CNBC Poll: Should the Fed be Abolished?, page 2

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 47 times

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 04:20 PM by watcher2

reply to post by whatshenneping

seeing how the fed was created to prevent depressions, it should be done away with.
they haven't done squat and is now run from out of the country, Netherlands I think.
how stupid are we to pay interest on our own money when most of it goes overseas

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 04:30 PM by mrpotatohead

I think we have come too far, and must fall off the cliff before we can get up, dust ourselves off, and start over.

Except for a violent insurection, change would be very difficult. Many Americans just don't understand who really runs this country. it certainly isn't the voters. As Americans, we have given away the keys to the kingdom, and they will not be freely given back--we must take them back.

Americans must also forget this concept of a two party system. It doesn't really exist. there is only one ruling elite, and they control it all. We are periodically as serfs, given little bites of the pie, that we actually own, but gave it up for new episodes of American idol, and Sex in the City. I think you catch my drift. Right out from under our noses, it has all be taken away, and now, the elites will finish what they started.

Abolish the FED???? That is an idea that shows the spell has been broken, and Americans now know who really screwed things up for all. What will happen???---How much civil unrest are we willing to put up with??? The answer to that is the key to the question......

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 04:46 PM by walman

What a disingenuous poll.

You are asking people, who don't know exactly what the Fed is doing (or what its agenda is) outside of mostly speculative theory, whether we should abolish the Fed? How about first asking whether we should audit it, that way we can actually know what it is doing (and what its agenda is)?

Anyone of a sound mind should disregard the results of this poll.

I voted 'Not Sure'. But if the question was whether or not we should audit the Fed, I would likely have voted 'Yes', and reserved my response to the question of abolishing it until I had all of the facts that an audit would reveal.

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 05:05 PM by lagnar

reply to post by walman

VERY good point wal, but you've got to admit that it serves a positive that so many in such a short time have viewed this info, and are possibly making their friends aware of this issue.

Honestly though, any genuine audit of the Fed will certainly mean its undoing (operative word being 'genuine').

My question is, "Exactly what happens to the Dollar - or more the point - the Dollars in my personal bank account if the fed is undone?"

But maybe GCD is right. Maybe the audit will be nothing but an elaborately entertaining surface audit, and come to nothing but vein distraction in the end.

[edit on 19-9-2009 by lagnar]

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 06:47 PM by badmedia

reply to post by walman

Excuse me, but I do know about the fed. I voted yes and for a reason. I think many other people understand it as well, because it's not really hard to understand.

Answer the following questions:

1. Why is the money by the fed issued as a loan? Who is it in this world that has all this money to loan out? If the US is the richest nation in the world, then who is so rich to loan out so much money?

China? Russia? Nope. The total debts to these countries is less than 5% of the debt.

So, who is it that we owe this money too?

2. Why is this money created/loaned at interest? How is it possible to pay back this interest money when the interest money itself is never created, and the money which is created is given away as a loan and has to be paid back.

That is really all you need to know in order to know if the fed should be gotten rid of.

The "money" they create comes out of thin air. It gets it's value based on the existing currency, of which it takes value from(IE: the money in your pocket). As such, why is it loaned out to the very same people who it gets it's value from? And at interest.

There is absolutely no reason why those who control our currency should be allowed to create money out of thin air, and then loan it at interest.

At the very least, we could have a system that didn't issue money as a loan and at interest, and guess what would happen if we did that - no more income taxes would need to be paid.

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 06:50 PM by Shaun1111

abolish the fed and anything like it, please

it does not exist in my reality!

hugs

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 07:21 PM by BaronVonGodzilla

Originally posted by Chovy
I'm Canadian and I think the fed should dismantled and burned to the ground.

Are Americans finally waking up?

Americans have always been awake, it's just that America is trying to put us back to sleep and every day is a struggle with 100% media saturation. Our Country is basically owned by Fox News, which is owned by Rupert Murdoch, an Australian.

Originally posted by Beefcake
Hardly a scientific poll but relevant none the less as it is on a mainstream site.

I keep seeing people say this in this thread. I am admittedly no scientist, but I don't understand why this is?

Could someone explain to me what is broken about this poll? Not necessarily Butterbean, though Butterbean is cool.

[edit on 19-9-2009 by BaronVonGodzilla]

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 07:23 PM by BaronVonGodzilla

((Sorry I am kind of absent minded and posted twice in this thread. I have combined the two posts above^))

[edit on 19-9-2009 by BaronVonGodzilla]

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 09:12 PM by walman

Originally posted by badmedia
reply to post by walman

Excuse me, but I do know about the fed. I voted yes and for a reason. I think many other people understand it as well, because it's not really hard to understand.

