A Reminder About Iran

reply to post by DeltaChaos


I think you might have jumped in here a little late. I'm not wanting anyone to attack Iran. Please see earlier posts.

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


Zero, I'm sorry but I'm not sure what you are asking.

reply to post by argentus


Good point. The centrifuges were for peaceful nuclear power in every article I've read that didn't have slant to it. I will have to read up more about what you said with the new enrichment going on.

I still have yet to see any agency claim Iran is making anything other than nuclear power.

It would be nice to get a correctly translated message for sure. I've seen in a lot of places though that he did not say what the MSM said he did. He did not claim Iran was going to wipe Israel off the map.

It was more along the lines that Israel would destroy itself through it's own policies.

Originally posted by mkross1983
reply to post by Legion2112

 

Ok. I hear what you are saying.

Why is it do you think these other countries in the Middle East would want Israel gone?

I'm not implying anything, just looking for why you think this is the case.

[edit on 21-9-2009 by mkross1983]

1. The devil knows his time is up, according to prophecy Israel will once again be the biggest factor to the sign of the end times.

2. Take Israel away, takes God promise away and make him turn out a liar.

3. Because Israel was build and succeeded so they want it off them.

4. Because Palestine was never a country or a culture, it was just land mass ruled by Britain.

5. Because they are Jews, its seen as an honour to kill the Jews according to their scriptures.

5. The Conquest mentality, every inch we give they take a mile and make it their own.

6. As long as infidels are driven out or they are under sharia intolerant laws they can throw whoever they want out.

7. Wiping out the Jews like every other demonic forces in charge of the opposing enemy is the only agenda because it seals all the wrong things up.

8. Temple Mount is a sign, once that is out of the way prophecy begins, but the golden lid is stuck on for now.


Arab Caliphate rule (638–1099 CE) Out with The Romans now a new danger.

In 638 CE, following the Siege of Jerusalem, the Caliph Omar Ibn al-Khattab and Safforonius, the Patriarch of Jerusalem, signed Al-Uhda al-'Omariyya (The Umariyya Covenant), an agreement that stipulated the rights and obligations of all non-Muslims in Palestine.[85] Christians and Jews where considered People of the Book, enjoyed some protection but had to pay a special poll tax called jizyah ("tribute").
Infedel Tax.

Britain ruled Palestine between 1920 and 1948, a period referred to as the "British Mandate." - The preamble of the mandate declared:


[edit on 21-9-2009 by The time lord]

reply to post by mkross1983


I wanted to pop in; I just saw, and read the OP. Very well done, and I agree with Warrenb; it's now in my favorites. The information is concise, and I see the naysayer's are picking at straws, or making childish "funnies"

S&F

Originally posted by CanadianDream420
Question #1.........
You're right, he didn't say that in that context. But we all know what he meant.

Com'n, take your head outta your butt.

Question #2....
Oh because they signed a peice of paper, they won't provide nuclear material to "other nations".... 1st off, that doesn't mean the won't... 2ndly, why would they need to provide this to other countries when Hezzbollah is right in their own nation?



facepalm.jpg

/thread


You hit the nail on the head.

reply to post by mkross1983


Name the wars that Israel started.

Name them.

And for your information the manner of the language is nuanced. An Iranian who I work with understood the meaning clearly.

Wipe Israel off the map.

He caught a lot of flak, put some apologists to work on it, and apparently, you bought into that line of crap.

Now, name the wars Israel started.

Hokay, you don't need centrifuges to enrich uranium for a mid-level grade power plant, first and foremost. They're chiefly used to weaponize it. The IAE being rebuked at virtually every pre-disclosure turn should be your second clue. And whether you want to argue over the "context" or not, the fact that a Muslim leader a) suggests the holocaust didn't happen and b) uses terminology that could easily be discerned to mean he wants Israel wiped off the map should be your third. Beyond the forementioned assaults by multiple middle eastern nations on multiple occasions, I can't say anything that would either change your mind or want me to stick around for this. I'm not blind, Israel has had it's fair share of foul-ups along international and in some cases, moral, guidelines. But to so innocently suggest that Iran has nothing but warm, fuzzy feelings for Israel goes so far beyond naeve that I can't in good conscience keep up with this conversation.

reply to post by dooper


Begin seems to think Israel did start the wars

www.wrmea.com...

