actual situation. Yes it looks like Nazi Germany, however without the actual context, you have no idea of what is actually happening, who threw what first. Peaceful demonstration in the dark? There is really only one reason to demonstrate in the dark, because you are hiding something and want to start trouble. This looks no different then Riot control to me. But without that context, you cant really tell.

reply to post by JWH44


Welcome JWH44,great post and a star for you. Now on to more important matters.

Fascism is reality now in America, its not conspiracy, its not debatable, it is here and we the people are against it. You may want to reconsider your employment because the time will come soon that you'll have to pick sides,them or us? Whats it gonna be JWH44 will you continue to side with the fascists or will you come over to the people who support the constitution.

You do know that it is our duty to throw off such forms of government dont you? I believe you do, if not its in the declaration of independence.

I'm sure your aware of these people if not I'd like to introduce you and see you sign on with them,we the people need protection against a tyranical fascist government.

oathkeepers.org...

This is such a difficult situation! Of course, it's TERRIBLE to see this happen in the streets of the USA. And the answer to the OP is that No, this definitely does NOT look like America to me. (I could only watch the 2nd vid)

I can see both sides of this situation and both truly break my heart. I appreciate JWH44's unique perspective here. And I don't expect answers to these, but I have questions. As arcnaver said, we're missing the context. And even though it may seem clear what we're seeing, without context, we cannot know.

Why were they clearing the street? Were they "just following orders"? Or was this street needed for something else relating to the G-20? Were they clearing the protesters just because they were protesting?

Where was this in comparison to the summit meeting? Was there a security risk to the world leaders? Is this area inside a "security zone" for the summit or along the path that leaders would travel?

Did the cops know why they were doing what they were doing? Did they care?

It really breaks my heart. I could almost feel some of the cops thinking that they hated doing what they were doing, but they were under orders and, like the military, they are trained not to question those orders. Did they go home that night and cry for their country? Or did they brag to their wives how they scared the hippies? Could it be that there were some of each?

If they broke ranks, what hell would they have to pay?

What happened before the recording started? Did the cops explain why the area was being cleared? Was anyone hurt?

Think of all the peaceful protests around the country that DON'T get dispersed... I know this "shouldn't" happen in America, but I can see situations where it could and not be "fascism". After all, in some other countries, they wouldn't use jackbooted cops to clear an area. They would use machine guns.

I mean, there are so many questions I have that will never be answered. And I think it's unfair for me to make a judgment about this out of context. I just can't do it, but it's sad beyond belief! I'm so sorry for my country...

[edit on 26-9-2009 by Benevolent Heretic]

reply to post by JWH44


Well I can't believe that you are supporting the NWO regime by denouncing someones opinion of people obediently following orders.

The New World Order is only made possible by people who follow orders without thinking or questioning those orders. In fact the world wouldn't be in this position and current clusterf*ck if people stopped blindly following orders and stood up for themsevles and their beliefs.

Look at all the soldiers that come back from Iraq/Afghanistan with psychological issues and trauma. Allt he suicides because they can't live with what they've seen and done.

The phrase "Just following orders" is what I like to call the "scapegoat" clause. It removes responsibility for your actions.

A lot of people in uniform enjoy the power trip. There is no denying that.

You're entitled to your point of view but I must point out that it is exactly the ideology that lead to the culmination of Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy before WW2.

Originally posted by Thumb
reply to post by JWH44

 

JWH44, I have a couple of questions for you.

1st, why do you hang around on this board and read the posts?

2. I am aware there are 2 sides to every story, but with a lot of the info posted on this site in regards to law enforcement and military, are you appalled by any of it? And if so, if you find it unconstitutional, or an abuse of powers, what are you doing, or willing to do, from your position to make a difference?

looking forward to your reply.

1. I am a conspiracy buff; always have been, always will be. As I mentioned in my original post, I find a lot of interesting information on this forum and I check it everyday. Despite my position, I am not blind to the fact that there are those in much higher positions than myself who do not hold the best interests of those they are supposed to serve in high regard. Basically, I just find it interesting and informational.

2. Of course I am appalled by some of the things I see. That is what has driven me to pursue a career track that has led me into management. I work hard to ensure that those whom I supervise and lead do not take the kind of action you see in some of these videos. Our job is to uphold the law, not break it. As I have said, I have actively investigated and seen former colleagues of mine pay the price for those sorts of acts. Believe me when I tell you; my Agency is very busy fighting corruption, violations of civil rights and abuse of power. I and my Agency make it a point to highlight these cases and make an example out of those that break the law.

Now, that being said, I can only ask that you do not judge books by their cover. I realize that many of the things you see on video can be inflamatory. Are some of them legitimate instances of civil rights violations? Of course. But often, the two minute clip that makes it to you is only part of a thirty minute interaction between the officer and the suspect. I have seen several videos that make it the public that show a seemingly innocent person get tazed. Then you get to see the entire video in the investigation. You get to read the testimony of witnesses. In short, you see the whole picture. Believe it or not, these two sides are often night and day. Don't take that as a general statement from me that all videos you see are not the whole truth!! I'm not saying that.

I know that many of you will disregard me as one of "them" just trying to justify everything you see. However, I hope that you are not missing the forest for the trees.

I am getting ready to go home, just worked an overnight shift. If I don't respond, don't think I'm just giving up. I hope to be a voice for those of us that do our jobs with your best intentions in mind. Thank you everyone for your comments and feedback.

reply to post by JWH44


Glad to have you aboard JWH44 I can only hope that more people in your position think the way that you do.