Answer the following questions:

1. Why is the money by the fed issued as a loan? Who is it in this world that has all this money to loan out? If the US is the richest nation in the world, then who is so rich to loan out so much money?

China? Russia? Nope. The total debts to these countries is less than 5% of the debt.

So, who is it that we owe this money too?

2. Why is this money created/loaned at interest? How is it possible to pay back this interest money when the interest money itself is never created, and the money which is created is given away as a loan and has to be paid back.

That is really all you need to know in order to know if the fed should be gotten rid of.

The "money" they create comes out of thin air. It gets it's value based on the existing currency, of which it takes value from(IE: the money in your pocket). As such, why is it loaned out to the very same people who it gets it's value from? And at interest.

There is absolutely no reason why those who control our currency should be allowed to create money out of thin air, and then loan it at interest.

At the very least, we could have a system that didn't issue money as a loan and at interest, and guess what would happen if we did that - no more income taxes would need to be paid.

I should have made myself more clear, and I apologize that I did not: it's a CNBC poll. No mainstream media outlet takes into account that its readers are well versed in the knowledge of the history of the Fed. They're dealing with beginners and asking them if we should abolish it - that's like asking the average High School science student whether or not we should embrace String Theory based on some partial commentary.

If it were a poll in ATS I would not have responded as I did. I hope you don't think that "most people" who answered that poll are from ATS.

There are aspects of the Fed that are easy to understand, but the reasoning for implementation and the philosophy of intervention are not very easy. You clearly subscribe to a different philosophy than some people who support the Fed (and who probably understand it more than you do), so the decision to audit/abolish is easier for you to come to on less information than it is for them. I will go out on a limb and say that most of the people who voted in that poll have no understanding of the contrast between interventionist (more regulation) and non-interventionist (less regulation) philosophies, and therefore go into it ill-equipped and are not making a truly informed decision.

Quit saying the money comes out of thin air unless you're prepared to say that the plants that it is printed on come out of thin air, or that the confidence that backs it manifests out of thin air. It is no more out of thin air than anything you make or any agreement that you come into. Gold itself - though there is more logic behind its valuation - by similar reasoning comes out of thin air.

I think you need to reconsider the reasons for the conclusions you come to. To some degree I would like to see some more transparency in the Fed, some oversight by people of integrity who can assure that there is no abuse or subversion of American sovereignty. But even with all that I know about the Fed I am not prepared to say that it should be abolished. That said, though, I am not opposed to abolishing it.

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 09:44 PM by mrpotatohead

Originally posted by walman
What a disingenuous poll.

You are asking people, who don't know exactly what the Fed is doing (or what its agenda is) outside of mostly speculative theory, whether we should abolish the Fed? How about first asking whether we should audit it, that way we can actually know what it is doing (and what its agenda is)?

Anyone of a sound mind should disregard the results of this poll.

I voted 'Not Sure'. But if the question was whether or not we should audit the Fed, I would likely have voted 'Yes', and reserved my response to the question of abolishing it until I had all of the facts that an audit would reveal.

Most Americans aren't as stupid as you think. They know the FED controls monetary policy. They know our dollar is worthless. They know Congress could do something if they wanted to. They know as a nation , we are ruined. They know we need some answers.

How long are we going to let people keep pointing fingers?? There aren't that many different organizations in control to blame. The FED, and congress. What are we waiting for.???

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 11:14 PM by kissmygrits

Abolish the Federal Reserve:

We cannot abolish a private company. I have been telling people for years ( about 20 yrs) that the Federal Reserve has nothing to do with the federal government, that it is in deed a private enterprise. (1933)
It was only given that name so we the people would not pay attention as to what was going on inside the FR. We are all thinking, my gosh the congress and every body are surely looking after our better interest, while all this time the World Bank CFR people are laughing up their sleeve patting each other on the back reassuring each other that the average american can be raised like a Mushroom ie.( kept in the dark, in a warm & fuzzy environment while what use to the Mainstream news media heep's plies of B.S. on us) so we will grow in the right direction.

We still have the power Know one is prouder of an 8.0 credit score than I am. Now that the credit card companies have upped everyones interest rate and we can no longer keep up or get a decent housing loan or refi out a ARM we are stuck because all the stimulas money went to Wall street Gang. Here is What I suggest We Do ...It's going hurt them more then us. HOW can we take control back well if we can cause the econmy to collaspe on our terms then the NWO, Federal Reserve, CFR and all the powers to be will know that we the people have control.