Originally posted by Legion2112
Hokay, you don't need centrifuges to enrich uranium for a mid-level grade power plant, first and foremost. They're chiefly used to weaponize it. The IAE being rebuked at virtually every pre-disclosure turn should be your second clue. And whether you want to argue over the "context" or not, the fact that a Muslim leader a) suggests the holocaust didn't happen and b) uses terminology that could easily be discerned to mean he wants Israel wiped off the map should be your third. Beyond the forementioned assaults by multiple middle eastern nations on multiple occasions, I can't say anything that would either change your mind or want me to stick around for this. I'm not blind, Israel has had it's fair share of foul-ups along international and in some cases, moral, guidelines. But to so innocently suggest that Iran has nothing but warm, fuzzy feelings for Israel goes so far beyond naeve that I can't in good conscience keep up with this conversation.

I bet once he turns the switches on it all goes wrong like a curse and the only Holocost he will know about is his own in Iran once it all blows up in his face.

Originally posted by dooper

Name the wars that Israel started.

Name them.

1) The 1947 Civil War, which became the Arab israeli war in 1948. Started with a terroist campaign waged by the men and women that would later become the leaders of Israel.
2) 1956 Sinai War (Suez Crisis) (Israel, Britain and France were the military aggressors)
3) 1982 Lebanon War.
4) 2006 Lebanon War.

Those are the official "wars". Then we have Operation Litani in 1978, the Occupation of Southern Lebanon (1982-2000), and countless strikes on the West Bank and Gaza. Then there's smaller incursions like Operation Opera (1981 surprise attack on Iraq's nuclear reactor), and another attack on a Syrian facility in 2007.

Now, name the wars that Iran has started.



[edit on 24-9-2009 by vox2442]

First we must ask why did Israel start those wars and for what reason and is it as bad as it sounds now once there is a reason?

There is also a problem where the Palestinians on one side want to live in a democratic system without sharia law because life would be better, but the extremists are holding them hostages to fear and adding religious dishonour or blackmail on their populations, they can use various Quranic scriptures to keep this mentality going. By saying doesn’t trust the Jews separate them from a united society, their extremism keeps them separate as well as Arab international pressure to do so.
At the end of the day they don't want the Jews, the Quran says it simply enough, it happened in 600AD or so and has done throughout Islamic history, nothing changes, it’s always Islam vs. the Infidel, Sharia Law is set in concrete and will not change where as other more open governments has no problem with Islam as a religion. The Quran itself may insult Christianity and its people and Jews but we are not allowed to mention it because its Islamphobia a hidden social myth to keep people from exposing it, but Islam is full of a 100 phobias where everything is seen as a threat and that includes Jews and Israel and even food and women, to know the real reasons of these nations like Iran we must find out where they fundamentals are played down.

This is a conspiracy website right?

Anyone heard of Propaganda?

Of course what is written about Iran is incorrect, just TPTB advancing their agenda. Western media distorts a lot of the information stream.

Originally posted by The time lord
First we must ask why did Israel start those wars and for what reason and is it as bad as it sounds now once there is a reason?

Ah, so you want me to justify their actions to suit your political views- regardless of the fact that numerous Israeli academics, military officials and government members have agreed that the aforementioned cases (and many more) were cases where Israel was the aggressor?

