What does drinking out of a skull signify?

nevermind.

[edit on 19-9-2009 by jeasahtheseer]

reply to post by kingswillquiver


Read the whole book and you will get your answer. I won't spoil it for you.


I highly reccommend this book to everyone. While it is a work of fiction it will definatly change how you look at religion and science for the better.

Best fiction book I have ever read.

My question is to freemason members, Augustusmasonicus, RuneSpider, JoshNorton, network dude, Skyfloating, Masonic Light and friends...

( Please..... i am demanding you, to respond seriously and honestly. )

As you were holding the human skull in your hands and drinking wine out of it, how did you live the experience and what went through your minds.

Each of you Individualy, please discribe your experience and what did you gained out of this macabre ritual.....



Thank you

[edit on 19-9-2009 by Shadow18433]

reply to post by Shadow18433


Oh bloody hell.

Look dude, I'm not a Mason. I don't intend to BE a Mason, if I give off the impression I am, it's because I've actually made a attempt to learn about Masonry.

If I come off as rude, I'm sorry, but I'm seriously getting tired of it.

Originally posted by Shadow18433
My question is to freemason members, Augustusmasonicus, RuneSpider, JoshNorton, network dude, Skyfloating, Masonic Light and friends.

Achilles, I never joined the York Rite or Scottish Rite and I have not particpated in a degree of this nature.

Speaking to members of my lodge who are in the York Rite and Scottish Rite it would seem that this ritual does not occur in our jurisdiction so I would not be able to answer even if I opted to pursue these appendant bodies.






[edit on 19-9-2009 by AugustusMasonicus]

Similarly, from what I can tell this ritual does not occur in our jurisdiction.

However, drinking wine from a skull hardly seems like a big deal. There are lots of props used during degree cermonies to help make a point or to be symbolic of something. No one is actually using a real human skull. Earlier tonight I was at Walmart and saw plastic cups shaped like pumpkins, skulls, etc for use at kids Halloween parties. Is this any more nefarious than using a plastic skull as a cup/bowl during a cermony?

reply to post by kingswillquiver


I will offer this..

In a religion class we did watch a video about Hinduism.. and there was a Samanah who drank and ate from a human skull.

He believed it gave him great wisdom and power by doing this.

reply to post by kingswillquiver


ill tell you what it signifies......it signifies the person is real bloody thirsty.

AM.... *sigh* it's the second time you call me Achilles, i don't know if it's a therapy to help you exercise your demons '' or '' because i said in another thread, you were Appak and the thread '' A Mason about to expose ALL the secrets '' was an HOAX '' or '' simply a off topic post strategy, to derail the thread...but i would appreciated if you would had the courage to talk to us about the drinking wine out of a skull ritual, instead of trying to hide it...

Oh well..., if you are to unconfortable and anxious, i respect you decision,
maybe another freemason will have the courage to talk about it and
share with us his experience.


S & F for your thread kingswillquiver, it's very interesting...

Originally posted by Shadow18433
As you were holding the human skull in your hands and drinking wine out of it, how did you live the experience and what went through your minds.

Each of you Individualy, please discribe your experience and what did you gained out of this macabre ritual.....

It's never been a part of any ritual I've participated in to date. That said, if I ever have the opportunity to partake in such a ceremony, I'd have no qualms doing so. I'd wager that like all ritual, allegory and symbology in Masonry, the explanatory lecture accompanying the act would spell out the history and inspiration of the tradition.

Here's more info on the topic: lostsymboltweets.blogspot.com...

Originally posted by pluckynoonez

Originally posted by kingswillquiver


What does drinking wine out of a skull signify?

It signifies that you are a satanist.

You really didn't know this? I mean, I am not a satanist, but if I saw some people drinking from a skull I would be pretty freaked out.

so by that ever so concise and deductive logic you've shown in your decisions making here...

we can claim the same for Christians who symbolically eat the flesh of christ by eating crackers and drinking his blood by drinking the wine...

riiight.. i love it how knee jerkedly reacting to a visual image gets so many agreeing stars for the post... very telling of the panic prone paranoid overwhelmingly jump to conclusionary heh..makeup of the readership here.

phooey i say.
malarkey!
shenanigans!!

