Your NUMBER ONE Enemy, you'll never guess who.

Great thread. In the case that the dollar does collapse and civil unrest does pop up, I see it in a similar fashion. Society would become hell for some people and not so bad for others - probably depending on where you live. The United States would immediately become a place for prison-like politics. I don't know if some people are familiar with the politics that go on inside of American prisons (perhaps you've seen a good prison documentary), but that's exactly how the structure would be formed for the most part. You would have to watch your back, and you couldn't trust anyone, outside of your immediate family and/or close friends (maybe not). Our whole social-think would change within a blink of an eye. The United States would turn into one big Pelican Bay Penitentiary.......also take into account, that without money/social structure, you would have no one in control of our prisons. Eventually, most, if not all inmates would be released (escape). That adds to the whole mess in a very bad way.

We would probably have the balkinization of America within weeks. There would be gang wars, racial riots - the haves vs. the have nots, etc. Every type of me vs. them mentality that you can think of, will probably happen. If you're realistic about it, that's probably what would really happen.

reply to post by spacebot


you cannot compare those ancient civilizations too now.. back then we didn't need fuel to get around, back then most people grew there food, back then most people didn't mortgage there houses...(although the elite could) Back then most products and supplies were from within there countries... unlike now where we import most fuel and products... back then they didn;t use fiat currencies although inflation was still an issue even with silver\gold based coins.. Back then people were just more self sufficient.. we are nation full of non self sufficient people.... and if the U.S does fail then there will be some serious issues while another power swoops right in(NAU anyone) so its not there there will be a complete collapse... just a temporary one... and its during that time that if your caught with your pants down... your pretty much screwed.

[edit on 21-9-2009 by thefreepatriot]

haha, I didnt read this! you may have "good points" but I live in Utah, we have to be "the most prepared" state in the union! ya gotta love the Mormons!

Hey Mr King9072 - a very interesting, articulate and well thought out post. Unfortunately, I just cannot agree with you. Please don't take this as an insult, but I think you sound a little paranoid, and are seeing patterns that aren't there, leading to flawed conclusions.

You are attributing these government types as Bond Villain-like evil geniuses cleverly manipulating international politics to take over the world. This is ridiculous for the following reasons:-

1) Not everyone in politics is evil. The motivation just is not there. I have a fundamental belief in the goodness of my fellow man (at least in the most part). For your conclusions to be true, you would need corrupt, evil individuals throughout the hierarchy of American politics. On a similar note, not only would the politicians have to be thoroughly corrupt, but so would the military. Do you really think that the average grunt, earning a # wage, is going to collude with a plan that is going to devastate his friends and family? Come on!

2) Not only would these 'enlightened ones' have had to infiltrate the American government, but also all the major international governments. ALL of them. How likely do you think this is? Otherwise, appropriate actions would be taken to intervene.

3) Why should I bother stocking up on goods/ water, etc when I know that if it all goes tits-up, I can just stroll over to your little enclosure and steal all your stuff??? Obviously I'm joking, but there is a serious point in there. By warning everyone of these events, you are setting yourself up as a likely target if one feels a bit peckish and is wondering where to steal some goodies.

John (having said that - I liked the post, and usually enjoy reading what you have to say, King9072).

I just wanted to add to my post above..... (I think this is a really interesting thread!)

IF..... the first few stages of your prediction come to pass - what makes you so sure the outcome will be the that those with foodstores will demand protection from the government and hand over more powers? On the contrary, we - in my opinion at least - are more likely to have a full-blown revolution. This could be the great, big re-set switch. It could be a great thing. The people fighting back, and throwing off those shackles. Maybe the 'enlightened ones' are actually on our side?!

Originally posted by Millions

Hey Mr King9072 - a very interesting, articulate and well thought out post. Unfortunately, I just cannot agree with you. Please don't take this as an insult, but I think you sound a little paranoid, and are seeing patterns that aren't there, leading to flawed conclusions.

