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NAVY and NASA - The REAL "Chemtrails"

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posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 02:38 AM
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Originally posted by Imagir
Quote from official HAARP site: "The HAARP program is jointly managed by the Air Force Research Laboratory and the Office of Naval Research and The HAARP program began in 1990. "


The Program may have started in 1990 but the array wasn't activated until later.


Work on the HAARP Research Station was begun in 1993 following a one year environmental impact analysis. The first functional facility was completed in December 1994 with three passive, diagnostic instruments and an evaluation prototype HF transmitter consisting of 18 antenna elements and a net radiated power of 360 kW./ex]

www.haarp.alaska.edu...

[edit on 26/9/09 by Chadwickus]




posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 02:39 AM
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Originally posted by Imagir

Originally posted by Phage

Quote from official HAARP site: "The HAARP program is jointly managed by the Air Force Research Laboratory and the Office of Naval Research and The HAARP program began in 1990. "


True, but the facility was not operational until later.

Anyway, if you believe that you must surely also believe from the same page:


The HAARP facility will not affect the weather. Transmitted energy in the frequency ranges that will be used by HAARP is not absorbed in either the troposphere or the stratosphere - the two levels of the atmosphere that produce the earth's weather. Electromagnetic interactions only occur in the near-vacuum of the rarefied region above about 70 km known as the ionosphere.

The ionosphere is created and continuously replenished as the sun's radiation interacts with the highest levels of the Earth's atmosphere. The downward coupling from the ionosphere to the stratosphere/troposphere is extremely weak, and no association between natural ionospheric variability and surface weather and climate has been found, even at the extraordinarily high levels of ionospheric turbulence that the sun can produce during a geomagnetic storm. If the ionospheric storms caused by the sun itself don't affect the surface weather, there is no chance that HAARP can do so either.




(which, incidently, is down to those who believe HAARP does affect the weather to disprove
)

[edit on 26-9-2009 by Essan]



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 05:11 AM
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Zorgon I had a beer with a CEO of A Defence contractor.

You are well and truly on the right track mate



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 05:15 AM
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US navy etc... Jorn network not what it seems as even he said it used for other purposes than OHR


According this guy the US Navy are shipping a LOT of stuff in and out of OZ


Gee I need some vodka...go the Cats



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 05:35 AM
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Originally posted by neformore

Originally posted by kingswillquiver
How much you want to bet, 90% of the debunkers are government employees?

Disgusting.


No.

Whats "disgusting" is the fact that, in order to promote your belief, you choose to label, smear and denegrate those who don't see things the same way you do.


Whats more disgusting is that you have not taken anytime to look around for any facts.

That is sad mate


I was lucky enough to talk a defence CEO today whilst drinking dome fine ale's who said that the the US navy is in and out of OZ and to quote him " That's the way its going"

When i asked him about another project which was suss he mentioned above and the conversation led to JORN and what it's really used for and he was more than happy to state the real reason which people are led to believe in a small percentage of WHAT its really used for.

Now you may find some jolly's in useless facts..... but what I have passed on is Hard Wired.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 05:48 AM
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Anyway, back on subject ........ seems we can expect a few more such launches in the future


Bernhardt is already thinking of how the group will design future cloud-making launches. For one, because noctilucent clouds are usually found at higher latitudes, he thinks that sending a rocket into the atmosphere above Alaska or Norway would give a better idea of these clouds' natural behavior, and perhaps allow researchers to follow one for a longer period. If so, residents in northern latitudes could be treated to quite a show during the next experiment.


NASA lights up the East Coast with a Noctilucent cloud

Straight from the horses mouth


[edit on 26-9-2009 by Essan]



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 07:52 AM
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Originally posted by Somamech
Whats more disgusting is that you have not taken anytime to look around for any facts.

That is sad mate



Incorrect Assumption. I'm wating to hear something new. Its a nice try at shooting me down though, but I've been looking at this stuff for 10 years or so now, which is why I have an interest in it.



When i asked him about another project which was suss he mentioned above and the conversation led to JORN and what it's really used for and he was more than happy to state the real reason which people are led to believe in a small percentage of WHAT its really used for.

Now you may find some jolly's in useless facts..... but what I have passed on is Hard Wired.


So by all means educate us, in the meantime, rather than just tossing acronyms about....

Over the horizon radar


Given certain conditions in the atmosphere, radio signals in this frequency range will be reflected back towards the ground. The "correct" frequency to use depends on the current conditions of the atmosphere, so systems using ionospheric reflection typically employ real-time monitoring of the reception of backscattered signals to continuously adjust the frequency of the transmitted signal.




A more recent addition is the Jindalee over-the-horizon radar developed by the Australian Department of Defence in 1998 and completed in 2000. Jindalee is a multistatic radar (multiple-receiver) system using OTH-B, allowing it to have both long range as well as anti-stealth capabilities. Interestingly, Jindalee uses 560 kW as compared to the US's OTH-B's 1 MW, yet offers far better range than the US 1980s system, due to the considerably improved electronics and signal processing.