-


edit aaactually.. if you enjoy your orgasms regularly, are obese, smoke, selfish to any degree, lustful, prideful etc..
then technically.. you ARE an unknowing Satanist.
unwittingly you're obeying your ANIMAL BODY'S desires and quenching desire and the thirst of the ego for your own gain.
the animal body is satan.. it's not a person.. it's your animal body.

but wait you have to think of it like an afterschool action cartoon with good guys and badguys and someone to blame outside of yourself and we can't get too deep just like it pretty and plain and black and white with imaginary angels and devil monsters....
riiiight...

satan is your animal body.. you're an intellectual animal.. and all of it's confines and desires are behaviors produced by it.
rise above and give yourself virtuous behavior not in alignment with over indulgent emotional mental and physical gain then hey.. good for you.. rise to a higher level than animal / satan.

if christians only knew the first thing about satanism they'd fall dead in their tracks SHOCKED at how they realize they've been satanic their whole life.
because it's not about worshiping a separate entity
it's about worshipping your own ego and desires
and worshipping means paying "attention to."
paying attention to ego and desires means doing things your animal body wants and lusts for.

...and if you do those things.. then you're technically the same as a satanist.

thing is... lol... you gotta stop and wonder how many Christian Americans are smokers, obese, filled to the rim with pride.. and hump like wild dogs.

so funny they think they're in league with virtue



[edit on 20-9-2009 by prevenge]

Originally posted by kingswillquiver
reply to post by fraterormus

 

Thanks for the added info.

So, it seems it's confirmed, that there is a ritual involving drinking out
of a skull.

Well, you take what I said incorrectly. Although I provided you with information regarding the Historical Source of such a practice outside of Freemasonry, and the Primary Source from which the practice is claimed to exist in Freemasonry, I also mentioned that such a practice does not appear in any 33rd Degree Ancient, Free & Accepted Freemasonic Initiation that has ever been published, other than that one single source.

The 33rd Degree Freemason Initiation - Deadly Deception is the only source that ties this practice to Freemasonry.

Although Shaw was indeed a Scottish Rite Mason, tendering his demit in 1966, after joining in 1945, his position as an Anti-Mason are clear in that book, and it is written with a specific agenda to discredit Masonry. As such, it seems scandalous to one who would take his work as authoritative and a truthful account, but it is anything but. His references to various positions in Freemasonry are accurate, but his embellishment of ceremonies and activities are absurd.

Regrettably, all those whom quote and cite his work are proving is that they have no desire to be truthful, as they refuse to do the research and find the truth by either verifying the claims made by Shaw, let alone questioning them.

There is a possibility that the Templar Strict Observance Rites that were in fashion in Freemasonry in the mid-Eighteenth century in Germany and spread to the United States during the late Eighteenth century, and to which Thomas Jefferson may have belonged, may have used such a similar rite as described by Shaw, but even when the Templar and Royal Arch Degrees were adopted into mainstream Freemasonry, such a practice does not appear to have been carried over. Likewise, there is no evidence either for or against what Shaw describes being used in the Templar Rites, although if there were any shred of truth behind Shaw's claims, this would be the most likely origin.

It is, however, most unlikely that anything of the sort occurred during Shaw's 33rd Degree Initiation into Freemasonry. Either Shaw fabricated the drinking out of a skull to prevent from violating his Solemn Oath to Secrecy, or he did so with purposeful malicious intent to generate sensationalistic scandal.

Of course, authors of Fiction, such as Dan Brown, don't have to worry about credibility and historical accuracy. They would prefer fabricated sensationalism as such sells more books. However, if one wishes to have any shred of credibility outside of Fiction, one would have to substantiate the claims made by Shaw, which personally I cannot find anything to substantiate his claim.

reply to post by Shadow18433


I am a 32nd degree Scotish Rite mason, and I have never seen or been involved in a degree where I was directed to drink anything out of a skull. I beleve I have mentioned before, we drink sweet tea. And never in the lodge. The secretary always talks about how much it costs to get the carpets cleaned. If red wine was brought out, I think he would colapse. There have been quite a few things told about masonry that were not factual. I don't have any inside scoop as to whether this is, or is not, but I am guessing it's not factual.

Well, I know the truth will not be revealed by the Masons. Even if they did drink out of a skull, they wouldn't tell about it.