You are attributing these government types as Bond Villain-like evil geniuses cleverly manipulating international politics to take over the world. This is ridiculous for the following reasons:-

1) Not everyone in politics is evil. The motivation just is not there. I have a fundamental belief in the goodness of my fellow man (at least in the most part). For your conclusions to be true, you would need corrupt, evil individuals throughout the hierarchy of American politics. On a similar note, not only would the politicians have to be thoroughly corrupt, but so would the military. Do you really think that the average grunt, earning a # wage, is going to collude with a plan that is going to devastate his friends and family? Come on!

2) Not only would these 'enlightened ones' have had to infiltrate the American government, but also all the major international governments. ALL of them. How likely do you think this is? Otherwise, appropriate actions would be taken to intervene.

3) Why should I bother stocking up on goods/ water, etc when I know that if it all goes tits-up, I can just stroll over to your little enclosure and steal all your stuff??? Obviously I'm joking, but there is a serious point in there. By warning everyone of these events, you are setting yourself up as a likely target if one feels a bit peckish and is wondering where to steal some goodies.

John (having said that - I liked the post, and usually enjoy reading what you have to say, King9072).

No offense taken, I value your opposition.

More than one person has mentioned that this is simply paranoia, with no basis in reality. I truly wish and hope that to be the case, unfortunately, documented history and the current flow of our reality points to the contrary.

The best part is that, even if I am completely wrong, the only thing you have lost is the time it took you to be prepared. But those preparations are useful if any large natural disaster hits your area.

---

Now, the meat of your post was the result of you failing to see the greater picture. You are still stuck in the mindset of focusing on the limbs of the monster, and not the monster itself.

Do not worry, you're not alone.

Your entire post rests on two facts;

A. Not everyone in politics is evil.
B. "every government would have to be infiltrated, even foreign governments".

For (A), you're absolute right. Now you need to understand that politics is one large distraction. All real changes are done without democracy having any involvement, that's a fact so I suggest you look into it. Start by investigating how much "DEMOCRACY" went into passing either 1. Patriot Act, and 2. TARP.


For (B), again, you are focusing on the established belief system. The international bankers that steal all of the income taxes of Americans, Canadians, and many other countries do not know national boundaries.

They are international in every sense of the word, and thus, hold no loyalties. They use whoever and whatever to further their goal. The evidence of their existence is overwhelming, and this is why everyone needs to quit with the theory that "They just wouldn't do that, they're not that evil"..

This was a common detraction with 911, "Oh yah right the government wouldn't kill 3000 people get real you lunatic"...

Once again, hate to be the barer or bad news, but they will. The difference is between what we are both thinking about when we say government.

When you say government, you imagine your local politicians and perhaps even federal. In that sense, you're correct. But the true sense of the word in my opinion is the people who actually make things change, and in that respect, it's the international bankers.


EVERY SINGLE ISSUE that is on the Mainstream Media's platter is simply distraction. It is all meant to keep us entertained so we do not look at the greater picture, and the greater picture is that the FRAUDULENT MONETARY POLICY, and it's (CREATORS AND OWNERS) Are actually above everything else.

So I hope you do not take offense, when I say that on this, you are ignorant to your reality. I cannot state whether it's ignorance by choice, but I urge you to research.


Good luck everyone, glad this thread has been received well.

Originally posted by Millions
I just wanted to add to my post above..... (I think this is a really interesting thread!)

IF..... the first few stages of your prediction come to pass - what makes you so sure the outcome will be the that those with foodstores will demand protection from the government and hand over more powers? On the contrary, we - in my opinion at least - are more likely to have a full-blown revolution. This could be the great, big re-set switch. It could be a great thing. The people fighting back, and throwing off those shackles. Maybe the 'enlightened ones' are actually on our side?!

I know I did not specifically state it, I was really hoping people would understand my point.

3 things that I wanted people to take from this thread:
1. Get prepared.
2. Inform their friends.
3. Understand the pattern.


Cause you're exactly right, if everyone was prepared though, the government would not be able to use social breakdown as a TOOL. That's all this is to them, it's a tool to impose control, and consolidate more power and money.

But if a large majority of Americans were prepared, and social breakdown occurred, those who remained when the dust settled would not allow a totalitarian solution, and that's why I say, I wish everyone in the US and other countries would wake up tomorrow with the knowledge of this thread. If that were the case, disaster would be avoided.