Everyone with a credit card should charge them to the Max. then refuse to pay them. If enough people do this I have calculated that we can cause a rush for the economy to completely fail ( which it is going to do anyway) but on our time table. If you can disrupt the oppositions time table you can stop or break their chain of control. I recommend that you use you credit cards for buying all the gold bars and silver dollars you can store and then buy food goods and other types of commodities's so you will not suffer when the melt down does arrive. Change your phone number so the creditors will not bother you. The economy will most likely collapse before you will need to file chapter 11 or 13 BK papers. I did it once it was not that bad and I recovered in short order.

What do you think is this a whacked idea or will it work ? I think It will work and the more people involved the faster we the people regain control while there is still time to do it. Stern measures are needed and I do consider this a stern measure I do not make this suggestion in jest nor do I make it lightly. KMG

[edit on 19-9-2009 by kissmygrits]

reply posted on 19-9-2009 @ 11:42 PM by badmedia

reply to post by walman

90% of the people in the poll answered to get rid of it. Obviously they know something.

My CEO doesn't visit here, and I'd bet he would vote yes as well. With the economy the way it has been, it's made people take a look at things, and the scam of the fed is pretty clear and easy to see. I told him before the economy collapsed it would happen, and when I asked him about the economy last time and what he thought, he replied to me with 1 word - "Fiat".

I think people know more than you think they do. It's the internet and the information age.

There are aspects of the Fed that are easy to understand, but the reasoning for implementation and the philosophy of intervention are not very easy. You clearly subscribe to a different philosophy than some people who support the Fed (and who probably understand it more than you do), so the decision to audit/abolish is easier for you to come to on less information than it is for them. I will go out on a limb and say that most of the people who voted in that poll have no understanding of the contrast between interventionist (more regulation) and non-interventionist (less regulation) philosophies, and therefore go into it ill-equipped and are not making a truly informed decision.

Quit saying the money comes out of thin air unless you're prepared to say that the plants that it is printed on come out of thin air, or that the confidence that backs it manifests out of thin air. It is no more out of thin air than anything you make or any agreement that you come into. Gold itself - though there is more logic behind its valuation - by similar reasoning comes out of thin air.

You are criticizing what other people know, and yet in your post here you yourself don't even begin to touch on the problems with the fed.

The #1 problem with the fed is that it loans out the money it creates with interest. When the value of the money it creates comes from the existing currency. It's legalized counterfeit, and is nothing based on what you are talking about.

It's pretty simple. Lets say there is $100 in the world. Lets say you have $10 of that. You own 10% of the worlds wealth. For simplicity, lets also say there exists 20 apples in the world to eat from. Each apple has a value of $5. 20 apples X $5 each = $100. With your $10 you can by 2 apples. This is your purchasing power.

Now, enter in the fed. The fed adds $100 to the circulation. Now each apple has a value of $10 each. Still only 20 apples, but now $200 total, so 20 apples X $10 each = $200. You still only have your $10. Guess what? Now you can only buy 1 apple, when you could buy 1 before. Half of your purchasing power was just taken from you, and your wallet was never touched. This is an inflation tax on the people.

But since the fed loans that $100 out, it has to be paid back. But who has to pay it back? You do in part. That is the national debt. But oh, it doesn't stop there. They also charge interest, so you have to pay $105 back. Well guess what, Make 20 loans and the original $100 is owed back to the bank. Now the bank owns everything.

There is no legitmate reason at all why that which controls the legal tender and money supply of the nation to be able to loan out money, especially at interest. Because the value of that money comes from the people themselves.

This hurts the poor the most and is why the poor are in such need. Because they don't get that new money, they are on fixed income. So when the prices go up as the economy adjusts to the inflation, they are just stuck with buying less. Meanwhile, the rich people get all this new money and live like kings.

Anyone who doesn't favor getting rid of the fed is no friend of the people. I haven't even got into how the money trickles down to those who serve the system through corporations(soul less beings that have been given the same rights as individuals without having to bear any responsibility).

The reason people ask for a gold standard is because under a gold standard the money is redeemable 100% in gold. So even though the money is inflated, you can atleast redeem the money for real gold that is not.

Which is btw, the same reason they dropped the gold standard. Because it got to the point where only 10% of the money that existed was actually backed in gold. This meant that someone could take 10% of the wealth in dollars, and then redeem it for 100% of the value and take all the gold if they redeemed their money.

