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Officials: Iran has second enrichment plant

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posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 10:15 AM
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TIME OUT!!! I think I have a possible answer!!!

There is a lot of fishiness surrounding this entire situation. A question that just hit me in favor of on the side we have known about this is,

Was waiting until now a strategic time for world powers to make this announcement? We just made a huge international decision that we want to start eliminating nukes and being "nuclear free."

Obama's announcement came yesterday if I am not mistaken. This letter (not made public until the wee hours of last night (Central US time) was sent Monday. Naturally, my first thought was even though I read "sent on Monday" about Iran's 'new' facility, I registered it as breaking news - because for the public anyways this is breaking news.

Seems that the new incentive for TPTB is to try to make themselves seem on a righteous and pure quest to eliminate nukes. At the same time we are painting Iran to be the bad guy in yet another way for wanting to keep pursuing nuclear technology.

All those nations who started getting fed up with us about Afghanistan and Iraq? They will be lining up left and right to help support this.

Hate to say it, but seems the US government and intel has duped the world into their agenda yet again...


-Sliadon




posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 10:17 AM
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Originally posted by Harlequin
since iran has signed the NPT , they are allowed to do this - , israel has not signed the NPT and is a proliferator of advanvced weapons to `opposition` countries *they sold lvai to china and more*



Wrong. The NPT demands complete transparency on all nuclear work. In 2003 the IAEA discovered that Iran had been running a secret research program for the best part of 20 years - in direct violation of the NPT. And now, surprise surprise, they've been hiding a second enrichment plant too.

Hiding behind a treaty you have no intention of abiding by in order to deceive the world is probably worse than not signing up at all. Iran should be punished severely - or what message does that send out?

And before you (no doubt) shove Israel down my throat, I think they should be punished too. Nobody is free of blame on this issue, but we shouldn't take the attitude that "they're naughty too so it doesn't matter."

Iran gaining a nuclear weapon would create a dangerous arms race in the M.E. and because Israel is so outnumbered and surrounded by enemies the whole M.A.D. scenario would not work - at least not on a regional level. Iran need to be stopped now, preferably by the UN, before it gets messy.

[edit on 25-9-2009 by Curio]



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 10:19 AM
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Iran could always sign an non-aggression pact with Israel, the same way Egypt and Jordan have. Both countries that attacked Issrael as part of Arab League initiative. Iran could also use the same money for domestic improvements it uses to sponsor and arm organizations shelling Israel.

Iran has declared it has a hard-on for the destruction of Israel. Sponsoring Holocaust Denial forums and speaking of it constantly does not benefit Iran's peope or economy. Before the Islamic Revolution Israel was Iran's closest ally in the region. It was a better arrangement.

Pakistan has nukes. No one tried to stop them. Iran is using North Korea as a model of how hostile and provocative you can be in pushing the rest of the world with nuclear development. There is always the option of just keeping tight lipped and going about your business quietly.

Iran doesn't have to make itself a shunned pariah state, but it makes moves that escalate resentment and anger. Lots of countries have bad blood politically and economically. The smart ones learn to get over it. But iran continues to invite trouble then are shocked and outraged when they get it.

Iran has put itself on a collision course. There is no obvious benefit for this, yet they persist. Running a country of 70 million with emotional thinking rather than pragmatism is not the way to go.
Theocracies don't work. The people under them suffer in the end.



Mike





[edit on 25-9-2009 by mmiichael]



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 10:39 AM
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Obama does make a few great points.




posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 10:49 AM
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Originally posted by sos37
reply to post by Wimbly
 


You're absolutely right. I think though the difference is that they have the proof to show everyone now. It's funny that now that Iran has been exposed how China and Russia suddenly back sanctions against them and Iran suddenly tells the Atomic Energy Agency that they have this other site.

Bush was right and Israel was right all along. And we ALL know that Iran's goal is to build enough atomic weapons to launch a single strike at Israel and wipe them out in one fell swoop. I seriously hope this revelation has stopped those evil ambitions once and for all.


lol........



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 10:58 AM
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This talk about Israel and Iran is getting tiresome.


They both need to put their difference aside and just come to terms with it. No one country has the right to tell the other to have Nuclear weapons. No one countries is the judge over the other. The nuc program is just another blantant excuse to cause another full scale Iraq.