EDIT TO ADD: The following quote makes it abundantly clear your still clinging to blissful ignorance, (please do not take offense, everyone goes through this)

Maybe the 'enlightened ones' are actually on our side?

Nothing can be further from the truth, history has clearly demonstrated that the people at the very top have no emotional attachment to you, I, as well as likely anyone we know. They do not care, to help illustrate this point, I will include quotes from a key member of this cabal.

"We are grateful to the Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years."

"It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subjected to the lights of publicity during those years. But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries."

- David Rockefeller

But more importantly, from his own memoirs;

For more than a century, ideological extremists at either end of the political spectrum have seized upon well-publicized incidents to attack the Rockefeller family for the inordinate influence they claim we wield over American political and economic institutions. Some even believe we are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as 'internationalists' and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure - one world, if you will.

There is no need for theories, when the people in charge of all this, publicly state their agenda.

The tragedy, is that even with the truth right in front of people they do everything they can to deny the truth that conflicts with their false perception of reality.



[edit on 21-9-2009 by king9072]

reply to post by king9072

I salute you'r masterfully researched and skillfully presented exhortation to those who have an ear to listen to the measured and calm voice that says"prepare".
I first began tracking the H.I.V./A.I.D.S. reporting in 1981, after an undisclosed entity contracted with a group I was involved with concerning the transfer mechanisms of the A.I.D.S. virus. This did not appear to be developed as consequence of any known viral infection (H.I.V. was not noted)in any human population, rather coming on scene in African populations already fully developed in 1978 and developing into full blown A.I.D.S. within weeks instead of years.
The next outbreaks in 1981 had been modified so that carriers would be contagious (H.I.V. phase) for a much longer period before "Slims" as aids was called in native populations became disabling.
It was generally recognised that H.I.V./A.I.D.S. were not a natural development of any known disease process, and the whispers were that this was a laboratory created disease which was targeted. In June of 2009 the Scripps Institute provided a close-up look at the cone-shaped shell that is the hallmark of human immunodeficiency virus. The mystery surrounding the "impossible" capsid hexamer was seen at atomic resolution to be a work of great artistry.
We had been shut-out of our studies in 1983 soon after we began suspecting that we were dealing with a created virus. The new Smallpox if you will.
I have kept a running count on the actuarilly impossible wave of deaths of microbiologists since the late 90's when it became obvious that all was not well in whoville. Many had studied the A.I.D.S. virus and had charted infected populations more than a decade ago, looking for mutations, but had begun to look at more virulent diseases which might cause more fatalities in infected populations.
I and a few friends (most of whom are M.D.s or are involved with graduate school statistical surveys regarding contagion and distribution across varied ethnic, social, and geographic groupings) have researched numerous doctorial thesis of PhD candidates, and published papers of microbiologists who had presented for peer review distillations of their studies, findings, and conclusions, in search of common threads regarding several diseases which started making a comeback in 1977. These were scientists who looked for cause, and cure after identifying S.A.R.S. which didn't seem to have "legs" outside of Asian cities. How many had looked into the strange bedfellows of (1918 Spanish Flu)H1N1,(the 1977 re-emergance of AH1N1 extinct since 1957), strands recombined into a not as virulent as expected flu, it is not known, but now that the H5N1, and H3N2 segments have been added virologists expect more widespread outbreaks with higher mortality, as the couragous Dr. Horowitz noted, populations will be "primed" with this newly improved flu virus...somebody needs a lot of fatalities, as soon as possible.
The 4 horsemen are riding hard and fast, be aware and stay informed because when the SHTF you don't want to catch the sneeze with the breeze.
In case of nuclear attack I intend to be standing at ground zero with my catchers mitt....instant karma!

i totally agree with this thread but how soon will this happen people??
i dont know if i'll have enough time to prepare and warn everyone!

Paranoia grows more and more complex by the day, I'd have to ask. . . What if nothing has happened in twenty years and you read the same post by the next generations of the highly paranoid?

Will you counter there fears as I just have, or fear being labelled a member of the 'sheeple' society?

Edit: God bless America.