Of course "they" know all this stuff, it's why they are so guilty. If it was about honesty, at the very least they would issue the money without it being a loan and without interest. And then the money that is issued would be used for government services, and there is no need for an income tax and such - which btw only goes towards paying the interest on the debt - documented back in the 80's when we owed much less.

I'm glad people are waking up to it. It's nothing less than economic slavery under the illusion of freedom.

reply posted on 20-9-2009 @ 12:21 AM by ashamedamerican

Watch this and it should explain all you need to know about the Federal Reserve, and our illegal income tax.
America: Freedom to Fascism - Director's Authorized Version

Google Video Link

"Even if the 16th Amendment were properly ratified, according to Article 1, Section 9 of the Constitution, it has always been unconstitutional for the U.S. Federal Government to directly tax We the People in their property, wages, salaries, or earnings."

Not to mention that the Fed isn't suppose to be controlling our money to begin with.
According to the constitution only congress has the authority
"To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures"
"Money was to be by weight, not by fiat. That’s why in that clause, it talks about weights and measures."
Also:
"No Money shall be drawn from the Treasury, but in Consequence of Appropriations made by Law; and a regular Statement and Account of the Receipts and Expenditures of all public Money shall be published from time to time."
I want my receipt for all those black budget projects now please.

reply posted on 20-9-2009 @ 02:11 AM by mike dangerously

It's about time to do away with the Fed although I expect them to fight this bill to the bitter end Bernake is gonna be showing up on the hill using very scare tactic he and his masters have.

reply posted on 20-9-2009 @ 07:45 PM by patchy

Fed Abolished?

Yes and No!

Yes! If Congress and "We The People" can't Nationalize the FED and remove it from the hands and control of the private Corporation and Banker's that hold sway!

No! If Congress can wrest control and Nationalize the Fed and "We The People"can print our own money!
The FED is an established institution, we just need to take it over,root out the criminals.
To replace it with another would take forever.

Let's abolish the IRS!

I firmly believe without a doubt, that this is the most important issue at hand and that it's the first step in saving America, and the world from the Globalist threats.

Realistically? 911 was nothing compared to what the "powers that be" would unleash to prevent it from ever happening!

I'd like to be wrong about that though, and have in fact given monetary support to HR 1207 and SB 604 and signed a petition to the U.S House and my Senators!

Patchy

reply posted on 20-9-2009 @ 08:00 PM by The only 1 who knows the

I agree 100% that the FED must go. Why? cause the FED is like 3rd Party Loan Sharks. Before the Feds came into power Congress went to the Treasury to print our money, to keep our country going and it was interest free. But in 1913, The Federal Reserve Act was implemented and followed by the IRS as a collection agent for the FED. Also when we get a raise we just get an amount just under the cost of living and never equal to or above it. We have lost our freedom to the private banks that create money out of thin air and enslave the common man to a life of debt. If we are to be indebted let it be to our country and not the Private bankers called the FED. In my opion the UN is just a front for the World Bankers. This is why the middle class can never get ahead and will always be a sheepie or slaves to the fed.

If this is in the wrong place please excuse me
Thanks

reply posted on 21-9-2009 @ 03:15 PM by mike3

I'm curious. I've heard some here say the FED is "illegal". Where in the US legal code is the law that the FED would be breaching?

reply posted on 21-9-2009 @ 03:40 PM by Doc Holiday

income tax started as a war time $$ generator only and was to stop @ the end of ww-1 if I am correct?
Thats just for starters on what is illegally being done by TPTB.

reply posted on 21-9-2009 @ 03:41 PM by Skada

Originally posted by walman

Originally posted by badmedia
reply to post by walman

Quit saying the money comes out of thin air unless you're prepared to say that the plants that it is printed on come out of thin air, or that the confidence that backs it manifests out of thin air. It is no more out of thin air than anything you make or any agreement that you come into. Gold itself - though there is more logic behind its valuation - by similar reasoning comes out of thin air.

Plants do (partially) come out of thin air. They take in CO2 and spit out O2. Since they are Carbon based, they (in a sense) DO come out of thin air.

That is no reason to state that money comes out of thin air, only its value. Fiat money's value is backed by the government, but only since the bankers falsely brought the FED into being many moons ago and since then we have suffered for it. By defaulting on the BS loans that where taken out and our real property with real value has been taken.

Life was easier in the 50's, why? The value of the dollar went farther. Now, both parents have to work JUST to raise a family. I'm a single parent with one child and still struggling. Hmmm, pay the notes or eat? Tough choice.

And now, the banks get my money from taxes because they "are too big to fail." I smell BS. The FED is illegal as is income taxes.

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