Faith Versus Preparedness

This is not a discussion about any particular religion and please don't call me an idiot, again. As with everything in my life, I am forced to approach it through my own experiences and my own beliefs. This is an effort to get YOUR input on the differences, reliance on, compatibility, or lack thereof of the two principles.

I have a belief in a higher power. Sometimes I call him 'God.' I'm not enlightened in the way some of you are, and not so sure I WANT to be, but that is part of the reason I am here.

A very good friend of mine, whom I love dearly is a firm believer in a 'god' that will 'take care of him' in whatever situation should arise. During a brief conversation with him on what I feel is almost a certain upheaval in our society, his response was casual and almost flippant. "If it's my time to go, I guess it's my time." Rather than take any measures of preparedness, and almost scorning those who do, he has put his 'faith' in the fact that his 'god' will protect him, or that his 'god' has beforehand, made the decision about whether he is meant to live or not.

He uses scriptures from that highly debated book that seem to instruct him to put his 'faith' in god, but seems, on this issue, to deny the one 'faith without works is dead.'

For over twenty years, I have had a terribly paranoid feeling that I would get to witness a major collapse in society. If it turns out to be just a mental illnes, I suppose I will be ok.

My problem comes in when I try to balance a belief in a cosmic, 'higher power' that loves me and will take care of me with the possibility that this power has told me to prepare myself and my family for contingency and that in itself is an expression of this power's love.

At least half of me fights for a 'blind faith' that the universe works itself out and that what happens will happen regardless of my input or preparedness. The other half counters that this power is giving me a heads up so that I may be better equipped to help myself and my family in the event of a disaster.

I feel strongly that my 'god' wants me to TRY to survive, no matter what, but then I feel as though I am not a 'faithful' person if I don't put my trust in my 'god' to protect me.

Part of what I really appreciate about this place is the diversity of beliefs and the different levels of spiritual evolution that are accessible for reference from or TO any of us.

I know that it may be more trouble than you are willing to go to, but if you would describe a little of your belief on the issue of 'faith versus preparedness' I would really mean a lot to me.

For a change, there is absolutely NO ARGUMENT necessary in this thread.




HEY MODS! I really struggled with where to put this. Thank you for dumping it wherever it goes if I have exceeded the constraints of this forum.

God doesnt love you. Just like he didnt love the 50 children who died in the time it took to type this sentance. Its not good to warp your mind into delusional circular logic that might mean your "loved" by an cloud surfing genie.

Prepare as much as you want to ...... collect a mountain of supplies. Your still gonna be fighting back a horde of the needy if you want to keep any of it.

I don't know where your friend gets his idea that God will just come along and feed and protect him without his lifting a finger to help himself. It reminds me of the old joke about the preacher who was stuck on a rooftop during a raging flood. First, a boater came along and told him to get in, but he said "No, the Lord is gonna save me." A helicopter came and he refused them with, "No, the Lord is gonna save me." Rafters came along and his answer was the same. In the end he drowned and went to heaven. He asked God,"I waited and waited for you to save me, and you never came." God answered, "I sent you a boat, a helicopter, and a raft. What more did you want?" Yes, of course God is always going to take care of you, but He also put a brain in your head. If you were expected to do nothing to help yourself, then everyone could just go outside and get naked and let the ravens feed 'em and the rain fall on 'em for water to drink! The reason we hold jobs and build houses is because He expects us to help ourselves day to day. The same goes for preparing for disaster, IMO>

I have to say that all of this has been going through my head alot lately too. first I bought protection for the family, in case I had to survive without being prepared...then recently I sold my sport bike and bought approx 1 yr. of food storage to sustain my family. I believe god wants us to be prepared. "God helps those who help themselves! Sure I have heard of "mana from heaven" but I dont think that is a realistic expectaion. I am not saying I dont have faith that God will provide for me, I am just thinking, if mana rained down from heaven or whatever, it would be exclusively for "gods people" and this day and age that is few and far between. now maybe after TEOTWAWKI and groups of believers start to come together, they could recieve those kinds of blessings. Right now, God is leading me to be prepared! and I am listening. I advise that everyone do the same as much as possible.

for those who say i am deluded for believing there is a God, what is your "higher power" telling you to do? ...nothing...well lets see who lasts longer, and we can talk about this again when its all said and done.

reply to post by KSPigpen


This is something like I'm going through with my husband.I want to
prepare for the worst case scenario.My husband treats me like I don't
have any faith in God to protect us.