[edit on 21-9-2009 by Sed Non Credo]

I live in a rural area we are always stocked up and prepared. Imo one thing that is not being factored into the equation is Medicated America.

I did medical transport for a small nearby town. There is a large percentage of people who take serious meds on a daily basis. On the other hand there is an equally large percentage who use illegal drugs/alcohol routinely. Could this be part of the plan getting America good and anesthetized, addicted?

Even if prepared with supplies could people make do without their meds/drugs/alcohol for very long? Sure they might be rampaging at first especially the illegal drug users and alcoholics but how soon before withdrawal sets in? Withdrawal can be horrendous even deadly. Those would be some pretty desperate people they would not be looking for food or water they will be careless, panicked and dangerous but getting sicker day by day. If you could wait them out many will die or be killed. The people on legal meds could easily be persuaded to move to camps where their meds could be more easily provided. I would expect such places to be orderly and safe but for me it would be like prison living under an overseer caring for my needs..not me at all.

It's no use comparing the old days to now. People are completely different. We are domesticated man. Imo there are many methods of control, big pharm & the illegal drug trade for example. You could list electricity, modern heating, supermarkets almost anything we take for granted that is in place keeping us dependent whether intentional or not.

After a time people who are left will come out of hiding and begin to share and help each other. Just be prepared to sit it out for awhile no matter where you find yourself. Don't forget interior doors and furniture could be used to secure exterior doors & windows. Keep long wood screws & tools handy.

I don't know if anything like this will happen but for us being prepared to live with what we've got on hand has always been the norm. It has happened a time or two living as isolated as we do. Imo it's more the mindset than the amount of supplies you've stocked up on. Try living simply for a week just to get a taste of it who knows you might actually enjoy it. Great thread S&F for you

Originally posted by Sed Non Credo
Paranoia grows more and more complex by the day, I'd have to ask. . . What if nothing has happened in twenty years and you read the same post by the next generations of the highly paranoid?

Will you counter there fears as I just have, or fear being labelled a member of the 'sheeple' society?

Edit: God bless America.

[edit on 21-9-2009 by Sed Non Credo]

Paranoia was Y2K.

Paranoia is not looking at the facts, and stated agenda of those controlling the collapse, and then using logic and reasoning to predict the next moves.


Everyone is so quick to jump on the paranoia bandwagon. What they fail to understand is that it could go both ways, understanding why they do things and what their actions indicate for the future - could show you something "good" that is about to happen. In this case though, all indications point to something "bad" happening.


And, if anyone does not want to prepare, and wants to completely dismiss this as paranoia - be my guest. Good luck to you and your loved ones, you're going to need it.

reply to post by Morningglory


You make a great point, and it expands on a point I have made throughout the thread.

The fact of the matter is that BY DESIGN, we have been forced into dependence on our society.

Long gone are the days where a small town could be self sufficient, producing everything they need locally. LONG GONE. Med's are yet another thing that must be supplied externally.

So we're stuck in a situation where practically every major city in the US;
- cannot produce enough food to supply it's people.
- does not have adequate supplies on hand to deal with large disasters (whatever that may be)
- ultimately, they cannot and WILL NOT be able to satisfy the basic needs of the millions of people.

That's why there HAS to be social breakdown. They've purposely removed the means to be entirely self sufficient. The more dependent on external resources we are, the less powerful we ultimately are. Because if they can stop the flow of external resources, they can bring us to our knees.

Not paranoia, this is fact.



EDIT: HAHA 54 flags, 60+ responses and once again my experiments yield the same results. Any mention of the inappropriate actions of the sites admins/moderators guarantees zero applause. Good thing they don't matter

[edit on 21-9-2009 by king9072]

A great thread that includes a lot of the information I have mentioned myself. I have repeatedly asked, "Who is this elusive enemy everyone fails to identify" - I think King9072 offered many great points.

I believe the catalyst will be when and if the Just-In-Time delivery system that's in place to keep store shelves well stocked breaks down. This will be when people lose their minds. I think hunger will be the driving force behind social distortion.

People are too involved with routine and the pecking-order too take action or accept what is going on around them, if the system breaks down.