Let's judge the situation with more common sense. Let's judge this from the outside looking in. People on this website are been ignorant and biased. People need to wake up to the truth of war. What has war created in the past. Why is it that people seem to forget their own behaviour so quickly and be ever so sharp to point the flaws in others.


Let's grow the # up people.


War begets war.
Peace begets peace.


The UN and the powers of be don't have the power anymore. You do. You choose your reality. You choose what you want to have in this world. The light of the cosmos is shining stronger as each day approaches to 2012. There are two realities taking shape on this planet at this time. The old reality is this one where we still repeat history. The other is the new reality where balance and dicernment for each other is brought into this world. The vibration of this planet must be raised.

It's your choice. Remember only one reality can exist after the 2012 dateline. Polarity and intensity will still exist for the time being. But the old ways will be discarded. If you continue with the old ways as your choice you will find it increasingly harder to live in the new world.


And remember we must not fear this transition. Peace and harmony is the new reality.


Let's stand back and dicern the world we live in before we kneejerk and judge nations and other peoples choices of reality.



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 10:59 AM
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Originally posted by mmiichael
Iran could always sign an non-aggression pact with Israel, the same way Egypt and Jordan have. Both countries that attacked Issrael as part of Arab League initiative. Iran could also use the same money for domestic improvements it uses to sponsor and arm organizations shelling Israel.

Iran has declared it has a hard-on for the destruction of Israel. Sponsoring Holocaust Denial forums and speaking of it constantly does not benefit Iran's peope or economy. Before the Islamic Revolution Israel was Iran's closest ally in the region. It was a better arrangement.

Pakistan has nukes. No one tried to stop them. Iran is using North Korea as a model of how hostile and provocative you can be in pushing the rest of the world with nuclear development. There is always the option of just keeping tight lipped and going about your business quietly.

Iran doesn't have to make itself a shunned pariah state, but it makes moves that escalate resentment and anger. Lots of countries have bad blood politically and economically. The smart ones learn to get over it. But iran continues to invite trouble then are shocked and outraged when they get it.

Iran has put itself on a collision course. There is no obvious benefit for this, yet they persist. Running a country of 70 million with emotional thinking rather than pragmatism is not the way to go.
Theocracies don't work. The people under them suffer in the end.



Mike





[edit on 25-9-2009 by mmiichael]



You based this crap on the crap you hear and take from the media.


Would you ever cut this nonsense out please. All hearsay and media biased. None of it actually coherent or even common sense. It what you watched on the news etc. Be more self aware in future and stop labeling and judging everything outside of you as fault.

[edit on 25-9-2009 by Mind1universe]



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 11:03 AM
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Originally posted by Mind1universe


Take your 2012 nonsense, bad attitude, and one line posts and get the hell out of here. The grown-ups are trying to have a conversation.



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 11:10 AM
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Originally posted by Curio

Originally posted by Mind1universe


Take your 2012 nonsense, bad attitude, and one line posts and get the hell out of here. The grown-ups are trying to have a conversation.



Your hypocrisy is almost too funny. Please don't insult me. This topic is about having a conversation is called a two way street. If you can't handle a two way street don't use it. You have the choice not to be here. This is what it means to be an adult. You have choices and with the choices you make lies self responsibility. You make sure you focus on your own behaviour first.

I say this because I don't see the point in getting upset over this.

[edit on 25-9-2009 by Mind1universe]



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 11:37 AM
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\

Originally posted by Mind1universe
You based this crap on the crap you hear and take from the media.
Would you ever cut this crap out please. It's a load of crap.


Let's get something straight website self-proclaimed authority, I haven't seen a TV newscast in over a decade. I deal with Iranian people on a day to day basis.

The cream of Iranian intelligensia, investment, entrepreurship, have fled the country in droves since the Islamic Revolution. The Iranian people themselves aware of what's happening in the outside world would love to see their own governmemt toppled.

No one, except know-it-alls like you defend the current Mullah regime. Even Russia, China, Syria, et al - who feast on their spending oil revenues on aggressive regional domination policies and military toys - know it's matter of time before they dig themselves too deep into a pit. Everyone takes their money and rolls their eyes.