The things I have prepared for my family,I give God the praise and
glory. I know it was God who let me find what I needed at the time
I needed it.I found a set of camping dishes on sale for $13.00,on the
internet,they were selling for about $50.00!

You put your faith and trust in God,He will supply your needs,one way
or another.

reply to post by mamabeth


Yeah, I've got 3 children and elderly parentsa to care for, also on a tight budget. I cannot rush out and buy $$$$$ worth of survival stuff. But, we are avid campers, hunters and fishermen, so that's covered. We also are lucky enough to live in a very rural area on 180 acres, so we had a HUGE garden. We have taters, 140 quarts of peas, butterbeans, corn, etc. I raise chickens, guineas and cows, too. My Father God has been very good to put us where we are, but He also expects us to work for what we have! He has yet to hand me big wad of cash and say "Get ready!"

reply to post by KSPigpen
I keep in mind and old saying I learned from my grandfather.
"Son, when you're in the middle of the river in a rowboat, and you see a storm coming up, have faith in God, but row like hell!" (We lived on the banks of the Mississippi, for those of you in other states who are unable to appreciate what a real river looks like.)

Originally posted by kettlebellysmith
reply to post by KSPigpen

 

I keep in mind and old saying I learned from my grandfather.
"Son, when you're in the middle of the river in a rowboat, and you see a storm coming up, have faith in God, but row like hell!" (We lived on the banks of the Mississippi, for those of you in other states who are unable to appreciate what a real river looks like.)

Ya'll sound like my kinda' folks!!!

reply to post by Wertdagf
It must be sad to live a life without belief in a higher power. I feel sorry for you. And this post will probably make you angry. I apologize in advance.

Originally posted by kettlebellysmith
reply to post by Wertdagf

 

It must be sad to live a life without belief in a higher power. I feel sorry for you. And this post will probably make you angry. I apologize in advance.

I love you guys. All of you. It doesn't matter if you don't believe in a power greater than yourself, or not, to offer up a valid viewpoint in this discussion. I may have a belief that it could be 'sad' or 'terrible' or something else for someone to not share my beliefs, but I really, really, REALLY (did I say really?) want to avoid cross-talk about whether or not someone believes in God and what it must be like to either be a 'gullible believer' or a 'godless hellion.'

I know those words are my own. I just want input on faith vs. preparedness and have no desire to get into who is right.

No offense, ok?

As a former xian, I can see where your conflict comes from. God however, does not want us to sit on our laurels. The lord of the bible provides us with plants and animals to eat, but he doesn't cook them for us. We have to plant the seeds, tend the fields, harvest the stock, and store for the sparse months. I don't remember reading of any god that provides all meals with it's own hands for it's followers. It's our responsibility to prepare for the future. Only things we can't predict will any god provide for or provide the items we need as we look for them(as they are supposedly omniscient and we aren't).

I am not a "religious" person, but I do believe in a higher power, if that make sense.

There is a lot more to this than just the two extremes:

"But my God shall supply all your need according to his riches in glory by Christ Jesus."

-Philippians 4:19

vs

"Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition"

-Frank Loesser

I believe more in the following quote:

"Heaven helps those who help themselves"

-Ben Franklin

Put your faith in your higher power (whomever that might be) and if you like, believe that they are going to help you out. Just be prepared if you need to wait a little bit for that help. Call it a test of faith.

I would rather take my chances and be prepared for my family (which I do out of love for them and no other reason) and be wrong. I don't think an omni-benevolent being would be all that mad at me for growing and storing a little extra food from my garden, or storing some water, or learning how to protect myself and mine from others who may one day wish to do us harm. I know that if "Situation X" happens, I will be looking to my higher power for strength to pull through the dark times.

Until then, I pray that it never does happen.



***edits for typos***

[edit on 18-9-2009 by DropInABucket]

Maybe the key is a little of both.