The American Populace is strung out on pharmaceuticals that keep them subdued and passive. Point being; People care about 'So You Think You Can Dance' and the 24 Hour News Cycle of infotainment so much so that if their world is falling down around them, they wont care to take action because it wont seem real. To further this point; Look at the quality of entertainment thats prevalent in our society, go to the movie store, review whats available on Video Now services. Horror,slasher and cut-em-up films, even main-stream films like Gladiator and Black Hawk Down all display gratuitous violence/gore. The end result being a desensitization to violence/gore. Couple this with the abundance of mind altering medication in our society and I don't know how likley people will be to 'go nuts and turn on one another'. They may simply sit in their house glued to the T.V. waiting for the reality programs next episode. There will be an initial surge of crime but people will become too lazy or uninterested in taking action when it would be much easier to stand in a food line provided by the Government. Take for instance the fall of the Soviet Union in the late 80ies. Mafia style crime rings flourished and the mass of citizenry stood in line for Government distributed food stuffs. There was no epic struggle of Mad Max types roaming the landscape of a dead country killing their neighbors.

This is not some movie set we are moving in to as a nation. To fantasize of such social catastrophe could be considered a mental illness.

What about Martial Law? I have not read mention of Martial Law in this thread. What about the U.N.? What action would other Nations take if the one recognized world power began to fall apart? Would other Nations send troops and what would an occupying foreign army look like, how would that be delt with? You see, once you believe to have the answer, you only open the door for many more questions. King9072, I think you've got a great thread, but I think you've only touched less than 1% of the issue.

You seem to suggest we stock up on food, ammo and run for the hills. Do you not think that the hills is most likely where the masses will run if TSHTF? Hills being outside city/town/metro areas. Are we to build fortresses in the woods to protect ourselves? Are we not simply prolonging the inevitable by taking such actions? I mean to say; Eventually, when your own supplies run dry, will you not become the home invading criminal you once defended against?

Now enters Nicomachean Ethics. Is a starving mother who attacks you and your family to feed her self and her children an 'Enemy'? What justice should be applied to her? Do you kill her for wanting to survive? Would your actions be justified? Would you not at this point become the thing in which you identify as an 'Enemy'?

Is this all fantasy? Fortresses in the woods? Home invasions? The American collapse? Stock piles of essentials? What does the Gov. do to groups of people that stock-pile essentials, the Branch Davidians is a good example.

I look forward to your responce King9072

[edit on 21-9-2009 by Mr.Hyde]

Nice work , while I may not agree 100% with you ,I'am 100% sure that if we where all prepared at least a little bit things would be a lot less dangerous if things get bad for any lengh of time.Winters comming and up here that brings a whole new dynamic to any # hitting the fan scenario.Once again nice work keep it comming.
S&F

Paranoia? Alot of people are in for a very rude awakening. People assume it cant and wont happen here. The ecconomy will colapse. It is inevitable. The numbers dont lie. We cant sustain the debt. Ignorance is your #1 enemy!

[edit on 21-9-2009 by liveandletlive]

reply to post by frostback


Im sorry to tell you this, but i think he's dead.

Scottish author John Galt (1779-1839) wrote extensively during the early 1800s, producing novels as well as works of drama, poetry, art criticism, and biography. He also worked as a lobbyist and founded settlements in Canada.

I cant afford to prepare.


also...

[edit on 21-9-2009 by spaceman84]

If you think you are prepared, if such a situation really were to occur, you would find that there is nothing you could have done to really prepare. You are fooling yourself. Your garden and weapon locker won't mean squat.

Of course, I think the OP is blowing things out of proportion. I don't think the dollar will be ALLOWED to collapse to that point. Not now. Not when the entire world would be so dramatically affected. It simply won't be an allowable option for many reasons.

And swine flu? Are you kidding me? What mandatory vaccinations? If you have some special news source we are not aware of please share it.

Of course, this and other conspiracy sites thrive on gloom, doom, and financial and political ruin. For some reason, they get off on the thought of civil warm, disaster, and unrest. So hearing this sort of thing on a regular basis is hardly a surprise.

reply to post by king9072


"The time of reckoning is at hand."

It is not.