Hey Fellow members.

If any of you ever see me dressed as a stormtrooper and suppressing freedom - I want you guys to take me out. If I become like these 'men'; I want you guys to put an end to my ways.
(even if I was ordered or if it is department policy)

You have my permission to use against me whatever force is required.

*And Please make sure I get my jury trial so there is no doubt about my guilt and complicity. Further, it will allow the process of transformation to become out and be seen by all; people will be able to examine the transition from the man who took an oath to uphold & defend the Constitution to the traitorous depths that I had lowered myself..



[edit on 26-9-2009 by Exuberant1]

Larry King interview with Ahmadinejad


A great part is when King asks Ahmadinejad about the protests in Iran and the police brutality and Ahmadinejad responds with, "Have you heard the news from Pittsburgh?"

Owned.

Does anyone here know a police officer? We need to get some interviews with the guys behind the shields...I bet you their answer to all of this is "Im just doing my job"....now, thats whats really sad.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


The second video is a relatively small, peaceful assembly by we are change, who were denied a permit to march in protest.

In the video, many of the people you see are just spectators and reporters. Pittsburgh police used the LRAD even though the protesters were not committing any crime, did not physically challenge the police line and were simply exercising their Constitutional Rights.

I don't know how far it was from the actual g20 summit perimeter but the street scene does not appear to be too close to the Lawrence Convention Center.

Portions of the third video were taken by students at Pitt who were gathered in a dorm union, watching the protest on the street below. Students in the adjacent stairwell were gassed, lightly injured by the scuffle and not allowed to leave the area to return to their dorm. They were not part of the protest.


[edit on 26/9/2009 by kosmicjack]

reply to post by warrenb


wow, when i saw the shot of those troops with glowing eyes and the robotic voice my first thought was 'wow awesome!' then i started to feel sick as i realized this isn't warhammer or some new ridley scott flick - this is a couporate fashist state as its worst.

Click here for more information.

I'd like to know who they are to decide who can and cannot have a permit to prostest which unless i am mistaken is an inalienable right and on what basis do they decide?

Originally posted by TortoiseKweek
It's a disgrace! Really, these people's taxes pay them, and they treat them like this? What is happening to America? God, we don't see this in Canada. Then again, I must say that the police here in Toronto are very friendly. The first time I visited in 1997, I was lost downtown, holding a map and trying to figure out where I was, and a cop car approached me...



[edit on 26-9-2009 by TortoiseKweek]

You must be under the misconception that Paying Taxes gives you the right to do what ever you want, when ever you want. That is not the case. Law Enforcement has the Duty to Keep the Peace. If you are making trouble in the middle of the night and are part of a large group of people doing the same, Taxes doesnt exempt you from the Laws you Break nor does it give you Mercy in the Penal Code.

reply to post by nickoli


I used the link you provided for oathkeepers.org. It's impressive to see that soldiers, vets, police, etc. have made the oath to uphold the constitution and follow the motto: not on my watch.

Unfortunately, this went down on their watch and nothing was done to protect these citizens.

How are oathkeepers going to stop these jack booted thugs?

I'm considering getting out of Dodge and moving to a more peaceful country.....like Mexico, Brazill, Costa Rica, Israel, or Iran.

his message is for those still writing comments on message boards. Come to justin. tv for r3V07ution films with live chat. Check out the Guest Broadcast Channel (www.justin. tv/verbalmilitiatv) where anyone with relevant films on their hard drives can b...
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Originally posted by kosmicjack
The second video is a relatively small, peaceful assembly by we are change, who were denied a permit to march in protest.

Yeah, I know. That's the video I saw and had so many questions about. From what we see, yes, I understand your position. But my point is that we're not seeing it all. We don't have the whole picture.

I'm not defending what's happening here, but I can't come to a conclusion about it either. I do know that I hate it and it saddens me. But I can't make the judgment that many here have made... that these cops are all thugs or that they represent all cops or even that the protesters' Constitutional rights were breached. I need more information and I doubt I'll get it.

Portions of the third video were taken by students at Pitt who were gathered in a dorm union, watching the protest on the street below. Students in the adjacent stairwell were gassed, lightly injured by the scuffle and not allowed to leave the area to return to their dorm. They were not part of the protest.

I just watched that one. That was a violent protest. The protesters were throwing rocks and bricks and assaulting with garbage dumpsters. Again, how did the scuffle start? We don't know.

I really hate the way media (including YouTube) displays the side of the issue that they want us to see. I have to be as critical of these YouTube videos as I am of Fox and MSNBC. Because everyone has an agenda. And while we deride people for believing everything they see on TV News, I think it's important to apply the same critical thought and skepticism to the videos we see on YouTube.

Everyone has an agenda.

Nah! Like the song goes... same as it ever was...... same as it ever was.......

Nothing new under the sun.

I went to a Dump Nixon rally in Indianapolis Indiana back in the 60's. There were little kids running around laughing and playing while they listened to some speeches. Most people came for the music. Phil Ochs... John Denver... can't remember who else was there.

What was really freaky was that the park where we sat and played was ringed by National Guard Troops with bayonets fixed.

Row after row of "my fellow American's" just itching to attack a peaceful gathering of people who were sick of Tricky Dick and his fascist regime.

This ain't nothin' new folks...