Iran could be a prosperous modern nation. They could have a nuclear deterrent program with no one caring. But their 12th Century approach to religion, tribalism, advancement does not work in the 21st Century.

Businesses fail because they don't understand market changes, what the competition is dues, regrettable policies. So do whole countries. There are such things as bad leadership and bad regimes. Iran suffers from it - big time.

No apologies and explanations can change that.


Mike


[edit on 25-9-2009 by mmiichael]



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 11:54 AM
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Originally posted by mmiichael
\

Originally posted by Mind1universe
You based this crap on the crap you hear and take from the media.
Would you ever cut this crap out please. It's a load of crap.


Let's get something straight website self-proclaimed authority, I haven't seen a TV newscast in over a decade. I deal with Iranian people on a day to day basis.

The cream of Iranian intelligensia, investment, entrepreurship, have fled the country in droves since the Islamic Revolution. The Iranian people themselves aware of what's happening in the outside world would love to see their own governmemt toppled.

No one, except know-it-alls like you defend the current Mullah regime. Even Russia, China, Syria, et al - who feast on their spending oil revenues on aggressive regional domination policies and military toys - know it's matter of time before they dig themselves too deep into a pit. Everyone takes their money and rolls their eyes.

Iran could be a prosperous modern nation. They could have a nuclear deterrent program with no one caring. But their 12th Century approach to religion, tribalism, advancement does not work in the 21st Century.

Businesses fail because they don't understand market changes, what the competition is dues, regrettable policies. So do whole countries. There are such things as bad leadership and bad regimes. Iran suffers from it - big time.

No apologies and explanations can change that.


Mike


[edit on 25-9-2009 by mmiichael]



No I'm not defending anyone. Just pointing how absurd at the crap you post. Blaming and pointing fingers. It shows immaturity and lack of awareness in every way.

America has nucs. Why are you so hellbent on focusing about nations you never been too. You say Iran is this and that. But what do you actually know? What is your sources? Why are you focused on problems elsewhere. Can Iran judge what goes on in your house and in your country.

It's absurd the way your behaving. It's quite frankly not something an adult would not communicate in. Adults don't sit and focus about the problems elsewhere. Adults take responsibility for what they do and create in the world.

Seriously just stop the bull#. It's almost unbearable at this rate.

[edit on 25-9-2009 by Mind1universe]



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 11:59 AM
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the war drums are getting a little to loud for my taste, i wonder when it will get to the point that Israel or Iran can't take the banging anymore, resulting in the first stone being thrown, getting the conflict started.

very scary that this tension between these two country's has created a sort of dodge ball type game with Israel and Iran as the captains picking whose on there side en-tell most of the country's with substantial army's are involved...

"I know not what type of weapons will be used in WW3, but WW4 will be fought with sticks and stones" Einstein



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 12:06 PM
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For the sake of this thread and continuation I am going ask everyone to please stop the direct attacks at one another. We all have our own opinions and they are just as valid as the other person next to us. It's okay to disagree with the point made or with the logic behind it but the personal attacks should be left out.

One of the things that makes ATS better than other Alternative News Sites is how much importance our Admins place on Internet Etiquette. C'mon guys, I've read your posts in other threads and know that y'all are better than that!


That being said, does anyone have any thoughts on my question of



Was waiting until now a strategic time for world powers to make this announcement? We just made a huge international decision that we want to start eliminating nukes and being "nuclear free."



-Sliadon



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 12:10 PM
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Originally posted by Sliadon
A US or an Israeli drone.


Not needed.

Try Google Earth at 33°43'9.22"N, 51°43'12.67"E. This is the old enrichment site at Natanz.

Calutron buildings. Compare historical photo of tech here.

Imagine what we could find if we just played with Google Earth all day.

Words out: in a mountain near Qom- 34.65, 50.883333



[edit on 25-9-2009 by Chakotay]



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 12:19 PM
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I don't doubt Iran wants nuclear power... and while I'm sure they'd like nuclear weapons they've consistently co-operated with IAEA inspectors. Last year both the IAEA and the CIA gave Iran a clean bill of health... but the whole time there's been this fearmongering campaign.