What would be the point?

reply to post by vox2442


All I am saying or should have expanded is that sometimes the little stories that cause these wars are not always explained or researched well, sometimes you have to dig deep, it always seems when Israel is concerned the story backfires on them. Not untill 9/11 has the world realised or stood up to these constant Islamic threats. Many Islamic threats, intolerant laws, human rights in the Middle East was unheard of, many people did not even care untill it effected them or the West directly, now that it has caught attention we take notice, but under the rubble many stories and reasons have been lost, it's easy to infiltrait as a journalist against a democracy, but its harder to do the same insight of such closed off opressed societies unless journalists dig deep, we don't know how much abuse in Iraq and Afghanistan has gone on, its just the tip of the iceberg, but no one cared before.

reply to post by vox2442


Clever, but no cigar.

The Masters of Warfare have all determined the offensive mindset is critical if one is to maintain freedom of movement.

They likewise tout "offensive defense."

It's another term for "necessity."

In other words, if your opponent is raring back his arm to hit you with a hammer, while he's still in the backward motion, you grab him up close and gut him with the knife in your hand.

A man comes at you with a machete, you'll likely die if you wait for his attack. You'll likely die if you try to run. You attack the man with the machete, and get in close so he has a real problem trying to use it. He already has one hand occupied, so if you're quick and decisive, you can bite his throat, and while it takes three major bites, you can rip his throat out with your teeth, and that machete will just fall to the ground.

Offensive defense. Even in defense, always attack.

The fighting in 1948-49 was going on BEFORE the push for independence.

The others likewise were offensive defenses.

I don't consider the word of one old man to be the definitive final determination of a group effort.



[edit on 27-9-2009 by dooper]

Iran is not North Korea. The leaders don't run around causing trouble and restricting freedoms for the sake of their health. That's not to say they're justified in their approach, but the question is this; Why are the powers that be within Iran reluctant to embrace true Democracy and Freedom? Is it because they're just nasty psychopaths? No.

For every action there is a reaction. The restricted freedoms and farce liberty within Iran is a direct result of international meddling. Mainly by the Americans, British and Israelis. It's a REACTION.

Now if we entertain the above to be true, we're left with the question of why the forementioned nations would bother to meddle with Iran? What purpose would that serve? The anwser is simple, power and oil.

The lack of freedoms and increasingly hostile and irrational rule in Iran is the byproduct of endless international meddling.

We all want freedom, liberties and safety for the Iranian people... Well, most of us. They're the victims in all of this. But we've got to look at it clearly. We can't just say freedom for Iranians, without analysing fairly why Iran is in the state it's in.

For 50 years America has been meddling with Iran. Internally and externally. Whether it's government influenced media propoganda, or actual CIA presence within Iran.

Past Iranian governments however have reached out to the US and western nations for help in growing internal Democracy. We've always spat in their face. The last time being not so long ago, in Bushes presidency... The European Union have also refused to guarantee Iranian security, countless times, when Iran has tried to move forwards as a Democratic power, willing to put a halt to ALL uranium programs. We don't have to look that far back to see far worse criminal acts. 1953, the Shah, a brutal dictator, illegaly put into power by the States and Britain. In 1979 the Iranians took back power of their country. What did the US and Britain do? We supported Suddam Hussein during the Iran-Iraq war. We still continue with ridiculous sanctions against Iran to this day! Continuelly FORCING them into abandoning Democracy, so we have an excuse to invade.

We're allies with the Saudi Arabian dictatorship, a far more brutal regime. Where are the protests for the Saudis? I don't see an international protest for their freedoms. And they live under an even harsher and less democratic nation! Why aren't we threatening them? Why not Israel?

We're not subjected to a barrage of anti-Saudi propoganda, because we're friends with them. The term for this is hypocrisy.

The Iranian government are not the root problem. They're the result, the byproduct, of the root problem. That root problem being the American government and their tyranical foreign policies. Aswell as their sidekicks, Britain and Israel.

There are 2 types of people in this world. The educated, and those who support military action against Iran.

I will post some informative documentaries for those ignorant to the relationship between Iran and the West in both the present and years gone bye, if anyone is interested.