I'm failing to see a link to chemtrails. At least Zorgons initial post involved injecting a small amount of substance into the far reaches of the upper atmosphere. JORN relies on reflections off the magnetosphere.

So...go on then. Tell us what you think its for.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 11:21 AM
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reply to post by Essan
 


from that article...


Because these clouds block sunlight, they play a part in, and may one day offer a solution to, global warming.


yet, all the patents for aerosol spraying are "not necessarily" being implemented.
yet, NASA is spending, what, hundreds of thousands? millions? ....on creating these noctilucent clouds, hoping to "someday" combat global warming.

apparently, they are already terrified of global warming, so why would they NOT be implementing and experimenting with sunlight blockage?

i mean, that's EXACTLY what chemtrails (from planes) do. they spread out, and merge with each other, and block out the sun.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 11:39 AM
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Originally posted by neformore

Originally posted by Somamech
Whats more disgusting is that you have not taken anytime to look around for any facts.

That is sad mate



Incorrect Assumption. I'm wating to hear something new. Its a nice try at shooting me down though, but I've been looking at this stuff for 10 years or so now, which is why I have an interest in it.



When i asked him about another project which was suss he mentioned above and the conversation led to JORN and what it's really used for and he was more than happy to state the real reason which people are led to believe in a small percentage of WHAT its really used for.

Now you may find some jolly's in useless facts..... but what I have passed on is Hard Wired.


So by all means educate us, in the meantime, rather than just tossing acronyms about....

Over the horizon radar


Given certain conditions in the atmosphere, radio signals in this frequency range will be reflected back towards the ground. The "correct" frequency to use depends on the current conditions of the atmosphere, so systems using ionospheric reflection typically employ real-time monitoring of the reception of backscattered signals to continuously adjust the frequency of the transmitted signal.




A more recent addition is the Jindalee over-the-horizon radar developed by the Australian Department of Defence in 1998 and completed in 2000. Jindalee is a multistatic radar (multiple-receiver) system using OTH-B, allowing it to have both long range as well as anti-stealth capabilities. Interestingly, Jindalee uses 560 kW as compared to the US's OTH-B's 1 MW, yet offers far better range than the US 1980s system, due to the considerably improved electronics and signal processing.


I'm failing to see a link to chemtrails. At least Zorgons initial post involved injecting a small amount of substance into the far reaches of the upper atmosphere. JORN relies on reflections off the magnetosphere.

So...go on then. Tell us what you think its for.



Shooting you down ?




Crikey nice try at twisting the whole scenario of who is shooting people down



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 11:45 AM
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reply to post by Somamech
 


Nicely dodged.

I'll ask again, what do you think its for? Do tell.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 12:20 PM
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Originally posted by billybob

i mean, that's EXACTLY what chemtrails (from planes) do. they spread out, and merge with each other, and block out the sun.


Which is one of the causes of regional warming


Cirrus clouds produce an overall net warming, especially in higher latitudes where they are most prevalent due to the amount of commercial air traffic.

We are therefore looking at ways of reducing persistent contrails.

We do not know whether noctilucent clouds have any such effect - hence we are studying them to find out.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 01:00 PM
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Originally posted by Phage
 


Originally posted by C-JEAN
You KNOW, and I know,and all clever readers here know
VERY well that NOT all chemtrailers say that all persistent contrails
are chemtrails.


Originally posted by Phage
No.
I did not say all chemtrailers say that. You may think I said that,
but your own quote of what I said shows that I did not.

No tricks, just facts.

! ! NOT TRUE again !! It is FAR from being facts ! !
I repeat AGAIN: You are turning to quite low tricks, in your arguments !
They ARE little dirty and childish tricks !
Here is the story, again !:

Originally posted by Phage
But they do say that all persistent contrails are "chemtrails".


Originally posted by C-JEAN
That is NOT true !
That is AGAIN DISinformation !


Originally posted by Phage
Rather than implying I'm lying about something. . .

YES, YOU DID, again !
You KNOW, and I know, and all clever readers here know
VERY well that:

Originally posted by Phage
**But they do say. . .**

has a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT meaning from

** But SOME OF THEM say. . .**

Hey ! ! ! English is NOT my primary language ! !
Will **I** have to show ""you"" how to write english ???

I DID have respect for some "mature answers" you did before.
That is over, now !
And I am done with this ** "ALL" & "not ALL"; "I did" & "I did not" **
thread, and that trolling of yours ! == We have seen your true self !! ==

And. . . back to topic?:
Zorgon, for those who nitpicked in your choice of
the word "chemtrails", we could go for "CHEMDROPs" ! B-)

Blue skies.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 01:55 PM
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reply to post by Essan
 


perhaps, then, global warming could be reduced by not laying down chemtrails, lol.
maybe it's like "the arrival". they WANT global warming, so the shape-shofting reptilians will be comfortable when they take over the planet.

(no, i don't remotely believe that it's "the arrival" scenario)



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 03:47 PM
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Originally posted by billybob
reply to post by Essan
 


perhaps, then, global warming could be reduced by not laying down chemtrails, lol.