I stocked up and prepared, then I forget about it and continue having faith in positive outcomes. That way, either way I'll be prepared

Hello KS
Hope you are well,
From my perspective i do not see doing something like being prepared as being a sign of a lack of Faith,


"The prudent see danger and take refuge, but the simple keep going and suffer for it." Proverbs 27:12

There are many times that God spoke about looking at the times and making sure that you are ready for what is coming,Taking heed,being aware of what is going on around you,making note and taking action accordingly is an act of Faith in itself,
Yes there are times when he will call to Give away all and follow him and
that is an act of Faith as well,and sometimes there may be storms around and
all seems like that it is against you,that the situations that arise may seem insurmountable,Trusting him in this time as well as the others where we would rely on ourselves is an act of Faith as well,regardless of the circumstances,
Having Faith is a lifestyle,a mentality,Faith is not a switch that we turn on and of when it suits but a way of life and living.

I know that i came to this board for a reason,That what i have seen going on has changed my perspective somewhat,That now i have a better understanding of what is happening,I also know that i have the choice,
What is going to come is inevitable,where will i be and what will i do when it does,That it comes i cannot change but how i will function in it is now up to what i do before hand,
I am not a survivalist by any means but i believe that through his Grace that i have been given tools and understanding in what is required and i have come to realise that it is not so much what i have even tho this is important but how prepared i am in my heart and mind to deal with these things.


I hope that You,myself and all these others will never have to deal with the things that we talk about,How lovely that all our preparations would be in vain,
But i think that we know better,As is said,"Hope for the best and prepare for the worst"

“Trust in the Lord with all your heart,
And lean not on your own understanding;
In all your ways acknowledge him,
And he will make your paths straight.”
(Proverbs 3:5-6)

BV

reply to post by jennybee35


With the 180 acres,the skills for gardening and canning yes, God
has been good to you.

DEAR FRIEND... NOAH HAD FAITH THAT WHAT GOD TOLD HIM WAS TRUE, SO NOAH BUILT THE ARK, STORED FOOD, GATHERED SUPPLIES FOR ALL, AND WAS READY WHEN IT STARTED TO RAIN. LIKE WISE, WE SHOULD HAVE FAITH THAT GOD IS PUSHING US TO BE PREPARED, THAT LITTLE VOICE OR GUTFEELING THAT SOMETHING JUST ISN'T RIGHT, SO WE NEED TO BE READY. PREPARE AND HASTEN YOUR WALK WITH GOD, FOR HE WILL SHOW HIS GREATNESS WHEN WE CAN NO LONGER DO FOR OURSELVES...

I am a Christian. The bible clearly tells us that the NWO will be taking over, RFID is coming and TS is going to HTF. God warned us so we could be prepared. For those who think God is just going to bail them out, God is just going to shake his head and say "I warned you 2000 years ago this was going to happen, I told you that you would know when the season was upon you so you could get ready. I'm not going to change what I had planned from the dawn of time just because you didn't listen to what I said. I never said I would bail you out. READ MY WORD!"

Thank you all very much. This is precisely what I was hoping for...some varying viewpoints and even some stuff from printed material to back up your opinions.

Stars all the way around.

Reply to post by calstorm

Literally took the words right from my mouth.

Short answer:It's both.

Little longer answer:God has given us his word and if we have faith that His word is truth, we will prepare ourselves. He has given numerous signs if only we have eyes to see. He will not put on us a load of more than what we can bear. But it is on us to prepare for that load.

May the truth shine brightly and prepare each of us for what is to come.

A2D


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Okay, I'm gonna approach this from a "heathen" stand point as I believe in a higher power, and even know the bible quite well, but am not a Christian; I'd rate myself somewhere in the simply "spiritual" category.

I believe in a real all encompassing consciousness of the Universe, I think what You can see on a Macrocosmic level is also the same on a Microcosmic scale.

The above is the basis for my premise. I think it is outlined throughout Nature that preparedness is a necessary thing for survival. Bears to ants, all animals, and insects who have longer life spans have seasonal preparations for the coming winter. Chipmonks, and Squirrels store up nuts, and other things for the winter.

I think We are entering a dark dark winter of sorts; not just the actual physical season, or Gregorian dates, but a proverbial time in which preparation is necessary; as outlined by the microcosmic level.

I am not worried for the possibility of death, and don't allow that to rule the decisions in my life; it is a natural cycle. We know one absolute in this life, and that is We all will die. Death completes the grand circle of life; there is no cheating it.

So, I prepare because to myself it is by design, but at the same time I do not prepare for the fear of death.

Just a Heathen's two pesos

S&F