Membership in the Thirty-Third Degree is by invitation only. Initiation includes drinking wine out of a human skull and taking a solemn oath that their primary allegiance is to the Thirty-Third Degree Masons. (Jim Shaw and Tom McKenney, "The Deadly Deception," page 104)

"What am I saying then? That an idol is anything, or what is offered to idols is anything? Rather, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice they sacrifice to demons and not to God, and I do not want you to have fellowship with demons. You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the Lord's table and of the table of demons." (1 Corinthians 10:19-21)

www.crossroad.to...


[edit on 20-9-2009 by kingswillquiver]

Originally posted by Shadow18433
...but i would appreciated if you would had the courage to talk to us about the drinking wine out of a skull ritual, instead of trying to hide it...

I did answer you question Road Warrior, I thought I was very clear in my response. Did you have any issues understanding what I said? If so, let me know and I would be happy to reiterate what my reply was in the previous post.

Originally posted by Shadow18433
AM....

*sigh* it's the second time you call me Achilles, i don't know if it's a therapy to help you exercise your demons '' or '' because i said in another thread, you were Appak and the thread '' A Mason about to expose ALL the secrets '' was an HOAX '' or '' simply a off topic post strategy, to derail the thread...but i would appreciated if you would had the courage to talk to us about the drinking wine out of a skull ritual, instead of trying to hide it...

Oh well..., if you are to unconfortable and anxious, i respect you decision,
maybe another freemason will have the courage to talk about it and
share with us his experience.


S & F for your thread kingswillquiver, it's very interesting...

Yes, I can see their tactics. They try to claim you are someone who has
been previously banned.

There is no honor in Freemasonry.

reply to post by kingswillquiver


just exactly what in my previous post was missed. Perhaps you shoule read it again. I am a 32nd degree. If I was a 33rd degree, then I would expect to know about things to do with that degree. What has been deceptive in your opinion?

Originally posted by kingswillquiver
Yes, I can see their tactics. They try to claim you are someone who has
been previously banned.

Whatever you say, Mint...

Originally posted by kingswillquiver
Well, I know the truth will not be revealed by the Masons. Even if they did drink out of a skull, they wouldn't tell about it.

An article published on June 22, 1889 by the New York Times details the rift between The Nothern Jurisdiction of the Scottish Rite and the Cerneau Rite which had the skull-drinking ceremony as its 33rd Degree ritual. Notice how vocieferously the Cerneau Masons are labled as clandestine and the rapidity in which the Northern Jurisdiction condemns them.

This seems to have taken place in other parts of the country as well, Missouri and New York being two examples.

In his book, Is It True What They Say About Freemasons?, Art de Hoyos details the utilization of the Skull in the 33rd Degree of the Cerneau Rite:

For example, Rev. Shaw claims that candidates drink wine from a human skull in the 33rd Degree. This is plagiarized directly from Blanchard's Scotch Rite Masonry, vol. 2, p. 470, and is in fact an identifying characteristic of "Cerneau" ritual. I imagine if I produced a copy of the 33rd Degree ritual to counter this claim, Mr. McKenney would declare the document a forgery. Similarly neither members of the Supreme Council nor anyone else interview 33rd Degree candidates (pp. 102­103), but how could a researcher confirm this statement? We are reluctantly left with addressing the general pattern of Rev. Shaw's claims that can be tested.

It would seem that this ritual-drinking from a human skull-which was created by clandestine Cernau Rite Masons was further and falsely propagated by The Reverend Jim Shaw in his book The Deadly Deception in which he claims to have particpated in this ceremony. Shaw was not subsequently able to prove that he received the 33rd Degree and his claims were recognized as the hoax they were. He also claimed to have been the Past Master of his lodge but, de Hoyos, in his book, uses publically available documents to show that these claims are untrue. It is interesting to note that Shaw left Masonry when he 'found Jesus' and would appear to be odd that a so-called 'Man of God' would resort to preveracating to defame a group of people of which he was a member of for nearly twenty years. Obviously, lying seems to be copacetic for this 'Christian' and the Bible's admonishments were somehow overlooked for his own self-promotion.

The notion that this is the correct ritual for the 33rd Degree in both the Northern and Southern Jurisdictions has been disproved and refuted long before Dan Brown published his new novel. While Dan Brown can utilize this clandestine ritual for the sake of literary embellishment the intellectually honest researcher will recognize that this is only a plot device and in no way is historically accurate for the vast majority of Freemasons.