Indeed. As some have been suggesting for some time now

www.livescience.com...



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 11:35 PM
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reply to post by Essan
 


Great Thread Baron


Been a long time since we spoke called several times no responce yet though check your messages once in a while will try again tomarrow

Oh and even though I may be new to the site and no disrespect meant I've been listening to this man for several years,you people should listen to zorgon he has been in th reasearch game longer than... well moses was in diapers when Zorgon started looking into things that were outta place



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 11:47 PM
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Originally posted by neformoreI'm wating to hear something new..


NOAA on Over the Horizon Radar...



Other applications of OTH radar

* Hurricane Tracking and Forecasting
* Numerical Weather Prediction
* Space Weather Forecasts
* Marine Weather Forecasts
* Pollution Control
* Fisheries Oceanography
* Air-traffic control
* Search and Rescue
* Calibration and Validation of Satellite Ocean Sensors
* Shortwave Radio Forecasting
* Climate Change
* Marine Weather Research
* Coastal Wave Forecasting
* Ionospheric Research
* Iceberg Tracking


www.etl.noaa.gov...

From the horses mouth
NOAA is using OTHR for CLIMATE CONTROL

Don't know how yet, but that is why OTHR's are on my study list



posted on Sep, 27 2009 @ 04:44 AM
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reply to post by zorgon
 


From following the links on that site, you get....

Pollution Control


To make better use of expensive cleanup resources, models that predict spill trajectories need better and up-to-date current measurements. OTH radar can map ocean surface currents with high resolution, through clouds and rain, over very large ocean areas. More information about surface currents is precisely what is needed to predict the trajectories of surface-borne pollutants. OTH radar can also monitor bursts of strong currents or sudden changes in current direction that can damage offshore oil platforms and cause spills.


Climate Change



OTH radar can monitor surface winds, waves, and currents over large, fixed ocean areas that influence the weather and climate of North America and Europe. It can characterize sea state, a critical unknown in assessing the effects of air-sea interaction on global climate change. Sea state affects ocean albedo and thus the absorption of solar radiation. Sea-surface roughness affects the uptake of greenhouse gases. Surface wind stress, determined by wind speed and surface roughness, affects ocean circulation and the global heat budget. The recently demonstrated capability of OTH radar for mapping surface currents could contribute directly to monitoring ocean circulation and heat fluxes.


Ionospheric Research



Understanding the electrodynamics of the upper atmosphere, particularly in polar regions, has implications for electric power generation, mitigation of geomagnetic storm effects, and estimating satellite drag. It may someday be possible to tap some of the immense electric power flowing in ionospheric currents during geomagnetic storms. Ionospheric heating using high power (such as OTH) radar is a convenient way to study the upper atmosphere�s response to known energy input. Researchers have also proposed studying auroral fine structure and the dynamics of artifical barium clouds with the OTH-B radar.


Its using OTH radar to monitor, not control those subjects, and NOAA has even gone to the lengths of explaining how and why its doing that.

So...what I can't understand is how you draw the conclusion that such things are being used to control, because when I read the above thats not suggested at all. What I see is a tool for research that may eventually lead to other technologies.

You say "you don't know how..." well it strikes me that neither do they.

So, we're in the second guessing business with no facts to show otherwise?

Edited for formatting

[edit on 27/9/09 by neformore]



posted on Sep, 27 2009 @ 10:26 AM
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reply to post by neformore
 



So...what I can't understand is how you draw the conclusion that such things are being used to control...


Second the sentiment, you beat me to it.

But, let's not get in the way of a good yarn, eh??



posted on Sep, 27 2009 @ 01:29 PM
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Originally posted by neformore
Its using OTH radar to monitor, not control those subjects, and NOAA has even gone to the lengths of explaining how and why its doing that.


Well I wasn't using OTHR... I merely added that after it was included.


And as far as the HAARP like, EISCAT like stuff goes... I have only identified sites of interest so far.. haven't gotten around to presenting all the material I have gathered... and I have as yet not drawn any conclusions

That is why its called RESEARCH I don't know yet where it will lead as every time I open a file, it leads to many other facilities mentioned.

I have found enough evidence that lead me to believe that weather manipulation, a space 'shield' for defense purposes both for potential missile threat and solar radiation is at the very least one of the goals of the research.

When I have the final proof you will be the first to know... well maybe not

In the meantime I shall continue to seek my answers and lay on the table what I find... that will give you, Phage and others plenty of material to work over...




posted on Sep, 27 2009 @ 01:37 PM
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Originally posted by weedwhacker
But, let's not get in the way of a good yarn, eh??


Tell you what... since you have admitted you're to lazy to do any research and prefer to sit and munch stale popcorn washed down with cheap barley soda.... and your obvious bias has shown many times in the past you don't even look at material in a serious way, but continue the tactic of constant ridicule, seems to me a waste of bandwidth


I am not here to entertain you, despite how much amusement my material seems to bring you. I am here seeking answers. If the way I think, or the way I make my presentations gives yawl grief, I have only one thing to say...

TOUGH BEANS





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