It's the boy who cried wolf. How do we know this isn't more fearmongering?

Sadly, it seems as if the IAEA is no longer independent. So I can't take their word on things any more.



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by rich23
It's the boy who cried wolf. How do we know this isn't more fearmongering?


Very good point Rich! With the way the MSM and global leaders have made everything so convoluted its difficult to distinguish what is fear mongering and what is solid fact.

What I do know as fact here is that

*Iran has a second enrichment plant that has made international news.

*President Obama as well as many G20 Big Players are making claims they want a nuclear free world (it is debatable if this is smooth rhetoric or genuine, I'm only looking at fact)

*Iran is now facing international pressure by the US and Western European powers to open the plant up and let inspectors check out what is really going on in there.


Along with all those points are opinions and MSM claims. This is a breaking news story and will take quite some time for us to know for sure what is fact that they are saying vs what is added fear mongering. I really hate to be at a loss for an explanation, but unfortunately I can not answer your question as to whether this is added fear mongering because all I could give is an opinion, not standing facts past what I have presented above.

This truly is something to watch closely because (opinion) this has potential to develop into much more serious a situation than it already is. Statements made by leaders of nations can fan the rhetoric one of two ways. One paints Iran more a villain in the Western world's mind, the other has Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad stepping forward and cooperating.

Like I said, I think this is very important and we should all follow this closely.


-Sliadon



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 12:39 PM
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Originally posted by Mind1universe
No I'm not defending anyone. Just pointing how absurd at the crap you post. Blaming and pointing fingers. It shows immaturity and lack of awareness in every way.

America has nucs. Why are you so hellbent on focusing about nations you never been too. You say Iran is this and that. But what do you actually know? What is your sources? Why are you focused on problems elsewhere. Can Iran judge what goes on in your house and in your country.

It's absurd the way your behaving. It's quite frankly not something an adult would not communicate in. Adults don't sit and focus about the problems elsewhere. Adults take responsibility for what they do and create in the world.

Seriously just stop the bull#. It's almost unbearable at this rate.



Most of what I posted here is the cumulative knowledge of people from Iran, in Iran, or who have dealt with Iran. I pass it on. You claim you know better than they do. And then try to present some Supreme Being POV on anything conflicting with your narrow assessments.

This is a conspiracy site full of overgrown adolescents unaware of what they don't know. Overloaded with insecure people trying to attain some semblance of self respect by assuming they understand everything and passing judgement on anything they disagree with.

Adults do something about problems that exist in their communities, their countries. I know what I've done in my life.
I don't require lectures from a loud mouth on an anonymous forum.

M



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 03:24 PM
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For you armchair Google Earth sleuths, here's a few more sites to see:

AP List of Iran Nuclear Sites.

They say the stuff is underground- good luck finding stuff.

Imanutjob is going to look silly getting his US Army dental exam if he don't wise up.


[edit on 25-9-2009 by Chakotay]



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 07:30 PM
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reply to post by Sliadon
 


The next 3 months will be boring.
Iran will use delaying tactics.
The action will start January 2010.
Keep an eye on Russia.
Putin has a wonderful opportunity here to do something.
Question: If Putin says he can takeover Iran with 3 million troops
and shut down the Iranian nuclear weapon program, will the
United Nations say OK?
Think about it.

I can see them at the UN already.
Hey! Putin isn't stopping!
He entered Saudi Arabia!
OOPS! What do we do now?!!!



posted on Sep, 25 2009 @ 07:37 PM
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Why on earth would Putin attack his buddy? He doesnt want to attack Iran. I dont think Russia can even GET 3 million troops to Iran. When is the last time they have tried to move that many troops? It aint easy and you better have a lot of practice at it.




Originally posted by Eurisko2012
reply to post by Sliadon
 


The next 3 months will be boring.
Iran will use delaying tactics.
The action will start January 2010.
Keep an eye on Russia.
Putin has a wonderful opportunity here to do something.
Question: If Putin says he can takeover Iran with 3 million troops
and shut down the Iranian nuclear weapon program, will the
United Nations say OK?
Think about it.

I can see them at the UN already.
Hey! Putin isn't stopping!
He entered Saudi Arabia!
OOPS! What do we do now?!!!



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